[Closed] What do 'Business Analysts' do?

They prevent the business people from explaining what they want to the developers. See also product owners.

Analyse.... Business.

Or:

There are quite a lot of them involved in this work project at the moment. They sit at the side of meetings and don’t say much, but do have posher laptops than anyone else.

I presume they’re doing something important, but what?

What do they do in your organisation?

Titles in the title.

Ask them, indulge yourself.

Learn about other parts of the organisation and what others do..

It's educating.

But I guess you'd rather come on here and ask the question instead of building up relationships in your own workplace.

Says a lot really.

"They sit at the side of meetings and don’t say much" that's because WE are we're busy listening, taking notes and analysing!

When ever anyone asks me what my role involves as a business analyst, my fast/easy answer is that I am the go-between between the business and IS.

What do ‘Business Analysts’ do?

They identify the next lot of people to get "streamlined"

“They sit at the side of meetings and don’t say much”

"....much like lions, silently gazing at a herd of wildebeest, to identify the weak and the injured"

I'm one, have been for pretty much twenty years.

They prevent the business people from explaining what they want to the developers.

A good one will help the business people to work out what they really want, and make sure the developers understand that too, rather than developing what they think the business people want.

A (probably weak) analogy; imagine someone wanted a house built but had no experience of building a house; would it be better for them to talk straight to the brickies or talk to someone like an architect who can help them tease out exactly what they want to get from the house.

I think I'm pretty good at it and my clients seem to think so too. There are, however, many who are bobbins. In my experience permie BA's are generally the latter, contractors generally the former.

A (probably weak) analogy; imagine someone wanted a house built but had no experience of building a house; would it be better for them to talk straight to the brickies or talk to someone like an architect who can help them tease out exactly what they want to get from the house.

Clearly, you've never had a conversation with an architect 😉

Business Analysis is such a wide term now!

Ideally, they should help gather requirements, write criteria in which devs should follow to build. whether that's stories, Acceptance Criteria or Design documents.

As above, can act as a go-between Devs and business; translator, design, analytics - a bit of everything really!

my fast/easy answer is that I am the go-between between the business and IS.

🤷🏻‍♂️

But I guess you’d rather come on here and ask the question instead of building up relationships in your own workplace.

Says a lot really.

perhaps it does. in my reading, it says that I am daunted by these big rooms full of high rollers with opaque job titles that I get summoned to a couple of times a year, and that I'm embarrassed to ask questions like that, for fear of emphasising my obviously junior status.

I was admittedly flippant in the OP, so perhaps I gave a different impression, but it was a enuine question.

It's what I do.

The main thing for my role is making sure 'improvements' are based on actual data and not just the whims of someone in the operation. Almost every company I've worked in has suffered from people that think they know what is wrong and what will fix it. Usually they are wrong.

A good one will be able to identify root cause, define the scale and impact, understand if a solution will work, and to what extent, then be able to communicate that to both the operation and to developers. A bad one will take whatever the head of a department says they want and in a roundabout and complex way misrepresent that to a developer so the solution neither works nor gives anyone what they want, never mind what they need.

rather than 'go-between' I use the phrase translator.

bad ones just sit and write down everything verbatim and then chuck it over the fence to the devs. Bascially well paid Dictaphones.

good ones help develop the business's thinking, and often have experience of the domain the change is needed in so can help with influencing sensible type requirements, and are respected by the dev teams for the insight they can bring (and the prevention of hospital passes)

OP - If the most junior person in a large meeting came up to me afterwards and asked what I did (with my posh laptop), I'd probably offer to arrange a time to sit down and explain over coffee/tea/beverage.

Most people are quite nice, it can be daunting to ask initially but it's a great way of finding out more about your company and could even lead to something interesting.

My mate is a business analyst and every time I ask him what he actually does on a day-to-day basis in his job, he mumbles a bit & then changes the subject.

