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@Kryton57 I note there is an article on Forbes today about the high end secondhand watch market starting to falter, and suppliers of new watches becoming more plentiful relative to supply.
Buy it if it will make you happy.
Buy it if it will make you happy
Can't fault the sentiment but it rather glosses over the difficult question. How do you really know if it'll make you happy until you've actually bought it?
Dangerous thread this.. I've got an old SKX on today, but it's a Philippines market one.. It's part of my modest collection of mostly Seiko watches, some Chinese stuff, some Swiss stuff, and some microbrands that's about 55 strong now.
55! And I’m wobbling over 10….
Useful article thanks IGM, looks as thought the fall will continue to mid ‘25. I’m not buying for investment, but becuase I’ve got a unique chance to enjoy a Panerai for a bit, even if later it has to go. I think with a bit of negotiation it’ll be just sub £4k, I’d get my money back also bearing in mind it’s a discontinued model PAM0104.
Re enjoyment, I’m not thinking about it too much, but when I tried a new one on I got quite an emotional reaction to it, the same way as I did with the SMP. At the same time I’m watching <£1000 watch reviews of Citizens, Chris Wards, new Samurai (yuck), and as nice as they are I can’t bring myself to buy one with the current collection in mind. I tried the new Enamel AT and… nothing.
mostly Seiko watches, some Chinese stuff, some Swiss stuff, and some microbrands that’s about 55 strong now.
Scrub the Swiss and add in a half dozen or so Casio and that's pretty much the make up of my collection. I've only about half your number though!
I'm currently wearing a frankly ludicrous Khuraburi Ti on a canvas strap and I'm loving it.
They're not all nice watches.. some are sentimental, some are cool (I've got a gen 1 RAF Seiko Chrono for instance), some are cheap ones I was given, some are nice ones I've bought myself.. there's a couple of casio's in there too, obviously. 😀
RZE Resolute Pro x Fratello Contour
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Kryton. There’s a 104 on Facebook market place for £3750 in that London FYI.
Blazin Saddles - messaging isn’t working, could you drop me an email at kryton57 at sky dot com please?
Also this one here on eBay (may be the same one Blazin mentioned)
Yes, that the very same one.
Talking of accounting for taste, a friend was offered a rolex GMT by an AD last week, unfortunately it was the root beer, rose gold one which is very vulgar;
https://www.rolex.com/watches/gmt-master-ii/m126711chnr-0002
I was chatting to him on Thursday and he said even though he knew I was after a new watch he knew I’d never wear that one so passed on it.
You're not seriously considering 4 grand on a watch on Facebook market place? Right, I'm off to Turkey with an empty suitcase...
Rootbeer is lovely, rose gold, it's not showy like err....errr gold gold?
Oh and yes, the 32xx movement is a disaster. Rolex seen to have no desire to fix that issue either.
You’re not seriously considering 4 grand on a watch on Facebook market place? Right, I’m off to Turkey with an empty suitcase…
as long as you do due diligence, why not? It’s as good a place to find adverts as any, sometimes good deals. I bought my Black Bay Pro from an advert on there. Nice guy, all the paperwork and receipts and much less money exchanged hands than if I’d bought on eBay/Chrono/Shop.
.
Am I right in thinking that Panerai use ETA / Valjoux movements?
The p9000 (is that the right movement?) Is a unitas (hand wound eta) I'm not sure on the autos....I have a feeling they are unitas with an auto winder added, with a small rotor? Could be imagining that.
Due diligence blazin, yes. I'd do it on the seller as much as the watch, and that's not really possible on Facebook. A watch forum, a long member with good feedback....it may not seem like much but for me and many it is a big confidence boost. Even ebay with its verification service/authentication is pretty good now. Facebook is the wild west by comparison.... plenty of gold nuggets but some real wrong'uns too.
My Panerai, PAM00088 is based on Valjoux 7750-P1. Can’t remember the exact year of mine, but about 2004 I think.
The watch Kryton is looking at contains the OPIII movement I think, OP being the outsourced movement designation. This also based on the Valjoux 7750.
Panerai’s in-house movements are shared between other brands within the group. IWC, Cartier, Baume & Mercier. I think where Panerai have gotten in trouble is when they have described their watches as having in-house movements but in fact had an ETA. I love my Panerai, I’m happy with the movement. When I wear mine I’m never worrying that it’s a Valjoux, equally when I wear my Rolex I’m not thinking about the movement. I get why people do, just not me.
Would I buy a Panerai new at RRP? Nope. Will Kryton’s £3600 Panerai hold its value? I would suggest so.
