MegaSack DRAW - This year's winner is user - rgwb
We will be in touch
There’s a used California on VW used vans website for £73,000
You could buy a very, very good used Range Rover for that! Or a really high spec big estate, and a little hatchback. And change!
And people wonder why plenty folk don't like them...those prices are clearly more money than sense (or actually buying for the badge lifestyle) as very clearly there are far cheaper options with very similar (or better) spec from other manufacturers...
(Now I've said that I suspect I'll be spending the evening looking at specs of vehicles!)
I’m not sure there are many manufacturer built equivalents of the California? Kind of a captive market and they can charge what the market will bear.
I guess you could buy the Range Rover instead and get the Butler to bring you a nice cup of tea.
15k for that used transporter? My shiney new transit was 21k, not 4 years old not 4 weeks old, it was spanking new for 6k more! Sport version 170 brake half leather sat nav etc etc, vw get yaself bent over ready for some prison dry hump!
Best thing about my T5 is how its mere existence drives some people loopy. The fact is drives ok and swallows umpteen bikes and kit is almost secondary.
Some folk do have wierd fetishes right enough
<div class="bbp-reply-author">CaptainFlasheart</div>
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There’s a used California on VW used vans website for £73,000
You could buy a very, very good used Range Rover for that! Or a really high spec big estate, and a little hatchback. And change!
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Which of those three vehicles is a factory built campervan with numerous extras added? At least compare like with like!
You could get a whole camper for 73k.
I needed an auto van a couple of years back following a busted ankle, use for both work deliveries/collections and private use. There isn't much choice I could find other than VW Transporter or Mercedes Vito or perhaps an older imported Japanese thing like a Hiace. Test drove the former ones and didn't like the Vito because it has this sticking out by your left foot (transmission tunnel?) which meant you couldn't move your foot about, no DAB and felt a bit cheaply made. Opted for a year old DSG T6 from a main dealer which was a much nicer place to be but it isn't all roses, the DMF went at 12K miles, fortunately fixed under warranty. When the warranty runs out I'll probably flog (for not much of a loss hopefully) and get another year old one with the remaining 2 years warranty left or a new one via a broker (seem to be c. 15-20% less than main dealer). It's been handy having one over the summer for holidays and trips to festivals, carrying all our clobber, kipping in it etc. I'm surprised by people saying they get 40+ mpg, mine averages around 32, 36 on a long run driving very sensibly. Maybe it's because mine is a DSG and always full of loads of crap though.
I’ve created a bit of a monster thread here...ooops!
We do a trip north every year from Spain to the lakes and back, fully laden and get 42 - 44mpg over the 3.5k miles or so. 1.9tdi.
I needed an auto van
Vivaro/Primastar/Trafic has an autobox too.
I've had a T5, Vito, and now T6 Kombi, and I'll be getting another eventually. You can only really compare them to the biggest MPV in a fair test, and non of these MPV's will get more than 40mpg in the real world. My T6 does an easy 40mpg, is a comfortable, capable load lugger, sure it has a few rattles , but what MPV doesn't? especially after a few years of kids inside. I know quite a few van/transporter owners and none have any regrets. If you have it in your head to get one, get one.
Nice one on asbo motors aberdeen looks the same as postierichs just older
Pop top full non factory conversion inside.
2006
180000 miles.
Go on guess the price
15k for that used transporter? My shiney new transit was 21k, not 4 years old not 4 weeks old, it was spanking new for 6k more! Sport version 170 brake half leather sat nav etc etc, vw get yaself bent over ready for some prison dry hump!
So for 25% more you can have a new van? Bargain!
My Peugeot Boxer was £17,700 inc. VAT with Aircon, leather, satnav, heated seats, parking camera and the all important mudflaps. Also has deadlocks and alarm as standard. Pass the soap, You had your pants pulled down by Ford! 😉
Paid 2K for my T4 Caravelle, and it has been fantastic - camping around Europe, bike races, surfing, kayaking, climbing even tarted up as ball transport (it was a meadow ball) - I really can fault it. Has cost me a cam belt change and I had to fix an issue with the glow plugs staying 'lit' and burning out the relay, but now its faultless and perfect for getting 3 boys and their kit around. It does look like crap though so I think it'd struggle to be classed as a 'lifestyle' vehicle .. doesn't even have alloys as the 15" steels have nice cheap tough tyres and a full sized spare onboard.
