[Closed] Welsh land/footpath access for bikes

I think it is still at the consultation stage. Did you find this?

https://gov.wales/access-reform-advisory-group

Thanks Greyspoke, I had not found that.

Interesting, the final report was to be sent out from the committee at the end of April this year. I couldn't see if there is a timeline after that, but hopefully there'll be some announcement before the end of the summer.

Do you think the Welsh Government will open up the footpaths? By next summer?

I flippin hope so - anything to shift the agenda back to English access laws.

I think it is quite long term. The official position is to look into implementing the results of the consultation, in which a majority were in favour of allowing riding (four legs/two wheels) on footpaths, but a significant number were against it. Encouraging more riding would tie in with the Welsh Government's health etc. policies. A blanket "you can ride on footpaths" law is not the only option, a procedure for designating footpaths as "multi use" on a case-by-case basis, with local consultation etc. is possible - this was mentioned in the https://gov.wales/sites/default/files/consultations/2019-03/sustainable-management-summary-of-responses.pd f">summary of response, presumably because some respondents mentioned it.

Primary legislation is required for this, currently Labour need a vote from somewhere to get legislation through the Senedd, and Plaid will probably support whatever the Welsh NFU wants, so it is still all to play for and more lobbying may be needed. Not sure what the Welsh Conservatives will think about it. One would hope that, despite Covid, the current Government does get round to dealing with it in this Senedd.

Or to put it another way, the fat lady possibly has something pencilled in her diary, but hasn't actually been booked yet.

whatever the Welsh NFU wants

I have always wondered why land owners don't just ask for a footpath allowance, basically free money for doing not much! Probably make boths sides happy too as the Government can say they funded "active" travel.

I think you need the opinion of a 'Farmer in Wales', if only we had such a thing 😉

Ask again in 5 years and there might be answer, these things take a long time to happen.

scuttler wrote:

I think you need the opinion of a ‘Farmer in Wales’, if only we had such a thing

Hmmm, who might that be?

I may not be the best person to ask mind as I see the issue from both sides, ie. it is not just a black or white issue for me, but rather one of many shades of grey. I would love to be able to ride (legally) any where I fancied. But I also get thoroughly peeved when people wander willy nilly across fields that are shut up for silage, leaving gates and litter, climbing over and damaging gates and fences, or leaving them open so my sheep escape among other things. One thing I do think though is that there needs to be a lot more common sense and joined up thinking on the issue, rather than a blanket free for all that those who won't have to deal with the consequences might prefer! A sensible approach would seem to be to allow riding on tracks/paths on open access land and to carry out an appraisal of existing paths/tracks that could be easily opened up to riders in a permissive network of rights of ways across enclosed land. Whether farmers will be able to access public funds for providing increased access across working farmland is a debate that is still needed.

Shouldn’t we be pushing for a strong linkage between agricultural subsidy payments and increased (* and sensible) access for all user types, and a change to existing access laws to remove the ridiculous bias to walking (walkers get 100% of path types, bikes get about 25%).

*sensible - well this is tricky, anyway 2 bobs worth
- a move away from paths that run through the middle of farms/properties
- an understanding that a path that dead ends on a busy, fast, unpavemented road that is 2 miles from the nearest other adjoining path maybe isn’t furthering walking, cycling, horse riding etc in the countryside that much

I think the proposal is to allow everything then restrict it on a case by case basis. So farmers could easily use that to remove access from existing bridleways where it might be problematic. In theory this is a win/win situation - farmers get a genuinely useful recourse to protect sensitive land; we get better access overall.

I think the Senedd are likely to view it favourably because it's pragmatic, progressive, different from England, a visible positive to justify themselves and raise their profile, and it'll help tourism - all of which they are quite keen on.

It'd be nice if they could come up with a legislative framework to improve the landowner responsibility system. A landowner for example could allow people to build on their land under a certain special classification, and even provide a shuttle on weekends, and not be held responsible for people injuring themselves. A danger-sport law or something. You'd just need to put up big signs saying 'if you ride and hurt yourself you cannot sue anyone'.

Think of the trails we'd end up with!

Right, what's Julie Morgan's email address?

I’m not sure how much difference legally being able to ride would make.

I run on the Welsh boarders and the number of gates/fences/stiles is painful. Certainly enough to make any MTB ride pointless

There is scope to open up more areas, such as common land above the S.Wales valleys and Cambrian mountains where there is a lot of open mountainous space, which is currently subject to upland grazing and fairly wild. Definately some permitted access in these areas would be good. However, in the lower hills and valleys, there are already lots of bridleways but so many are un-rideable (overgrown/ poor surface/ start&stop nowhere).

I would like to see more effort in developing these - certainly giving farmers money to maintain bridleways would be good and developing areas like the cambrian mountains or Eppynt commons with a network of tracks would be great.

My experience of trail-building is that it's expensive (our local MTB track of 1 mile cost £100k!) and lengthy.

I don't think it will get as far as a 'right to roam'.

My experience of trail-building is that it’s expensive (our local MTB track of 1 mile cost £100k!) and lengthy.

Proper armoured trails, yes. But that's not what I am talking about - I mean just sensibly de-criminalising and supporting what people already do. Make a framework for it to work for landowners and riders. There are hundreds of miles of great trails that cost nothing but time to create.