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I'm not registered to a GP, will the NHS know my details?
Forgot to add a link to the Green Book - relevant sections would be for influenza vaccination.
I’m not registered to a GP, will the NHS know my details?
Currently, or ever?
Supposedly you will be contacted by the NHS, but that presumes your contact details are up to date. My advice? Try to register with a GP practice in your area.
https://www.nhs.uk/nhs-services/gps/how-to-register-with-a-gp-surgery/
But @TiRed, the calculation is still just a pile of bollocks. According to your approach, the new disease would be considered less harmful if a few more of its mildly-ill victims had been sent unnecessarily to hospital to kick their heels for a few days. *Regardless of the total number who actually died*. It's an arbitrarily-selected bit of cherry-picking that can only mislead - the sort of thing that gives a bad name to statistical analysis. And indeed statistical analysts.
chronic respiratory disease, including chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), cystic fibrosis and severe asthma
That's the thing, asthma uk say that the guidance of 'severe asthma' on the jvci list you posted above is incorrect, as severe asthma would put you in priority group 4, and that any one with a steroid inhaler (indicating moderate to mild) would be in 6. I definitely don't have severe asthma, usually defined as requiring far stronger oral steroid medication.
https://twitter.com/asthmauk/status/1341347824999538688
The key thing for you, who, IIRC, has mild to moderate asthma, is that the approach is ‘set out in the Green Book’, which is the standard ‘immunisation bible’ for the NHS. And means that those groups considered sufficiently at risk to receive the flu jab should be included in phase 6. That’s my reading of it, anyhow.
The green book further confuses things tbh,as it indicates any one with a steroid inhaler gets a flu jab, however the guidance for coronavirus jab indicates you need to have been prescribed regular oral steroids to qualify for group 6.Yet the previous government guidance states anyone who has to take regular oral steroids (ie has severe asthma) should have been in the shielding group, and my understanding is if you were shielding you'd be in group 4. Unless I missed the bit in the green book that indicated groups considered sufficiently at risk to receive the flu jab should be included in phase 6? If i did can you share..ta
Basically tons of conflicting info out there. The nhs site itself states that non severe asthma is a risk factor, directly contradicting your post i assume taken The jvci guidance.
Edit..just saw the green book link. The covid vaccine guidance is chapter 14a
Yes, you're considered at risk, but not extremely vulnerable, so would be in phase 6, according to the thread you've posted from Asthma UK. If they've sought and received guidance on this specific issue, then that would seem to settle the question as far as you're concerned.
The list I posted earlier was the 'extremely vulnerable' categories.
If they’ve sought and received guidance on this specific issue, then that would seem to settle the question as far as you’re concerned.
Yep hopefully in group 6, but I'm assuming the gp will take their guidance from the green book, which is very specific about oral steroids. I've emailed my gp the asthma uk post asking for clarity.
Edit..
The list I posted earlier was the ‘extremely vulnerable’ categories.
Nope that's the group 6 categories I think.
The rest of this comment is deleted.
So I've been sending info about the safety of vaccines to a friend who is a care worker and might be offered the vaccine sooner than most as she mentioned she might wait as she's not sure. When i asked why she said 'she'd heard there might be fertility issues' she'd not read anything herself just listened to others at work talking about it.
I wonder if this is something to do with the Bill Gates thing?! Have there ever been any genuine issues with vaccines and fertility? I'm not annoyed with her personally as she is not very scientifically minded and is a very easily led, gentle soul.
I've not really looked into the whole Bill Gates thing myself as it seemed so out there but I actually met a Swiss couple the other day who were trying to explain it all to me and were totally adamant it is true. I must admit i tuned out and had had a few beers so can't really remember what they were saying but they are both in there 50's professional, intelligent people so i was rather taken aback as i imagined it was the preserve of disenfranchised Internet nutters not normal everyday people i might meet. It makes me start to doubt my own trust and belief in things at times when confronted with so many conflicting ideas. I think what keeps me relatively straight is that i studied the sciences at a level and then did a bsc at uni and so have learned how to assess what is credible or not but that combined with another friend sharing guff on Facebook that can be disproved with a quick bit of research has got me feeling worried for the world.
Now I've just gone on Facebook and the guff sharing friend has posted a pic of the slopes in Verbier. Just arrived from tier 4! How is that even possible when I thought that other countries weren't excepting uk holiday makers since this new strain?!