There are better value new vans though, and when we replace this I might go Vito/Viano - lot of the surfers appeared to be on them now they have sorted the worst of the rusting out issues.
We do a trip north every year from Spain to the lakes and back, fully laden and get 42 – 44mpg over the 3.5k miles or so. 1.9tdi.
Bloody hell, thats a trip and a half! Southern france and back from south englandshire is enough for me!
£70k+ for VW Camper is nuts!
Anyway, someone said compare purposes built for purposes built.
https://www.motorhomes.co.uk/motorhomes-for-sale/hymer/b-class-sl/b-654-sl/2548/
And youve change for the VW Up! to yow behind it.
The California is eye-wateringly expensive, but it's aimed at the more high end of the market and the interior is a cut above the usual converted builders vans with electric pop-top lift and all the other high end electronic gadgetry you'd expect to find is a similarly priced high end luxury car.
The motorhome option + car is the silliest thing In the world - you'd be much better off with a caravan. The whole point of a Motor home is to take advantage of the fact you're not towing and have the convenience of touring an area, so staying for a couple of nights before moving on. Getting that thing prepped for an outing is a major logistical exercise so completely destroys the spontaneity that a small van based camper van provides...the main benefit I find of having a small campervan...a quick overnight stop is easy, no prep of the van, just load up and off you go. A £60k motorhome will just spend most of its time sat in a farmers field costing you to keep it there being unused.
"Getting that thing prepped for an outing is a major logistical exercise so completely destroys the spontaneity that a small van based camper van provides…the main benefit "
Care to elaborate.
I'll bet my bottom dollar my camper needs less prep to go than a VW based camper.
It lives ready to go.and provides plenty of spontaneous trips.
Great for load lugging. Have made it nice ish inside for occasional camping trips with my other half too.
Just glad I have a choice of motorbike or car so I don't have to drive it everyday. It's slow and noisy.
My advice? Get one!
I bought a 2003 T4 Caravelle with 100k miles 7 years ago, and apart from a £2k gearbox bill 6 months later (!) it has been absolutely worth its fee. Biking trips with mates, weekends away sleeping in the back, many hours sitting comfortably in the back with a cup of tea waiting for the boys football to start/finish. Even moving the eldest sons entire possessions 6 hours to Uni was painless.
Wouldn't be without it, and I'm really not looking forward to the day it finally gives up.
People who hate T5s are far more vocal about them than whose who have one and just gen on with their lives... 😉
As for van vs car, unless you're sure you really want a van then you might get the same utility out of a big people carrier like a Sharan, Previa or Espace type thing but cost less, drive more like a car and you won't have people jumping out of hedges yelling at you that your T5 is a lifestyle vehicle and you'd be better off in an LDV. (I joke...)
I am on my second Trafic sport and I love having a van. Great for cycling and motorbike trackdays and I have on occasion slept in it.
I have had both from new with the current one just coming up to 3 years old. The new third gen one I have is marginally nicer to drive than the gen 2 but the build quality does not seem as good.
I have considered a VW but the amount of extra money I would have had to spend was crazy.
I drove my mates older T5 the other day and there was no way I would swap that for mine. Much more clunky and van like. I am sure the newer ones are probably as good as the Renault/Vauxhaul platform but a lot of money.
I think next one will be a Transit Sport, though my local Renault dealer has a habit of doing a deal thats hard to turn down.
Transporters don't drive like a car - they can be better than a car! In our household we have an Audi RS4 and also have periodic use of a Toyota GT86 plus a whole multitude of hire cars (normally BMW) through work. I can honestly say I enjoy driving the Transporter as much as any of them.
Ours is a 180 Combi with second row of seats and a raised combi bed that slides out over the rear row of seats when folded. Took it all the way to the Alps this summer and it handled the journey with ease. Twisty mountain passes were lots of fun and it was comfortable, quiet and relaxing to drive. The increased height over a car/MPV made visibility much better and the extra power and bigger brakes of the 180 meant we could overtake slower traffic pretty easily, even loaded up with 1/2 ton of climbing and camping stuff in the back.
We've had our Transporter fully lined, insulated and soundproofed and it's quieter now than lots of cars. Slightly lowered on H&R springs makes the ride so much better and more comfortable than standard.
I've driven may new cars that provide in almost every way an inferior driving experience than that we get in the Transporter. It's just a fun thing to hustle along a twisty back road. Had it from new and it's on 35k miles now and not a single thing has gone wrong with it.
