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Financial literacy should be a compulsory and stand alone part of the curriculum.
and all the other useless shit you learn in A level maths.
oi, as I'm currently typing....
normal = n * ntm;
mlb::VectorNormalize(normal);
I resent that 😉
So what are the actual practicalities of this?
Oh look... there are none. What a surprise!
So my daughter did her A levels last year. She did English Language, English literature and politics. She got great grades and has an offer from her first choice university (which she's deferred for a year) where she's going to study creative writing (as you could probably tell from her A level choices)
So what possible *ing benefit would she gain from being forced to learn how to do quadratic equations at A level? And which of these subjects would she need to drop to allow for the hours a week of totally *ing pointless maths lessons?
Its an absolutely *ing stupid idea, which looks even more ridiculous when you look at the day to day practicalities that this would involve, not least that we don't even have the maths teachers to cope with the present curriculum
He's a *ing clown who's completely detached from reality
The problem is the pure opportunity cost of having a bunch of completely disengaged humanities students sitting in five extra maths lessons a week. Which subjects are going to be elbowed out of the way for this? Nightmare to study and a nightmare to teach. 18-year-old me would have been treating it like an extra private study session for the subjects I was interested in, completely ignoring what was going on at the front, and handing back a blank exam paper at the end.
And every minute spent 'teaching' A level students is a minute you could have spent helping GCSE students.
To say – “everyone should have basic numeracy on leaving school” is fine. to say everyone should study maths to 18 is daft
Absolutely. Some people though won't get to basic numeracy or literacy by 16 for whatever reason, and if we don't continue to upskill them to that competence level then they will inevitably struggle in adult life.
And yes, there will always be the school haters, or those that claim to have no qualifications and it did them no harm, we're not talking about paper qualifications, we're talking about being functionally able to work out your household incoming and outgoings and what'll happen to your mortgage if rates go up another %, etc.
How that is achieved in a non-school setting, I don't know, but it has to be a goal. I'm tempted to say part of OtJ training, or apprenticeships, or even part of unemployment support, but also aware that as we recruit our apprentice cohort (into a STEM field admittedly) if you aren't numerate and literate you're unlikely to get onto the apprentice scheme.
we’re talking about being functionally able to work out your household incoming and outgoings and what’ll happen to your mortgage if rates go up another %, etc.
Which is very basic stuff and not related in any way to what you learn in A level. Should the curriculum be changed for GCSE to include home financing for example - yes it should, but that is a different discussion
But Rishi is not suggesting what you have is he? He is just suggesting maths as it is (integration, differentiation, matrices) and all the other useless shit you learn in A level maths.
If that’s the case then it’s a terrible policy.
Also doesn’t fix the problem of way too many people being publicly proud of being incompetent at maths because being good at it is somehow embarrassing.
Yes it is an ill thought out policy. It will not fix the apparent problem of poor numeracy as if you have poor numeracy by the time you get to 16 that is an issue with what was going on until that point. Numeracy = basic maths in my view, A level is not basic maths, at all.
theotherjonv
Full MemberAbsolutely. Some people though won’t get to basic numeracy or literacy by 16 for whatever reason, and if we don’t continue to upskill them to that competence level then they will inevitably struggle in adult life.
So what that calls for, is an "out" from the current maths teaching into a basic, practical, real-world focused maths course to be taught to people who neither can or want to do gcse and a level. But those are the students that every government for the last, oh, forever has been least interested in, and which Sunak certainly doesn't give a shit about. So he'll happily talk of pushing them into more classes that won't help them and which they'll fail at, for no benefit and massive detriment to the system as a whole. He'll do absolutely ****-all to help sub-gcse students except to use them as a tool to beat teachers and schools with.
If that’s the case then it’s a terrible policy.
No one knows. No details. No funding. No timeline. No plan. No nothing. Not a policy at all. A political fart for everyone to have a sniff and a moan about, ignoring everything Sunak isn’t doing while he sits out the winter hoping we all have short memories when the summer returns and he resurfaces to claim the credit for gas prices falling and the slowing of inflation.
