Twitter is quite worth spending some time with today.......can't help but think Sunak is toast
I’m not the first person on the thread to suggest this series of gaffs is being orchestrated by forces within the Tory party to get rid of Rishi.
He's out at the next election anyway, so why bother? At this point he's as good a person as any to take the blame.
Suspect this doesn't affect many on here directly, but if you know anyone who wants to vote without a fixed address and feels they are disenfranchised.....
Its odd.
His manoeuvring to increase his power as chancellor after accepting it when Javid walked away rather than be controlled by Cummings and co indicate some political skill. As does his careful planning around when to knife Johnson without being the knifer in chief but it appears to vanish entirely once he deals with anyone but tory mps/officials.
Hemel Hempsted: Tory MP has pulled out at the very last minute (no explanation, but assume skeleton in his closet about to emerge) so theyve signed up a local councilor
doesn’t that just end up as “the poor are lazy” ?
The trouble with that sort of straw manning is it convinces no one to listen to a valid argument.
I try to take a balanced view on these things and see both sides. And explained it to my politically uninterested nephew last week (who can vote but doesn't) how it's supposed to work. It is possible to frame both ideologies in a positive way and then let people make up their mind based on either which argument they agree with or which political party just does things more competently.
Left of center -
The rich pay pay taxes which pay for a bus lane which brings people to their business, therefore they make more money overall.
The poor have access to a bus which get's them to work, therefore they make more money.
Right of center -
The rich pay less taxes and no bus lane is built. Therefore they have more money.
The poor pay less taxes therefore have more money in their pocket to buy a car and don't need the bus.
Substitute in education, defense, health care or whatever you like into the analogy as appropriate.
It's entirely valid to extend that analogy at the moment and say that the Tories are actually spending money on busses but the bus company is owned by their mate and doesn't have any busses and the staff are all on strike because they've not had a fair pay deal in a decade so no one is benefitting. And that should be enough to convince you to vote for something else even if you are philosophically right of center.
The “schedule was already set” really needed the follow up question “why?”
No, the follow-up should've been a statement, "Oh, you were never going to stay..." and be silent.
It's an interesting thought experiment to think about what might happen if Sunak resigns before the election. Presumably the tories would have to install an emergency interim leader. But who? Morduant is almost certainly going to lose her seat, Hunt and Shapps are also on the at risk list. The only other one I can think of is Cameron. At least he can't be kicked out of parliament but I doubt he wants it. Actually maybe he does and that's why he didn't stop Sunak buggering off to do his interview? Him coming to the rescue to rebuild whatever's left would allow the centrists to regain control of the party in much the same way as Starmer did with labour. I can't image having a lord as leader of the opposition is going to work though for obvious reasons.
I can’t image having a lord as leader of the opposition is going to work though for obvious reasons.
It's convention that the PM is an MP, but not essential. So I can't see why a Lord couldn't be leader of the opposition.
The pragmatic solution is to get an MP in a safe seat to quit and hold a by-election, although that's probably easier said than done when there might not be all that many safe seats and you've lost your leverage of being able to make them a peer in return.
that hemel hempstead candidate..
https://twitter.com/tomorrowsmps/status/1799088558994776191
actually a shame this didnt come out after 4pm then they'd have to expell him but keep him on the ballot, in that rarest of things, a safe Tory seat!
get the popcorn out for othe candidates being outed over the weekend
The pragmatic solution is to get an MP in a safe seat to quit and hold a by-election
He'd have to renounce his peerage before he could be elected as an MP. I doubt he would want to do that as it gets him invited to all sorts of nice parties.
Just came here to post the same pic as Kimbers. Twitter is brutal today and deservedly so.
The immediate interest for me is how tonitghts debate plays out........How does Sunak handle that? Is it just more hectoring and truculence? How can his spads possibly give him any kind of playbook?
Guardian live election text feed:
Here is [a picture of] Rishi Sunak looking at a laptop on a visit to Great Oldbury Primary Academy in Stonehouse this afternoon. We hope, for his sake, he’s not looking at Twitter …
The immediate interest for me is how tonitghts debate plays out
He's not doing the debate tonight, Mordaunt is. Bet she's thrilled about that! 😂
The alternative being he’s planning all these gaffs himself for reasons known only to himself.
Or its just the inevitable fall-out of a group of people that were [by all accounts] . 1. caught off-guard by the sudden announcement of the date of the election that went against their advice, and 2. given the polling and odds on the gambling sites are now in full on panic mode and this is result of them running about like headless chickens. I get them impression that no one is really in charge, or more likely it's a game of reverse pass the parcel when the idea is not to be holding the parcel when the music stops in July.
dazh - that is a crying shame - unusually I was looking forward to some bloodsports
https://twitter.com/AdamBienkov/status/1798968915298496877
yet Biden, Macron and Scholz seemed to have found the time, ****ing Tory Shills
@Solarider - fair enough, I hadn't considered the VAT on school fees effecting anyone in that way as I don't know anyone that privately educates their kids that couldn't afford the extra. I do feel for you and have a lot of sympathy with the "private schools take the pressure off public schools" line but private schools aren't charities and the fees shouldn't be VAT free. If ever there was a luxury item, it's private education.
