Lionheart '84 would be my guess - my first (and last) foray into BAOR.
When I was working for the NAAFI in Munster there was a big exercise that included getting a load of equipment over the North sea. Lots of reserves mobilised, some cars and street furniture got flattened by tanks and much beer was drunk and the officers in the bar reckoned everyone involved would have been dead within the first two days in the event of a real attack.
Bit odd to hear Ireland being referred to as Eire or Éire (with the fada) it is kind of weird and inappropriate to use if speaking in any other language – as if you said Deutschland while speaking English.
I hope that I wasn't inappropriate in a offensive sense, that wasn't my intention and my apologies if that is the case
I use "Éire" because it's an official term instantly recognised by most of us, unlike some of the other terms that may be confused with other jurisdictions or a combination of the two. Some of those terms have historic connotations that are offensive
I've also been taken to task over "Türkiye", but never "Barthelona" 🙂
yes no worries. No offence taken. You’re one of the more balanced people on here.
I’m overly sensitive on Ireland subjects, a hangover from having lived in England so long.
Israel can say and do whatever they wish regarding Middle East because their daddy and son is USA.
When they "control" the political scene in the most powerful nation, no other nations would dare to contradict them other than verbal objection. Both nations have the same interest in the Middle East. i.e. to control the petrol dollar.
Hence, all or most of the objection is brush aside by them as hot air.
In the context of religion, Israel is the daddy to USA.
In the context of modern weaponry, USA is the daddy to Israel.
What is troubling is whether they are the same person?
Regardless, they have a strong bond.
Thanks Caher
daddy and son is USA
You forgot holy ghost.
presumably Syria arent in a postion to do anything regardless of what they think about Iran getting bombed?
I think that keeping Syria disorganised is seen as Israel's best option by them.
I doubt that Turkiye will get involved, although they are a very capable force, because President Trump has sanctioned them over Syria during Trump v1.0
The danger for Israel is that IS militants will be part of that disorganisation (there is the possibility of bringing them within the organised Syrian fold)
I cant see even Trump being foolish enough to get drawn in beyond strategic bombing of the hard to reach nuclear production sites
Iranian air defenses seem completely wiped out, so thered be minimal risk of any US planes being shot down, so I think Trump would go for the bombing
I think that you've got to ask to what end.
I don't know what the implications are for bombing a nuclear enrichment facility in nuclear waste terms, but it'll certainly put an end to any chances of diplomacy, which is still possible. Talk of bumping the Supreme Leader off is a nonsense, who do you negotiate with in that event?
Israel's intelligence had better be good; how do you know that you've got all of their facilities and stocks? Have they got facilities that are actually secret? Iran has the knowledge and even the US think that they'll be up and running again quite quickly
Any failure will lead to Iran going even harder for "the bomb" and everyone around them will want one too. It'll be a proliferation disaster
There's only one way out of this, and to keep a lid on it in the future, and that's diplomacy.
Netanyahu wants permanent conflict throughout the Middle East as its his only way to stay in power/out of jail.
It was him who whispered in the ear of President Trump v1.0 to pull out of the talks in 2018. He was under corruption pressures then and a close aide had just turned informant.
Displaying photographs from the podium of the United Nations General Assembly, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on Thursday accused Iran of maintaining a secret atomic warehouse in Tehran, proving its intent to develop nuclear weapons despite the accord it reached with major powers in 2015.
“Today, I’m disclosing for the first time that Iran has another secret facility in Tehran, a secret atomic warehouse for storing massive amounts of equipment and material for Iran’s secret nuclear weapons programme,” he told world leaders on the third day of the Assembly’s annual debate.
“So, here’s what I say to Europe’s leaders and to others: Instead of cuddling Iran’s dictators, join the US and Israel and most of the Arab world in supporting new sanctions against a regime that endangers all of us in all of the world,” said Prime Minister Netanyahu.
he called on UN International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) chief Yukiya Amano to “do the right thing - go inspect this atomic warehouse immediately before the Iranians finish clearing it out.” https://news.un.org/en/story/2018/09/1021192
No more evidence, hmmm. An Iran free of sanctions wasn't a happy thought for Israel
I'm more than just a little concerned that bombing these sites is going to spread highly radioactive crap over the area (and downwind), making parts of Iran dangerous to live in for generations for the normal people in the population that have no choice about how or where they live.
If there legitimately is a stockpile of weapons grade Uranium in Tehran, then making the capital city deadly for the civilian population is a shit thing to do, irrespective of the military expediency.
If there legitimately is a stockpile of weapons grade Uranium in Tehran, then making the capital city deadly for the civilian population is a shit thing to do, irrespective of the military expediency.
I’m not sure that the health of the civilian population of Iran figures very highly in the Isrealis’ list of priorities.
Oh, trust me when I say I believe that too. I did have a whole paragraph about proportionality, LOAC and the ethics/legality of the whole thing, but reading it back just made me feel more and more sad.
