Russia is not interested in Finland unless Finland starts arming themselves with missiles pointing to/at Russia.
So why have they invaded them twice?
FTFY
LOL! NATO spooks them more.
So why have they invaded them twice?
Long history due to being former colony I guess. You know Russian Empire and that sort of things?
But now it's the turn of American empire.
p/s: Crikey, £8 to £9 for a portion of street food! Well, if inflation continues, which I see will, soon most restaurants will not survive. We will all be slaves to the system/govt.
Be interesting to see how putin sells Finish accession to NATO to his domestic audience
Its a huge policy failure for him, one of the reasons for his war that was meant to last 3 days, was to lessen the influence of NATO in the region
hes managed to achieve exactly the opposite of that, he still has a tight grip on power in Russia, but the oligarchs are not happy at what hes done to the economy
https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1640036537436889088
Long history due to being former colony I guess
When Russia invaded Finland in 1939 the performance of the numerically superior Red Army was so poor (sound familiar?) that Adolph Hitler decided to invade Russia
It would be karma if Russia experienced the ignominy of China regaining the territory that it lost to Russia in the late 1850s (the history is longer than that) and left Taiwan on the back burner.
Vladivostock was formerly Chinese (Hai Shen Wai) and the dispute wasn't properly sorted out until 2005. Chinese media still calls for the inequality to be rectified
China has been colonizing Eastern Russia for quite some time, there has been a lot of migration from China and they have set up a lot of businesses there as well IIRC. They are occupying by stealth.
Interestingly, when Lenningrad was under siege from the Germans, the Fins didn't press home the advantage to the North of the city, even though they were at war with Russia at the time.
This inaction by the Fins saved the city from falling to the Nazi's and demonstrates the Fins ambiguous relationship with them.
Apparently, as a thank ypu for not attacking, Stalin left Finland alone after that (If you can believe Stalin ever had a heart...).
Finns are just spooked into joining by NATO.
And yet both them and the Swedes avoided being spooked for years.
It was only after the second invasion of Ukraine and attempt to seize the entire country that for some odd reason the popular mood in those two countries came down strongly on the lets join Nato viewpoint.
Yup, The non-NATO scandis had no intention of joining NATO until this latest russian threat (the threat being russia are activley invading and trying to conquer countries on thier boarders).
Strange, that.
Interestingly, when Lenningrad was under siege from the Germans, the Fins didn’t press home the advantage to the North of the city, even though they were at war with Russia at the time
I'd guess that was to do with the Finnish position. They didn't want to be associated with Nazi Germany; it was more a case of the enemy of my enemy is my friend in regaining Finnish territory rather than advancing into Russia
Be interesting to see how putin sells Finish accession to NATO to his domestic audience
Nothing he can do about it now but just to tell the audience NATO has expanded to their door step. The reality has come true.
Its a huge policy failure for him, one of the reasons for his war that was meant to last 3 days, was to lessen the influence of NATO in the region
While Russia has been busy trying to manage and to improve their economy standing, NATO (Murica specifically) has been sneakily building influence and building their arsenal (Murica especially, I mean look at their budget).
hes managed to achieve exactly the opposite of that, he still has a tight grip on power in Russia, but the oligarchs are not happy at what hes done to the economy
That part of the world works differently from the western worldview. Dictator or not they just have different system.
When Russia invaded Finland in 1939 the performance of the numerically superior Red Army was so poor (sound familiar?) that Adolph Hitler decided to invade Russia
They are Not as Advanced by the way but everyone "learns". Even Hitler failed to invade Russia completely and NATO is thinking they can do better for now.
It would be karma if Russia experienced the ignominy of China regaining the territory that it lost to Russia in the late 1850s (the history is longer than that) and left Taiwan on the back burner.
Not sure who will receive the karma but I suspect NATO too will get some especially Murica. China on the other hand, although I don't like their system, will be difficult to break because historically they have the greatest influence in that region whether the West like it or not. Culturally and ideologically, the region is of Chinese influence.