I hope for your sake it's a nuanced introduction.
Perhaps if the rich had to use the same schools, hospitals, dentists, doctors…
I have private medical insurance (which unfortunately I'm getting a lot of use from at the moment). The dentists I use are the same private dentists as anywhere else - the real scandal there is that it's practically impossible to get enrolled as an NHS patient! Bizarrely the hospitals and doctors and surgeons private patients use are often the same as rhe ones NHS patients use - just on different days and often with shorter wait times. Ultimately it is a weird system in which many medical staff allow their private patients fees to "top up" their continued employment in the NHS. And of course there is no private A and E etc.
It shouldn't be this way.
“ If ever there was a luxury item, it’s private education.”
that and a rolling collection of very expensive titanium bikes.
Am wondering what is going to happen on HIGNFY later. They only have 30 minutes
Earlier in the thread someone started doing a Day 1, Day 2 list of gaffs. I can only assume that has stopped due to the author getting RSI from having to type so much.
Well I for one sincerely hope Sunak doesn't resign before the election. He's doing s great job, crack on lad.
Presumably the tories would have to install an emergency interim leader. But who?
I hope they've not found a way to crowbar Johnson in somewhere.
Starting to see some fall-out from some party functionaries....... i didn't click the telegrah link - god no
Tories have apparently suspended all online advertisingtoday.......
@politecameraaction except dentists aren’t employed by the nhs and the nhs doesn’t currently pay their businesses enough to remain viable without being subsidised by private income....
hate to say it but no one is fixing nhs dentistry anymore, that ship sailed somewhere in the last 14 years
Mordaunt must be absolutely fuming about being trotted out tonight.
Obviously in one way it raises her profile (for which she is about as craven an attention-seeker as I've seen).
But surely, if she makes it through election night, she knows that if she gets the leadership Labour can just play her defence of the indefensible back at her when she gets a bit big for her boots.
This implosion is so utterly delicious to see.
So I can’t see why a Lord couldn’t be leader of the opposition.
PMQs would be a problem and it would provide a handy attack option if bored/on back foot "unelected blah blah".
The pragmatic solution is to get an MP in a safe seat to quit and hold a by-election
Alec Douglas-Home sort of did this when he became PM whilst a Earl.
Not wanting to worry any tories in a safe seat but that by-election was due to the death of the incumbent though.
Mordaunt must be absolutely fuming about being trotted out tonight.
She’ll dress up in finery, brandish a sword and cry out “there can be only one”
He’s not doing the debate tonight, Mordaunt is. Bet she’s thrilled about that! 😂
Ah - one is minded of the avalanche of "Sir Fear Starmer" nonsense shovelled out this week.
I could certainly see a way that Cameron is interim leader if Sunak loses his seat or quits, pending a leadership election?
WRT school fees, they're set at what the private schools think the market will pay (hence why they've gone up drastically in real terms in a generation - not sure my parents or in-laws would have been able to afford it now). My suspicion is that there will be a decrease in pre-tax fees from a lot of schools so the overall increase is less than 20%, achieved either by the school just swallowing it, by increasing class sizes or by making things that are currently included extras.
Mordaunt
We can only hope she finds some backbone and actually criticises the behaviour of her overlord in the debate tonight...
This could be a lot of fun!
Quick one on the private schools thing.
They don't have to pass on all of the 20%. They could choose to cut back on, say, sport facilities, or funded school trips. All the things that state schools effectively cut back on too to preserve their standard of teaching. And private schools also have a proportionately high number of very rich former pupils who can be tapped up for help.
If Labour win and the policy is implemented I would doubt if private schools will lose more than 10% of their pupils and probably less than 5% will go under.
We can only hope she finds some backbone and actually criticises the behaviour of her overlord in the debate tonight…
Whatever her supposed moderacy she is still a Tory minister who has prospered under the Brexit incarnation of the Tories. She will only find backbone if it is to her advantage to do so.
Did I just hear the prime minister apologised for leaving Europe?
😉
Mordaunt, like many of the current ghastly cohort, is only there as they've purged the old fashioned Tories and we're left with the current absolute shower of C you next Tuesdays.
On twitter someone has just pointed out that Mordaunt is a serving RN reservist - so may have conflicting loyalists...
turns out remainers are more "patriotic" than leavers, fancy that.
Unfortunately the tories have managed to get candidates in all but 1 seat
I think reform are about 50 short, not sure how many have incumbent tories
Is there a published list available yet kimbers?
