[Closed] not happy with new car tires??... anything i can do?

What make do Ford recommend / came with the car originally?

i think it was the pirellis!!

There's your answer then. Buy some of those and flog the Yokos. I don't see that you have any recourse to the supplier if they were fitted on your instructions.

"The Yokohama S306 are better than the Pirelli P7000s"

😉

http://www.reviewcentre.com/reviews67033.html

tire?

never used these but yokohamas generally are supposedly grippy but wear fast, aren't they ?

don't suppose your roads have been dry for a while & just recently rained a bit ?

[url= http://www.blackcircles.com/tyres/yokohama/yokohamas306 = http://www.blackcircles.com/tyres/yokohama/yokohamas306 [/url]

Sale of goods act states "fit for purpose" and "as described" Which these appear not to be. The job of a tyre is to provide grip, which these have failed to do. You will struggle to prove it's not your wifes driving (not that I am suggesting she has done anything wrong, but they will)however, they are still obliged to do something. Suggest getting the original spec ones from the same company to show loyalty, then taking up the issue with their head office. They will struggle to answer why you would go to the expence of fitting new tyres so soon after having the Yokos fitted.
Good luck

Take them back and tell them they're no good. Got to be worth a try.

wHY WERE THEY ON OFFER, BECSUE THEY'RE CRAP?

Try altering the tyre pressures, what's right for the originals may not suit the new tyres, it's a funny business. And of course you did set the pressures when the tyres were stone cold etc?

In fact, I'd suggest you contact Yokohama and see what pressures they suggest. If the tyres have soft sidewalls, they may need higher pressure.

fORGOT to say, could the Ford recommended pressures need a degree of 'experimentation' as eery tyre will differ.

It's funny how cars behave with different tyres on. I had a Puma, which came with either Goodyears or Pirellis. The consensus of owners was that they were brilliant with Goodyears on, but very unpredictable with Pirellis. I stuck with Goodyears, and Avons worked well too, but Goodyears really seem to suit Fords, for some reason.

New tyres sometimes have a protective coating on from new so will feel a bit strange when first fitted

I have had it in the past with some new tyres (yoko's and khumos), it could just be that

Andy

Think they just need some miles under them. Put Pirellis on the back of my type R which caused it to oversteer at the first sign of lifting off mid bend no matter how fast. After 1000ish miles they bedded in and became good (but not great ) tyres. Give them time

[i]HIJACK[/i]

radoggair - i have yokohama advan sports on my type r - looking at 4 new ones (225 / 35 / 19)....
any recommendations other than the standard advan sport ?

Sadly I would suggest there is not much you can do...

Try proving the tyre is not fit for purpose! You never will.
The future EU tyre regulations that will rate tyres for grip (braking) & rolling resistance and score them A thru F (like a washing machine) will only generate more of these problems I expect.
Ford's have generally quite excellent handling but the downside of this can be tyre sensitivity.

If they are really very bad get in touch with your dealer. It depends how desperately you want to change them but maybe he'll take them back & credit you something towards another brand.

What size are they by the way? I am guessing the 195/65R15...

(edit: if they are the P7 then I think it should be the 205/55R16)

yep 205/55/16

What Andy said earlier, new tyres often come with the mould release agent still on the surface which makes them rather slippery to start with but which will generally wear off in a few hundred miles. Still no excuse for spinning a car though, that's poor driving.

Anything you can do? Yes - stop driving like a ****ing idiot. Even shit tyres take a lot to get them sliding. The roads aren't the place to dick about.

Sale of goods act states "fit for purpose" and "as described"

Driving - Check

Tyres - Check.

FAIL.

matthewh and goan....

my wife was driving at the time ,15 years with not even the slightest mishap .

my two kids were in the car at the time too.

she pulled onto the island following another car(her father btw) and as she turned to come off the island the car just span !

so you still think she was driving like a "***** idiot" as you so nicely put it???

Yes. Cars dont just spin and accidents dont just happen.

no but tires with very flexy sidewalls make a car oversteer !

ok mate you must be in the know on this sort of thing!!!

i must bow down to your font of all knowledge .

Swap your fronts to the rears..

Only three causes of skidding:

Over-acceleration,
Over-braking,
Over-steering.

The government says I'm an expert in this field, I'm happy with that.

my two kids were in the car at the time too.