Same thoughts here, dropping bombs on any radioactive material is not a very good idea - turns it into an effective dirty bomb, with massive long term health issues, for people across the globe. If a layperson can understand that, why cant others ?
If, Iran have enriched uranium in the deep bunker, blowing a dirty big hole in it isn't a great idea. And it's an "If" ! Trump's already ignored his senior adviser that's told him Iran aren't near producing a weapon.
Same thoughts here, dropping bombs on any radioactive material is not a very good idea - turns it into an effective dirty bomb, with massive long term health issues, for people across the globe. If a layperson can understand that, why cant others ?
If, Iran have enriched uranium in the deep bunker, blowing a dirty big hole in it isn't a great idea. And it's an "If" ! Trump's already ignored his senior adviser that's told him Iran aren't near producing a weapon.
With Fordo (Fordow?) specifically, is that actually an issue? The place is possibly 80-90 metres underground and the bombs penetrate up to 60m down, it's surely not going to spray stuff very far around. Most of it will be buried.
It's not even certain how much the US bombs will be able to damage it, given that no one knows exactly how deep it is or how it's reinforced.
If I was Iran I'd have spent the last couple of years building a nice long side-tunnel. Then when someone tries to bomb the place, all the important stuff is half a mile away behind a nice thick blast door. I'm sure everyone involved (on both sides) has thought of this though!
If I was Iran I'd have spent the last couple of years building a nice long side-tunnel. Then when someone tries to bomb the place, all the important stuff is half a mile away behind a nice thick blast door. I'm sure everyone involved (on both sides) has thought of this though!
I saw some Iranian TV where a government bloke was saying precisely this - if they were bombed it wouldn't matter as they have stuff distributed all over the place in tunnels. Same philosophy as Hamas and their tunnels.
I place my bet on Israel using nuke first. Then after that they will follow up with a justification of existential threat to them. They will use it because they can, and because the land mass (Iran many times larger) allows them to do so. Hello, as if Iran is going to nuke Israel because if Iran does that they will also nuke the Palestinians which they won't.
I'm more than just a little concerned that bombing these sites is going to spread highly radioactive crap over the area (and downwind), making parts of Iran dangerous to live in for generations for the normal people in the population that have no choice about how or where they live.
If there legitimately is a stockpile of weapons grade Uranium in Tehran, then making the capital city deadly for the civilian population is a shit thing to do, irrespective of the military expediency.
I can see Israel using a small scale “tactical” nuke on the mountain bunker complex, and the rest of the western world will continue to cry “Israel has the right to defend itself” and “we need to de escalate” .
Israel has so called “tactical nukes”….and I’m convinced they will use it as they’ve been allowed to do whatever they want for the previous 70+ years
I see Israel is now against bombing hospitals, I haven't seem much push back from the media about their gross hypocrisy.
Interesting discussion this morning on ITV breakfast pointing out that a pre-emptive US strike without UN support would be illegal and letting them use British bases to do so would also be illegal - think they were referencing Diego Garcia in particular.
I'm not hopeful that the UK/EU will have the balls to tell Trump that.
I can see Israel using a small scale “tactical” nuke on the mountain bunker complex
Assuming that Israel has a suitable delivery system to get a nuclear payload deep underground, then they wouldn't use it in this case
They'll rely on keeping doors and ventilation systems out of action with conventional bombing because:
1) any nuclear action is a massive escalation and
2) everyone in the region will want one, which effectively removes their trump card by virtue of MAD
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/jun/19/netanyahu-son-wedding-comments-israel-backlash
This is what happens when a psychopath who is responsible for war crimes and genocide tries to do empathy, they of course get it completely wrong and prove that they only care about themselves.
"It really reminds me of the British people during the blitz. We are going through a blitz"
“There are people who were killed, families who grieved loved ones, I really appreciate that"
Each of us bears a personal cost, and my family has not been exempt,”
“This is the second time that my son Avner has cancelled a wedding due to missile threats. It is a personal cost for his fiancee as well, and I must say that my dear wife is a hero, and she bears a personal cost.”
The SECOND time ! No wonder he thinks his dear wife is a hero.
From The Graun this morning:
-----
Regime change in Iran would be “unacceptable” and the assassination of the country’s supreme leader would “open the Pandora’s box, the Kremlin spokesperson has said, a day after the Israeli defence minister said Ayatollah Ali Khamenei “can no longer be allowed to exist”.
Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov told Sky News that Russia would react “very negatively” if Ayatollah Ali Khamenei was killed. “The situation is extremely tense and is dangerous not only for the region but globally,” Mr Peskov said in an interview at the Constantine Palace in Saint Petersburg.
A further expansion of the actors involved would “lead only to another circle of confrontation and escalation of tension in the region,” he added.
