It's like the temp, who half lied to get the job, fluffed things up and avoided all responsibility. We all knew at the time that they lied, but there was nobody else around and the budget needed to be spent. That they have left is just a thing, nothing to get excited about. It was expected, of us and them. There's no surprise other than they got signed again half way through, and nobody could understand why. They will get a reference, but they will not be welcome back. We've now got another temp. We all know he just copied somebody else's homework to get in, but the alternative wasn't going to work. Who knows - he may do OK.
Mistake from the wider Labour Party IMO. The various opposers, both legitimate and, let’s say less so, now have 2-3 years in which to tear the incoming PM down. The same as they’ve done with KS.
Now now all other potential candidates than Burnham are dropping like flies, they see it too.
Shame, Starmer seems like a good guy.
Sorry but - at the risk of repeating myself - he really doesn’t. He’s actively supported a genocide and presided over the extinction of free speech and the right to protest. He’s not a good guy at all. Whether Burnham will be any better remains to be seen. History suggests not.
- he was while Labour was in opposition and led them to a reasonable victory
He didn't have to lead anything and just happened to be in charge. The country had had enough after 14 years of the Conservatives; even the Conservatives had had enough of the Conservatives.
Labour achieved the lowest vote share ever recorded for a winning party, albeit with the third largest Labour majority, which says more about our voting system
Yep voted in on the merit of not being the Tories 🙂
It’s a common theme nowadays , BJ got in without actually doing much work and just hid a lot so not to actually put a foot wrong.
Sorry but - at the risk of repeating myself - he really doesn’t. He’s actively supported a genocide and presided over the extinction of free speech and the right to protest.
What a load of myopic rubbish. He wasn't as vocal as he could have been in the early days of the conflict but that's hardly actively supporting genocide. Is he actively supporting all the other genocides around the word by not speaking out loudly at every opportunity, he wouldn't have had much time for UK politics if he did.
I know people who have, sadly. If you are Muslim or Jewish, and have a professional in the family that can take their work elsewhere, why wouldn’t you? But reporting back, their chosen host countries are going the same way. This social change is happening everywhere (at different rates). Being an English (first) speaking country might make it easier to move us, but nearly all countries are getting moved.
Yep, that drip,drip of right wing social media is also being pushed hard to non English speaking countries.
Your not the only country with boats landing on the beaches.
Its the slop ai videos showing how the countries being overran by furrigners that bugs me, they basically get steamed into the target country and worldwide.
What a load of myopic rubbish.
Thank you for your considered and informative response. I won't bother to repeat all the ways the Starmer government has supported the genocide - a simple Google will suffice, or maybe just refer to the "Gaza" thread. And without going too wildly OT, the latest example - which is almost comical - is for Yvette Cooper to state that the London sale of West Bank property is a matter for the Advertising Standards Agency.
10 years since we’ve had a PM do a full term. Not sure what it is, but something desperately needs to change
Giorgia Meloni became Italian prime minister on the 22nd of October 2022, which means that during her term she's seen 3 British Prime Ministers and a fourth is about to come along.
And I remember that Italy used to be used as an example of how PR and coalition governments led to instability and that's why the UK has FPTP.
Giorgia Meloni became Italian prime minister on the 22nd of October 2022, which means that during her term she's seen 3 British Prime Ministers and a fourth is about to come along.
Italy and Belgium are starting to look like models for stable government.
IMHO his biggest problem has been that he hasn't had a plan that both he and the Cabinet could stand behind and deliver. He became PM because he wasn't Sunak, just like Johnson became PM because he wasn't Corbyn. As a result there has never been a clear purpose he can deliver on and get his own mps to support.
Whether his replacement will be any better or have a clear purpose remains to be seen. So far none of the likely candidates have given any clue, but it is early days and we will see what they present over the summer.
I have spoken to a Danish guy and a Spanish guy in the last couple of hours and both said how disappointed they were that SKS was leaving. They had enjoyed a period of calm cooperation between our countries.
Starmer totally mishandled Israel's genocide in Gaza. There was a moment to build stronger links with friends in the EU by coordinating with them, and with Ireland in particular by joining them in their ICC legal action. As a lawyer, he should have been all over that - and he failed.
On Ukraine, he (and I reluctantly admit Johnson) was excellent. I worry that will be interrupted under whoever comes next, especially if they need to buy off the Labour left.
I think the free speech and protest criticisms are totally misplaced. Palestine Action absolutely fits the legal description of a terrorist organisation in the UK under the laws passed by Parliament - not Starmer - ages ago. The EU definition is basically the same.
Giorgia Meloni became Italian prime minister on the 22nd of October 2022, which means that during her term she's seen 3 British Prime Ministers and a fourth is about to come along.
Italy and Belgium are starting to look like models for stable government.