She hit the roundabout too fast, mounted the central island, and spun the car with two children in the back ? ! 😯

well done mate im very pleased for you!!

I have to back Goan up on this. New tyres not bedded in = slippery - release agent on them. spinning car - driving too fast for the road and vehicle conditions.

could be oil or diesel on the road? I almost span a car twice on subsequent r'bouts when it was raining & there was crud on the road, luckily i caught it each time.

how long does it take a pair of tires to bed in then bearing in mind ive done 350 m/way miles on them since fitting, probably more!

350 miles should be enough to remove the release agent. Have you checked with the tyre manufacturer what the recommended pressures are? This can vary dramatically from the car manufacturers recommendation for original fitment tyres

I doubt you have any comeback under the sale of goods act as you asked for those tyres unless you can show the tyres to be faulty.

If you really dislike them then your only real option is to accept your mistake and have new tyres fitted.

350 miles should be plenty though depends a bit on what that 350 included..
If you have a dry day go & get them warm on the highway.

btw: softside walls normally reduce oversteer tendency.

I don't wish to be provocative but I have almost never come across tyres that are so fundamentally poor that they cause accidents as described. (there are some shocking ultra low budget tyres out there that mind & Yoko don't fit that description)
I would suggest your wife has has either been unlucky with some road contamination or that the tyres have yet to get bedded-in..

Tyres can be bloody aweful, and if they're a step-change in grip from what you're used to it's perfectly possible to spin the car while driving normally and in a manner that would normally be considered safe and within normal limits, but especially if other conditions occur at the same time (wet/poor surface etc) but it's not really an excuse as such. I have recently replaced a set of "doublestar" cheapo tyres with 5mm of tread that were up front on my car (came with the car). When I first got it I fairly regularly would push the nose of the car straight through roundabouts as it simply wouldn't grip as I expect any normal car to do so. Even driving 'sensibly' and often slower than most of the other traffic in the area it would fire its ABS left right and centre, it'd struggle to deal with even light acceleration in the wet and the front end would step out over the slightest of uneven surfaces, even with new shocks. In the first couple of weeks I even had to dodge into a soft verge as braking from 35 on a wet morning they simply gave no braking despite the ABS attempting to un-lock them, it bearly even steered. They were horrific tyres and I dreaded going out in the car even on a good day and even driving like a granny. I planted a set of Uniroyal RainExperts on it (all round) and it has transformed the car, the difference is night and day. the ABS actually works now because the tyres are gripping and it corners well for a FWD nose heavy diesel estate. But I did research the Uniroyals for about 2 weeks and eventually order them in myself as no tyre places locally would get them.

They were mildly slippery for the first couple of hundred miles but afterwards were fine.

Something a lot of people forget is that brand new tyres, even of the same make, will be less precise and grippy than their old tyres as older tyres have more worn tread blocks, though mostly in a the dry. Tread blocks are normally wider at the base and when they are 8mm tall they flex a lot, this can give a predictable slip near the limits, but when they are worn down they dont flex and grip a little more like a slick.

At the end of the day you've changed the thing that connects you to the road, the first thing I do when I do this is take the car to a known quiet safe location at night (car park) and scoot about a bit to see how it grips in comparison with the old tyres, in a place where no-one is likely to get injured. You'll never get your money back on the tyres because you'd have to prove they were not fit for purpose, which they are - your tyres are gripping and you're not sliding off to oblivion, so its personal interpretation as to how that grip is rated.

The sooner we introduce mandatory retesting every few years the better....

The attitude to road safety that the vast majority on here display is ****ing terrible.

Personally I'd happily take a retest tomorrow, I know I'd pass!

CK - I'll be in Glasgow every day soon. I am happy to assess your driving.

I'm struggling to see how some new tyres could make that much difference to a car. If you are utterly convinced its not due to poor driving or something else wrong with the car, just take the hit and buy some new ones.

I'm struggling to see how some new tyres could make that much difference to a car.

I've no idea what your driving or experience is like and wont make any judgements from it, but having had cars long enough (i.e. each car for several years) to have several sets of tyres on each (of different makes and price ranges), it really doesn't surprise me at all that his new tyres can make night and day differences. I am surprised that yokos are THAT poor though, while each tread pattern and compound (different compounds are used across the world, depends on your source and whether they bought cheap ones from abroad) are different, usually the more well known ones are consistently strong but with some tendencies.