Unfortunately the tories have managed to get candidates in all but 1 seat
I'm betting at least 4 drop out when some journo unearths the compromising pictures or ineligibility to stand....
4? I reckon that a bit of digging will end up with a list of at least 20 (and yes I think I am being generous with 20). They are hardly going to be picking the top tier
Lammy on R4 just now making it absolutely clear that Labour have nothing to say about Palestine. Statehood at some undetermined time in the future, subject to Israeli veto. Another Green vote here.
It’s convention that the PM is an MP, but not essential. So I can’t see why a Lord couldn’t be leader of the opposition.
It may theoretically be possible for a non MP to be PM, but its a tory party requirement that the Leader of the Conservative Party is a serving MP. I'm not sure what happens if they lose their seat. However I think its irrelevant, Rishi won't quit now - he knows he's gone on July 5th. He's probably already got a flight to California booked. When leaders quit whilst in official office, they almost invariably remain in post till the next leader is elected.
Penny will have an interesting dilemma tonight - is she trying to get conservatives across the country to think of her as a future leader or is she trying to get reelected - in 2005 she lost that seat by a small % to the labour candidate.
Lammy on R4 just now making it absolutely clear that Labour have nothing to say about Palestine. Statehood at some undetermined time in the future, subject to Israeli veto. Another Green vote here.
Of course they don’t, they admitted the utterly ****ing odious self confessed Zionist shitlord Luke Akehurst, he’s little more than a globule of fat n’ gristle
Another Green vote here.
🤷♂️
kimbers
I think reform are about 50 short, not sure how many have incumbent tories
They will havea lot of utter wrong'uns in that lot.
I expect all the parties might have a bit of an issue there but reform, by it's nature, will tend to attract people with some easy to find skeletons in their past.
They will havea lot of utter wrong’uns in that lot.
I expect all the parties might have a bit of an issue there but reform, by it’s nature, will tend to attract people with some easy to find skeletons in their past.
If the nature of that wrongness is far-right, xenophobic or racist posts on social media it will probably enhance their prospects with the target audience, though.
🙄
Looks like the quite a few of the Green Party’s PPCs’ social media posting history has seen a bit of scrutiny these last few days. I’m guessing this is one of those “don’t pay attention to the media” things though?
If the nature of that wrongness is far-right, xenophobic or racist posts on social media it will probably enhance their prospects with the target audience, though.
True.
Ie it's already happening as far as outing a few of them.
They have just exposed 2 Reform wrong'uns on CH4 news tonight. What the guy particularly said is... Well.
Regarding the VAT on private school fees, I could see an argument that the government shouldn't make decisions parents made about how they educate their children suddenly no longer viable to continue. It could for example be waived to allow already enrolled children to complete their current level of education at their existing school.
But relying on a tax break to afford this luxury, for that complete phase of a child's education was always a risk. It was pretty obvious that it would eventually come under scrutiny.
Larger and less foreseeable rugs have been pulled out from underneath people and businesses in recent years, much to their detriment and especially so people less able to absorb the impact. They and their kids had to suck it up, and now these parents and their (partially?) privately educated children will have to as well. There's no special protection for them against perceived unfair changes that restore fairness in the education system.
I bet Netanyahu is shitting himself
Did that make sense in your head before you typed it out?
I bet Netanyahu is shitting himself
Drop the **** in Gaza and I imagine he wouldn't have time to worry about shitting himself
The amusing thing about the D-Day furore, is that there's a good chance this will be referred to as the moment Rishi lost the election, as if he had much of a chance to begin with
Yep, he lost it on the beach.
She will only find backbone if it is to her advantage to do so.
She'll probably have to borrow. Tory Mp's don't come supplied with one.
Trouble is these days, there seems to be few going around.
Oh Christ we're back to wiping out each other out.
Nothing ever changes.
Seriously, as was - Boris Johnson and a nuclear bomb, the two never went together. Clumsy goat.
A kid was dropped off at my local independent school in a helicopter today.
Every other car is a Tesla / brand new Land-rover.
They have too much money and too many resources to the detriment of the rest of us. Tax them to control their wealth for sure.
(But not too much as my partner works there !) 😏
Labour and Conservatives both don't understand or don't want the public to understand that if you press the button in retaliation, we are all already dead. It's irrelevant in a global nuclear war (which all nuclear wars would be) if you have a deterrent or not as the two main players would wipe out the northern hemisphere.
Unsurprisingly, on tonight’s debate everyone is getting well and truly stuck in to the little fella and him finding something more pressing to do than honouring the D Day veterans
Penny Mordaunt apologising repeatedly for his behaviour has a face like Dot Cotton licking piss off a thistle
I hope there are no naked flames around with the amount of hairspray she must have on that 80’s haircut