It's a bullshit dead cat. Nothing will come of it. Nothing ever does.
> duplicate post deleted <
Oh, Biners rant +1
but an hour a week in schools on something similar, developing the life skills of analysis, debate, etc. will equip kids far more than another two years trying to estimate the shape of a quadratic equation on graph paper.
My boss has sat with Nick Gibb, ex education minister, current education adviser.
We were told in no uncertain terms than the current government do not want children and young people equipped with such critical thinking, we should not approach DfE around anything to do with sustainability and climate education, that senior government and leaders in DfE would resist it.
Teach the technicalities of what is happening, yes. Teaching to have a response or motivation or equip to take action - absolutely no way.
We're now delivery partner for the (underfunded and much delayed) DfE sustainability and climate strategy, national education nature park. It's £5m over 5 years, it's led by a *few* people in DfE, disowned by DfE curriculum team (biggest team in DfE) and is now 4 months behind on the contract actually being signed.
The only reason they have done it is a) a tiny team in DfE trying to do something right, and b) Nadhim Zahawi went off-piste with an announcement at COP in Glasgow to get that days headlines. I was sat with him and the DfE team an hour after he announced it - with most of them going 'wtf do we do' - hence why my organisation was invited to help.
Don't believe that any of our current government either understand how good education is undertaken or that they have any shred of 'education is good for all' motivation - thier motivation is self serving in the extreme.
We were told in no uncertain terms than the current government do not want children and young people equipped with such critical thinking
Heaven forbid the plebs get told how to work out that the Tories are screwing them over.
WILL PEOPLE PLEASE STOP SAYING MATHS WHEN THEY MEAN ARITHMETIC!!!!!
*bangs head on wall*
🙂
No. Arithmetic is not going to be taught between 16-18 as a student learns all the arithmetic they require by the time they are 14 so what do you think they will be doing when they are 16-18?
as a student *learns* all the arithmetic they require by the time they are 14
*should learn* - and yet reports suggest "on average, one in four adults in England has low literacy or numeracy. These are skills as crucial as understanding the dosage instructions on an aspirin packet". And apparently it's declining, not improving.
https://learningandwork.org.uk/news-and-policy/literacy-numeracy-england-map/
As has been said before, I agree there's no benefit to forcing numerate kids to do another two years doing "non-useful" maths like calculus or quadratic equations; those that it is useful for such as those planning on going into eg. STEM subjects in further education will do it by choice.
But if kids aren't getting to functional effectiveness in numeracy or literacy by 14 or 16 then I think it's important that it continues until they do. Respecting that some will really struggle either with a school environment, and some will just struggle full stop. How that is done; I'm not an educationalist but we can't simply say 'school's not for everyone' and give up, 3/4 is a terrible level of competency for a first world nation.
No. Arithmetic is not going to be taught between 16-18 as a student learns all the arithmetic they require by the time they are 14 so what do you think they will be doing when they are 16-18?
Everyone who has posted on this thread is talking about arithmetic not higher maths!
But if kids aren’t getting to functional effectiveness in numeracy or literacy by 14 or 16 then I think it’s important that it continues until they do.
Well, there's a potentially useful policy. But it isn't the political fart that Sunak let off, is it. Throw in some money and a plan to actually train and recruit more maths teachers (including specialists to oversee primary school maths teaching perhaps, rather relying too much on trying to fix things post GCSE) and we could be getting somewhere.
But it isn’t the political fart that Sunak let off, is it.
God no. It's just a dead cat attempt and like everything else this third (or is it now fourth?) choice gov does, even they are increasingly shit
Throw in some money and a plan to actually train and recruit more maths teachers (including specialists to oversee primary school maths teaching perhaps, rather relying too much on trying to fix things post GCSE) and we could be getting somewhere.
☝️
If they do go ahead with the policy they should make it maths skills needed for life. How credit works, Aprs, mortgages, insurance, Stamp duty, tax and pensions.
