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And $12k is probably what a dealer would charge to do an engine swap on a modern car that's done 125,000 miles.
Wasn't there someone on here talking about an engine swap in (IIRC) a diesel Passat? And he was being quoted £1500 for it. And that's not a standard maintenance item at 125k miles is it?
I'd like to see more electric cars. But I wouldn't buy one now because I can't afford it and I wouldn't be able to charge it up a home or at work due to the parking arrangements.
How did we get into this position where the governments got the facts on diesel vehicles sooo wrong?
Who advised them ?
Who lied to them ?
If people lied on such a scale why is no one going to jail ?
Interestingly(perhaps only to me), I had this conversation at least 10 years ago on a BMW forum with some Americans. I was saying why don't you lot embrace diesels and they were saying because they put out particles that kill you.
Seems they were correct but why the average bloke on US forum knew what nobody with a responsibility for transport in the UK did, I'm not sure.
Suspect we just wanted to sell a few cars.
Why don't I see hybrid vans?
EV vans would be a great idea for town deliveries/work.
How did we get into this position where the governments got the facts on diesel vehicles sooo wrong?
They didn't, really. They encouraged low CO2 cars, which is a good idea. They simply didn't realise that NOx would become quite such a problem. This might be a big mistake or an understandable one, but it was just that. Remember when the CO2 rated VED came out hybrids were new tree hugger weirdo tech, and there were no eco-boost petrol type things and no EVs.
And they didn't specifically promote diesels anyway - just low CO2.
Seems they were correct but why the average bloke on US forum knew what nobody with a responsibility for transport in the UK did, I'm not sure.
Most people in the US are pretty conservative. Petrol heads fantasise over big old V8s for some reason. So the concept of an economical car is anathema. Couple that with some really crap diesels being made during the 70s oil crisis and you give the typical petrol head lots of reasons to *choose* not to like diesels. So they pick up on the bad things reported in the press more than they would otherwise. And TBH the press report it more.
Anyway - how much particulates do DPF equipped cars actually emit?
Who fancies buying a car for £2000 that might need a replacement part that costs £10000?
A Leaf battery won't cost anywhere near that I reckon.
Wasn't there someone on here talking about an engine swap in (IIRC) a diesel Passat? And he was being quoted £1500 for it. And that's not a standard maintenance item at 125k miles is it?
Yes, but that's comparing fitting a brand spanking new battery at dealer prices. To an engine from a breakers yard fitted at a normal garage.
Nissan charge between £70 and £113 per month battery rental for the Leaf.
So that's:
£350 electricity + £1110 for 12,000 miles of motoring (assuming you go for the longest lease and 12,000 miles)
Or in my current car:
£1550 in petrol + £200 in tax.
So if I walked out the house today with enough ££££ to buy a car, the electric one would work out cheaper to run by about £300/year, even including leasing a battery to minimise the risk of having to buy a new battery if it dies. If I just buy the battery outright it's only £5000 for as long as it lasts (10 years at £500/year?).
Anyway - how much particulates do DPF equipped cars actually emit?
In the real world, or on the test rig when it's not regenerating?
[i]Seems they were correct but why the average bloke on US forum knew what nobody with a responsibility for transport in the UK did, I'm not sure. [/I]
Because it didn't matter as the Govt had changed the rules so diesels were cheaper to own/run (especially for company cars).
I had my last company petrol car 2006-2008. After that I went for the allowance as I didn't want to run a diesel. Funny now that I've just bought a diesel, although a +300bhp one 🙂
Anyway - how much particulates do DPF equipped cars actually emit?
In the real world, or on the test rig when it's not regenerating
Quite. I thought the problem was that the most dangerous stuff is too small to get caught in the DPF.
Yes, but that's comparing fitting a brand spanking new battery at dealer prices. To an engine from a breakers yard fitted at a normal garage.
Yeah, that's a fair point. How long has the Model S been out now? Five years? It will be interesting to see how many functional batteries are sitting in breakers yards in another five years time.
In the real world, or on the test rig when it's not regenerating?
Are you saying there's a difference? Are you saying that when they regenerate they create more particulates?
Facts, not insinuation 🙂
There appears to be a market in second hand batteries developing. Online theres video of BMW reusing them as base load for the grid.
I suspect they'll be worth too much to do that. They'll be straight off for recycling.It will be interesting to see how many functional batteries are sitting in breakers yards in another five years time.