I am not sure if he just doesn't want to talk about it, doesn't actually know or is really a bin collector & doesn't want to admit it.... 🙂

A (probably weak) analogy; imagine someone wanted a house built but had no experience of building a house; would it be better for them to talk straight to the brickies or talk to someone like an architect who can help them tease out exactly what they want to get from the house.

no that is quite useful, thanks. Makes sense. In this analogy I am probably a cook or, uh, someone who otherwise will be using the new house for their work....

I’m in the IT side, have a number of Business Analaysts working for me. Invaluable role to be honest. We are a large enterprise organisation. The technology team need clear well defined requirements, this can’t come from an individual, especially in cross functional applications. A business analysyt will look at the entire user journey and will understand the totality of proposed changes. This will then be documented and articulated in a manner the technical team understand. During a project they will also be able to perform the opposite function, breaking down the technical solution into a way that each of the business areas can understand.
IT are a support function of the business, a good BA will ensure that the tail does not wag the dog, but still understand the technical constraints IT will be working within.

My mate is a business analyst and every time I ask him what he actually does on a day-to-day basis in his job, he mumbles a bit & then changes the subject.

Perhaps he's a Tory MP and just uses 'business analyst' as a cover....

Ideally, they should help gather requirements, write criteria in which devs should follow to build. whether that’s stories, Acceptance Criteria or Design documents.

Isn't that just Product Management?

I like your explanation best xraymtb.

Can we swap you for the one we've got here?

IT are a support function of the business, a good BA will ensure that the tail does not wag the dog,

Welcome to my world.

As a one-liner, I would describe Business Analysis as making useful information available to the right people.

Organisations have lots of information floating around, but it is often poorly documented, confusing or ambiguous, and frequently hidden from the people that need it. Business analysis is about cutting through that to identify what is really required and documenting it in a way that everyone can understand. This frequently involves translating between different parts of the business who have expert knowledge about what they do, but are not necessarily good at communicating this information to people outside their area.

They prevent the business people from explaining what they want to the developers. See also product owners.

Exactly the opposite of this. BAs turn business aspirations into something concrete that developers can work with, and ensure both parties have agreed the scope of what is being delivered, and what is not being delivered.

More generally, particularly as a contractor, Business Analysis is a bit of a jack-of-all trades problem solving job, and you could be working on any stage of a project, from inital requirements through to delivery. None of the projects I work on are exactly the same, and my job usually changes even within the life of a single project.

Based purely on the comments on this thread, it sounds like they’re prime B-Ark material. (-:

At least they'll get good haircuts...

Isn’t that just Product Management?

Not quite, but the whole adoption of Lean/Agile/SaFE/Scrum etc is having quite an effect on the traditional role of the BA. A lot of very traditional BA's are struggling with the new ways of working.

In this analogy I am probably a cook or, uh, someone who otherwise will be using the new house for their work….

So the BAs should be talking to you about what you need to cook, how often, for how many people, how often you may have days you have to cook for miles more people than usual, how many people are cooking alongside you, how often you order your ingredients, how much storage space you need, what appliances you use, what appliances you think you need and why etc etc...

Sometimes, the name 'business analyst' is given to some poor gradaute who is given a load of documents about a business and has to plough through making what they think are 'requirements' for a project. Those people I pity.

A really good BA though, they are the ones who take charge of the process of figuring out what the project actually needs to be, rather than what all the involved parties imagine it should be. They should make everyone think the right way to get the results they want.