Edit friend is happier about the vaccine after reading the bits I've sent her 🤞
The £10 will barely touch the sides of the cost incurred by the vaccine program. GPs will lose income from dropping all the other public health stuff and the vaccination targets were high and will be a real challenge to meet and hence get paid
The way that GP practices are paid for all the work they do is bizarre, complicated, and arcane. They are essentially private contractors, and this kind of thing is far from unusual. It's not that they have to be incentivised to do something that should already be part of their job, it's just that they are paid for vaccinating people on a piecework basis anyway.
The £10 will barely touch the sides of the cost incurred by the vaccine program. GPs will lose income from dropping all the other public health stuff and the vaccination targets were high and will be a real challenge to meet and hence get paid
This too. They will most likely be losing more income by cancelling other paid activity.
From here https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/coronavirus-vaccination/coronavirus-vaccine/ updated today.
<h2>Advice if you're of childbearing age, pregnant or breastfeeding</h2>
There’s no evidence the COVID-19 vaccine is unsafe if you’re pregnant or breastfeeding. But more evidence is needed before you can be routinely offered the vaccine.The JCVI has updated its advice to recommend you may be able to have the vaccine if you're:
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pregnant and at high risk of serious complications of coronavirus
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if you're breastfeeding
Speak to a healthcare professional before you have the vaccination. They will discuss the benefits and risks of the COVID-19 vaccine with you.
You do not need to avoid pregnancy after vaccination. The vaccine cannot give you or your baby COVID-19.
The GP payment will have to cover things like leasing a large facility capable of getting 500-1000 patients/day through safely
Plus staff overtime (admin staff etc), consumables etc
It won’t be going into GPs personal pockets I can assure you
What has happened to the 4million doses of the Oxford vaccine we had ready? Now they are saying we have 500k ready to go?
^ political numberwang at work
No cherry-picking - it's all about conditioning. If we switch to a vaccine like analogy and take a population of 3400 and give half treatment A and half treatment B and observed 42 events, what is the likelihood of a split 21-21 or in this case 26-16? If you are a Bayesian and want an informative prior (beta(2,2) for example), then the posterior will be beta(43,27) - how does that compare with 50-50? Well surprisingly, there is a 97% probability that the proportion is different from 50-50.
From that study, the old strain has a higher admission rate (1.6x) but lower mortality (0.83x). The odds ratio is just your chances should you find yourself in hospital and odds ratios that big are unusual. It's possible that some imbalance in patient characteristics explains the finding - for example region; are London hospitals (with new strain) overwhelmed compared to those with WT. But I'd be looking for something, because 12/16 deaths is notable but 10/26 is typical.
she’d heard there might be fertility issues
The vaccines have yet to complete reprotox studies. That's unsurprising because such studies require the dosing of pregnant rhesus monkeys, then monitoring the offspring (the animals are not euthenised either, they go into the breeding colony). These are some of the longest and most expensive studies. There has barely been enough time to run and report them. The precautionary principle means that there is no data. Normally new investigational medicines are not given to "women of childbearing potential" until the studies have read out. No conspiracy, just the timescale for drug development.
Of note, some vaccines for RSV are now being delivered to the pregnant mother with the explicit expectation of passive transfer of antibodies to the newborn. These vaccines will have undergone the above testing. There is a long history of administering vaccines to the pregnant, but absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Treatment must be based on benefit risk. The risk is not yet characterized, but pregnancy increases risk of severe COVID by about four times.
The GP payment will have to cover things like leasing a large facility capable of getting 500-1000 patients/day through safely
Plus staff overtime (admin staff etc), consumables etc
It won’t be going into GPs personal pockets I can assure you
Brewdog have offered use of their "facilities" for free. Premises, fridges, admin staff and all.
What has happened to the 4million doses of the Oxford vaccine we had ready?
Aiui the 4 million doses need batching up and sticking into those little vials (then tested and approved) before they get stuck into your arm, so 4 million sat in big barrels of vaccine, 500k in jab friendly packaging.
Ta - that makes sense. Id heard talk of a shortage of glass vials too...
I see in the news tonight the Nightingales are being ‘readied’, in part by HM Forces.
why do i get the feeling the current death rate vs being the christmas grinch was a political decision.... blood on their Blowjo's hands again.
Current death rate is from two weeks ago. Now look at cases in the past seven days... 🙁
Current death rate is from two weeks ago.
christmas isn't just the 25th, it's mid November onwards. They didn't want it to cramp their own style so now we pay the price in blood.
How much of this is down to Christmas mixing and how much down to the more contagious virus do we reckon?
I see in the news tonight the Nightingales are being ‘readied’, in part by HM Forces.
One would kinda hope that all elements of the armed forces which are not deployed on live military ops had been allocated to COVID already.
It’s not quite like that. Many medical HM Forces work day in, day out within the NHS. And are now being deployed.