How credit works, Aprs, mortgages, insurance, Stamp duty, tax and pensions.
Which should be in place well before further education level, as the maths complexity required is actually fairly low and perfectly understandable at pre GCSE level.
Sunak’s announcement is nothing more than a distraction that won’t actually happen, but allows right wing commentators to blather on about it for a while instead of focussing on some really existential Tory nastiness currently going on. See also; the Harry and Meghan non story.
Sunak is just pushing out clouds of ink and waiting for the Bring Back Boris sect to gain enough momentum to do him in. To be honest, the whole party is doing that too - none of them think they've got a snowball's chance in hell of winning an election so they're going to spend two years lining the pockets of the mates who are going to be giving them jobs afterwards.
Of course he uses a private GP. And even he didn’t, has the means to go straight to private specialists anyway.
Interestingly he is moving on talking to the healthcare strikers. the latest is that he WILL discuss this years pay claim.
Dunno why the change of heart. He was getting some flack from backbenchers over being inflexible
I guess it can only be a good thing
Interestingly he is moving on talking to the healthcare strikers.
Don’t be fooled. He’s only talking about the upcoming pay review/year… not the current one that is being contested in these strikes. All hangs on what “this year” means… he’s so damn shifty.
According the Grauniad he is including this years not next or at least not ruling it out
could be smoke and mirrors of course but overt the last few days it seems to me that he is actually begining to get how unpopular his stance has been and softening it
Watch/listen to the actual interview… nothing positive about talking about pay for 2022/23, ie the year and winter of high inflation. They are still full steam ahead with using this high inflation year to embed lower real wages. Trying to use the next pay review to “move on” from the pain of this year for the staff driven to striking. Good line to use for the public, some will think that this is the government being more reasonable… without them having to move an inch.
From that guardian article linked above;
Before that process starts, the government is keen to sit down with the unions and talk about pay and make sure they understand where we’re coming from. -Sunak
Wow. The superlative arrogance of this man. The position is basically do as you are ****ing told, you plebs, I am in charge and I know best”.
On the maths thing..... My daughter is in Y13, studying the IB instead of A levels. For those not familiar, you study 6 subjects, 3 Higher, 3 lower. You have to take maths, english a language and a science, your choice of higher/lower. There is also a core syllabus, which includes writing an extended essay on a topic of your choice.
The maths they learn is more "Practical applications of maths"
IB is a lot of work, but we've been very pleased with it. Hers (Grammar) is one of the few state schools to do IB.
If I had the opportunity i'd make sure the **** needed to use his private health care
Rishi Sunak has opened the door to a pay deal for striking nurses when ministers meet health unions for talks on Monday after signalling for the first time a willingness to address demands for more help with the cost of living.
The Guardian understands ministers are prepared to look at a “one-off” payment to health workers, possibly in the form of a hardship payment to get them through this winter. Downing Street and the Treasury were accused of blocking such an offer last month.
He is moving on this knowing he is losing the public opinion.
He is moving on this knowing he is losing the public opinion.
For sure, he's not suddenly had an epiphany, he's just being reactive rather than proactive.
I’m certainly not holding my breath. For sure, he’s between a rock and a hard place, but Tories value pigheaded strength more than pragmatic flexibility. It’s all very toxic alpha male ego crap.
The only way out of this is if they can find a face saving way to give an increased pay offer, that he can pretend isn’t an increased pay offer, or that extracts some amazing productivity bullshit promise from the unions. We’ll see.
If I had the opportunity i’d make sure the **** needed to use his private health care
Join the queue, it's a long one.
He’s on a hiding to nothing though. The tail has been wagging the dog in the Tory party since 2016.