The example I always used to give was as follows:

Customer: All dates input into the system should be valid.
BA: What do you mean by valid?
Customer: You know, valid dates, like not the 99th of Octember.
BA: Are dates in the future valid?
Customer: No. Well, yes.. sometimes. But not always.
BA: What about dates in the past?
Customer: Of course!
BA: So is 12th June 1685 valid?
Customer: Obviously not.
BA: So when is the cut-off point for valid dates?
Customer: Oh er.. Hmm.. I don't know.
BA: So, we need to decide that. Also - if someone enters a date, then what do we do?
Customer: Raise an error message obviously.
BA: Where? On the form page?
Customer: Sure.
BA: But that means you won't be able to enter it into the system.
Customer: Perfect.
BA: But you want to send them a letter telling them that the date is incorrect. So it has to be stored in the system.
Customer: No but.. oh.. right.. hmm

And so on. If you don't have someone really good at the BA role, who might not have the BA job title - then your project is pretty much doomed. Seriously. People love to quote the B-Ark, but remember that in the book all the clever smug people back on Golgafrincha were ultimately wiped out by a disease contracted from a dirty telephone.

Note I am not a BA, but as a developer and architect I've learned how important good ones are. And how destructive bad ones can be.

but as a developer and architect

Everyone in IT's a bloody architect these days 😉

Good BA vs Bad BA:

Customer - I want a boat

Bad BA - What kind of boat?

Good BA - Why?

Everyone in IT’s a bloody architect these days

Me too!

Good BA vs Bad BA:

Customer – I want a boat

Bad BA – What kind of boat?

Good BA – Why?

Worse BA -"I think they said they need a goat - we got any camels they could use?"

So the BAs should be talking to you about what you need to cook

and they should be talking to the business about whether they need to employ a cook at all, or whether it would be more beneficial to find another approach to meeting the outcome (which is presumably people being fed)

Do all these Business Analysts and 'Developers' exist in say, Germany?

and they should be talking to the business about whether they need to employ a cook at all

Certainly not with any tenure, a zeros hour contract would be much better. Plus do they really need a rest room and toilet facilities, money to be saved there....

Do all these Business Analysts and ‘Developers’ exist in say, Germany?

Not all of them, no.

So the BAs should be talking to you about what you need to cook, how often, for how many people, how often you may have days you have to cook for miles more people than usual, how many people are cooking alongside you, how often you order your ingredients, how much storage space you need, what appliances you use, what appliances you think you need and why etc etc…

I see - so far I have been speaking to the Business Improvement Manager about all that, and had assumed her role was roughly what the BA role has been described as here. Which is partly why I was wondering what the BAs did. But it's a big project so I can well see the need for more than one person to do that.

Everyone in IT’s a bloody architect these days

Can you send some of em my way - most of ours are crap (or need a couple of assistants).

Since we don't employ any BAs, or at least anyone with that title, how does one become one? What is the career progression?

As for how I ended up as an 'architect', I can't recall other than one day my then boss gave me a new job title with the word in it and I must have said 'OK' or something like that. Other than that, nothing actually changed. I do have 'architect' imposter syndrome where I assume all the other ones know what they're doing. Maybe I should become an 'Analyst', I could do with a shiny new laptop 😉

how does one become one? What is the career progression?

Many (like me) come from a dev background - developer to systems analyst to business analyst (that's not supposed to imply a hierarchy BTW)

Many of the 'architects' these days are what we used to call systems analysts.

I've just applied for a role titled Agile Business Analyst at my work, hopefully I get to join the BA community on here!

hopefully I get to join the BA community on here

What???  Is that another section like the Premier Forum?

this thread has really given me a laugh. No offense intended but those who know what BAs are, explaining it in incomprehensible gobbledegook really helps!

One key thing surely should be the ability to explain things in english that normal folk can understand

"cross functional applications."
"experience of the domain the change is needed in so can help with influencing sensible type requirements"
"whether that’s stories, Acceptance Criteria or Design documents."

None of those phrases mean anything to me and I cannot even tease out the meanings.

All trades have their opaque gobbledegook including mine. My favourite from nursing still remains. "an ontological hermanutic approach" Eventually after reading the piece of research and after spending some time with the dictionary I grasped that this means - " a storytelling look at"

None of those phrases mean anything to me and I cannot even tease out the meanings.

