[Closed] One for the guys (worried sister content)

I'd rewind a bit first.

Talk to him, yes, suggest a doctor, hmmm not sure, but LISTEN FIRST before you do or say anything.

I accept that I may well have hacked him off by doing this but both his gf and myself feel he needs to see a GP for a medical examination and, possibly, some kind of bereavement counselling.

Speaking from personal experience [rightly or wrongly] I'd go beserk with you if you instigated anything, sorry

Thanks for the replies. The problem is he won't talk to me or his gf and the only thing I have done behind his back is talking to his gf. How does one 'persuade' ?

Edit: my brother can be stubborn and dig his heels in. He would have to instigate any appointment.

jota+1. He'll stop trusting you.
It may just take him a while, men are (normally) very close to their dads. Just try get him to talk to you but don't try to force it.

Oh and when my dad died it took at least 18 months before I felt 'normal'. Some blokes heal differently, who's to say what's right.

With respect, is your relationship with your mother clouding your judgement at all? That sounds dreadful, it's not meant to be insulting sorry, it's just when a parent dies it can, from experience, throw your remaining relationship into stark relief.

People change whern somebody dies, try and talk to him, or talk to him with a mate of his, preferably not his G/f or he will think youre ganging up on him.

Bereavments take time, some longer than others, be suportive, or try cruise, the bereavemnet councellors..

Big bottle of MTFU in the Buy 1 Get 1 Half Price thingy in Holland & Barrett's?

What Jota said.
Be more subtle, maybe something like 'I need to talk about such and such' or 'I think I need to see a bereavement councilor, would you come with me please?'

go for a long walk with him somewhere and see if he opens up

It changed my life forever when my mum died - not just the usual things

I now have a totally different outlook and personality

e.g. I don't think I ever cried between the age of 12 and 45, now it doesn't take much TBH 😳

Just one example but there's loads more

Death of a very close loved one may leave you permanently affected. Not everyoen can just go back to the way it was.

What jools said.

Is there any way you can get your mother to leave him alone? From what you've said, I wonder if she's as much the cause of the problem as the fact he's lost his father.

Based on the men in my life, suggesting a talking therapy will probably not go down well... Does he have any hobbies that would give him an excuse to go away for a week or two, maybe with friends rather than family?

Other than what's all ready been said there's nothing you can do. You've already said he'll have to instigate anything.
Wait for him to want to talk, if he doesn't expect to find him in a crumpled heap gibbering, then he'll know it's time for counselling.
(Speaking from my experience)

I agree with Stealthcat. Maybe the best thing would be to do something exciting to break away from routine. Joining a sports club or doing some sort of project outside of work that he would enjoy would bring back his spark. e.g. build a new bike 😛

i made the appointment to see the doc about a spell of depression, but it was my then girlfriend and sister who suggested i did so.

i didn't go beserk.

Death of a very close loved one may leave you permanently affected. Not everyoen can just go back to the way it was.

I don't think it is possible to go back to exactly how you were before the death of a loved one. Grief is a very strange and quite powerful set of emotions and feelings to have to deal with. Its been just over a year since the death of my mum and I'm still coming to terms with the grief and had a hard time with depression for about six months after her death.

From your description of your brother he sounds like he is depressed, not helped by the demands of your mother. Best thing to do is to get his girlfriend to suggest a holiday or even just a long weekend away. Break him away from the new and rather grim reality he feels he is facing and take him away from the stress.

Your mother is also probably struggling with the grief and whether through anxiety or fear for the future is placing a lot of stuff on your brothers shoulders to try and cope. Maybe you should speak to her first, she may be suffering as much as your brother.

From experience:

I would suggest going out with him (and maybe his GF too, if you all get along). Just do informal dinner or a drink somewhere, talk about fun/nice things, and try to make it something relatively regular. If this is not practical, then start off with one fun evening and follow it up with relatively regular phone calls that just consist of chit-chat.

At first, he will be suspicious, but after awhile, he will realise that you are not trying to 'work on him'. Once this is established in his mind, he will begin to just enjoy the 'dates', and start seeing them as a new family 'tradition'. It will never replace dad, but it will mean that he can start seeing the other members of his family in a more expansive, positive way.

Does that make sense?

He won't answer the phone, just leaves the answerphone switched on permanently. Won't answer mobile either.

Our mother acts as though our father never existed and, tbh, her behaviour has been pretty shabby for a few years now. I recently caught her out lying - she claimed my bro had said something about me (out of character imo) and when I spoke with him about it, he denied it and I believe him.

Perhaps he does need to distance himself a bit.

Interesting comments/perceptions, thank you.