The same ERG headbangers who championed Boris, then elected her then cheered Liz Trusses insane mini-budget now demand that Rishi go to war with unions. ‘No surrender’ and all that bollocks. And he knows that if he doesn’t appease them then the letters will go in to Graham Brady and they’ll depose him and bring Boris back
They’ll do that anyway, or at least attempt to, or something even more mental like trying to make Suella Braverman PM, but they’ll do it tomorrow if he compromises or shows any pragmatism
As we have been since 2016, we’re all at the mercy of the whims of these swivel-eyed loons, while they run the country aground
I do wonder if those couple of tentative steps towards a settlement from Sunak will be reversed once the loons give him a wedgie for even thinking of a tiny compromise
And he knows that if he doesn’t appease them then the letters will go in to Graham Brady and they’ll depose him and bring Boris back
No he doesn't know that. What he does know is that there is next to zero chance the Tories will change their leader yet again before next year's general election.
He would have to do something monumentally stupid before the Tories even begin to start thinking of replacing him, the chances of that happening are too remote to even consider.
Just look at what Liz Truss had to do to force the Tories to replace her, and how much slack they cut Boris Johnson as he staggered from one disaster to the next disaster for the best part of a year.
Rishi Sunak won't have any problem keeping is nose clean with the party, the only thing that he needs to worry about is how much of disaster the next election night will be for Tories.
And knows that right now the Tories greatest weakness, right across practically all the demographics, is the NHS.
If Rishi Sunak is beginning to show signs of being more responsive to the crisis in the NHS it will be because of that, not because he fears the ERG.
I think you're attributing a degree of sanity to the present Tory party which simply doesn't exist. They're effectively now an ungovernable rabble who are having a temporary truce between the warring factions as having a fourth leader in as many months would look even more insane than it already does
It won't last, obviously
The fruitloops who've been wagging the dog for years now still won't accept that Truss's policies were a disaster, that Brexit is a disaster and that all the other ultra-libertarian Ayn Rand nonsense they champion is utter madness too. They simply believe their ridiculous conspiracy theory narrative that it just hasn't been done properly due to sabotage by remainers/liberals/the media etc, etc, etc, etc - fault lies everywhere else but with themselves
I know she's madder than a bucket of spiders and she probably wrote this as she opened her second bottle of gin, but her views are pretty representative of a large rump of the present Tory party...
https://twitter.com/NadineDorries/status/1612033575477547008?s=20&t=VCGKfUTdy5dXQyiNZRlUjw
They honestly believe that if the king overseas (on a speaking tour, lining his pockets) returns then he'll win the next election for them. They really are that unhinged. Just read the Mail article. The ramblings of an utter madwoman, but she's hardly alone in those views. Self-awareness or contact with reality isn't something that troubles these lunatics
I expect that catastrophic local election results in May will put paid to the temporary cessation of hostilities, but that once that happens then all hell will break loose again. Most of the country could be on strike by then at this rate too, because the headbangers won't stand for any compromise with the unions
Sunak will be gone by June and then its just a case of whether they succeed in reinstalling Boris or whether its someone even madder, like Braverman
Watching the Tory party eat itself would be a highly amusing spectator sport if the collateral damage to the rest of us wasn't so serious
Absolutely taking the piss now. Tory governance continues its attempt to stay one step ahead of the satirists...
Dear god?!!!! 😳
I suppose it was either him or the tractor bloke
https://twitter.com/johnjcrace/status/1612873196155305995?s=46&t=K7b6tnA2N3ERWRx1D1FwnQ
The first PMQ's of the year coming up. I expect Rishi will continue his Boris tribute act approach of completely ignoring any questions and just waffling his pre-prepared soundbites.
Given that even more strikes have been announced this morning, this complete refusal to even engage with the issues is going to look even more ridiculous than it does already
Hang on, it's a relatively sane decision! Most out of character.
Bridgen has been posting that tin-foil-helmeted, conspiracy-theory lunacy for months, if not years now
Rishi - in his usual horse/stable door way - has apparently now registered with an NHS GP. He's a man of the people, just like the rest of us now
Anyone listening to PMQs…?
Nope - I cannot bear to hear them speak. My telly / computer would get smashed as I get so angry. I'll read the transcript and analysis later
I'm getting angry just reading the quotes on the BBC live feed
Wise TJ. Sunak today would/should get anyone and everyone angry. Especially paramedics and nurses.
