[Closed] Royal Mail Strike(Why we are going on strike)CWU Dvd

So why exactly are you striking this time?

Why don't you watch the video spoony ? Or is it just a wind-up ?

50/50

some of us are at work and cant go on youtube

I've watched a good solid 3.5 minutes of it. I don't understand the industry and I don't have much understanding of the union mindset either I don't think. I've never worked anywhere with that sort of culture.

The sad fact of the matter is that our sorting office seems to have been doing official and unofficial strikes for long enough, and the post is now unreliable enough, that we are not using Royal Mail for anything important at all. All our important post is going either with couriers or electronically.

Maybe if that response is widespread management will back down and give you what you want, but I'm pretty sceptical.

OK, well to sum it up in just a few words, this quote by the CWU deputy general secretary says it all imo :

[i]" Modernisation should improve services not cut them. "[/i]

Mmmm, soundbitey.

The Royal Mail is broken. It needs fixing. Who should get the job of sorting it? The unions or the management?

What was the starting point here? It appears that the complaint is that you need to work harder for longer but if it was an easy life before then maybe its now just like other jobs? I know that reads a bit inflammatory but that video doesn't actually give an example of a postal workers typical day so I don't know what to base it on.
The company I work for has made many people redundant this year yet is making record profits (whilst our competitors are in trouble). There is actually more work and less people so everyone is working extra hours unpaid (I assume postal workers get overtime?).

Finally I think that many of the public find it hard to symphathise with a strike over pay and conditions when so many people have been made reduntant and want to get back to work.
I do think the government (labour and tories) have really messed up on the Royal Mail but the horse has bolted and there will be no Royal Mail if the two side don't sort this out once and for all.

2.5m unemployed (and rising) and the postal workers think that striking is the solution... wow, now that's what I call brave

Hell, handcart, etc...

The Royal Mail is broken

How can a company which makes huge profits be described as "broken" ?

we tried that line with the modernization of the fire service. and since weve already lost a number of fire stations , had hours changed, working routines altered come jan noone knows where they stand as the whole shift/leave system is overhauled . whole time stations are now day manned or even retained in places. and we are now way short of standard staffing. all in the name of modernization. and weve not a leg to stand on to argue with as the union agreed what was in effect a blank sheet of paper agreement for us to go back to work for ;-( further stations are due to be lost too. at least the union rep got 4 promotions out of it all ****s

hope your union are more honest than ours rich just be careful what you go back to it might be worse than youve already got

[i]How can a company which makes huge profits be described as "broken" [/i]

Because they should be delivering (Ha!) a service, rather than being a money making exercise. It is still virtually a monopoly and it shows.

From the outside it looks like neither the Posties on the streets nor the suits in the head office give two poos what they are there for.

Sack every single one of those who are not willing to go back to work for 8 hours a day, starting Monday. Hire new staff from the large pool of unemployed we have at the moment.

Maybe Maggie should climb out of her David Cameron suit, would get my vote.

Postierich - What is your stance? Strike or get back to work?

Postman Pat was still on CBeebies this morning.

Scab.

Who is going to leave my gates open? Who is going to litter the streets with rubber bands? Who is going to deliver my post to the wrong address?

These are all serious questions, we really should consider what is happening here.....

Perhaps posties would be better off wearing clogs (or sabots as some call them) to work so that they may throw them into this new beast of iron and steam in an attempt to put one over the mill owner, I mean management, for daring to want to drag the postal services of this country kicking and screaming into the 21st century rather than p*ss off the people who rely on it.

Because they should be delivering (Ha!) a service, rather than being a money making exercise.

Well the unions want to keep it as a service, and the management wants to turn it into a money making exercise ripe for privatisation.

So the answer to your question : "[i]Who should get the job of sorting it? The unions or the management?[/i]" it would appear that it is the unions.

....... I'm glad we've sorted that out.

*Spits tea over keyboard*

Well, if that's your view you might as well pack up your shorts now.