It's a bit like when you and Drac and Dr P talk about medical hurty things.

Edit - 10 mins too late

Edit 2 - Onto the second page, and no-one's had a pop at the UXers (a branch of Business Analysis).

One key thing surely should be the ability to explain things in english that normal folk can understand

Indeed. And in words of single syllables for developers to understand 🙂

and in pictures for graphic designers to understand?

Do all these Business Analysts and ‘Developers’ exist in say, Germany?

Why is 'developers' in quotes there? It's not some fake silly job role, developers are the people who actually write the code so about as down-to-earth as you can get. And yes they have them in Germany and in any country where they write code. German for 'developer' is 'entwickler'.

I promise these roles are not nonsense, they are important, and if you do it wrong it buggers up the entire project. The shitty IT projects and 'new software's you've come across are bad because the analysis is not done properly. It's rarely the developers' fault.

Many are highly skilled in the art of sales prevention.

It’s rarely the developers’ fault.

It's usually everyone's fault.

Business analysts pick the grapes.

UX designers make the wine.

🙂

Our business analyst has a mug that says "Business Analysts: Solving problems you didn't know you had, in ways that you don't want" He didn't choose the thug life though.

I see Homer's not happy with Binner's work.

UX designers pick the grapes.
UI designers make the wine.

FTFY

Everyone in IT’s a bloody architect these days

I'm a Technology Strategist!

Please don't ask me to explain what it is though.

I used to be a Business Analyst though. Career went IT Support, Developer, BA, IT Architect, Technical Lead, manager of people, manager of more people, Innovation Lead, Head of Innovation... Technology Strategist.

Most of the roles I've really liked come down to "talking to people about what they'd like to achieve, then getting others to help them do it".

“experience of the domain the change is needed in so can help with influencing sensible type requirements

Shall I help with plainer English?

In your context....working on a project that is delivering something to a bunch of nurses. The BA probably was, or knows very very well nursing (the domain) where the project is going to be uised (change)

influencing sensible requirements means someone who has a scooby about how things work in the real world (of nursing in my example) helping to design the new thing so it has some actual chance of being used by the people (the nurses) it is being supposed made for and does what it is supposed to (meets the objective).

Don't think that was really much BizTalk gobbledegook was it?

Being condescending is another key skill 😉

I'm not a BA I'm a part time EA 🙂

(I had a couple of years stint of managing a BA team amongst others...)

UXers (a branch of Business Analysis).

Can't believe I've just seen this. I know a number of UX'rs who would be very offended by this. Quite a few BAs too 🙂

Clearly, you’ve never had a conversation with an architect 😉

I once endured an exasperating spell as structural engineer on an NHS project. Meetings were of course run by the architects who had some bizarre ideas. It culminated in me saying something along the lines "no you can't have x, y and z because the bloody thing won't stand up". It earned me a kick under the table from my gaffer.

Still the catering at the meetings was first class and I'm pleased to say the hospital is still standing 30 odd years on.

No one posted this yet?

Good BA vs Bad BA:

Customer – I want a boat

Bad BA – What kind of boat?

Good BA – Why?

When you put it like that, I think perhaps this could be a role I was born to do. I've been doing exactly this most of my working life, I never realised it was a 'thing' with an actual title and everything.

When you put it like that, I think perhaps this could be a role I was born to do. I’ve been doing exactly this most of my working life, I never realised it was a ‘thing’ with an actual title and everything.

I think you might be confusing 'Good BA' with 'Belligerent Techie' 😉

of all the stuff said on here, this is the phrase that I don't understand

We are a large enterprise organisation.

a large organisation that does "enterprise" (whatever that is)?
an organisation that does large enterprises (whatever they are)?

No one posted this yet?

No, probably because it's poking fun at management consultancy.
With a good BA helping you, you wouldn't have made that mistake.

I never realised it was a ‘thing’ with an actual title and everything.