I didn't go to see the Doctor until I was ready. Be warned it may get worse before he makes the decision. It will take a while and all you can do is be supportive.
Keep talking to him and don't hide anything, my sister hid her marriage break up during my bout of depression. I was more upset about the omission than the split, I had nothing to spare for her problems mind.
All the best to you and your family.
Mike

does he have a girlfriend? if no and you do have some fit single mates sort him out a quick jump.

if yes well buy him something recreational £50 worth should do it.

I don't think I would mind if My bro was so concerned about me that he felt he needed to speak to my better half to see if she thought there was anything wrong... not all blokes are wired the same. or all people for that matter... Just felt that this was the only point that hasn't been addressed. Start by talking to him. Hope it gets resolved, I have had several very close people die in that last few years its not nice at all, I'm extremely cloe to my Dad, his death would crush me. Hope you manage to get him to sort himself out, it's horrid watching people you love destroy themselves.

Andy x

Playing internet psychologist, is there a component of your relationship with both brother and mum in this?

Took my brother about 8 years to get over our Dad dying. He vanished for the best part of three years. The best support for him was for us to be there so when he reached out we were there and were non-judgemental.

The ideas about trying to break the cycle that he has got into sound like a good approach to me (I am NOT a medical person). He needs to have some new happy experiences. I suspect that you will also need to deal with your mum as well, she has drop her demands of him - she needs to let him go.

Buy him a mountain bike.

I appreciate reading your different perspectives as it just goes to reinforce that death affects everybody in such a unique way.

@ crikey - ah, well his gf felt that our mother was almost expecting him to 'replace' our father in the sense that he should drive her to any family get-togethers. Our mother does not leave the house - she is totally dependant on us, even though she is capable.

Unfortunately the older generation have tended to suppress their feelings so thank goodness us 'youngsters' are more enlightened!

when my dad died it took at least 18 months before I felt 'normal'.

This^

Took me a long time to come to terms with the old man not being around anymore. He died 9 years ago and I still miss him.

Sorry to hear of your troubles...
I would say that forcing (you know what I mean) him to seek medical help won't work, as he is unlikely to engage or accept any help offered. I'd he can be convinced and agrees to go, then he may benefit...

DrP

Just wondering whether GP surgeries still run the 'Well Man', or whatever they're called nowadays, clinics? You know, checks made on blood pressure, cholestorol etc.

Just wondering whether GP surgeries still run the 'Well Man', or whatever they're called nowadays, clinics? You know, checks made on blood pressure, cholestorol etc.

I just get called in, I think most of them do it for over 50s

usual things as you said + 😯

Take him for a beer, after a couple tell him your concerned.

Hi CG You OK ? Long time no see , ride soon ??

Now then about bro ...
Was he very close to Dad , and destroyed when he died ? Then will need alot of time to overcome the loss .
Death is a life reality check. It reminds us we are only mortal , and will also die at some point .
There might be underlying issues of things to do / regrets / if onlys, that Dads departure have brought to the surface .
He might be evaluating life and relationships combined with work and is stuck in a rut without an illuminated exit sign .
I dont think he will talk to you about it ..sorry
A stranger or g/f is more likely . He might be OK without seeing a specialist , over time .
Best course of action might be a long holiday , hiding from things by burying yourself in work is not the way forward .
HTH
Insert "std stw discalaimer here "

Hi Babe!

I've not been through all of the responses but I recognise some of what you are saying. When my Father died, I mostly just got on with things. My Mum still needed lots of help as her health was failing too and I ended up doing lots of looking after her. I was lucky that Mrs Druidh was very active in helping me too. Brother in Shetland meant I couldn't really expect him to help out much. When Mum passed on less than a year later, that hit me pretty hard. Someone up there ^ mentioned the crying thing and that sounds so familiar. It still doesn't take much and that's 15 months later.

I considered bereavement counselling but, typical man, never got around to it. I certainly wouldn't have thanked anyone for lining it up for me. My only advice for you at the moment would be to talk to (a) your Brother - just give him the chance to open up if he wants to, nothing wrong with showing a bit of concern (b) your Mother - regardless of what she's like, she is also going through a grieving process. Is there any way you can do some of your Mothers "errands" to give your Brother a break? Maybe if you let it know you're available she'll spread it around a bit?

As always, happy to chat off-forum if there's anything I can help with or give a perspective on.

Bereavement counselling - good- for people who want it and accept it. Otherwise pointless.

Well-man clinic - pointless - based in a very physical model, and little of that is evidence based or useful. I think you have your own health issues, but doesn't mean a physical model is appropriate here, and any GP worth their salt will consider doing some blood tests when investigating fatigue.