[img] [/img]

if that's your view

I'm sorry....... I thought it was [i]your[/i] view ? 😕

..... am I going on holiday btw ?

The CWU are the union that a lot of out techie guys are in
We've just been through a few redundancies & I had the [unenviable] task doing all the admin side of things for some of the guys, telling them why they need to go & what the company will help them with etc.
CWU guys have been present at all but 1 of the meetings I've held, what a bunch of incompetent idiots!
There were times when I felt like objecting & questioning stuff that I'd said myself, I was actually pausing & waiting for them to jump in for clarification, most of the time they didn't

Postierich - I hope the ones that look after you are better than the lot they sent to our meetings

Ernie - Are you sure that the unions are purely interested in the provision of a good service to the public? Could there be a little bit of "ooo, all those union subs we could be losing" in there as well?

Unions employ people too, they have a 'customer base' to protect.

(sootyandjim - Married to a union rep and in a union himself, which may suprise some I've no doubt.)

Are you sure that the unions are purely interested in the provision of a good service to the public?

Are you sure that the unions are purely interested in the provision of a good service to the public?

Absolutely. It is completely in their interest to do so. And they are of course customers themselves. The evidence that it is in the interest of management to put service before profit, is somewhat weaker.

ernie - missed my point by some margin, I think.

A new broom is required at RM. Unions prefer things to be left as they are.

Do I need to draw you a schematic diagram?

The evidence that it is in the interest of management to put service before profit, is somewhat weaker.

(Good) service is profit, without one the other suffers. At least thats how it works in a sectors of industry without a single supplier enjoying such a monopoly.

cheers_drive - Member

What was the starting point here? It appears that the complaint is that you need to work harder for longer but if it was an easy life before then maybe its now just like other jobs? I know that reads a bit inflammatory but that video doesn't actually give an example of a postal workers typical day so I don't know what to base it on.
The company I work for has made many people redundant this year yet is making record profits (whilst our competitors are in trouble). There is actually more work and less people so everyone is working extra hours unpaid (I assume postal workers get overtime?).

The main complaint seems to be that RM is actually sugesting paying them for the hours that they do work.

The following is quite funny though a bit old

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2007/oct/12/postalservice

Do I need to draw you a schematic diagram?

You could try that.

In the meantime, I'll remind you again of what you said :

ScottChegg - Member

Because they should be delivering (Ha!) a service, rather than being a money making exercise.

Posted 28 minutes ago # Report-Post

Posties and firemen. Last bastions of old school union idiocy.

We're still waiting for the "efficiency savings" that were to be brought in after the last fire strike 5(?) years ago. Why should we believe that posties will be any different.

Automated sorting? Just a means of ensuring that the post gets to the address stated, unlike the present when post goes anywhere(especially the interetsing looking things)

(Good) service is profit, without one the other suffers.

Like the NHS ?

Royal Mail makes plenty of profit btw.

Its all about job and knock isnt it? basically when they go out for their second round they dont have to report back so they just dump the post in the nearest post box to be done in one hit the following day ...and knock off - now theyre wanted to report back after delivering and dont like it . Been standard practice for years apparently....

I work in an office that has gone through the modernization that the Royal Mail wants to inflict on ever office in Britain.
All routes have been Geo planned(Pegasus)8 fulltime jobs lost out of 76
Start times changed from 5am till 6.15am
First letter delivered 7.30am now 10am if you want it before 9am you have to pay extra !!!!
Any full timers (40hrs) leaving the buisness are replaced by 20hr contracts and all they do is take the mail out, its all prepped(put in order to deliver)for them.We have lost 5 people in 3 months.

I,m no shirker to a bit of work but the workload is incredible and no place for old un,people are resorting to using their own cars because of the lack of infastructure like safe bag drops and proper vehicles to transport people out to their deliveries.