The motorhome option + car is the silliest thing In the world
I certainly wouldn’t. It was more an illustration of how little that particular offered for the cash. They’re not ‘that’ nice in side!
We’ve had our Transporter fully lined, insulated and soundproofed and it’s quieter now than lots of cars. Slightly lowered on H&R springs makes the ride so much better and more comfortable than standard.
Now this my Transit doesn’t do, most of the noise seems to come through the foot wells so the lining hasn’t really impacted that.
Don't let the hater's put you off!! Great vans IMO.. Don't think you can go wrong with quite a few of the modern vans these days.. all drive very well with a good spec engine.. if you are into cycling and need to carry stuff had an estate car and was just a right royal pain in the arse and can't for the life of me understand why I didn't buy one sooner?!! True touring vehicle cruises on the motorway with ease!! Buy one and you won't look back.. T5.1 owner and highly rate 🙂
I had a ride in a brand new Vito last week and it was impressively quiet and rode pretty well. Seemed a pretty pleasant place to be.
Although (and I’m not sure how VW do it) the Transporter is a better looking van.
Can’t say I want one over an estate though!
Nice van Stu 🙂
Mainly at my wife's behest, we bought a T5.1-based camper conversion over 2 years ago. We'd rented campers for 10 years beforehand and I'd always thought an estate and our bell tent would be better, but I've been proven wrong. There is no way my wife and 2 kids would let this be sold now.
Ours was converted by one of the bigger names, but based on what was a 3-year old van at the time. It's quite utilitarian when compared to a high spec car, but the look and feel of the conversion and van match well and it's comfortable. It handles family life well and there are no carpets or posh trim to worry about.
The popularity of the T5 allows you to retrofit pretty much anything. So far, this van has just had a better stereo and some rubber mats fitted; both original VW. In contrast to many of the Transporters out there, we've kept away from big wheels and various sporty upgrades.
It came with a down-tuned 84PS version of the 2.0 TDI - but the engines are all identical to the 140PS version and merely modified by software, which has since been done to a healthier output of around 165 horses. It probably compares to a mainstream car from about 2005 in terms of feel, although it's obviously a lot more rattly and ponderous around corners. I don't drive it quickly, but it's immensely satisfying.
It suits our needs very well, although we use it much more as a day van than a camper. There's a lot to be said for touring in comfort and with great flexibility, plus of course there's plenty of room for bikes and kit. We have barn doors, which have upsides and downsides - the most obvious downside being limited to 2-bike carriers, so I will probably get a towbar mounted carrier in due course. The upside is that barn doors are easier to open in more situations.
Running costs have been similar to most diesel vehicles of 2013 vintage. It's had a minor and major service, a cambelt change and an exhaust sensor in our time with it - probably running at a rate of £60 per month (although that's not how I budget). It only gets used on long runs, with a brim-to-brim measured fuel economy of 40-45mpg. Van tyres, in modest sizes at least, seem more durable than car ones. When needed, I've found new tyres on unused spare wheels typically cost £50 each via eBay.
We live in a city centre and think of it as our escape vehicle. Probably the main issue for us is that our area is likely to fall within a low emissions zone in 2 years or so (one of the many proposed across the UK), meaning that as pre-2016 diesel we'll need to budget for a daily charge. It won't be worth changing vans on this basis alone, but I do think this is something that many van users haven't been made aware of yet.
Anyway - the best advice we had was: "Just get one, they're all great".
On my second Transporter Kombi. Had a T5 180, now got a T6 204. Love them.
I have plenty to compare them to, as prior to this I had:
Defender 110
Discovery 3
Audi A6 Avant (the proper 3 litre, V6 twin turbo one)
Discovery 3
Range Rover Vogue 4.6
Things that are great about the Transporter Kombi:
1. Seats 5 comfortably
2. Huge capacity for swallowing bikes, dogs and/or work kit
3. #2 can be further enhanced by removing one or more rear seats
4. Useful as a mobile changing room after wet/muddy walks, runs and rides.
5. Low rear sill height makes it easier than any other vehicle for dogs (especially older ones) to get in and out of
6. It's a van, so it's pretty 'classless'
Both my vans have been 4Motion which just ads to the whole "forget Land Rovers" thing; with proper winter type tyres they have performed admirably in snow and mud, off road.
