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27.5 – Trail Bikes
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coconutFree Member
Following on from my recent post about modern 29er trail bikes being a bit heavy & not agile. Who’s currently riding a 27.5inch wheel size trail bike? do you find these overall more nimble and more fun to ride ? I have a hankering to try one out, last time I rode a 27.5 I found it way more playful than my 29er Giant Trance.
faustusFull MemberWhat about mullet? Does the 27.5 rear help with playfulness/agility? Going to find out myself shortly, but worth considering as it’s a popular build on 29er trail bikes of many types. One smaller wheel and tyre won’t make much of a weight saving, but more about ride feel??
phil5556Full MemberI love my Bird Aether 7.
It’s much more nimble and playful than my 29er Trail bike…But that one has a motor so it’s not a fair comparison!
2nickcFull MemberMy Spesh Enduro is 27.5. I’ve also got a 29er Yeti ARC and the difference…
Isn’t really that noticeable if I’m honest. I think the ARC spins up faster, but then its a few kilo lighter so it should, maybe the Enduro doesn’t roll over things as well – can’t say that I’ve given it much thought. Erm, the Enduro rear tyre doesn’t buzz my backside?
KramerFree MemberI ride 29ers, and have had a few goes, back to back on my mate’s Orange Crush 27.5 and his Alpine 27.5. Both are noticeably more nimble than my bikes when ridden back to back. However when I’m riding my own bikes I don’t find them cumbersome.
2zerocoolFull MemberAirDrop bikes. They almost exclusively make 27.5 bikes for the reasons you state. I’ve know idea what sort of travel counts as a trail bike nowadays but they do a few.
alpinFree MemberStill riding my 2017 Strive and am reluctant to look for anything new as just about every new bike is 29″ on at least one end.
I’m 5’7″ and will often scrub my arse on the rear tyre. From what I see and hear this happens even more often for those on 29″.
I enjoy technical, natural trails where some low speed skill and nimbleness is required as opposed to built tracks where you can generally just hold on and plough through.
1chakapingFull MemberIf you want a fast, fun, playful 27.5in trail bike, have a look at secondhand Orange Fives (and maybe Fours) from the last 4 or 5 years.
Think the Five Evo is the current version.
rhidFull MemberI have an Aether 7 and a transition patrol mullet. The Aether does feel a lot smaller and easier to shift round on the trails. However my Patrol is set up as a park bike so is heavier. They do feel a bit different though, but I dont really ride the two bikes on the same trails so maybe its a poor comparison.
I do have a Stanton Switch160 frame still. I replaced this with the Aether frame for trail riding and it feels better but I suppose the Aether is a much smaller lighter bike. Being a bit on the shorter side I am a fan of 27.5 frames.
sharkattackFull MemberIf I had the time and energy to ride more than one bike I’d definitely still have a full 27.5. It would be perfect for man made trails and ripping berms and jumps and stuff.
I’d like to test ride an Aether 7 or Airdrop Filter.
coreFull MemberI have a Cotic Flare 650b (not that I ride it often due to lack of time/other hobbies), and can’t see the point in changing it for the sake of a heavier bike with bigger wheels and a couple of degrees slacker head tube and steeper seat tube – it still does general mountain biking as well as it did back in 2017. I’ve nothing against 29er’s, I’ve had several, but I don’t think they do twisty technical trails as well as smaller wheeled bikes, and all of these new bikes are so bloody heavy – 35lb for a full sus seems to be widely accepted these days?!
chestrockwellFull MemberI have a 27.5 HT and 29 FS, both with modern geometry. From my experience the same rules still apply, bigger wheels = more stable, feel faster and smoother, 27.5 = more nimble and easier to shift about but can get bogged down so you need to not be lazy. The short chain stay on my HT make it much easier to lift the front too. 29ers are the better bike 90% of the time but the 10% is the most fun, imo.
1sharkattackFull Member35lb for a full sus seems to be widely accepted these days?!
I’ve had plenty of bikes in the past that were way under 35lb and I wouldn’t go back to any of them. The extra weight comes from all the things that make modern bikes so bloody good.
stanyFree MemberCurrently spinning around on a 2022 trek Slash (29) while my 2012 Ibis Mojo HDR (27) is out of action.
The Slash is a lot more travel and up to date ish Rock Shox kit rather than my dated (and reason it’s off road) Fox kit. I’ve always known the RS suspension is a bit plusher than Fox, and with longer travel, unsurprisingly the Slash is a joy on downhills and jumps, but I’m definitely noticing the slower steering. It’s still fun on the tech stuff but I’m having to think a lot more.
The Slash is a tad heavier than the Ibis but I don’t think there’s much in it and the 12th gear helps get up the tougher climbs.