The managers have targets and I have just been told(I,m the CWU rep) we need to make an 11% saving on our budget for next year,which is totally unachieveable.Apparantly the mail is down 10% each year maybe from people directly going through Royal Mail and using TNT etc but we still have to deliver the competions mail for a scanderlously low fee.

We will get a yes vote and I will be on the gate but a few people will scab it but @ the end of the day we will be out for the right reasons and for everybody that works for Royal Mail as I for one want to work in an environment to be treated fairly and not harrased and bullied to make fat bonus cheques for a few people @ the top.

Rich
Hope it makes sense and no I cannot afford to go on strike but I cannot afford the union to be torn apart and be unrepresented in the workplace.

chatsworth weve had our efficiency savings weve lost around 300 fireman, 4 stations other stations have gone parttime and our leave is due to be ****ed come jan . but all the savings have been pumped into giving out free smoke alarms and deepfat fryers

Ernie - Comparing the Post Office to the NHS is neither a fair nor practicable comparison. You may as well compare the PO to the armed forces whilst you're at it.

......and our leave is due to be ****ed come jan

does that mean I'll have to get a new window cleaner? 😉

Ernie - Comparing the Post Office to the NHS is neither a fair nor practicable comparison.

I wasn't. I was showing that (Good) service isn't necessarily profit.

i rather sympathise with postierich, i would vote yes if i was him, and i see no reason why good service and good working conditions should not go hand in hand in this case. moreover i always thought that the '10% drop for the last however many years' was baloney, i mean come on! that just sounds like pants.

i worry that the stakes for the workers are very high though if the ballot comes out no, or if the strike gets broken. goodluck!

as an anecdotal aside, postierich's blue bike is pure class, my postman is a lovely man, i never have had any problems sending packages and post offices are great (though city and country POs tend to be great for different reasons)

In an organisation not designed to make any profit of course it's not.

And yes sooty, Royal Mail makes plenty of profit :

[url= http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/4307491/Royal-Mail-makes-profits-of-900000-a-day-as-it-shuts-thousands-of-post-offices.html ]Royal Mail makes profits of £900,000 a day as it shuts thousands of post offices[/url]

Quote :

[i]The healthy financial performance is likely to trigger large six-figure bonuses for the management team, including chief executive Adam Crozier.

It also stands in stark contrast to the losses posted by high street banks. Earlier this week Royal Bank of Scotland posted a record loss of £28billion for last year.[/i]

well if you window cleaner chooses to clean your windows after his 48hr week then you may do 😉 dunno where hes posted but i sure dont do any work in my off time

I wasn't. I was showing that (Good) service isn't necessarily profit.

Well in that case actually you're wrong there.

Good service from the NHS produces a 'profit' which is the customer not having to continue using the service over an extended period of time. In other words, if the NHS does their job right the first time the patient will cost then (and by them I of course mean us) less in the long run.

Although no actual money has changed hands between the 'customer' and NHS money is saved if the job is well done and this saving can in a manner be considered 'profit'.

The same can be said for any branch of the civil service and the military too.

In other words..

"Do it once, and do it right"

LOL @ Sooty !

and ....

[i]"What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world and loses his soul?" [/i]

eh ?

Really about time RM employees got into the real world. RM is no longer a public service, it is a business. My dad now works for RM and some of the stories and working practices he's told me about are truly staggering. All rather sounds like the dying gasps of people who's fulltime jobs have evolved into blocks to progress (union reps). Unions have an important role to play looking after individual members, the time has long past where business let the unions dictate how a business is run.

sootyandjim fails again.
If the NHS does it job right, you live longer and need more, not less medical care. If they screw up completely you die and stop being their problem.

BTW did you ever find out where the salmon farms are on the Tay?

mick - Member
well if you window cleaner chooses to clean your windows after his 48hr week then you may do dunno where hes posted but i sure dont do any work in my off time

Well my boss has a regular gardener who is a fireman, and his mate(s) have just redecorated all through his house. How DO they find the time to put in a full time job, and still have the time and energy for second jobs? Assuming that they are actually working in the first place. Remind me again, what goes on during a nightshift? And I've been in firestations at night and seen!