I'd certainly consider another make (I do like the look of the new Transits) but would not want to be without a van and the 4WD bit a something of a dealbreaker.
"People who hate T5s are far more vocal about them than whose who have one and just gen on with their lives…"
Who needs to be outwardly vocal when you are driving everywhere in pimped out panel vans with spoilers, stickers, body kits etc. waving to each other down the bypass and constantly stalking about the "scene" it all screams "look at me"
Honestly think some people missed on being boy racers.
I'm a hater. Don't get me wrong, nowt wrong with a nice factory spec transporter. Ideal for bikes etc. Bit too big for our needs. The price is also stupid. A transit etc does the same cheaper. Also have no need for one as a camper. I'd rather stand up in my old man caravan than have to kneel at the cooker to feed the offspring.
My mates love theirs. My closest friend has a 130k on the clock conversion. The flowers, the logos, the whole lifestyle. Spent 20k on it and one of the teenage kids has to sleep across the front seats. Sounds great. He's getting a pop top soon though. Only £4.5k to have a hole cut in the roof and some canvas banged in. Ideal. £20k would buy a tidy autosleeper.
For the person who thinks VW are the only company who make a high spec smallish camper from factory. Have a look at Mercedes Marco Polo. Was speaking to a Merc car dealership a few weeks ago and he was telling me his stock Marco Polo was standing him at about £60k and it was fully loaded.
I run a Merc Vito 2012 136bhp with less than 50k on the clock. 1 owner before me, full Mercedes service history and even had its dpf & cat replaced under insurance when they were stolen from the previous owner so all nice and fresh. Including the £3k I spent on converting it into a camper myself it stands me at under £10k. Its got a few bells & whistles like Brabus alloys, bars etc.
I love it and wish I had purchased one years ago when I had younger kids.
There's a lot of made up nonsense and self-justification in this thread. Transporters are big, heavy (2 and a half tonnes) vehicles, which are based on commercial vehicles. They have a lot of height, which means they have of interior space. Compared to a typical mid-range estate or MPV
They are
not as economical as a car (the claims of 45mpg might be real, but given that pretty much matches the extra-urban test figure, a similarly driven estate would be pushing 60s)
not as cheap as a car
not as nice to drive as a car
not as quiet or refined as a car
not as quick as a car (even with the 180bhp engine, over 10 seconds to 60 is pitiful)
However, they are also
much bigger than a car inside
more flexible than a car (customisation etc)
unlikely to lose as much value as a car
less likely to offend middle-class aspirations than the competition (transits, etc)
whether that tradeoff suits you or not is up to you. They're a niche vehicle, which is why they don't sell many (less than half the number of focus's Ford sell, for example) and when you consider that only a fraction of those are used as non-commercial vehicles shows just how niche they are. There are lots of people on here that fill the niche
I'd probably caution listening the thoughts of someone who loves them, and instead look to independent reviews, or better still, try one out..
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/volkswagen/caravelle-2003-2015
pimped out panel vans with spoilers, stickers, body kits etc. waving to each other down the bypass and constantly stalking about the “scene” it all screams “look at me”
well none of this is true about me or nearly any of the T5 owners on this thread. Maybe you're trying too hard to get worked up about it? Perhaps a holiday would help. Have you thought about camping?.. :-p
/edit - I'm happy to admit there is a badge tax. We paid more for our van than an equivalent Transit or Vivaro. We'll redeem some of that if we ever sell.
The plus side of this is the ease and convenience of the community (or "scene" if you want to sound condescending about it).
Need new tyres? Someone will be flogging their factory wheels & tyres for cheap as they've pimped their to black alloys. Nearly new wheels and tyres for half the price of new tyres alone.
Want to add a swivel seat? Easy to find a swivel base for whatever.
Want to do a conversion yourself? there's are loads of flat pack kits to do it.
Want to add naff stickers? Loads of them about too, if that's your thing.
You could buy a very, very good used Range Rover for that!
Yeah, but how many would that sleep, and where's the cooker. Whereas ...
"People who hate T5s are far more vocal about them than whose who have one and just gen on with their lives… "
In my experience, it's more a case that many Transporter owners can see NO other option than a buying a Transporter when someone wants a van and are completely blindsided by the whole Transporter 'lifestyle' and buying in to wider VW brand image in the UK. I tire of the usual reasons such as 'Transporters hold value better' (more expensive in the first place in many cases), 'the T5 and T6 will be future classics' (yeah right oh) or reason not to buy a Vito being 'all Vito's suffer serious rust' (before 2006 ie 12years ago, prior to triple galvanising).