Belgium?? 😂🤣😂🤣
Election in June '24, threatened by their King if they didn't get something sorted by 2025
Finally put a coalition together in Feb '25. Plenty of time for it to fall apart; their record is almost 2 years without a government
They had enjoyed a period of calm cooperation between our countries.
I wonder if the UK/EU summit will go ahead next week?
It's really disappointing that Labour have not learnt anything from the cluster **** that was the last conversative government and have instead dived head first down the infighting path
They absolutely have. Starmer has resigned because he has realised it's not in the country's interests to have a fight. That's absolutely not what the Tories did at all.
There was a moment to build stronger links with friends in the EU by coordinating with them, and with Ireland in particular by joining them...
In September 2025, that happened in terms of recognising the State of Palestine... coordinated with France, Portugal and a whole load of other European countries. Of course Ireland and Spain led the way in May 2024. Just like the ICC ruling though... it had zero effect. European countries, and their leaders, will not bring peace to the region... all can and will be judged for failing to do. There is little unique about Starmer there.
Anyway, some people see all politics from the angle of Israeli action. They aren't going to be happy any time soon. The next PM (or the ones that immediately follow them) is not going to fix that intractable mess.
There is little unique about Starmer there.
Putting aside what actually happened on the ground in Gaza, which has been exhaustively documented elsewhere, the thing about Starmer that damns him is that straight out of the blocks he was talking about "they have that right" to cut off food and water to a civilian population His knee jerk reflex was to side with cruelty. That shows (for me) who he is.
Regarding PA - I have always said that calling someone a "terrorist" only serves to define your prejudices, since the definition is always written in such a convoluted way as to carefully draw a line between your friends and your enemies. However, to then use that definition to lock up grannies with cardboard signs and to sentence young people as "terrorists" after a secret trial is authoritarianism the like of which we haven't seen in Britain for a good while.
Starmer certainly lacked the clarity of say Spain with regards to Gaza. And I agree with DrJ about his authoritarianism which started as DPP - something I raised during the leadership race.
On the other hand he didn't drag Britian into Trumps folly in Iran and on Ukraine Zelensky has this to say:
“Keir, thank you for all our cooperation, your support, and the joint decisions that have helped make our Europe and our protection of life stronger.
The United Kingdom has been, is, and will remain among the world’s leaders. Here in Ukraine, we deeply value Britain, and every meeting and every conversation we have had has always been filled with real substance.
Thank you for always being in touch, always engaged, and always striving to do what is needed and what will truly help.
I wish the United Kingdom and all British people every success as well as realisation of your national goals. We have confidence in Britain.
Keir, you are always a welcome guest in Ukraine.”
However, to then use that definition to lock up grannies with cardboard signs
The grannies need only remove the "Palestine Action" wording from their signs and they can peacefully demonstrate for their cause. Or alternatively accept the outcome of their civil disobedience (which is the point after all)
The grannies need only remove the "Palestine Action" wording from their signs and they can peacefully demonstrate for their cause.
Yes, they have the right to free speech. As long as it's the sort of free speech we like.
That's how free speech works.
We have a right to free speech, but there are boundaries. Laws define the boundaries.
Not about Starmer anymore then.
That's absolutely not what the Tories did at all.
unless I am forgetting something all the tories pms resigned and didnt fight the leadership contest when they were told it was game other.
The fight happened amongst the contenders and do you really think Streeting wouldnt be a candidate if he thought he actually stood a chance?
We have a right to free speech, but there are boundaries. Laws define the boundaries.
That's what I said, I think ? The problem arises when you start off with a law that leads logically to an unjust result.
Anyway, I'm sure we know where we stand on this issue so back to the topic of the unlamented Keir Starmer....
The fight happened amongst the contenders and do you really think Streeting wouldnt be a candidate if he thought he actually stood a chance?
Exactly, he either can't get the 81 nominations he needs, or doesn't think he will win so has decided to see if he can get the job he wants in cabinet instead
unless I am forgetting something all the tories pms resigned and didnt fight the leadership contest when they were told it was game other.
Johnson Did resign eventually but after a long(seeming) fight
So Kier Starmer has resigned but did I say that when he first got into office that he would be a one term max PM?
Well, when people are hungry and struggling no amount of leadership can solve that.
7 Prime Minister in 10 years! Now can you see the pattern?
IMHO his biggest problem has been that he hasn't had a plan that both he and the Cabinet could stand behind and deliver. He became PM because he wasn't Sunak, just like Johnson became PM because he wasn't Corbyn. As a result there has never been a clear purpose he can deliver on and get his own mps to support.
As the saying goes... You can please all of the people some of the time, or some of the people all of the time... Starmer tried to be all things to all people, and quickly ended up being nothing to anyone!
Considering my vocal dislike of Starmer, I really should feel better right now than I do about his resignation today, but as many others have pointed out already, Burnham really shows no signs of being anything different (other than being a bit more charismatic and media savvy) and the right wing press are already hounding him and he hasn't even started the bloody job yet!