RM is no longer a public service, it is a business.

Actually it always has been. So nothing's changed then.

In which case it's one and only reason for existing is to make money for it's shareholders. Most businesses realise that they will make more money if they other a good service but the fundamental reason d'etre is to make money not to provide a service. As for the unions whinging on about the employees rights to jobs etc. and the purpose of the business being to keep people employed 🙄 (although again good businesses usually realise they will make more money with a well motivated workforce, but the primary motive is the profit).

Personally I'm quite happy with businesses being there to make money, if a service is so important to society it should be provided by the government whose priority should be the provision of the service.

i dont know chatsworth get round to leeds central station for 7 tonight and you can watch how busy i am if you interested ? 😉

RM is no longer a public service

It still is and its about time other "services" like Water, leccy etc be turned back into services for the public instead of a high priced service cut privatised cash cow for boards of directors and shareholders.

It seems some of you still believe that privatisation works. It hasn't worked for the UK public.

I'm still no wiser as to why they are striking and I stand by my comments I made on a previous thread - if they aren't wanting to work - sack them, then they can see how they survive with no money coming in...any money coming in to pay bills is better than none...so let them go and give the job to someone who would appreciate the job...this idea of going on strike because they aren't happy with changes is just alien to me...suck it up and get on with it as you are one of the lucky ones that has a job with an income.

this idea of going on strike because they aren't happy with changes is just alien to me

Really? Seems pretty sensible to me tbh. I take it you are with the guy on the first page then, happy working for a company making huge profits, doing loads of unpaid ot because they've made too many people redundant. Personally I just think you're jealous that they have decent representation and you don't. Ah well, bend over and enjoy your corporate shafting then...

Good luck Rich and all the other posties on here.

The problem for a lot of punters, me included is I fail to see how the service we receive can get any worse than it has been for years now, so I couldn't care less about your conditions. The wildcat strikes happening now have cost me £50 as my claim for my phone rebate didn't get to T-mobile until after the deadline, and my dads birthday card and prezzie arrived nearly a week later than it should have done. I was stood behind a woman in the post office yesterday who's sister had died and the majority of condolance cards and messages had arrived a week after the funeral. In all honesty would you feel sympathy for Royal Mail workers if you were her?
Twice this month I have come home from work to find packages on my doorstep in clear view of the street because the postie couldn't be bothered filling out a card and putting it through the letter box. I'm constantly cleaning red elastic bands out of the garden you fail to take with you and the gate is never closed like it was when you came through it. It doesn't happen anymore but we used to get cards through the door saying there was no-one in to receive a parcel whe my wife was at home on maternity leave, resulting in a trek to the local sorting office for a heavily pregant women.
I don't think it's the organisation thats the problem but a significant amount of Royal Mail workers attitude to the job. Whe you pay us some respect we may care whether you keep your job or not. I'd have privatised the service years ago.

One of the coffee companies I use has just e-mailed to say they have chucked Royal Mail because of the interruptions to business and gone with DHL.

Sadly, industrial action is driving business away and damaging image beyond repair.

"RM is no longer a public service"

It still is.....

imo nationalised companies in Britain (with the obvious exception of the NHS) have almost never been run as 'services' for the benefit of consumers and the general public.

Indeed this is precisely why, for example, British Rail was a failure. In contrast, the French saw public transport as providing a vital and necessary service to the nation, and as a consequence, the history of the French nationalised railways is one of impressive successes.

Furthermore, despite the fact that a nationalised industry might not [i][u]necessarily[/u][/i] create a profit, the "social wage" it provides, contributes hugely to the economic well-being of the individuals within the society.

Wish you much luck mate
Unless others worked in such work places and enviroments
then there will be an understanding.

^^ 🙄

I actually think it is many of the Royal Mail employees who could do with a dose of understanding what it is like on the other side and before you ask I have, albeit a long time ago, worked for RM and as I said earlier my Dad does so I do have some understanding of the RM work place.