(I’m on my second Panerai, well aware of the movements….i may be gullible in that regard! Both of mine bought for a price I was very happy with. My last Panerai I managed to part ex a watch that I was struggling to sell, so for me it was a very good deal)
The seller from those adds is a reputable and highly regarded small Jewellers in London FWIW.
Re movements, they originally - at the start of the business many years ago - use Rolex movements, then moved to ETA, and more recently they are in house movements. There are several types - hand wound, auto and micro rotor. When look at the watches you need due diligence on which movement is inside the Watch to decide on your purchasing price.
Panerai is quite interesting in its history. I’m a fan of Panerai, but I’m also well aware of its history.
This is worth a read by someone who clearly isn’t a fan:
https://perezcope.com/2021/08/08/panerai-in-house-movements-a-pam-of-worms/
Thanks for posting that. It was an interesting read.
Oh gee, interesting indeed. I haven’t pulled any triggers yet, perhaps I’m avoiding a triggers broom. I woke up with a hangover and little enthusiasm to buy it, slammed the Slim Turtle on my wrist and continued with my day ?♂️. That article hasn’t helped me be any more positive.
Having said that; most of not all micro brands are out sourced components and it’s likely few mainstream brands haven’t outsourced something? Would I choose an in-house Tudor(?) of which I’m sorry but the IRL looks bore me, or an outsourced Panerai? Perhaps as woodster suggest it’s a question of price point - buying a new £8k Panerai may be a travesty, but buying a less than half price 2nd hand model with eyes wide open might be ok.
Otherwise, I may as well buy the Pagani clone that’s 1/30th of the price.
For me I’m drawn to Panerai for the unique looks, the heritage and the fact that I just love everything Italian.
I knew about the movements before buying mine and I’m ok with that.
For me there’s just something special about it, I much prefer it to my more expensive watches (I'm wearing it today in fact)
More interesting reading for those inclined:-
https://www.fernotime.com/blog/the-history-of-panerai
I think £3600 is a good price for that watch. It’s from a trusted dealer with box and papers and comes with spare strap.
I've likely said ie before but I'll say it again, Eta movements are very very good. Unitas, 2824 etc, valjoux and so on. Sellita sw200 also excellent (they used to make eta 2824 for eta so their own copy should be good shouldn't it?)
Many in house movement are also good but don't get sucked into thinking it's better just because.
Oh and yes panerai were fast and loose with their description of some I house movements, but isn't most of the Swiss watch industry? The rules on 'Swiss made' just need final assembly... the rules on in house allow for a bought in movement to be tweaked in house and described as in house.
Where panerai are less forgiveable is some of their marketing which appears to celebrate their links with Nazi soldiers. They get a lot of stick for that. But then iwc, laco etc are proud of their history and use by the Lufftwaffe. If you like the watch, buy it.
Indeed. I have no issue with ETA or Valjoux whatsoever and wouldn’t hesitate to buy a watch with one. My Breitling has a slightly jazzed up 2824 in it I believe. I have a couple SW200 watches too
Would I spend 7,8 or 9 grand on one though? No, and that’s what I see many Paneria retailing for which blows my mind.
Any recommendations for a watch storage solution for 5 or 6 watches, preferably with room for spare straps etc?
Oh and the issue - nothing in leather please :-).
The more compact the better, just looking for storage not some kind of display case.
I've got a canvas watch roll that fits the capacity requirements, 6 pockets for 5 watches with a spare straps in the final pocket. Trouble is that they seem to universally have a leather tie or strap to keep then closed.
You might have more luck searching for a small tool roll or getting something made.
I’ve got a ‘ballistic’ nylon case with foam inserts for 5 watches, think Oakley case for watches. It’s not hi zoot or anything but it gets the job done.
I'm selling my Smiths PRS-29A as it's just sat in the box since I bought it. If anyone fancies it give me a shout.
I'm just looking for my money back on it.
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Re the Panerai - you snooze you lose, both watches I was in conversation with sold over the weekend. Lesson learned, a sub £4k Panerai in good nick isn’t going to be around for long.
Never mind, there’s plenty of time! (Guffaw….)
I'm in the market for a modestly priced dress watch...thinking maybe vintage omega (other ideas welcome!). Can anyone recommend a shop that does this sort of thing well? I'm not getting 'into' vintage, dont much mind about the whole thing being super original, just want some thing small, ideally gold that looks good with a suit, will tell the time for 24 hours and someone who'll help out when it goes wrong in the future.
Never mind, there’s plenty of time! (Guffaw….)
To be fair, you hadn't done nearly enough hand wringing to make a proper choice. We expect at least six months worth of posts cataloguing each stage of (in)decision 🙂
There'll no doubt be others if it was meant to be or mebbie you dodged a bullet?