Enjoy your Transporter if that's what you like but other viable options do exist.
Enjoy your Transporter if that’s what you like but other viable options do exist.
See also- Islabike.
Following this thread with a bit of interest. I do fancy a Kombi style van for various reasons and I do keep going back to Transporters. Keep trying to convince myself that the transit custom is the better choice but I just don't think they look as nice and the interiors don't seem laid out as well. Never really thought about the Vito and started having a look. They seem to only be available in RWD unless you go for the basic 1.6 option? RWD and no weight in the back and snowy roads just seems like a pain even with winter tyres.
Anyway is a moot point as I can't afford either!
I must be a cliche then with a T6 and a collection of Isla bikes for the kids. Don’t really get the haters. At the end of the day it’s your money, make your own choice.
Note to self get some stickers for the van just to wind some of the haters up.
RWD and no weight in the back and snowy roads just seems like a pain even with winter tyres.
You’d think so but in practice they are pretty good.
I regularly drive mine up a steep road in Austria during ski season and I’ve never got stuck or not made it.
"
There’s a lot of made up nonsense and self-justification in this thread. Transporters are big, heavy (2 and a half tonnes) vehicles, which are based on commercial vehicles. They have a lot of height, which means they have of interior space. Compared to a typical mid-range estate or MPV
They are
not as economical as a car (the claims of 45mpg might be real, but given that pretty much matches the extra-urban test figure, a similarly driven estate would be pushing 60s)
not as cheap as a car
not as nice to drive as a car
not as quiet or refined as a car
not as quick as a car (even with the 180bhp engine, over 10 seconds to 60 is pitiful)"
OK lets break this down a bit:-
"They're big"...well their footprint is about the same as a Mondeo estate sized car, so actually smaller than alot of the larger cars out there and certainly smaller than the larger SUV's and pick ups etc. So as large as a large family car, but not ridiculously large. Of course the LWB van is 40cm longer, but most people have SWB vans.
"Heavy at 2.5T". That is the gross weight so when it is fully loaded up to max capacity - and some go upto 3.2T, mine is 2.8T. The weight the van is 1792kg, so a wee bit lighter than my old SMax, which was 1800 kg, so comparable to a similarly sized car. But also has a much higher load capacity adding to their practicality. Most people don't drive them around at gross weight. they mostly are transporting air.
"Height" - yes, they do have additional interior space which is the main reason people buy them. Mine is a shade under 2.1m tall so will fit in most large multi storey car parks no probs. Some tips have a 2m height restriction which is a PITA, but alot don't. So some forward planning might be necessary if heading into a town centre to park up.
"Compared to a typical mid-range estate or SUV": no point comparing apples with oranges ,you should be comparing with large estates/SUV's....so Mondeo/A6 Avant/5 series Touring/X5's/Touregs/Q7's etc.
"Not as economical": might be or might not be...totally depends on how the driver drives the car. Mine returns an average of 34mph, my previous SMax returned 37mph, so slightly less economical, but it is the lower powered version with a 5 speed box. A more powerful engined van with a 6 speed box or DSG box will return higher economy. When I have an uninterrupted motorway run it returns much higher MPG...maybe 40/early 40's so mid to high 40's should be totally possible with the 6 speed box/DSG and a more torquey engine if driven well.
"Not as nice to drive as a car": maybe...but I've driven some pretty terrible cars in my time, so better than some. but generally not...but not an unpleasant drive by any stretch. Goes round bends well - loads of grip - just as well in mine as I need to maintain speed once I get it up there.
"Not as quiet or refined as a car": mine isn't as its a converted builders van. A Californias and Caravelle's are very refined.
"Not as quick as a car": define quick. Acceleration is not great, but I'm not racing. It will cruise at 'normal' motorway speeds easily and comfortably so perfectly quick enough. Pretty sure in mine the 0-60 would be better than 10 seconds, 9 seconds maybe. I'll time it, but I've never held up traffic off the lights. Having less acceleration actually makes you a better driver as you end up looking well ahead so you can predict the traffic and maintain speed once you're yup there. But I've been in my mates 200bhp T6 (can't remember how powerful but around there) and it's plenty quick enough...easily car quick.
