[Closed] Smoking is a pretty disgusting habit, but...

I suspect you may well expect a number of E)'s in your life if that's your view!

maybe, but if you think the right response to someone asking you to be considerate to other people around you who are sharing the same space is to get punchy then I'm not surprised you think that.

And you might have missed my other comments about how I'd consider that a last resort.

To be honest I wouldn't sit down next to a group of smokers if I could avoid it, and if I couldn't avoid it I'd probably go to another pub or place to eat, only if I'd already ordered and it was the only place to sit would I consider asking someone to stop, and I'd like to think I'd be able to do it politely too, in fact I'd feel embarrassed to have to ask

I know quite a few people who don't go to pubs nowadays in the summer as you can't sit outside without having cigarette smoke around you all the time

Presumably these (fictional) people had never been in a pub before the smoking ban ?

I know quite a few people who don't go to pubs nowadays in the summer as you can't sit outside without having cigarette smoke around you all the time

Sounds like you know some fun, ceraaaaaaaazy people. Must be party time time round their non-pub-attending houses on a weekend.

Do they often burst into tears or hide underneath furniture for no apparent reason?

Presumably these (fictional) people had never been in a pub before the smoking ban ?

They're not fictional, I'm one, and so are a few other people I know, and my fiancée is very wary of it due to her Asthma. She can't go running in the evenings for most of the week surrounding bonfire night due to smoke in the air setting her off, and we actively try and avoid places where smoke may be an issue.

The smoking ban coming in actually made going to the pub a much more frequent and enjoyable thing for us, and pubs don't seem any less busy for it, just nicer places to be in general.

Presumably these (fictional) people had never been in a pub before the smoking ban ?

They probably had to sit shivering in the beer garden because of the stinking smokers inside. Fictional?

EDIT: Ah, I see amedias has explained that they're not fictional at all. You ought to try and be a little less presumptuous.

amedias - Member
I suspect you may well expect a number of E)'s in your life if that's your view!
maybe, but if you think the right response to someone asking you to be considerate to other people around you who are sharing the same space is to get punchy then I'm not surprised you think that.

That wouldn't be my reaction at all. I'd judge whether a thought you were sound or a dick(this would be decided on how you asked me) and then decide whether I wanted to be nice to you or not after that.

Your complete unawareness of [u]your[/u] ignorance is astounding though.

I'm currently sat in my local cafe bar with dd snoozing in his buggy. There's a pint of Gem on the table. There are a few smokers sat outside on the terrace with a view of our classy high street with its charity shops, hairdressers, nail salons and chippies. It's a busy road with plenty of slow moving traffic so I suppose they're breathing in the shite from that too. And it's raining. Frankly, it's what they deserve.

Given the amount it costs, what is does to your health whilst on the planet, that you are likely to exit the planet early in a horrible way, that the majority of potential partners now wouldn't be interested in you because of your habit and the public at large finds you socially unacceptable because of your habit I've come to the conclusion that to be a smoker as an adult in 2015 you have to have a bit of a mental health problem.

No. Addiction does strange things to the minds of otherwise normal people.

*phones social services*

I'd judge whether a thought you were sound or a dick(this would be decided on how you asked me) and then decide whether I wanted to be nice to you or not after that.

See that must be where we differ. It's not a [i]decision [/i]I'd have to make, I would be nice and considerate to the people around me regardless.

I can understand how you might be able to reconcile the impact vs reward of being a smoker yourself, but I can't honestly understand how people can come to the conclusion that its acceptable or appropriate to inflict it on other people against their wishes in a shared space.

Given the amount it costs, what is does to your health whilst on the planet, that you are likely to exit the planet early in a horrible way, that the majority of potential partners now wouldn't be interested in you because of your habit and the public at large finds your habit socially unacceptable I've come to the conclusion that to be a [s]smoker[/s] cyclist as an adult in 2015 you have to have a bit of a mental health problem.

🙂

I'm currently sat in my local cafe bar with dd snoozing in his buggy.

Does DD know you're using his login while he's asleep? Who are you anyway?

[img] [/img]

vaping - I don't want to smell or inhale that shite - so sod off to the same place as the smokers.

Really? My wife vapes (0% nicotine) - are you really saying that the barely distinguishable vapourising scent of water and vegetable-based toffee or melon drifting across the breeze* is equal to nicotine smoke, not to mention more alarming/offensive and injurious to you and yours than the stink and carcinogens from (variously):

the pub BBQ?
The frying oil and grease from the kitchens?
the road?
the pub car park?
the diesel particulates from the trucks that delivered your imported food?
your deodorant?