Vladivostock was formerly Chinese (Hai Shen Wai) and the dispute wasn’t properly sorted out until 2005. Chinese media still calls for the inequality to be rectified
They know that but that is not their objective at the moment. Their objective is get get NATO out of Asia. Yes, out of Asia and eventually it will happen. NATO/Murica, got the "fright" when then the President of Indonesia Suharto dared to oppose Murica/West. In retaliation Muria/West sow the seed of influence to get the opposition to bring his govt down. But the Indonesian people only realised many years later. Furthermore, as usually, NATO then started encircling Indonesia after Suharto (Chinese alliance for many centuries) to keep an eye on them. But things will change if the Muria/West don't keep them sweet, which eventually means slow brewing of tension.
China has been colonizing Eastern Russia for quite some time, there has been a lot of migration from China and they have set up a lot of businesses there as well IIRC. They are occupying by stealth.
No different from past colonial "masters". Same strategy. That's how Western power conquered the world previously.
Interestingly, when Lenningrad was under siege from the Germans, the Fins didn’t press home the advantage to the North of the city, even though they were at war with Russia at the time.
That's because the Finns knew that if they did that they would never sleep well, because there was simply no benefits at all in being greedy. They also knew they would not have enough manpower to maintain the place.
This inaction by the Fins saved the city from falling to the Nazi’s and demonstrates the Fins ambiguous relationship with them.
My guess is that they just wanted a "peaceful" neighbour rather than headache.
Apparently, as a thank ypu for not attacking, Stalin left Finland alone after that (If you can believe Stalin ever had a heart…).
There you go for establishing "good" neighbourhood.
And yet both them and the Swedes avoided being spooked for years.
It was only after the second invasion of Ukraine and attempt to seize the entire country that for some odd reason the popular mood in those two countries came down strongly on the lets join Nato viewpoint.
Their younger generations are just easily influenced. For years they have been "told" or drum in by the West that the evil empire would gobble them up one day if they remained out of NATO. Well, it works. Keep drumming and eventually everyone will dance to the same beat. Murica has been using scare tactics for yeaarrs!! And they are very good at this.
Yup, The non-NATO scandis had no intention of joining NATO until this latest russian threat (the threat being russia are activley invading and trying to conquer countries on thier boarders).
Strange, that.
For years Scandinavian countries were told that same story and eventually they succumbed to the NATO persuasion (more like Murica). NATO knew that in order to get the rest on board the simplest thing and the easiest thing to do is to poke the hornet's nest and then use that as "evidence" to show the world that the evil empire is expanding. Since Russia has never been portray as "civilised" the story fits very well and spooking the Scandinavian countries is much easier than thought.
At the end of the day, Murica is empire building and they know they can because they have already controlled the currency but this is not very stable. Hence, the next step is to control the world but their competitors are not playing ball. That's the problem.
Here is your occasional reminder that NATO has not invaded Russia and is not looking to.
————————-
What would it take to have a “HIDE” post option next to the REPLY & REPORT ones?
Here is your occasional reminder that NATO has not invaded Russia and is not looking to.
Cuba did not invade Murica but see what has happened to them.
Anyone wants to explain why Cuba is treated so badly?
I said:
The non-NATO scandis had no intention of joining NATO until this latest russian threat (the threat being russia are activley invading and trying to conquer countries on thier boarders).
Strange, that.
@chewkw said:
For years Scandinavian countries were told that same story and eventually they succumbed to the NATO persuasion
I think Putin raiding Ukraine, again, may have been the last straw, I doubt anyone "succumbed" to anything.
I can't speak for the Finns, but if I were them, I'd be looking to form or deepen non-russian alliances, given they have quite a large border with a country that is activley starting wars with countries on its own borders.
Here is your occasional reminder that NATO has not invaded Russia and is not looking to.
————————-
What would it take to have a “HIDE” post option next to the REPLY & REPORT ones?
+1
+1
I think Putin raiding Ukraine, again, may have been the last straw, I doubt anyone “succumbed” to anything.
I can’t speak for the Finns, but if I were them, I’d be looking to form or deepen non-russian alliances, given they have quite a large border with a country that is activley starting wars with countries on its own borders.