Personally I find Pirellis (primarily the P6000s) to be absolute death traps. And strangely enough they have the nickname "ditch hunters" in the boy racer world.

This is an interesting point though, you see lots of people judging the handling and performance of a car, yet few even know what tyres were on it. My GT4 has different tendencies with different tyres, with the cheaper Federal SS595s it understeers heavily but predictably. With conti sport contacts on it drifted evenly and predictably, and with uniroyals on it tails out, same size tyres, same pressures, same wheels.

I don't really understand this. There are a lot of very cheap tyres about, as in £25 type stuff. You would think they would be crap but plenty people must buy them since they can't afford anything else.

Why then do we not see loads of cars on cheap tyres sliding all over the place?

When you had the tyres fitted did they do anything else to the car - tracking, suspension adjustment, etc?

I've had yokahamas on one car and found them okay but they did seem to 'tramline' - not dangerous but you did have to fight with the steering on occasion. I also had pirelli p-zero on another car and they were okay but wore quickly.

Both cars now have michelin pilot premacy and I'm very happy with them.

I've been driving almost 20 years in lots of cars and lots of tyres (including some very cheap ones) and have managed not to spin a car for at least 10 years by not driving like a **** which is why I suggested he just buy some new ones if he's convinced ****ish driving or car shock problems are not the cause.

You would think they would be crap but plenty people must buy them since they can't afford anything else

Next time you're in a car park have a look about it. Most of the cars have named-brand tyres. Taxis tend to have non-named, presumably to keep costs down. The normal cars that have cheapo tyres are the sheds with 50hp driven by a super-careful mum to the supermarket. Or at least thats my observations.

I've been driving almost 20 years in lots of cars and lots of tyres (including some very cheap ones) and have managed not to spin a car for at least 10 years by not driving like a **** which is why I suggested he just buy some new ones if he's convinced ****ish driving or car shock problems are not the cause.

I'm taking a guess that he can't really afford to buy another £300+ worth of tyres that easily. Plus lose 50 quid in changeover costs unless he can get the same place to sell them again as part-worn. Hence he'll be reluctant.

Just to go slightly off-topic for a second, and to indulge in a minor troll...... I had an ancient Cosworth Scorpio a few years back and spent six happy months driving everywhere sideyways. I perfected my technique in a suitably large and obstacle-free car park in the dead of night, accompanied by a hysterically laughing mate.

Sadly, sold it to a guy who lifted out the engine and crammed it into a Capri, where it resides to this day.

Oh happy times!!

[i]The normal cars that have cheapo tyres are the sheds with 50hp driven by a super-careful mum to the supermarket. Or at least thats my observations. [/i]

Exactly, but you don't see them spinning all over the place at every opportunity.

[i]driven by a super-careful mum[/i]

So you're saying that the op's wife wasn't driving carefully then?

Maybe we just have different opinions on what is ****ish driving or super careful then.

Possibly, but thats entirely understandable if the car previously gripped just fine. "super-carefully" is relative to the vehicle as well as the road and conditions. I'd not "gun it" out of a junction in my estate as it would just sit and spin its wheels causing an obstruction, but I'd happily gun it in my GT4 as it wouldn't spin and would be faster and cleaner out of the junction. Its not as easy as is/isnt driving like a tit. And I'd happily gun it (the gt4) regardless of whether I was in a rush or not, if the road conditions allowed.

I'm taking a guess that he can't really afford to buy another £300+ worth of tyres that easily. Plus lose 50 quid in changeover costs unless he can get the same place to sell them again as part-worn. Hence he'll be reluctant

The price of having wife and kids spinning round a roundabout? My money would be on something else wrong with the car or poor driving.

Again, it's not necessarily poor driving, more lack of awareness of a change in the vehicle. If you put crap tyres on my diesel without telling me (or even if you told me and I assumed they were the same quality) I'd quite probably drive it the same as I do with the good tyres, the good tyres allow me to stop in a sensible distance and so I drive to that distance, but my old cheapo tyres would leave me slamming into the back of the car in front with that distance (it took a stupidly long distance to stop with the cheap tyres).

And I'd happily gun it (the gt4) regardless of whether I was in a rush or not, if the road conditions allowed.