Wise TJ
words I never thought I would see on here 🙂
Don’t be daft, your contributions are often informative and enlightening. Just not always… 😘
Anyone listening to PMQs…?
I watched it, dunno why as Sunak doesn’t answer the questions.
If I’m ever stopped by the police/up in court I’m going to apply the Sunak defence of answering questions by attacking those asking the question, it’s a genius strategy that is bound to win me favour.
You could tell how bad it was. The utterly spineless speaker actually intervened and pointed out to him that it was Prime Minister Question, not Leader of the Oppositions Questions
A pity he didn't follow it up by actually making him answer the questions
Apart from that... Union Paymasters? Tick. Jeremy Corbyn? Tick. NHS Family? Tick. Blah, blah, blah...
Feet back up until next week, Boris-stylee, with maybe a private jet flight to a hospital
Feet back up until next week, Boris-stylee, with maybe a private jet flight to a hospital
or a ****ed up photo opportunity in a doctors surgery waiting room, asking a pensioner with a sprained wrist if she plays rugby.
Bridgen has been posting that tin-foil-helmeted, conspiracy-theory lunacy for months, if not years now
He went full on covid conspiracy just after he lost a few court cases
I'd lay money on him doing this for cash
Outrageous that he's not been suspended before now, the very worst type of MP
I’d lay money on him doing this for cash
That wouldn't surprise me in the least
There are a couple of Tory's that are worth following on Twitter because the stuff they post is so completely and utterly unhinged and preposterous as to be laughable. One is Andrew Bridgen and another is John Redwood.
I saw from that Sky MP's earnings' website the other day that John Redwood is one of the highest earners from dubious 'interests' outside parliament. So I'm sure his earnings and his propensity to spout utter rubbish aren't entirely unconnected.
Maybe Bridgen is aiming for that? Spewing out utter garbage would appear to be extremely lucrative
This is how Sungak answered a question of availability of nhs dentists earlier, his answer bares no ****ing relation to the question, Lindsay Hoyle needs a ****ing slap for letting him get away with such shite
https://twitter.com/thhamilton/status/1613192494665154562?s=61&t=OEu0ugrYy4HOYH9PwD9Dvw
He's going to have to get himself squeezed onto a Dentist's NHS books before next Wednesday, isn't he.
He’s going to have to get himself squeezed onto a Dentist’s NHS books before next Wednesday, isn’t he.
He’s going to get his teeth knocked out next PM’qs?, actually I’d pay to see that.
Maybe I'll get a dentist appointment if I ring up my GP then? Not been able to get an appointment for my dentist since before lockdown, no doubt the same for many people. I've been sent a letter to say no chance of getting one either so look elsewhere. Good old BUPA! I'll likely go private which also includes driving whereas I used to walk to my old dentist.
Its obvious Sunak is even more tin-eared, remote and detached from day-to-day reality than his predecessors.
He's actually managing to make David Cameron look down-to-earth and in touch with the common man
This lot are all the same though. They couldn't give a toss about the education system because all their kids are educated privately and they couldn't give a toss about the NHS because they all have private medical care. Train strike? Private jet. They're insulated from absolutely everything by their wealth and power.
They appear so sanguine and don't appear bothered about anything going on in the country at the moment because they have absolutely no skin in the game. Its like they're playing a video game. They make decisions and stuff happens, but it only happens to some hypothetical people who appear on their TV screens. Its not real because it won't ever have the slightest impact on them personally
TBH he's got an in-family GP 🙂
Its seems a sad hill to die on and the PMQ's sort of indicated that he probably needs to go to specsavers for a hearing test.
Even Marge said she went private.
I think its actually worse than that Binners
Many of them have a vested interest in selling off the NHS and many of them have an ideological hatred of it. Its not indifference. Its actively working to the end of the NHS
Many of them have a vested interest in selling off the NHS and many of them have an ideological hatred of it. Its not indifference. Its actively working to the end of the NHS
And the gullible fools who voted for Brexit or Tory in 2019 have accelerated this.