I’m looking forward to getting the HDR back on the trails and seeing if TF breathing life into the Fox CTD brings the pop back to it.
PS – I tried the Cotic Flare 27 a couple of years ago and loved it, but it was a heavy beast. Not so much in the ride but I wouldn’t want to throw it over too many gates.
NSFree MemberWhyte T130 RS for me – very agile 27.5 trail bike.
Also a newly aquired Trek Fuel Exe that i’m running with a 27.5 rear – currently thinking that mullet maybe the best of both worlds!
BeagleboyFull MemberI swap between my 29er Spesh Levo e-bike for longer rides and my 27.5er Orange Four for local spins. The Four always brings a smile to my face, it’s so quick off the mark and nimble.
seriousrikkFull MemberPicked up a Trek Remedy recently.
Love how it rides until things get quicker then it feels a bit sketchy. This is not down to wheel size though, it’s just a bit short for me. Totally my purchasing error there.But as an fun agile bike it’s really opened my eyes.
Then I flipped the chip on my 29er and put the 27.5 wheel off the Remedy in the back… and my world changed again. My 29er does have super short chainstays so was already quite good, but with the smaller wheel it feels nearly as agile as the trek but still get nice amounts of stability at speed. Also encourages mild hooliganism off jumps, so it’s quite likely to kill me at some point.
grizzlyFree MemberI don’t think there is as much difference in roll over between the two wheel sizes to be honest. I think the most important factor is tyres and wheel size depends on frame size. I went from a F/S 29″ 2.4 tyres to a HT with 27.5″ 2.6 tyres and there was not that much difference in the total wheel/tyre size due to different volume tyres. The rollover feels similar but the 27.5 definitely get up the speed faster and is more fun and faster on the rough stuff (but hurts more!).
I have just got a gravel bike with 650b wheels, 50mm tyres and it gets up to speed faster than my previous 700c 44mm bike on and off road. The 650b is more comfortable on the road absorbing the imperfections and just as fast.
So, smaller wheels, bigger volume tyres are better! 29ers is just a marketing conspiracy, I tell ya! Don’t believe the hype! (Unless you are tall or race professionally and care about tenths of seconds)
1sharkattackFull MemberI hated running 2.6 tyres on my last 27.5 bike. They felt fast over rough stuff and were supremely comfortable but I hated hard cornering. They squirm and fold too much especially on berms and hard pack. The big volume is also too much of an undamped spring and makes the bike rebound weirdly out of compressions and stuff.
I didn’t have inserts in those days though. 2.6 tyres with Rimpacts might be the ultimate combo.
VanHalenFull Memberi like my old school 27.5 bikes.
i could go mullet but that means more expense and i`m a cheapskate.
regarding hte above i had to put a rimpact in my 2.6 rear tyre on the eeb. I kept burping the bloody thing in corners. with teh rimpact its fine. its heavier than the moon though.
NorthwindFull MemberTBH I just don’t think it’s really all <that> true… I’ve had 3 “big trail bikes” recently, no massive differences in weight but my Rocket was definitely a big slugger, way less agile, way less involving if you weren’t riding it hard, and sort of harder to turn it on. Not a great bike to have a low energy day on. But the Remedy 29 was agile and playful, more so than the 650b version of the exact same bike because you could actually use it better and get away with more, and my Bird AM9 a really good balance.
Wheel size is just one factor and you can make a big slugger of a 650b bike or an agile 29er. I think it’s more that if you’re making a longish travel 29er you’re just naturally more likely to lean into it and make it a big thumper of a bike even if you could make it more playful? Similar to how 29ers tended to lead the charge a bit into “long low and slack” just because it’s physically easier to package a 29er bike that way, whereas 650b bikes tended to be more conservative because they didn’t have the <need> for the length.
sharkattackFull MemberThat’s true. My Geometron was full 27.5 and it was a monster. Went fast everywhere and had all the grip but it certainly wasn’t ‘agile’ or playful.
My Norco Sight pops around like a DJ bike in comparison. I love how easy it is to jump and wheelie around on. It’s the bike that made me think ‘yes 29ers are sorted now’ and stop worrying about wheel size.
But.. I still don’t like how the rear tyre hits my bum on drops and steep stuff. It sometimes feels a little harder to tip into a corner in tight situations. Maybe that’s why people ride mullets but I haven’t tried one yet.
squirrelkingFree MemberStill rocking my Pitch which, yes, is 26″ but hell yeah to a 650b. I have a 29 which does its job well but smaller wheels are always more fun. I’d have an FS BMX for the lols if I could justify it.
robertajobbFull Member2014 Model (2015 bought) Mk2 Orange 5. 27.5″ both ends. A more capable bike than the rider, and I’ll be fecked if I spend about £6k in today’s money for anything to replace it.
