20mph in Wales…..

Over a million people signed the roll back Brexit petition. Think this one will be as effective.

Ah the USA.

They exist there too, not to the same extent but they have rural gravel and lots of forest service roads that anyone can drive on. As long as you go off the beaten track you’ll find them, that’s why events like the Gambler 500 exist.

<span style=”color: #000000; font-family: Roboto, ‘Helvetica Neue’, Arial, ‘Noto Sans’, sans-serif, -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, ‘Segoe UI’, ‘Apple Color Emoji’, ‘Segoe UI Emoji’, ‘Segoe UI Symbol’, ‘Noto Color Emoji’; background-color: #eeeeee;”>’She couldn’t get her head round the idea that a decelerating vehicle has a negative force’  I’m curious as to where you took this.  Is that why pedestrians fly over the bonnet when you hit them rather than just launching further down the road?</span>

They exist there too, not to the same extent but they have rural gravel and lots of forest service roads that anyone can drive on

Much of the gravel road network is two-way though, and there is a clear distinction between gravel and non-gravel which is well known so it would be straightforward to program the car not to go down them.  The ones I saw were well signposted as you turned onto them – and of course the road surface changed visibly.  And there are far fewer gravel roads than tarmac. On top of that, they are mostly in remote locations where few people live so I’m willing to bet most people live their whole lives without going on them at all.

In the UK on the other hand most of the road network is actually single track so the chances of needing to go on some are pretty high.

Bit off the main topic.

On the idea that British roads are too tricky for autonomous vehicles. That is the reason asda is going to use them in North London.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/markfaithfull/2022/12/21/autonomous-grocery-trucks-roll-into-london-as-asda-ocado-and-wayve-test-tech/

If you are in Wales and want to vote to keep the law you can do so with this petition:

Reply To: New (?) Warburton’s advert!!!!

A cycling friend popped over the border into Wales on her motorbike today – she seemed to feel that pedestrians seem to either be unable to judge a motorbike at 20mph or believe that the change gave them the right to wander into the road at will. (Which was my experience on Cambridge today as well!)

@molgrips that graphic doesn’t say what you think it does, a C or unclassified road isn’t necessarily a single lane, it’s just not an A or B road. Think about it, is your street an A or B road? (I’m hoping it’s neither to prove my point!)

No, plenty of C’s with a white line in the South East but likewise there are A and B roads in Wales where the white line disappears for short or long periods. That’s kind of my point, it’s really random and inconsistent.

Anyway, back on topic, the implications of the 20 limit are now largely academic as everyone seems to be ignoring it now, in my neighborhood at least.

Seems like pretty good adherence to the speed limit in Pembroke…there were LOADS of cars behind me today and they were all doing 20mph like me 😆

<span style=”color: #000000; font-family: Roboto, ‘Helvetica Neue’, Arial, ‘Noto Sans’, sans-serif, -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, ‘Segoe UI’, ‘Apple Color Emoji’, ‘Segoe UI Emoji’, ‘Segoe UI Symbol’, ‘Noto Color Emoji’;”>”A cycling friend popped over the border into Wales on her motorbike today – she seemed to feel that pedestrians seem to either be unable to judge a motorbike at 20mph or believe that the change gave them the right to wander into the road at will. (Which was my experience on Cambridge today as well!)”</span>

Maybe because it’s the law?

Applies to pretty much every road in the UK except M-ways and a few other places – pedestrians HAVE the right of way, motor vehicles don’t.

There’s pretty good adherence here in the Amman Valley, Carmarthenshire. Coupled with the 40mph limit with average speed cameras on the Brynamman mountain road things are almost reasonable enough for road riding in safety here.

Having said that though, a friend yesterday posted about the third! Operation Snap prosecution that has resulted from footage of close passes that he has been subjected to.

400,000 sign a petition demanding scrapping of the law, but only a couple of hundred (at most) turn up in Cardiff at a protest march yesterday.

There were 10,000 in Bangor at a Wales independence march.

Hmmm

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-66902150

Gwaelods link is what I thought I would find when opening the ‘roasters’ thread 😆

It was publicised for ages yet people are only protesting it now? Probably not the level of forward thinking you want for doing more than 20 in a residential area.

If we can also adopt light controlled pedestrian crossings that prioritise the pedestrian like in Europe that would also be great. 5 minutes stood waiting in the rain here while drivers go through sat in the dry 🙄

The difference between the number of petition signatures and the number of protesters is quite something.