I call troll...

* I can't even smell it 90% of the time indoors, sitting right next, neither in the car. When I do I say 'oh...toffee'? The thought of even detecting it outdoors let alone finding it offensive takes a lot of work tbh. The vapour is gone by the time it travels a few feet.

...I would be nice and considerate to the people around me regardless.

That's where it differs for smokers - their consideration ship has sailed years ago - the utter lack of self-respect they display is a good indicator for how to expect them to behave towards anybody else.

amedias - Member
See that must be where we differ. It's not a decision I'd have to make, I would be nice and considerate to the people around me regardless.

Usually I agree, but if someones treating me with contempt, they get treated equally! Like i say it'd depend how you asked.

As Figure 8 shows, the UK’s smoking bans correlate more closely with the collapse in pub numbers than any other factor,

So this figure then?

[img] [/img]

It's not exactly conclusive is it? Amazing to think that the smoking ban caused such a huge drop in pub numbers 25 years before it was introduced.

I'm talking about a certain type of preachy, whiney, sanctimonious type - the professional moaner - who thinks its appalling that the should have their enjoyment of the pub ruined by smokers, yet they never actually go to the pub anyway. probably because they've got no friends.

Oi. I'm a preachy, whiney, sanctimonious, moaner and I go to the pub every Thursday. And if the weather holds I'll be sat in the beer garden tonight.

Does DD know you're using his login while he's asleep? Who are you anyway?

😀

You should see him asleep in his buggy the little thing. Butter wouldn't melt...

deadlydarcy - Member
...I would be nice and considerate to the people around me regardless.
That's where it differs for smokers - their consideration ship has sailed years ago - the utter lack of self-respect they display is a good indicator for how to expect them to behave towards anybody else.

their consideration ship has sailed years ago - the utter lack of self-respect they display is a good indicator for how to expect them to behave towards anybody else.

For a practical demonstration of the consideration for others exhibited by many smokers, just glance at the floor of a given public space and count the cigarette butts.

They're not fictional, I'm one

Although now I'm wondering why you didnt say that in the first place.

"I know some people who don't go to pubs anymore because of the smoke.... Hang on a minute... Who are they? ..... Oh yes of course, it's [b]me[/b]. How silly of me to forget"

🙂

It's health and safety gone mad. There's way too many sensitive souls around these days. What's gonna happen on big nights out? Surely everyone smokes on a big night out, even if you're not a smoker!

Hurrah graphs at last,about bloody time.

Although now I'm wondering why you didnt say that in the first place.

"I know some people who don't go to pubs anymore because of the smoke.... Hang on a minute... Who are they? ..... Oh yes of course, it's me. How silly of me to forget"

E? I wasn't the one that first made the comment, I was responding/supporting to the person who did when you suggested it was fiction

[b]robdob[/b] - Member

Hope they do ban it everywhere round pubs. I used to smoke but can't stand the smell now, while I am eating it is especially nasty thing. [b]I know quite a few people who don't go to pubs nowadays[/b] in the summer as you can't sit outside without having cigarette smoke around you all the time

[b]nealglover [/b]- Member
Presumably these (fictional) people had never been in a pub before the smoking ban ?

[b]amedias [/b]- Member

They're not fictional, I'm one

*Disclaimer - It just occurred to me that only tend to frequent either quiet polite rural pubs with big beer gardens or else uproarious piratical seaside outposts where everyone smokes all manner of stuff in a breeze - so a lot of my experiences might not echo those who frequent congested pubs in and around cities.

ymmv, but I think cities themselves are stinky, congested, dangerous and poisonous places - and we should defintely think about banning cities before picking on outdoor smokers around rural pubs. Fairdoos? 😉

You should see him asleep in his buggy the little thing. Butter wouldn't melt...

So you get over excited about people daring to smoke in areas that they are allowed to smoke in yet take your child to these areas and consume alcohol while you're at it? I imagine you must hate yourself.

Hurrah graphs at last,about bloody time.

😆

Actually [url= http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/smoking-is-a-pretty-disgusting-habit-but/page/3#post-7105084 ]irc cited that graph on Page 3[/url]. I just thought I'd pull it out for those who couldn't be bothered reading the PDF.

*Disclaimer - It just occurred to me that only tend to frequent either quiet polite rural pubs with big beer garden

This is the "beer garden" at one of my locals (a quiet polite rural pub):

[img] [/img]

It's very nice - but not exactly huge.