The narrative of Russia being the evil expanding empire, especially to those countries with boarder to Russia, has been going on for decades. However, Ukraine is a strategic position for Russia and that's why they are not allowed/permitted to be under the influence of NATO/Muria/West, regardless.
Ukraine is a strategic position for Russia and that’s why they are not allowed/permitted to be under the influence of NATO
I'm not if sure you got the memo? Ukraine is a sovereign country. They can do whatever they please, and that includes protecting thier borders and forming allies with other countries as they see fit.
Firstly, NATO didn't invade Ukraine.
Secondly, NATO didn't commit war crimes against Ukrainians.
Thirdly, NATO did not explicitly threaten Sweden and Finland.
Fourthly, in the absence of
What would it take to have a “HIDE” post option next to the REPLY & REPORT ones?
perhaps maybe not keep bollocking on with assertions that have already been debunked and that make very little logical sense.
that’s why they are not allowed/permitted to be under the influence of NATO/Muria/West, regardless.
This quote would be best illustrated with the Benny Hill Theme and with clips of soon to be Russian tank turrets being popped off by the various NATO main battle tanks headed there.
I wonder if chewkw is aware that Putin was actually invited to join NATO? IIRC, he was considering it, but then decided to become an autocratic, authoritarian dictator hell-bent on restoring the Imperial Russian empire with himself as Peter The Great. The man is paranoid and mad as a bag of owls, pretty much cut off from what is going on in the rest of Russia.
However, Ukraine is a strategic position for Russia and that’s why they are not allowed/permitted to be under the influence of NATO/Muria/West, regardless.
I’ve told you before, chewkw, Ukraine was a sovereign country a thousand years ago, it’s rulers were princes from what are now Scandinavia, Vikings, in fact, who were called the Rus; ‘those who build boats’. From Rus comes the word Russia. Kyiv was a city with cathedrals when Moscow was little more than a hamlet in the middle of a forest. Russia owes everything it has to Ukraine, but can’t bear to admit it, hence all Putin’s rhetoric about Ukraine being nothing more than a small district of greater Russia.
Also, look up Saint Olga of Kyiv. A Viking princess who really kicked ass!
I’m not if sure you got the memo? Ukraine is a sovereign country. They can do whatever they please.
So is Cuba but nobody seems to care about them.
Firstly, NATO didn’t invade Ukraine.
Did Cuba invade America?
Secondly, NATO didn’t commit war crimes against Ukrainians.
Nor did Cuba on Americans but other South American cartels I can't say.
Thirdly, NATO did not explicitly threaten Sweden and Finland.
They don't have to because the bogeyman Russia does the job for them.
This quote would be best illustrated with the Benny Hill Theme and with clips of soon to be Russian tank turrets being popped off by the various NATO main battle tanks headed there.
Yes, but why is America so afraid of Cuba a tiny nation? Now that's real Benny Hill moment don't you say? A tiny nation like Cuba? Really?
I wonder if chewkw is aware that Putin was actually invited to join NATO? IIRC, he was considering it, but then decided to become an autocratic, authoritarian dictator hell-bent on restoring the Imperial Russian empire with himself as Peter The Great. The man is paranoid and mad as a bag of owls, pretty much cut off from what is going on in the rest of Russia.
Putin would be a fool if he did that.
They don’t have to because the bogeyman Russia does the job for them.
So the penny has finally dropped? lol.
And, we're back in non-sequiturland again.
@mods - can we perhaps have a Cuba thread so that chewkw can talk crap about Cuba there please?
So the penny has finally dropped? lol.
LOL! Poked the hornet's nest then accused the hornet of being vicious.
Why should he? He would be a fool to do that.
Russia, or possibly more accurately, the Putin regime are still members of the U.N. I belive, but he seems to do everything he can to undermine peace, democracy and having a general global consensus of peace.
It's little wonder he won't join NATO, not that he'd ever be allowed to after the last few years.
I'm pretty sure the U.N. would be glad to see the back of him too.
LOL! Poked the hornet’s nest then accused the hornet of being vicious.