400,000 sign a petition demanding scrapping of the law, but only a couple of hundred (at most) turn up in Cardiff at a protest march yesterday

Probably as they’d have had to get off their arses and out of their cars to walk?🤣

Also ironically think the roads are too dangerous to walk and cycle on 🙄

Well it’s quite a journey from Tufton St to Cardiff especially at 20mph

If we can also adopt light controlled pedestrian crossings that prioritise the pedestrian like in Europe that would also be great. 5 minutes stood waiting in the rain here while drivers go through sat in the dry 🙄

That would be great. Also lights that either prioritise roads with actual traffic on them or turn off late at night.

Why we still use timed lights in the 21st century is beyond me.

Why we still use timed lights in the 21st century is beyond me.

I think many are on sensors? Box with a red LED on top of the lights? Or sometimes a weight sensor under the rectangular cut section just behind the line?

Oh many are, but they are still installing timed lights all over the place and not upgrading them.

Funny how 20mph has appeared in some Scottish local authorities without the same level of fuss.  What could it be about the devolved Welsh Government that has attracted the ire of Tufton Street?

Funny how 20mph has appeared in some Scottish local authorities without the same level of fuss. What could it be about the devolved Welsh Government that has attracted the ire of Tufton Street?

It appeared in many Welsh towns and cities also without much fuss, though there was some. It was putting it in national legislation as a default that meant it could be deliberately misrepresented so as to raise peoples’ ire that gave the opportunity for it to be treated as a “wedge” issue (is that the word).

There’s an Op-ed here today about Conservatives in Wales and how they are trying to stoke it up as a wedge issue, despite it being them who began the process to bring in the legislation in the first place.

Shocking Facebook posts prove 20mph row is the most toxic issue since devolution began

Don’t know what the fuss is. Just been over from Manchester, via our caravan in Prestatyn and then across to Harlech. Prestatyn to Harlech is 60 miles but took about 2 hours. Lots of short 20 zones but that possibly delayed us by a couple of minutes at most.

I think many are on sensors? Box with a red LED on top of the lights? Or sometimes a weight sensor under the rectangular cut section just behind the line?

Aren’t they proximity sensors under the road rather than weight?
I know a hack for the older ones was to pop a rare earth magnet as low as you could on the bike and position it over the line of the sensor to trigger the “car waiting” part of the timer.

And as soon as any of the sensors fail, or send a gibberish signal, the whole thing does default to a simple timer.

I was impressed in France recently where you drive into a town or village (at 30kph) and a red light is showing at a crossing with nobody on it. If you’re travelling at 30kph or under it goes green, if not it stays red for a bit. It’s a genius idea for calming speed without humps.

There’s one on the A75 at one of the little villages around Castle Douglass. Great idea, been there a few yrs now.

Looks like it’s working

https://nation.cymru/news/new-research-details-astonishing-impact-of-wales-20mph-speed-limit-after-first-week/

On Saturday, a march against the speed limit’s introduction attracted over one hundred protesters

😅😅😅😅😅

There’s one on the A75 at one of the little villages around Castle Douglass. Great idea, been there a few yrs now.

There was one on the A78 through Fairlie, not sure if it was deactivated at the end of the trial phase but barring a few teething issues it was a great idea.

Sample analysis of two routes has indicated a journey time increase of between 45-63 seconds along the two 2.5km routes in Cardiff and Wrexham

OMG 60 seconds, how will we cope?

Folks over in Anglesey not too impressed. But they like to moan. Here in North Wales most people I’ve spoken to are ok with it, most have taken it with jest….lots of funny moaning.

It was weird being in England with 30mph limits on streets that in Scotland and Wales would be 20mph this weekend. Noticeably noisier and less pleasant.
Then I went to Wales today and all was well.

It was weird being in England with 30mph limits on streets that in Scotland Stirlingshire, some city centres, the Borders and Wales would be 20mph this weekend.

FTFY, it’s going to be bad* enough round here when they decriminalise parking and start actually enforcing it without 20mph limits as well.

*depending on your viewpoint, I’m going to be sitting back laughing at them all.

It’s pretty telling how much of the anti campaign is just lies, isn’t it? Just an admission that they can’t achieve what they want with the truth.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-66687817

https://x.com/APlayfulCity/status/1705875103890756091?s=20

What is it about being asked to drive a bit slower that attracts these utter fruitcakes?

I’m a bit disappointed chemtrails didn’t get a mention.

We have had a 20mph speed limit through our small town now for a couple of years (England). Most of the drivers ignore it, don’t know it’s a 20 zone, or thought that the ‘previous humps when removed’ meant they could just carry on as normal.
Hopefully the 20mph limits come into force in England soon.

20 here is definitely being ignored on our road.  that said I think the average speed has come down.  most were going well over 30.  now it’s probably closer to 30.  so better but still a long way from 20