We expect at least six months…
Pffft. Just pulled the trigger on a PAM00001 2006.
I know it's not exactly a watch, (possibly more on that in a few days!) but I like my new kitchen clock quite a lot. Variable reviews on accuracy, but seems OK since I installed it on Saturday.
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For ****s sake this forum! Feel like I really wasted my 502 raffle money. ?
Not a great photo, tried to get the setting for context. Also, need a more in-keeping fruit bowl.
Also, need a more in-keeping fruit bowl.
Not a fish bowl you mean?
Bananas need eating
Nice clock though.
Bananas need eating
Might make a bannana loaf tonight. And possibly do something about the lamp so it's not in shadow. Looks better in the daylight.
It came from evil amazon. If the below returns one of them broken kindle links, just search for Karlsson flip clock.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Karlsson-Clock-Black-Chrome-Stand/dp/B01EZAABRM
Great thanks
If you don’t need the money you may want to hang on Derek, Samurai’s may be having a little value bump in the next few years after Seiko’s recent “new” version is a flop in that regard. As per the 2019 Arnie re-issue, these could be cult status in a few years.
@derek_starship I quite like that and frankly do miss the one i sold. (Side bar I wonder how many on this thread do this, sell a watch, regret at leisure, then re purchase it again)
If that’s 200 posted sir you have a deal
id say PM me here on STW, but I’m not sure any of the usual STW framework is working at the moment.
just seen krypton’s comment so if you’re holding on - no drama let me know.
Sorry Walowiz! IANAE, these things arnt going to be £1000’s in the next few years just that’s I (and some others) feel that the replacements potentially leave them in cult status further down the line. As it is today, there’s gazillions on the market and Dereks is a nice example.
Ha ha - having already owned one I’m under no illusions that its future value will be at best maybe as much as I pay now. Maybe 🙂
And that’s ok.
Whistles nonchalantly…
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I'd send that back, not only is the dial upside down, it's backwards too
U wuzz robbed
😀
Mirrors eh…. Here’s the full pic. It’s a Pam001, very clean, ETA/Unitas manual. Stunning condition and less than £3k… Search and Panerai Reg done for authenticity.
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I’m a very lucky boy, this was sub £3k. I’m massively emotional about it, even had wobbly legs opening the box.
Not mine but a friend of mine just acquired a Zodiac See Wolf Chrono:
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Worn one then returned by the original owner, my mates paid less than 1/3 of the RRP!
Love the Panerai. Got yourself a relative bargain! Nice heavy brown box? Spare straps?
Yep fully boxed, Black & Brown leather straps plus the rubber strap all OEM Panerai.
Im sitting watching telly in a state of euphoric disbelief TBH, the weight / feel / quality belies the pics.
In I have to admit, I’m a fan so probably biased….
But I do know what you mean regarding the weight and the feel.
Really glad you’ve got the emotional connection to it!
Jeez, how are you people wearing bulky watches right on the knuckle, or is that just for the photo?
Pam001? Or 00001?
PAM00001.
I was concerned for a moment. The dial didn't look right.
yeah the 001 is the boutique edition right? And had "Firenze" on the dial. Those are in the region of £6-£7k I believe.
No idea, just yours looks like applied numerals, 001 is a sandwich.
Ah. Actually mine is the hollow dial - the indices are indented into the dial and then filled with lume .
Nicely done Kryton. That’s not helped my desire for one!
I’m not that sure of all the different models now if I’m honest. I don’t know how yours is different from a 111, maybe that yours has painted dial and the 111 is a sandwich dial? I need to do more reading. I think my preference is for a symmetrical non seconds variant though, but do be fair I’ve never even tried one on.
I quite like the sub seconds dial at 9. It's a very obvious reminder the first pams were pocket watches with wire 'lugs' soldered on.
but do be fair I’ve never even tried one on.
Once you do there’s no going back! I took at look at my mates GMT when we shared a hotel room in May - he left it on the side whilst showing so I had a good look. I then went to WoS, tried one on and that was it, I was in watch heaven.
Double post
No idea if this uploads works…..but while folks are talking about my favourite subject….Panerai GMT
Ok watchists, what watch is Mark Foster (ex swimmer presenting the BBC Olympic swimming) wearing?
I’m intrigued, I think blue leather strap and possibly a GMT?
Ok watchists, what watch is Mark Foster (ex swimmer presenting the BBC Olympic swimming) wearing?
I’m intrigued, I think blue leather strap and possibly a GMT?
Looks like a planet ocean
I used to be able to use the website to post pics. Not sure where I'm going wrong. Anyway here's my new Tissot Tuning Fork. Very happy with it!