Well I hope you are as good a driver as you dream you are. Roads have all sorts of things on them which are entirely unpredictable, you gun your cock extender as much as you like but one day it will bite you on the ass or more likely someone else.

Well I hope you are as good a driver as you dream you are. Roads have all sorts of things on them which are entirely unpredictable, you gun your cock extender as much as you like but one day it will bite you on the ass or more likely someone else.

"gun it" does not mean "drive dangerously". It simply means to accelerate faster than dawdling out of a junction.

And it's not a cock extender, BTW 😉

Ah so that's why you get pissed off at cyclists in ASL's coffeeking, they prevent you taking off from the lights to try to beat everyone else.

Ah so that's why you get pissed off at cyclists in ASL's coffeeking, they prevent you taking off from the lights to try to beat everyone else.

Yup, thats right 😉

But in actual fact my comment, as I stressed on that thread but it seemed to get ignored, was that I did not put anything like the level of stress into the situation as you seem to.

And it's not a cock extender, BTW

Thats not what your wife said 😉

I'm sure you do drive safely but many people dont and many men think they drive fast but safely when in actual fact they've just been lucky. I got through a miss spent youth without hurting anyone but I did learn about sliding cars and spinning cars and how slow they are to stop in the wet. The way I see some people drive (especially on motorways) leads me to believe they have never tried to stop a car quickly in the wet, or they have had their fear glands removed.

[i]But in actual fact my comment, as I stressed on that thread but it seemed to get ignored, was that I did not put anything like the level of stress into the situation as you seem to[/i]

mmm but I think you'll find I didn't get pissed off at all by asl use or not whilst you do. Rubbish comeback, must try harder coffeeking.

Thats not what your wife said

Must admit I've never compared the length of mine to anyone elses so it's hard for me to judge! I just enjoy using it (and the car!) and dont worry what anyone else thinks of it (and the car!).

I drive quickly where space, conditions and traffic allow. I.e. rarely, but empty country roads with good visibility and no passengers or nearby likelyhood of pedestrians. I don't like speed, I like acceleration, cornering and stopping ability. My car is set up for control (heavily modified brakes and suspension), not speed. I'm currently considering a gearbox replacement which would give me a redline of 110mph over the 160 it's currently limited to because I never get into 3 figures - not the acts of someone who likes speeding on motorways I'm sure you'd agree. I've done the driving too fast to stop in the wet (first year of driving I slid 6 car lengths up between stationary traffic and oncoming traffic on a single-carriageway road, missed them all with some careful guidance!), I've ended up in a field quite a few feet below the road due to missing a sign in the fog, i've head-on'd a RLJer because I wasn't aware people could be that stupid and had no-where to escape to (many lamp columns on both sides). I've learned from those mistakes and observations. It doesn't mean you have to drive everywhere like an 80 year old with poor sight.

mmm but I think you'll find I didn't get pissed off at all by asl use or not whilst you do. Rubbish comeback, must try harder coffeeking.

Miss-understanding of my comment there I think you'll find, what I meant was I dont get "pissed off" by them, I get mildly put out by their use, whereas you seem to get very worked up by my comments about it, so much so that while I'd forgotten that post even existed, you remembered and brought it into another post 😀

Have you had the car checked for any other problems - did the garage alter the tracking possibly? I'd take it back and ask them to take a look.

it's a false economy, quality rubber is what connects you to the road !!!
would happily spend £304 on 4 x 205/55/R16 91V Bridgestone Turanzas again

most of us wouldn't think twice about spending £100's on bike bits but balk at the cost of everyday items like branded tyres for a car that our kids / wife's / partners drive about in

there's a reason quality tyres cost a few quid more
next time you have to do an emergency stop in the wet or get caught out on greasy road in winter you'll be glad you paid just a little extra

and yes it WILL HAPPEN at some point no matter how great a driver we " think " we are ...... even the pro's get caught with their pants down

Only three causes of skidding:

Over-acceleration,
Over-braking,
Over-steering.

and a skid-pan.

Back to main topic, keep us updated on how things go in next few weeks with the tyres. It could be something simple like oil on the road which regardless of how you drive you will spin, especially if you have never felt a car lose traction before. Did your wife back off suddenly, hit the brake, something to shift the weight of the car forward?

Wholeheartedly agree with you dab.