So in reality not much self justification. Yep there is a trendy scene which attracts some people - fair enough, same with mountain biking, surfing, tattoo's, wearing your pants below your boxer shorts and many other things, but the economy, cheap running costs, adequate performance, extremely useful space and practicality, their adaptability is what attracts most people.
I have had a Transit Custom DCIV for 4 years and it has been great, I enjoy driving it. The only think that I'd like to change is not having the bulkhead and being able to remove the seat on occasion; Ford don't seem to offer this so I'm heading towards a Transporter Kombi.
^^^ if you check the Transit forum there are a few threads where people have removed the bulkhead & replaced the seats with folding/sliding ones from a Tourneo (normally available on ebay). Annoyingly the only factory version to have this configuration is the stooped VR46 one.
“Not as quiet or refined as a car”:" mine isn’t as its a converted builders van"
Yes it is 😉 It's just the conversion was done at the factory
Yours will have the lovely noisy factory fit webasto as well. VW cheaped out nicely and didn't bother to fit the silencers.
Most of the aftermarket conversions of "builders vans" ironed out all the kinks that come with the factory fit one. Except of course the lack of interior space.
Cheers zilog6128, I'll have a look
I think the Webasto is my favourite thing about my van 😀
Field of VW vans Check!
Stickers on van Check!
Loving the lifestyle Check 🙂
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They’re a niche vehicle, which is why they don’t sell many (less than half the number of focus’s Ford sell, for example) and when you consider that only a fraction of those are used as non-commercial vehicles shows just how niche they are
Still doesn't really ring true. Saw another three on the short walk home tonight. 2 this morning, two last night, two yesterday morning (it's s ten minute walk round the corner to work.)
Me and the Mrs have been remarking on how many there seem to be on the road so yes, I am counting at the moment. They're all over the shop!
One word of advice, if you do get one, avoid the 180hp BiTurbo engine.
There's a known problem with the EGR valve breaking down and spitting bits of aluminium into the engine thereby wrecking the bores. Telltale sign is massively high oil consumption to start with.
There's a Facebook page dedicated to this, "vw t5.1 / t6 excessive oil use for cfca 2.0 180hp engines".
. A more powerful engined van with a 6 speed box or DSG box will return higher economy. When I have an uninterrupted motorway run it returns much higher MPG…maybe 40/early 40’s so mid to high 40’s should be totally possible with the 6 speed box/DSG and a more torquey engine if driven well.
No chance!! Everyone I know who’s had a 180 4 motion DSG complains how thirsty they are, high 20’s if you’re lucky.
One word of advice, if you do get one, avoid the 180hp BiTurbo engine.
There’s a known problem with the EGR valve breaking down and spitting bits of aluminium into the engine thereby wrecking the bores. Telltale sign is massively high oil consumption to start with.
There’s a Facebook page dedicated to this, “vw t5.1 / t6 excessive oil use for cfca 2.0 180hp engines”.
That's exactly the engine I bought, it's a great engine and have had zero problems so far. I believe that this issue was mostly confined to the earlier pre 2011/12 BiTurbo's and even then the vast majority of engines are fine. Yes there are a group of owners who have had a genuine problem with this issue and understandably they are annoyed. But these owners also tend to shout the loudest, creating the scare story you've mentioned above in the process and are perhaps unrepresentative of the vast majority of BiTurbo owners who continue to drive their BiTurbo's daily without any problems.
I'll ignore the unmeasurables such as 'comfort' because they're debatable..
“Heavy at 2.5T”. That is the gross weight so when it is fully loaded up to max capacity – and some go upto 3.2T, mine is 2.8T. The weight the van is 1792kg, so a wee bit lighter than my old SMax, which was 1800 kg, so comparable to a similarly sized car. But also has a much higher load capacity adding to their practicality. Most people don’t drive them around at gross weight. they mostly are transporting air.
that figure might be accurate for a base spec, unladen van, but most people have more than 2 seats in addition to lining, insulation and so on to make theirs more livable. If you take the caravelle as a reasonable comparison, it weighs 2,400kg or 2,500 kg in 200bhp diesel config(depending on short- or long- wheelbase and 4motion or not). That's 5-800kg more than a sharan (also a 7 seater MPV from VW) or close to 50% of the weight again. It is heavy.