Either way... If Labour want to remain electable, they need to reconnect with their core voters, principles and forget trying to appease the dog whistles coming from the far right...
Genuinely wouldn't have bet on Donald Trump outlasting Keir Starmer in government! That one has shocked me a little...
It’s a tragically low bar, but he’s the best PM we’ve had for 16 years. He didn’t break anything important, and he managed to fix some stuff too. I doubt our next one will be better.
It's not about the best PM etc, it's about the people's pocket and livelihood. People will not forgive the PM if their livelihood is affected or suffered.
The next one (PM) will have will be heading in the same direction if nothing change. Judging from the current geopolitical environment, the likelihood of heading in the same direction is very high.
People will not forgive the PM if their livelihood is affected or suffered.
Great to hear that from someone who championed Brexit. What's amazing is that Farage isn't the one suffering for what he's done to our livelihoods.
Judging from the current geopolitical environment, the likelihood of heading in the same direction is very high.
particularly as Burnham hS said he will stick to the same taxation and spending policies
Great to hear that from someone who championed Brexit. What's amazing is that Farage isn't the one suffering for what he's done to our livelihoods.
No politicians will suffer due to their policies etc. People voted for Brexit because their livelihood had already started sliding down or felt it or saw it coming. It is like a slow car crash people see coming but can't do much, and in desperation the only thing they can do is to switch drivers to see if they can avoid the slow crash.
particularly as Burnham hS said he will stick to the same taxation and spending policies
If nothing much will change then we might be heading for a major landslide in the next election. i.e. people are so drained by that time they will vote for whoever promise some changes for better.
Burnham can capitalise on his "charisma" but that will only buy him sometime until people feel the pinch.
It’s a tragically low bar, but he’s the best PM we’ve had for 16 years. He didn’t break anything important, and he managed to fix some stuff too. I doubt our next one will be better.
I share your thoughts on Starmer, please somebody give me hope on Burnham.
People voted for Brexit because their livelihood had already started sliding down or felt it or saw it coming
Those who voted most enthusiastically for Brexit were on pensions which for them most part gave them a better standard of living than the youngsters who voted remain. And let's not forget the main motivation of every Brexiter I've spoken to was people like you and me, immigrants 'though not your sort of immigrant" people have said to me, but perhaps not you. 😉
Now Ernie has gone (sobs) you're the only Brexiter to post on politics threads, Chewkw. 🙂
And, of course, one of the things that did for Starmer was making a very small part of pensioner's benefits means tested. Pensioners must be protected from the financial doldrums on the seas of Brexit at all costs. However they vote.
I remember when we used to laugh at Italy for the length of time it's premier s lasted. Now we are fairly getting through them.
Burnham really shows no signs of being anything different (other than being a bit more charismatic and media savvy)
If you exclude all the areas where he's different, he's exactly the same.
Charisma and media savvy might be exactly what we need in a PM. That is the current battleground, as ridiculous as it sounds.
The issue many of us see Molgrips is that Burnham says he is going to stick to the same tax and spending limits and to stick with the same hard brexit - so there is unlikely to be any economic improvement thus no improvement to standards of living and thus no financial room for his pledges on nationalisation etc.
I heard he was planning to sell Scotland to the Russians to raise some capital, unless Trump wants, it to turn the whole place into massive golf course
My "hold the line" comment wasn't an "idea", it was a reaction to everyone running around like ****less chickens shouting about the sky falling in. It's driven by the media, especially social media - why do people let themselves be steered by media moguls and tech bros?? I'm tired of fact checking and myth busting the utter shiite family and friend spout/share.
Is there a better, serious, competent alternative to Labour right now? No. So hold the line. The alternative just now is dodgy chancers (backed by god knows who) trying to grab the steering and take us where, exactly?
The govt is broadly moving things in the right direction, hitting a few obstacles and losing some folk overboard, but what's going catastrophically wrong? Does anyone really think Reform, in the pocket of MAGA/Putin is the answer?
Gen Elections are 5 years apart for good reason.
Fair enough. Well put. I agree. Sorry.
Well, Hodge has made my mind up… every point she made on C4 News in support of a “coronation” made it clear to me a leadership contest is essential.
I’ll go further, Starmer (or rather Labour, he didn’t decide for himself did he) shouldn’t have resigned and should have stood against Burham. They’d both have to openly set out their stall to MPs, and in doing so would be taking over the news agenda informing the public about what they’ve done, what they want to do next, and how they’d get us there.
The winner would be more armoured against charges of “not knowing what they stand for”, and “what have they ever done for us”. Burham could make it clear what he learned as GM Mayor, and how he’d improve the country based on that. Starmer would be forced to explain himself to the public, and given the opportunity to refocus. Whoever won, MPs would be making a choice, and we could hold them to account for it. The transparency is needed.
but what's going catastrophically wrong
continuing with tory austerity. Continuing with hard brexit. Both disastrous policies
outrageous hardline immigration policies. another disaster