Apply for some jobs then. In my experience, BAs come from a pretty diverse range of backgrounds, and if you can prove you're good at identifying the root causes of problems and understanding how things work then you'd walk in I reckon. People are (or should be) desperate for competent BAs that can sort stuff out.

dt 78. actually that is a good plain english explanation and I do not find it condescending

Plain english is one thing I think really important and find gobbeldegook is often used to hide meanings and to cover up lack of knowledge.

I did once send an incomprehensible buzz word filled email back to sender with a request for a plain english. Plain english is the key to understanding and effective communication

A good BA, pictured yesterday...

Where's his maracas ?

He don't need no maracas fool!

I think you might be confusing ‘Good BA’ with ‘Belligerent Techie’ 😉

Yeah, you well may be onto something there. (-:

In my experience, BAs come from a pretty diverse range of backgrounds, and if you can prove you’re good at identifying the root causes of problems and understanding how things work then you’d walk in I reckon.

One of my favourite previous roles I've had was basically the techie equivalent of Red Adair. We'd have escalation cases where some obscure problem had occurred, no-one knew how to fix it or even whose team was responsible for it (eg, a voicemail server - the voice guys go "it's a server" and the server guys go "it's voicemail"), it'd get passed from pillar to post for a fortnight with a dozen different people poking impotently at it until finally the customer exploded, at which point they'd drop me into the middle of it to sort it all out.

I'd work out what the problem was, come up with a solution, identify who should be dealing with it and then (the best part) half the time I could kick it back to them to sort out rather than having to do the mundane bit myself. I absolutely loved it and (#WhatModesty) was bloody good at it.

Food for thought if I ever get sacked. Hmm.

They are the unicorn.

And in words of single syllables for developers to understand

Who are these developers of which you speak? Everyone is an Engineer now.

UXers (a branch of Business Analysis).

This is becoming one of my favourite threads.

Can’t believe I’ve just seen this. I know a number of UX’rs who would be very offended by this. Quite a few BAs too

Yes I have been offended by quite a few BAs too 🙂

In actual real world practical terms , the role of a business analyst could be compared to that of the string quartet playing on the deck of the Titanic as it plunges to the bottom of the Atlantic...

😀

You know, if you did a Geography degree or something, and still don't really know what you want to be, but know you don't want to be a teacher? 🙂

I’m a Technology Strategist!

Please don’t ask me to explain what it is though.

Doss about on the internet.
Chuck random moon on a stick type ideas at management.
Cackle at large salary and managerial acceptance of ideas as future projects.

None of those phrases mean anything to me and I cannot even tease out the meanings.

You don't know about the three sea shells?

So if " people who can, do; those who cannot, teach" where do business analysts fit in?

UX designers pick the grapes.
UI designers make the wine.

FTFY

UI designers impersonate UXers to get a higher day rate, giving everyone a bad name in the process.

F *T* FY

Everyone is an Engineer now.

This is true.

One of my favourite previous roles I’ve had was basically the techie equivalent of Red Adair. We’d have escalation cases where some obscure problem had occurred, no-one knew how to fix it or even whose team was responsible for it (eg, a voicemail server – the voice guys go “it’s a server” and the server guys go “it’s voicemail”), it’d get passed from pillar to post for a fortnight with a dozen different people poking impotently at it until finally the customer exploded, at which point they’d drop me into the middle of it to sort it all out.

I’d work out what the problem was, come up with a solution, identify who should be dealing with it and then (the best part) half the time I could kick it back to them to sort out rather than having to do the mundane bit myself. I absolutely loved it and (#WhatModesty) was bloody good at it.

That's an 'Incident Manager' then... a good one can be worth his weight in gold when things get stuck.

So if ” people who can, do; those who cannot, teach” where do business analysts fit in?

How about...

People who can do,
those who can't teach,
those who can't teach, teach PE
those who can't teach PE, become BAs