Better approach - possibly - get to see him or turn up (with GFs cooperation) and tell him how your dads death makes [i]you[/i] feel and be honest about how you feel about your mum. By seeming to be human and fallible and exposing your weakness, you might draw him out and get him to share... possibly...

Hi CG, I hope you don't take this the wrong way, but maybe you should also look at your own feelings following your fathers death, and how that now affects your relationship with your mother and brother.

My dad was killed a long time ago. Still not "over it" but by this point I hope I never will be because that means some thing in me has also died. These days its having my own kids and wondering what sort of Grandad he would have been.

He's lost his spark, is always tired, hates his job, doesn't want to communicate

Normal male behaviour when dealing with an internal crisis.

Depending on what sort of bloke he is he might never talk openly about how he is feeling right now. He may well deal with it and move on, so to speak.

+1 to try a work around. Either you or his girlfriend or a trusted mate ask him how he thinks your mum is coping, how he thinks you are coping... how he thinks the dog is coping. Anything but HIS feelings, that might be a work around to him talking in the end IF he wants to. Alcohol can help this process.

The first and only time I ever talked openly was when a mates dad died many years later. We mostly talked about the unwanted "promotion to man of the house". Which was the hardest part.

My glib answer is talk to his best mate and tell him to take him out on thei piss . A close male friend can be totally blunt and insensitive and get away with it drawing your brother out of himself .

My less glib response is just to keep trying messages on the answer phone notes etc it does not matter if he does not respond just knowing you are there will help him .

It is trite but true to say time is a great healer it's over 15 years since my dad died. Certain things still totally catch me out but he is now a fond memory rather than a constant loss .

You know your brother and your relationship with him so you can judge best whether to approach him or not.

Personally I'd never discuss anything like this with my sister. Sounds like it's going to be something he'll talk about if he wants to. More than likely it'll be with mates when p!ssed if anything like me!

As long as he's not in any real trouble with it, I'd make the offer that he can talk to you if he wants any time and leave it at that if I was you. Don't push it or force him to do something he's not ready to do.

My boss pretty much packed me off to the doctor instead of firing me when I was depressed. I was very grateful indeed and the relief of having someone notice that I was in trouble and make me do something about it was enormous.

From the way you describe him, what you have already done is the worst thing you could do so don't make it worse by telling him.

Lost mum and dad here and my younger brother sounds very like yours. I just leave him to himself and occasionally he opens up a bit.

Hello singletrackmind. 🙂 Definitely long time no see but still hoping to hold a belated house-warming/bike ride weekend here!

I've always felt that men struggle to open up and it's possible that he doesn't want to offload on me. Only see him occasionally and have confessed to having bad days, really as a way of coaxing him to talk.

I'm the bad girl even though I visit every 10 days, it's now a 3 hour round trip for me. But when you have someone who's lonely and bored in their own little world, the days are bound to drag so we have to tolerate the 'playing up' behaviour.

Thank you druidh for your kind offer. Don't really know how you coped with losing two parents in such a short time, that just seemed so cruel.

mastiles - I honestly don't consider it the worst thing which, to my mind, would be ignoring it and hoping it went away.

Again, thanks for the replies from a bloke's perspective.

I was in a simular boat three years ago I ended up having counselling 7 months off work and a course of happy pills. After I realised I had a problem I went to the doc and the ball started rolling. Sorry but he has to make the first move himself - he needs to recognise that he has a problem. I'm mostly good now, I know my triggers - still have low days even though I'm taking the pills, but doesn't everybody.

Good luck, I feel it's a matter being there to pick up the pieces when he realises that he has issues.

Ash

C_G, I don't think you've done anything wrong IMO. I certainly wouldn't have been bothered and I'm not the talk-it-out type.

However, what you might have done differently is ask him first - the direct approach might work best (again, personal view). 'Bro, you don't seem yourself, are you OK?' 'Yes, of course, er, no not really.' Timing is everything. Your mum might be putting her emotional needs above his and yours by demanding so much of him. Must be as hard for her to be alone. I know that I get sucked into very frequent errand-running simply because I'm around, while my siblings aren't.

Funnily enough, I don't agree with anything suggested above..

I lost my Dad in June 2002 and then my mother 3 months later. My mothers death was entirely expected as she'd had luekemia for the previous 3 yrs however my dad died completely unexpectedly from a stroke with no previous indications of poor health.

I wasn't 'devastated'. Death is something which happens to all of us - maybe I was conditned to expect it because of my mothers ill health. After a brief period of mourning, life carried on as normal. Now maybe Im a heartless bastard, but I never felt the need for grievance counselling and would have been livid if someone had arranged something like this for me...

Point Im making is maybe your bro neither needs or wants help. Having said that, If I was bottling up something like that, I'd be more likely to open up to a close buddy over a few beers than someone within the family...