I drive quickly where space, conditions and traffic allow. I.e. rarely, but empty country roads with good visibility and no passengers or nearby likelyhood of pedestrians.

likely is the keyword there isnt it. Your gambling. Its not the purpose of this thread though so I'll leave it.

the_lecht_rocks - Member
HIJACK

radoggair - i have yokohama advan sports on my type r - looking at 4 new ones (225 / 35 / 19)....
any recommendations other than the standard advan sport ?

I'm guessing this is the new type r. My original post was for the last type r, mpv style. I have the newer version just now. opted out of the 19's because A/ ride is harsh enough, B/ the service guys have told me that some have popped off their rims hitting some pot holes etc, C/ the chances of surviving a year with untouched alloys is practically zero ( if driven like it should be) and D/ have you seen how much tyres are??. the do look nice though, that was my only plus point. Tyre wise, i've always found my hot hatches have ran well on Goodyear F1's. The new versions for 08/09 are a bit better as well. When it comes to tyre replacing thats what i'll look at anyway

likely is the keyword there isnt it. Your gambling. Its not the purpose of this thread though so I'll leave it.

You're gambling with your and others lives every time you take the car out. Every time you ride your bike. The risks are unquantifiable and vary continuously in space and time, who can say what the acceptable limit is? I know of a few people who'd say any motorised transport was too much of a risk and we should ban cars. I suspect you think that's ridiculous just as much as I do. To take it to a similar stupid extreme, if I don't get to "play" in my car or on my bike occasionally I become seriously depressed, theres a small risk I'd become suicidal... Feel free to email me if you want to carry on the discussion!

radoggair - you ever seen a good driver o a skid pan? they can drive at a fair pace without losing traction.

hello there,

just a bit of an update really.

it was the first time since the new tires were fitted that my wife drove the car and she said it felt funny on that island!!

i ask her to show me the island in question on the way back from shopping earlier and low and behold there is a car facing backwards in the bushes on the side of the roundabout!!!

looking at the island there is alot of sandy stuff covering the surface about 2/3 of the way around it.

so its obviously something has spilt on the road surface which is why it happened.

so thanks for the remarks about my wife driving like a ***** .

you know who you are.

cheers

steve

While I've attempted to point out it it might not be her fault all along, you've certainly not helped yourself by not thoroughly ruling out the road conditions yourself before posting. You should know by now that STW requires all facts to be stated in the first post or at least clarified by the end of the first page.

everyone knows women can't drive...

[img] [/img]

🙄

renton - so someone else had been driving like a ****ing idiot... Spills are pretty damn easy to see.

I totally disagree Groan, spills aren't THAT easy to see, especially on a roundabout!! Depends on road surface,weather (wet,dry etc),lighting conditions.

"Goan - Member
Only three causes of skidding:

Over-acceleration,
Over-braking,
Over-steering.

The government says I'm an expert in this field, I'm happy with that."

Cock?

I'd get the front and rears swopped round, the fronts should be scrubbed in by now. That will make the rear feel a little more stable.
In the hand book ford will give you min and max pressures depending on load set them at the mid point for a week and see how it feels. Then 1/2 that down wards to the little load setting.
That should give you an idea.

yep it was dusk time and not that east to see due to the camber of said roundabout.

goan give it a rest slating my wife mate , ive got bad toothache and not in the mood to have someone saying my wife is a shite driver especially as you have never met her.

thanks speshpaul .... you took the word right out of my mouth

Anyone that spins a car on a public road is a shite driver. End of - it is not open to debate.

oh dear

can i just ask how long you have been driving goan

17 years. Done around 1 million miles and have never even came close to spinning a car.

Are you a Taxi Driver or a sales rep?

well done im very pleased for you ........

i take it your a driving instructor then ??

Driving instructor trainer.

Goan - 99% of the time you are right about that. Just occasionally it is almost impossible to avoid - and diesel spills are not always easy to see.

Remember you are the trolling zoofighter and a raving maniac behind the wheel of a car because a bike wouldn't get off the road to let you past.

Diesel on the road can be very bad news and I could imagine having a good slide on some under normal driving, spinning right round on some on a roundabout with what I call normal driving would however be unlikely.

so thanks for the remarks about my wife driving like a *****

I'm not sure anyone said that, I said if your sure driving like a **** wasnt the reason then something must be wrong with your car. If you are offended by that I'm sorry.