You missed the point though, you can get a new* battery from Nissan for a Leaf on what is effectively finance, for less than the cost of running a petrol car. So you could buy a bangernomics Leaf, and be quids in even though there's a big outgoing to Nissan.
*or maybe they'll re-circulate the s/h ones too once there's more in circulation
Facts, not insinuation
That would require getting my phone out to video the clouds of smoke coming from the Passat I followed down the M4 last week. Was that you, you seem quite defensive? 😛
That would require getting my phone out to video the clouds of smoke coming from the Passat I followed down the M4 last week.
So all Passats emit clouds of smoke? I missed that.
Or maybe it's just faulty ones, perhaps with knackered turbos?
bikebouy - Member
mitsumonkey - Member
Good effort though for trying to shoehorn Brexit into every thread.
Thanks, but your lack of a "P" means we don't take your thoughts seriously
Ha ha ha! That coming from a man who can't eat a bag of minstrels without feeling sick and not being able to sleep! What does your "P" stand for? Piss weak?
Arse
Ahh the retort.
Bit later than I expected.
Nice.
****ed turbos an amateur tuners who over fuel - the corner stone of the vag modifiers.
If they are going to offer such a scheme it should be biased to pick out the vehicles which contribute the most
Based upon location and mileage, rather than a blunt incentive
Many be increase fuel duty within the most affected areas + more emission controls
id be quite happy if they made citys diesel free zones tbh.
id be quite happy if they made citys [s]diesel[/s] [b]combustion engine[/b] free zones tbh.
^ My opinion
id be quite happy if they made citys [s]diesel[/s] car free zones tbh
Mildly concerned because we have a 21yr old diesel camper van (which admittedly isn't allowed into several German cities).
Not sure making a whole city car free is viable.
The central centre square km or so should be that's for sure . Such as Ghent - Bruges - Alkmaar - den gelder arnhem
Then you use the park and ride or ride your bike in from an outer location.
It's what I do with Aberdeen now. Ride my bike into the village and take the bus into the centre.
That's what I mean. City centre, but a decent swathe of it, not just a couple of streets.
If the lottery coughs up tonight, I'll be putting in my order for one of these tomorrow!
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Is it a bat mobile
Not sure I'd want that. Doors open funny.
Welcome enlightened one 🙂
Probably best not to google 'model x' though.
RE: the fleet problem mentioned earlier.
My employer has approx 3,000 diesel vans and trucks aged from 1 to 15 years old, so the full range of Euro categories and pollution levels. The cheapest vehicle to replace is £40k, the most expensive is £300k (all custom built, not standard, like most large fleets) so they are only replaced when the old ones die through an MOT failure. As they take a while to come through from ordering the new ones go to our London bases due to the Low Emission Zone banning most of the older vehicles. These older vehicles get spread around the country so the pollution is spread around, as it were. If other towns and cities banned the higher polluting vehicles we would be stumped! Other transport companies would be in the same boat so the changing of a company's fleet will not be quick!
As for the mix of fleet and private diesels in cities, from my observations I'd say the mix in Cardiff during the week is 40% commercial traffic (buses, trucks, vans), 15% taxis (vast majority diesel, one or two Priuses), 20% private diesels (MPV's, SUV's, 4x4's, big saloons mainly), 20% petrol and the remaining 5% on bikes and motorbikes. Which does beg the question about what people will trade in their diesels for? Are all these people running around in their diesel MPV, SUV and 4x4's going to trade for a petrol with it's worse fuel consumption? Downsize to a small petrol car? Electric cars are currently too expensive for the average person so what will they buy? I hope this will be the push that people in general need to buy smaller, more efficient vehicles more suited to their use and end the obsession with cars as big status symbols.
Not sure I'd want that. Doors open funny.
the rear doors really put me off. Means you can't put a surf board/kayak/bike on the roof. Admittedly that means it stops people killing the range with drag but I would have just rather they saved money and complexity.
The seating options in the rear are quite good though. You can have 2 electric luxury seats in the middle row or a conventional 3 seat middle or miss out the rear 2 smaller seats. I think my ideal would be 2 middle seats and no rear seats, I could then fit a nice dog bed in the gap between the seats or stand a bike up in the middle.
Although even with the triple middle row and the rear twin seats in (but folded) you can still get a bike in whole. They are huge.
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Seating options:
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You are supposed to carry sports equipment on the back:
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The guy in the Tesla store asked if I could just use a trailer for my kayak and surfboard 😕