If you voted for Brexit or Tory in 2019 and have a problem with me calling you a gullible fool, tell me why you're happy for us all to lose access to free-at-source healthcare.
This was the Guardian headline when the UK government fully supported EU membership:
"Britain’s largest union is concerned trade deal would make privatisation of parts of the NHS irreversible"
The smear that anyone opposed to the EU doesn't support free healthcare is particularly offensive.
The NHS was founded many decades before the EU.
@binners I'm sure Redwood's outside interests include an FT investment column in which he famously recommended investing in the EU but outside Britain, which would definitely anger the prominent Brexiter John Redwood
He’s actually managing to make David Cameron look down-to-earth and in touch with the common man
TBH I can't believe we haven't seen pics of Rishi driving around in his Lambo.
This lot are all the same though. They couldn’t give a toss about the education system because all their kids are educated privately and they couldn’t give a toss about the NHS because they all have private medical care. Train strike? Private jet. They’re insulated from absolutely everything by their wealth and power.
This is the biggy.
He went full on covid conspiracy just after he lost a few court cases
I’d lay money on him doing this for cash
Outrageous that he’s not been suspended before now, the very worst type of MP
I'm really fascinated by Brigdens descent down the rabbit hole, his constituency isn't far away so he's on the local news a lot.
Yes, he's always been a hardline Tory, but his descent into full antivax intrigues me. He can't be doing it solely for money, he's had his already poor judgement tipped over an edge
The smear that anyone opposed to the EU doesn’t support free healthcare is particularly offensive.
Who said that? It was the exact opposite back in 2016. Many people voted Leave to save the NHS. They saw the posters, buses, videos... they completely support free healthcare and totally support the NHS. Unlike those who persuaded them to vote that way, who have shown their true colours since. Part of the Brexit bait and switch that got us to where we are now. What people voted for, and what it would enable, haven't proven to be the same thing. That's established now, yes? But it didn't stop after that vote... 40 new hospitals... everyone can vote for that, yes?
Oh... TTIP... if that was to ever to occur, and if it meant the end of free healthcare... the UK government would have to have allowed it. Just as they will if the same now happens in a UK/USA trade deal. Unite are right to watch the USA like a hawk when it comes to the NHS and trade deals. And our government for that matter.
Ah me microwave internet tv just blipped and I just missed that bloke from the inbetweeners saying something about illegal immigrants being the problem.
@somafunk not just mostly answering a different question but also spouting complete b****cks in the small part of the answer that related to the question.......
https://www.bda.org/news-centre/press-releases/Pages/PM-mythmaking-on-crisis-in-dentistry.aspx
Note the line " it would take an extra 1.5 billion / year to get nhs dentistry back to 2010 funding levels ...."
and people wonder why they cant find an nhs dentist......
I have an NHS dentist... but still had to go private to get my mouth sorted... a metal inlay was cutting me to bits... blood everywhere, couldn't eat... no, it couldn't wait a few months... 🙀
As a wee aside I see 42 billion a year in uncollected taxes because inland revenue is understaffed. That money would be very useful in public service.
If you add that to the losses from brexit then we could fund the NHS properly, have a nice payrise for the staff and have loads left over
Oooof! 38 seats! Gone by the summer.
https://twitter.com/LeftieStats/status/1613892506499923970?s=20&t=CzG616AI5EHeByjbNlTe3g
He’ll be gone in May when the Tory party is absolutely decimated at the local elections.
The question is what happens then?
They’re so hard-faced that they’ll just try to do something mental like bring Boris back or make Braverman PM, but at this point we surely to god have to have a general election
388-seat majority
Nonsense bit of election prediction there. 150+ seat majority looking possible though. But I agree, replaced in the summer if May’s results look anything like this. Labour wise to be ready for Johnson to return and run a “Save Brexit and the NHS” nonsensical but emotive campaign within months of returning. Otherwise… who would it be? Hunt? They’d be little point in that for the party…