Nonsense tbh. When I smoke i'm usually quite aware of others around me and try to minimize their impact. Example it's not usuaul for me to get up and walk away from the table if i'm sitting in a beer garden. You're generalising too much.

He's not the only one, you're generalising and assuming most smokers are as considerate as you, some are, but there's a heck of a lot who aren't.

To be honest, as a smoker, even a considerate one, you're not best placed to judge the impact it has on non-smokers.

If there's one generalisation I'm happy to be caught making it's that smokers are often blind to the extent it affects the people around them.

Anyway, I'll look forward to catching up on this thread when I get home later, I expect more graphs, and generalisations, lots of generalisations! toodle pip!

ymmv, but I think cities themselves are stinky, congested, dangerous and poisonous places - and we should defintely think about banning cities before picking on outdoor smokers around rural pubs. Fairdoos?

The problem with cities is rural dwellers commuting in their big stinky cars. I'd prefer it if you all did a reverse Dick Whittington and eff-off back to your amenity-free dormitories.

This is the "beer garden" at one of my locals (a quiet polite rural pub):

If you're describing The Ship as quiet and polite then you must not be able to hear the Karaoke from your street!

I haven't read through the six pages of discussion but surely the answer here is to allow pub/bars to choose if they want smoking in their beer gardens.
Therefore you would have smoking pubs and health club pubs (David Hockney reference there) who maybe also could have running machines in the beer gardens.
You could also have bouncy castle pubs were children are only allowed in the beer garden.

It's very nice - but not exactly huge.

Those ashtray are bloody huge! Point taken. If smokers can't police themselves effectively around non-smokers in a fairly confined space then they deserve at least not to be encouraged.

So you get over excited about people daring to smoke in areas that they are allowed to smoke in yet take your child to these areas and consume alcohol while you're at it? I imagine you must hate yourself.

😆

I think you need to get rid of that erection first. When you're less excited at having something to post about and are feeling a little more aware, let me know. 😉

The problem with cities is rural dwellers commuting in their big stinky cars.

If that were even true then all the more reason to localise and diversify with smaller businesses, smaller self-sustaining communities. But mass pollution isn't the problem here is it...it's an increasingly generalising, conservative/parochial attitude which prefers a catch-all ban-hammer in preference to sorting it out between each other like adults.

If that were even true then all the more reason to localise and diversify with smaller businesses, smaller self-sustaining communities. But mass pollution isn't the problem here is it...?

No, whataboutery is the problem.

Smoking areas are fine, but why do smokers find it acceptable to litter the ground with fag ends. My work has a total smoking ban so the other side boundary fence is fine to smoke in. It is almost ankle deep in fag butts, shame it's also a country park! What I find unacceptable is the disregard smokers have for other users of the places they get their fix in

^ I habitually bury or bin my rollies when smoked, even when walking the dog in the woods. So why do duvet/car/oil/mattress/garden-rubbish/takeaway food users feel that the countryside is the place to dump their fix once they move on to the next?

Maybe when Comrade Jezza gets to power he can ban cigarattes but legalise cannabis instead, then anyone who wants to carry on smoking can at least die with a smile on their face.

wasn't the one that first made the comment

Fair enough, hadn't spotted the names.

But I still have a question, these pubs you no longer visit due to the smoke

Was there ever a time you were a regular?

Because surely, due to smoking bans, and the fact there are an ever decreasing number of smokers in the UK, there has never been a time when a trip to the pub involved LESS smoke than right now.

binners - Member
...We pay shedloads of it on our 20 Bensons a day, we tend to go quickly after a short, horrific illness,..

You're forgetting the decade or so of shortness of breath, inability to walk far, or ride your bike.

And then there's the pain as the rest of your body deteriorates from lack of use - I never want to watch anyone go through that again.

Not all are "fortunate" enough to have a quick death.

But it's all horrific - and unnecessary.

And all the time the smoking addict stinks worse than a horse's arse even when they are not smoking.

What I find unacceptable is the disregard [s]smokers[/s] [i]some people [/i]have for other users of the places they [i]go[/i] [s]get their fix in[/s]

Firstly, it's by no means all smokers.

Secondly, there are many more (and worse) things than cigarette ends dumped all over the place (possibly even by non smokers!)

I'm surprised that on a forum dedicated to a healthy pastime such as cycling, there are so many who like to puff away on a noxious old bit of Indian rubber clobbering the heck out of their alveoli & pumping their blood full of carcinogenic shite???

On the upside it means the trails will be quieter....

...so many

Not many if this thread is anything to go by?