_tom_Free MemberBanshee still do 27.5″ bikes and their geometry looks a bit more old school than a lot of “progressive” designs which potentially suck the fun out of a lot of trails. On a hardtail I like 29″ as it doesn’t hang up so easily on ruts, roots etc, but it definitely feels more “barge” like and slower to turn etc, I don’t have the same confidence on it on tighter trails as I do on smaller bikes. Not sure I’d want a modern geometry full suspension with big wheels as well, but if it’s not too long and slack maybe it’d be ok.
MugbooFull MemberCurrently riding an Airdrop Edit, previously owned the Aether 7 frame that Rhid now rides (Hi Rhid 🙂 ). Also have a 27.5 Orange Crush. I haven’t ridden a 29r in anger but at 5’8″ I very occasionally buzz my arse so don’t fancy less room.
And at 53 I can no longer convince myself that lighter, blingier, bigger will alter my fun or skill level.
If I buy a whole new bike at some point in the future it might be a mullet but that will be because thats the way things have gone rather than because I think that magic will happen…
I’ve also been down the travel to the Aether 7 then back up again to 170/170 on the Edit. Still ride all the same trails and features, its just smoother now. One thing that did cause an improvement in my riding was sizing. Before the Aether I was on a small V1 Edit, the move to a medium Aether had me riding things that previously scared me. So in that sense, for me, size matters.
Overall though, unless you are racing enduros, I’m not sure it matters (even then you’ll be faster on whatever makes you feel confident). Most of us ride for fun, fitness and friendship don’t we.
In a way, my most fun bike is a Canyon Dude, the whole daftness of it just makes me (and others) smile. Ironically due its huge tyres, its probably a 29r!
kiwijohnFull MemberBanshee Runes have a 63.5º head angle and 76º seat tube angle, which I wouldn’t call old school.
It is a lot fun to ride. A 180mm fork certainly takes the edge off the hits as well.chakapingFull MemberThink OP was after short/mid-travel bikes.
Therefore 30lbs is not out of the realms of possibilty.
Granted I may be extrapolating from their previous post.
sirromjFull MemberAfter riding a 24″ wheeled street bike (steep angles short stays) and a 27.5 wheeled rigid MTB (brand x ht-01 frame exotic 29er forks) when i took my 27.5″ Bird Zero TR to the woods (for the first time in years) I did keep wondering why I couldn’t steer around puddles as expected – its quite a long bike. 2.4 Onza tyres on 30mm rims (zero tr) also bigger than 2.6 slaughter on 25mm rims (ht01).
Still never ridden a 29er. Not weighed my Zero TR yet either.
coconutFree MemberThanks, some interesting thoughts there. To me a trail bike is around 150mm or more on the front, and a 120mm on the rear, and the geometry to match. I was thinking more along the line of a 140 to 150mm trail bike in 27.5, ebay has a lot of old Giant Trance meeting that criteria.
alpinFree MemberGF’s Trance SX kinda meets that criteria, although being an SX it has a 160mm fork, 140mm rear.
RickosFree MemberI missed the nimbility a few years ago so built up a 2018 Orange 5 as a DAB (Dick-About-Bike). Loved it then sold it… Thought Mullet was the one true way (it is good mind), but the bike I replaced it with (Orange Switch 6) is just far too capable in a dick-about-bike way. So, ordered a Marino from Peru and that’s on a plane on its way here now. 27.5, nothing outlandish in terms of geo, but it’ll fit me better than anything else with my long legs/short body frame. Very much looking forward to riding it this summer.
chakapingFull Memberthe bike I replaced it with (Orange Switch 6) is just far too capable in a dick-about-bike way.
I’ve literally just built one of these as (potentially) my main bike.
I am so excited about using it in anger.
IHNFull Member*cough*
A lot of well looked after bike for the money.
Full disclosure, seller is a mate. In fact my oldest mate, aw, cute innit.
RickosFree Memberchakaping – saw that you’d got a Switch 6 on the Instagrams (some Orange fanboi page or something). It’s a fantastic bike, but the old medium sized 2018 Five was more fun at feeling on the edge and mucking about. The Switch feels quite serious in comparison – super quick and composed. I’m looking forward to my Marino arriving.
Having said all that, I think the 27.5 or Mullet thing is more to do with geo. If I made a long and slack 27.5 I’m sure it wouldn’t have the flicky feel I’m after.
chestercopperpotFree MemberSorry 27.5 was cancelled on here long ago. Get a 29ner ebike and stop messing about with these Amish contraptions.
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