In the mad world of government budgets, the military charge HMG for any work, so no, they won’t have been sadly.
I see in the news tonight the Nightingales are being ‘readied’, in part by HM Forces.
Well, HM Forces built most of them.
It’s not quite like that. Many medical HM Forces work day in, day out within the NHS. And are now being deployed.
Get that, my point is that wherever there is something that can be done by armed forces, for example forthcoming injection of vaccines which could presumably be done by suitably trained trauma first aiders of which there should be a multitude, hopefully it is or will be.
In the mad world of government budgets, the military charge HMG for any work, so no, they won’t have been sadly.
Yes I know that from work (we whistled up a nimrod on the hurry up once but fortunately it was a colleagues dad who was in charge so we got it for nada) it is quite frankly cobblers especially in the midst of a pandemic where anyone with half a brain would deploy all available assets but , Tory fwits innit
how much down to the more contagious virus do we reckon?
In the south cases and admissions started growing before the end of lockdown. This was at odds with the rest of the country where there was a downturn in cases, admissions and latterly deaths. So I’m loath to say cases are just down to Christmas mixing. And if cases spike in the SW, NW and NE this week, then one can infer additional mixing as a cause. Admissions will be next week, but they’ve been slow to update them online over the holiday, so can’t yet say.
It genuinely feels like something has materially changed in the virus activity. Up here in Scotland we're suddenly seeing numbers we haven't before. Compliance up here has been pretty good and i haven't sensed a significant change in the last few weeks. From listening to colleagues in London they are approaching the point of care rationalisation. My gut, although I'm hoping I'm wrong, is we're about to enter a whole new phase of the pandemic in the UK, possibly worldwide. Thinking of my colleagues down south tonight.
Who'd have thought that we'd have nearly a million vaccinations done by the end of the year though?.
#glasshalffull
I just hope vaccine rollout can really hit high speed now.
sadly it isn't going to save the numbers over the next few months but hopefully it will save many more in time.
Normally new investigational medicines are not given to “women of childbearing potential” until the studies have read out. No conspiracy, just the timescale for drug development.
Thanks Tired. So it's unusual that this new vaccine will be offered to a woman in her 30's?
It genuinely feels like something has materially changed in the virus activity.
It could just be winter.
It could just be winter.
They've just identified New Variant cases (not linked to overseas travel) in California, which is mostly still pretty warm and sunny, so the extent to which it has contributed to their current crisis will become clear fairly soon.
Good point. We’ll see. We were expecting transmission to be different here when it ramped up during a second winter “wave” though, so should have been ready for this.
We were expecting transmission to be different here when it ramped up during a second winter “wave” though, so should have been ready for this.
When cases increased (strongly) in these SE areas throughout the relative lockdown in November, all bets were off. There's no way you can get the NHS ready for normal winter pressures + pandemic strain + a signficantly nastier pandemic strain emerging in the autumn. Well, not without instantly reversing the underinvestment and skills drain we've had over the past decade or more.
By “ready”, I meant ready to act to reduce transmission sooner. You can’t magic up NHS staff. Prevalence should not have been where it was before we even got to November. “We” arrogantly thought we could live with prevalence at a level where hospitals could just about cope. That leaves no margin for any new surprises, be it from a new strain of this virus, or flu, or a particularly harsh winter.
So it’s unusual that this new vaccine will be offered to a woman in her 30’s?
As I say it’s down to benefit risk and informed consent. Ultimately it will be up to the individual with incomplete information. If that woman has other risk factors, then the recommendation will likely be to practice contraception. Guess what? In clinical studies unplanned pregnancies still happen and are monitored almost indefinitely in a pregnancy register once drugs are approved.
But I’m sure those reporting those studies will be running as fast as possible.
Not sure what more they could have done from December onwards, TBH. Their modelling would have initially been guided by Tier 3 appearing to work in Liverpool (with the old strain), so the November lockdown should have provided some degree of suppression around Christmas. The degree to which it failed was the kicker, all the modelling in the world can't prepare you for that.
Still - Happy New Year to everyone. The memories of the next couple of months will hopefully start to fade as the sun comes back in March/April.
Not sure what more they could have done from December onwards, TBH.
Which bit of “sooner” did you not get? The die was cast by November, never mind December, options were reduced by past actions, again. Short lock down at half term, with schools closed as well, was needed. That’s not hindsight. With a virus like this, you need prevalence kept low, to stand any chance of controlling spikes in transmission. Other countries get this… why don’t we?
Stay safe everyone and thanks for all the advice and information offered in this thread.
I know it helped me through this year and it will do into the next.
STW, at its very best. No, people at their very best.