.....as I said earlier my Dad does

So does the multi-millionaire Alan Crozier.

And ?

When i worked from home a card came saying that it wasnt in etc, but i was sat less than 2m from the door.
i read it, opened the door to a shocked postie and asked for the parcel as i was in and he had not knocked. He had to then admit he didnt have it and could i go and collect it? FFS.

A couple of years ago i got birthday cards through the mail and each one had been opened. I complained and they said that i can collect my mail from the sorting office if i was concerned.

I work 9 hour days with no break for 8 hours pay.
I won't be going on strike as all these problems have been on going for the last 2 years or so,and the timing of this action (middle of the worst recession since pre war) sums up the thick unions.Remember the coal miners striking in the spring/summer ?? Thick as the brown stuff.

I think the problem lies with management.The decisions and waste made by these idiots are staggering at times.
eg.
we had a manager who used to work nights and they continued to pay him his substantial night allowance 18 months after he started on days.
eg.
designing a barcode scanner (£150 each,1 for every delivery) to be replaced a year later by a Pda that will do the same job. (£1500 each)
eg.
When i started 10 years ago we had 2 managers and about 80 staff,we now have 60 staff and 4 managers !

I can't stand unions as i think in general they are thick and lazy and try and justify their fees by kicking up a fuss about nothing most of the time.I would generally agree that it would be in a managers interest to keep staff happy.However when a business is so big and in a position where quality of service is overlooked in order to incease(not turn loss into profit) profits,normal business rules seem to be thrown out the window.
The sooner they realise that an improvement in service leads to increased profits the better.You can't do the former by cutting services and staff and so the latter is impossible.

Their are also other issues about cherry picking services by private companies etc,but that is for another day !

not bothered to read all the above comments, but being a postie is an unskilled manual labour job. 99.9% of the country can read, walk and ride a bicycle. 85% of the country is licenced to drive a small van.

so this should be a minimum wage job. unfortunately a few union monkeys want to earn £100k a year so posties go on strike all the time.

our place employs 5000 odd people, we've just switched to dx and email / pdf for as much as we can following yet another postal strike messing up things for us. thats quite a few less parcels and envelopes going by royal mail. all the current strike has done is meant a few less postal workers are required in our area. well done boys!

basically posties need to join the real world, accept a big pay cut, and work harder, because otherwise their firm won't exist in 10 years time.

imo nationalised companies in Britain (with the obvious exception of the NHS) have almost never been run as 'services' for the benefit of consumers and the general public.

Indeed this is precisely why, for example, British Rail was a failure. In contrast, the French saw public transport as providing a vital and necessary service to the nation, and as a consequence, the history of the French nationalised railways is one of impressive successes.

Unfortunately, the problems with the British railway system go rather deeper into our national psyche than that.

basically posties need to join the real world

But not as much as you.

Then perhaps, you wouldn't come out with bollox like this : "unfortunately a few union monkeys want to earn £100k a year".

aracer - the only difference British railways and French railways, was government policy towards them.
Simple as.

That kind of contradicts your previous point I think, but I'm happy to agree with you (though I don't think it particularly contradicts my previous point - it's not as if attitudes towards the railways have improved).

basically posties need to join the real world, accept a big pay cut, and work harder, because otherwise their firm won't exist in 10 years time.

Perhaps if you had read more of the posts above, you would have learnt that RM is making huge profits WHILST posties are working under current conditions.

There are lots of manual labour jobs paying above the minimum wage, why should a postie be different? I'm not happy for anyone to be working for minimum wage, particularly so when the employer is very successful.

I really couldn't bring myself to watch that posted link.
All I would like is my post delivered on time, preferably before I go to work. How is it still posible to get delays and lost mail in the 21st century with our vast transport network and computer driven systems?
I posted some pedals the other day to Scotland, all for £2.89 recorded delivery, it arrived next day, to me that was a bargain and I would happily pay more for that service. My lunch cost more than that!