“Not as economical”: might be or might not be
lets compare the same 2 vehicles again. VW test the sharan at 56.5mpg (150bhp model) and the caravelle at a smidge under 40 mpg, so its using around 50% more fuel to lug the extra 50% weight around. Not hugely surprising really
Acceleration is not great, but I’m not racing. It will cruise at ‘normal’ motorway speeds easily and comfortably so perfectly quick enough. Pretty sure in mine the 0-60 would be better than 10 seconds, 9 seconds maybe.
The 200bhp caravelle does 0-60 in a smidge under/over 10 seconds, depending on the drivetrain (+/- 0.1 seconds). admittedly the fastest sharan isn't much better (they only do one with 180bhp) at 8.9 seconds, like for like (150bhp vs 150 bhp) its 3 seconds faster - and that's a sharan costing £23k discounted vs a caravelle costing £40k discounted (70% more). I can't find figures for 30-70 or similar to show. A 40k estate (530d or similar) is in the 6's for 0-60, as a comparison.
I wasn't trying to show they were bad vehicles, just demonstrate that they are a BIG compromise. The depreciation curve makes a lot of these things acceptable to some people, and that's fine, but even that isn't as good as some folks think - over 3 years/30k, a caravelle (200bhp diesel) is worth £21k, so has lost 19k compared to the discounted cost. The 150bhp sharan is worth £11k, so has lost £12k over the time, again, you're spending 50% more..
sources..
over 3 years/30k, a caravelle (200bhp diesel) is worth £21k
Good luck finding a 200bhp 3 year old Caravelle including VAT for £21k!
that figure might be accurate for a base spec, unladen van, but most people have more than 2 seats in addition to lining, insulation and so on to make theirs more livable. If you take the caravelle as a reasonable comparison, it weighs 2,400kg or 2,500 kg in 200bhp diesel config(depending on short- or long- wheelbase and 4motion or not). That’s 5-800kg more than a sharan (also a 7 seater MPV from VW) or close to 50% of the weight again. It is heavy.
My T5 Combi, extra row of seats, lined, insulated, leisure battery, fridge, combi bed comes in at 2,240kg unladen. I know because I took it to the weighbridge after conversion. That's about the same as your average large 4x4.
I wasn’t trying to show they were bad vehicles, just demonstrate that they are a BIG compromise.
Every vehicle is a compromise but . . can you sleep comfortably in a Sharan? Can you load it up with bikes, surfboards, etc and still sleep in it for a weekend away? Does the Sharan have a fridge, cooker or storage built in? Would you be happy to while away a rainy/stormy afternoon with the heater on (without engine running) in a remote location playing cards and drinking coffee sat inside a Sharan?
As previously mentioned, we also have an estate car (an RS4), but guess which vehicle we use for 75% of our trips because it's just far better for purpose. Yes it's the Transporter.
For those who are torn between the expense of a camper and want to dip their toe in the water. Have a look at this. https://www.tent-box.com/uk/product/tentbox-hard-shell-roof-top-tent/
bike can stay in the car safe and secure.
sleep wherever you can
packs down to the same as a normal roof box.
i was thinking of buying one and renting out for £50 per week if there was enough interest. All you would need is a roof rack
"Can you load it up with bikes, surfboards, etc and still sleep in it for a weekend away?"
On external racks I assume.
Nope, it’s not a load carrier. But if you had your estate car loaded with bike gear etc it would allow them to stay in the locked car while you kip under the stars
That’s exactly the engine I bought, it’s a great engine and have had zero problems so far. I believe that this issue was mostly confined to the earlier pre 2011/12 BiTurbo’s and even then the vast majority of engines are fine. Yes there are a group of owners who have had a genuine problem with this issue and understandably they are annoyed. But these owners also tend to shout the loudest, creating the scare story you’ve mentioned above in the process and are perhaps unrepresentative of the vast majority of BiTurbo owners who continue to drive their BiTurbo’s daily without any problems.
That's also exactly the engine I bought. Got my fingers burned. 100% hit rate. It affects the pre- 'D' suffix EGR cooler units. If I were buying another I would avoid like the plague. I hope yours continues to be fine, what EGR cooler do you have, out of interest ? Personally I'd rather do without the worry. Thought the OP should be aware, if I had been it would have saved me quite a few quid and a load of hassle. I suspect it's more of a problem amongst those with that cooler than you suggest. I bought a non-180 afterwards and regret it not one little bit.