-----
On a related note, didn't the plot of Threads involve some sort of confrontation over Iran? Spooky prediction.
This is well worth reading from start to finish. It's a summary of an interview with a former Mossad head. The reason it's worth reading isn't because I expect anyone to agree with his viewpoint, it's because it's important to understand how Israel thinks this might play out.
https://twitter.com/udschachter/status/1935861500431794644
Regime change in Iran would be “unacceptable” and the assassination of the country’s supreme leader would “open the Pandora’s box, the Kremlin spokesperson has said, a day after the Israeli defence minister said Ayatollah Ali Khamenei “can no longer be allowed to exist”.
I doubt the Russians are wrong about opening a Pandoras Box. Just the same as every other time the west has had a go at regime change, it’ll surely go really, really well!
Isn't the general consensus among people who know about such things that it would unleash the usual chaos and carnage but ultimately you’d end up with the military dictatorship, having just swapped the clerics for a junta?
I'm assuming the point that the Russians were making is that taking out a leader you hate with a well targeted bomb/missile does rather leave you open for an identical response.
I'm assuming the point that the Russians were making is that taking out a leader you hate with a well targeted bomb/missile does rather leave you open for an identical response
Exactly. It's a "gentleman's" agreement that countries don't try to assassinate other countries' leaders for exactly this reason. (c.f. Plausible deniability.)
AI says Israel is justified in it's strikes against Iran, even though the Google based AIs seems to have an anti-Israel bias :
And Israel is also right in its claims over land vs Palastine:
The cognitive dissonance really is pretty spectacular, isn’t it?
Accusing others of ‘crossing every moral line’ while you’re actively involved in a genocide that has already killed nearly 60,000 and left an entire population on the verge of starvation?
As my gran used to say “his face’d stand clogging”
The cognitive dissonance really is pretty spectacular, isn’t it?
Accusing others of ‘crossing every moral line’ while you’re actively involved in a genocide that has already killed nearly 60,000 and left an entire population on the verge of starvation?
As my gran used to say “his face’d stand clogging”
It just highlights the fact that there is a certain population of Israel that considers themselves to be a superior race of humans.
We’ve heard that before somewhere……. 🤔
An interesting analysis
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/jun/21/israel-iran-war-outcome-us-analysis
So Trump has now confirmed that the United States has attacked Iran, the Iranian response will be interesting.
I can't see any personal benefits for Trump and I don't know what he thinks it will gain him, especially if this results in American deaths.
WTAF...
Trying to decide whether to visit Xitter to revisit some of the "voting for Trump as he'll keep us out of these endless wars....." MAGA types
So, who are the Israelis going to attack next in self defence ?
Interesting stuff
I can't see any personal benefits for Trump and I don't know what he thinks it will gain him, especially if this results in American deaths
+1
I think that you've got to ask to what end
Diplomacy was still an option. Iran's offensive options weren't great before the bombing as Philip H. Gordon, national security adviser to Vice President Kamala Harris, wrote in the New York Times on the 17th
With much of its top military leadership eliminated, air defenses devastated, missile production and delivery systems taken out and regional proxies largely disabled, escalating or engaging in a long war against Israel will not turn out well for Tehran. To race to produce a nuclear weapon — perhaps tempting as a last resort to restore deterrence — would very likely bring the United States directly into the conflict, including with its bunker-busting bombs that could destroy Iran’s best-protected underground uranium enrichment site. Attacking Iran’s neighbors’ oil production facilities or exports would reverse the recent thaw in regional relations and could invite military retaliation by leaders long eager to get rid of the Iranian regime. Launching cyber- or terrorist attacks on Israeli or U.S. targets could cause significant pain and damage, but would be unlikely to undermine either nation’s resolve and could do the opposite. (my emphasis)
On Tuesday (17th) President Trump publicly disagreed with his director of national intelligence, Tulsi Gabbard, when she told a Senate Intelligence Committee hearing in March that Iran wasn't building a nuclear weapon.
TG (March) “The IC continues to assess that Iran is not building a nuclear weapon and Supreme Leader Khamenei has not authorized the nuclear weapons program that he suspended in 2003.” https://www.factcheck.org/2025/06/trump-gabbard-comments-on-iran-nuclear-capability/
DJT (June) “I don’t care what she said. I think they were very close to having one.”
She then attributed her March statement to media taking it out of context
I'll leave you, the jury, to decide the facts and necessity of the air strike, which historically tends to harden the resolve of the bombed nation. It's also a huge departure from Trump, man of peace, because you can't strike a nation in this manner and expect to walk away after one strike
"My proudest legacy will be that of a peacemaker and unifier" (DJT, January 2025)
PS I fail to see how Trump could come to the conclusive battle damage assessment of "totally obliterated" on publicly announcing the strike. That assessment will take days, if not weeks.
I can see that the WW3 and Trump threads will become a cross-posted mess