The hornets nest being Ukraine, and the poker being putin? yep, makes sense.
Ukraine is a strategic position for Russia and that’s why they are not allowed/permitted to be under the influence of NATO
Not allowed? Not permitted? Would you listen to yourself! In the USSR days, Russia got away with subjugating and bullying other states. As much as it hates it, the USSR is no more. It doesn't get to tell sovereign nations what they are allowed or permitted to do anymore. Yeah, yeah some random irrelevant whataboutery about Cuba 🙄
Russia, or possibly more accurately, the Putin regime are still members of the U.N. I belive, but he seems to do everything he can to undermine peace, democracy and having a general global consensus of peace.
How many wars have the American/NATO involved?
It’s little wonder he won’t join NATO, not that he’d ever be allowed to after the last few years.
I’m pretty sure the U.N. would be glad to see the back of him too.
Why invite Russia to join NATO I don't know.
The hornets nest being Ukraine, and the poker being putin? yep, makes sense.
Eermmm ... LOL
Not allowed? Not permitted? Would you listen to yourself! In the USSR days, Russia got away with subjugating and bullying other states. As much as it hates it, the USSR is no more. It doesn’t get to tell sovereign nations what they are allowed or permitted to do anymore. Yeah, yeah some random irrelevant whataboutery about Cuba 🙄
Why is America still put Cuba in sanctions?
Fun fact: Both Lada and Rover displayed an image of a longboat on their respective grille-badges.
Also, look up Saint Olga of Kyiv. A Viking princess who really kicked ass!
Stooge puppet of Murica obvs 🙄
Why is America still put Cuba is some form of sanctions
Start a separate thread about Cuba if you must, but stop derailing this one with your irrelevant obsession with it.
Start a separate thread about Cuba if you must, but stop derailing this one with your irrelevant obsession with it.
BBC: Nato's border with Russia doubles as Finland joins
Even the title of this article says a lot about NATO.
Even the title of this article says a lot about NATO
What does it say to you?
What does it say to you?
NATO has gained grounds.
What is your interpretation?
It's the beeb so a badly written article, but facts are facts:
Russia's invasion prompted a surge in Finnish public opinion towards joining Nato to 80% in favour.
It’s the beeb so a badly written article, but facts are facts:
I think it is deliberate otherwise no news.
Russia’s invasion prompted a surge in Finnish public opinion towards joining Nato to 80% in favour.
I wonder what the 20% think.
NATO has gained grounds.
As a direct result of Russian actions. Russia caused it. Neighbouring countries fear Russia because of their recently demonstrated desire for conquest and expansion so join a defensive alliance for protection. Who can blame them? Sweden and Finland had zero interest in joining NATO until Putin's illegal invasion.
I wonder what the 20% think.
It's called a democratic consensus, unlike the 48/52% brexit vote in the UK.
I wonder what the 20% think.
I've suspected for a while that you struggle with the concept of democracy
I wonder what the 20% think.
I can only dream of a referendum or opinion poll that drew 80/20.
As a direct result of Russian actions. Russia caused it. Neighbouring countries fear Russia because of their recently demonstrated desire for conquest and expansion so join a defensive alliance for protection. Who can blame them? Sweden and Finland had zero interest in joining NATO until Putin’s illegal invasion.
Good to know it is so clear and simple.
It’s called a democratic consensus, unlike the 48/52% brexit vote in the UK.
eermmm ... you might be asked to return to the Brexit thread if you wish to associate with Brexit voting pattern. Don't you know this is strictly NATO/Ukraine Vs Russia thread? LOL. You mean they voted wrongly? LOL!
this is strictly NATO/Ukraine Vs Russia thread?
Incorrect, this is a thread about the illegal invasion and war upon Ukraine, comitted by Russia.
Don't rise to it. Interesting posts are being buried under pages of nonsense 🙂
Incorrect, this is a thread about the illegal invasion and war upon Ukraine, comitted by Russia.
That's interesting about Legality of war.
Good point, as entertaining as Chewk is, I'm out of this thread for the time being.
I'm also out until the thread re-rails.
Come on - don’t feed the troll 🤷♂️