I'd also like to thank the postie for not delivering my insurance certificate on time due to strikes as I couldn't tax my car without it.

The RM is aeons old now surely you should have mastered the art of a postal service by now.

Last saturday a postie put a card through to say he couldnt deliver a parcel,but i was in, so chased after him, and he said he tried to deliver it the day before friday, but i wasnt in, so didnt bother try today saturday,and friday he said he didnt have any cards to leave.
so a drive to the office thats open from 07.00 to 11.00 hrs on a saturday, and 07.00 to 13.00 on a weekday,despite staff being there all day.

We as a customer make the effort to deliver the mail to a post box, all the staff have to do is pick it up once a day, sort it and then redeliver it within 2 days.

Or is that to easy. SEEMS SO.

Also theyre haveing a national ballot, by post, has anyone told the union theyre on strike and theres 20 million letters stuck in the system, and that doesnt include all the wrongly delivered,stolen or damaged letter already.

What a way to run anything.

We as a customer make the effort to deliver the mail to a post box, all the staff have to do is pick it up once a day, sort it and then redeliver it within 2 days.

Let me get this straight; you think it's a harder process for you to walk to the nearest postbox than the sorting and redelivery part. Despite that requiring enormous infrastructure and thousands of workers. OK. Lets also consider the many thousands of pieces of mail you've received without incident. Do you remember them, or just take them for granted?

Perhaps if you had read more of the posts above, you would have learnt that RM is making huge profits WHILST posties are working under current conditions.

Posties and firemen. Last bastions of old school union idiocy

I think you'll find teaching unions can be quite old school too - ours managed to get rid of our maniac, bullying head - we'd be stuck with him now otherwise

Really about time RM employees got into the real world

Is that the real world of job insecurity and shafting whoever you can for a profit - sorry, 'meeting targets'?

There's always going to be rogues in every industry. Every postie I know is decent, hard working but harassed.

management/target/streamlining/b0ll0x just destroys peoples pride in their work.

Good luck Rich, some of us can cope with mail being a little late for a day or two.

The post I replied to stated that unless posties worked harder and for less that the RM would cease to exist. Do you agree with that? Enjoy your ot by the way, I hope you get paid...

Rich Penny all the infrastructure was put into place and paid for by us the customer and tax payer, probably

Really? Seems pretty sensible to me tbh. I take it you are with the guy on the first page then, happy working for a company making huge profits, doing loads of unpaid ot because they've made too many people redundant. Personally I just think you're jealous that they have decent representation and you don't. Ah well, bend over and enjoy your corporate shafting then...

Correct. Same goes for microsoft and intel. But guess what, I still reckon it's harder to develop an OS and a computer than it is to type...

Who cares if the posties go on strike, maybe the crap that comes through my letter box each day will stop for a while. Bills & junk mail.

I'm that guy and If I don't like it I can leave the company when the economy picks up.

Surely it would be better in that scenario to stand up for yourself and refuse to do excessive amounts of unpaid ot? I know you can't do that, but some people can through unions and I don't begrudge them that.

I ignored Darksides post because it mainly appeared to be chuntering on about a single incident which they've used to denigrate the entire business. Did I miss something?

I'm not a postie btw, it just irks me to see peoples rights eroded and then the only comments being that once someones fathers mothers brother got a ****ing card a day late 😈

Reckon the CWU are going to be busy, i'm in that union and just at the start of a dispute with BT over working hours and a good few other things too

Think there could be a bit of disruption all round this winter, too many companies have seen the so called recession as a way to intimidate their staff

Terms and conditions that have been fought for over many years are now being eroded or removed at the drop of a hat
Old gits like me can put up with it for a few years until retirement, but it would be nice to leave the younger generation reasonable and safe working conditions

The Irish posties are out on wildcat strikes over the same issues. Apparently they're sending out a postal ballot to decide whether to return to work.....