...is disappoint.
Appropriate U turn and a listening peoples chancellor, or are we doomed to be Owned by China...?
Only a partial U-turn:
Not all of the tax credit cuts announced in the summer are being abandoned. The Treasury is still going ahead with a cut to the “income rise disregard” – the amount of extra money a tax credit claimant can earn before losing benefits. In July George Osborne announced that this was being cut from £5,000 to £2,500. That cut still applies, and it raises £170m.
Not that I'm complaining, his U-turn is welcome, but he can't expect a pat on the back for not screwing over the most vulnerable in society just to save money to pay for the next banking crash....
There was so much spin in his statement, that it became a blur.
Why the future paycut for nurses entering training?
Why the future paycut for nurses entering training?
Because the Tories hate anyone who works for the welfare state.
Deciding to not do something nasty does not make you a good person.
http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/tax-credits-debatevote-in-the-lords/page/2
the early version!
Not that controversial in the end.
Swings and roundabouts - so replace the tax credit cuts with payroll taxes instead - impact similar, bad for wage growth for earners. Chancellors have lots of tricks up their sleeve. As an employers, I am not a fan of payroll taxes!
In the end, Austerity George is pragmatic not a idealist - he bottled it on tax credits and succumbed to pressure on other cuts. So winners and losers are slightly different. But in the end, not that much is different...
ok, slight edit: the role of the state might still be a flag up the mast but only a return to previous levels of state involvement not the dramatic changes that many argue
Why the future paycut for nurses entering training?
Maybe because for years(decades?) the nurses have claimed their jobs are degree level, have revised and renamed their courses to have degree titles and claimed equal status with graduates. If that case, why should their training be paid for upfront, when a doctor, teacher or anyone else goes through the student loan system?
I've not heard anything other than the headlines, but have just got an email saying 'Umbrella' Company employees will be losing a lot of their tax allowances.
That'll hit me, but kick me up the behind to use my own Company for Agency work.
Seems reasonable, he found he had some extra cash and he spent it on this.
Tax Credits will ultimately end, personally I think that's a good thing, subsidising jobs at the same time as importing a workforce seems mental and has to stop (IMHO).
I understand other people feel otherwise.
Also binned their Carbon Capture Project (a manifesto commitment)..
The government informed the London Stock Exchange at 3pm, stating: “Following the chancellor’s autumn statement, HM government confirms that the £1bn ring-fenced capital budget for the CCS competition is no longer available. We will engage closely with the bidders on the implications of this decision for them.” The decision was not mentioned in Treasury documents.
alanl - MemberI've not heard anything other than the headlines, but have just got an email saying 'Umbrella' Company employees will be losing a lot of their tax allowances.
Serves them right for all those zombies.
midlifecrashes - MemberIf that case, why should their training be paid for upfront
Because of a chronic and ongoing shortage of nurses, an ageing workforce and an increasing reliance on agency staff and foreign nurses?
seadog101 - MemberBeing forced not to do [s]Deciding to not do [/s]something nasty does not make you a good person.
Apprentice levy of .5% on (large) company payrolls. Expected to raise £3bn. Really biting the hand that feeds. Though it's a year and a half away, so plenty of time to bin it.
I've not heard anything other than the headlines, but have just got an email saying 'Umbrella' Company employees will be losing a lot of their tax allowances.
That'll hit me, but kick me up the behind to use my own Company for Agency work.
Moving to a Ltd won't do you much good for long..
Because of a chronic and ongoing shortage of nurses, an ageing workforce and an increasing reliance on agency staff and foreign nurses?
Different issue, and hardly anything to do with the output per year of the nursing colleges, much more to do with retention, staff and contracts management. As for the shortage of nurses, there are 670,000 (inc midwives) with active registrations, but only 372,000 currently working for the NHS, so not quite a shortage.
Why pay for nurses training upfront when some opt to leave and work abroad
I too think Osbourne bottled it as tax credits are out of control. That being said he had the flexibility to dodge that political landmine and hes too shrewd to pass up the chance to do some
As for the shortage of nurses, there are 670,000 (inc midwives) with active registrations, but only 372,000 currently working for the NHS, so not quite a shortage.
Define shortage. There may well be 670,000 registered nurses, but in 300,000 of them want nowt to do with the NHS then there's a definite need for more nurses - or measures to change the minds of those that want nothing to do with the NHS.
Not sure it's as much of a u turn as it seems at first glance. How much income will vulnerable people lose when they're transferred over to Universal Credit?
Osborne still expects to cut 12billion from the welfare budget [url= http://uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/idUKKBN0TE00Z20151125?irpc=932 ]reuters [/url]
The 'nurses in nhs vs total on the rigister' figure is completely meaningless. nurses work in lots of places besides nhs acute hospitals and trusts. Our model of moving people out of acute hospitals into care homes or with specialist home nursing input supports this, and supports the moving of thise contracts of employment out of nhs trusts. This doesn't mean we don't need them, they are just being paid by a different organisation. Our local primary care trust is now a social enterprise with nhs logos at the top of its letters but none of the nurses there are now in your figures. Same goes for the whole of childrens services in devon (virgin). You doubtless have a large group of nurses close to you, dear stw reader who have recently been tuped out of the nhs, contributing to this meaningless number and also the wealth of private sector jobs 'created' in 2010-15.
Its great nursing is a degree subject nowadays. Workload for students of any health and social care profession undergrad course is vastly different compared to any other undergrad course. Of course its possible to do part time work on top of this but i found this much easier on my BA where i had 2/5 as much teaching time, similar workload for coursework, twelve weeks off just for summer (as opposed to eight weeks off whole year) and all without between six and nine months of full time unpaid [s]work[/s] placement. They simply do not compare! I believe the same is true for most other AHP training now and also social work. If its a race to the bottom, lets make all undergrad courses regardless of subject have this workload and lifestyle! If its not, perhaps we should consider funding for all training for courses for specific professions.
It is foolish when the chancellor complains about how much nhs trusts are spending on agency fees, to introduce something that will so obviously have an impact on numbers entering training in 2017/18 and impact on where they want to work at the end of it with student loans to start paying off. Anynone would think he is not thinking about the recruitment in the nhs in 2020/21, as if it will be someone else's problem;)
Also you forget the positive impact nurse training has had on social mobility. I realise that is a dirty word on this forum but the numbers of graduates in general from poor backgrounds or who are not fresh out of school and have children is made up of a disproprtionatly high number of nurses. ...and they often make far better newly qualified nurses than people who have come into it straight from school. Loans not bursaries will impact on this too.
Dunno about his ideals TBH.
But then I don't receive it because I've got no kids and I earn more than the threshold, so I guess you're only going to comment if you are not in the same position as I am.
, so I guess you're only going to comment if you are not in the same position as I am.
Not at all, it is a sign of a good civic society that those who are doing OK care about (and champion) those who are not.
midlifecrashes - MemberWhy the future paycut for nurses entering training?
Maybe because for years(decades?) the nurses have claimed their jobs are degree level, have revised and renamed their courses to have degree titles and claimed equal status with graduates. If that case, why should their training be paid for upfront, when a doctor, teacher or anyone else goes through the student loan system?
Modern Nursing easily qualifies as "degree level".
The bursaries were put in place to encourage people to become Nurses, because we have a shortage, take whatever moral stance you like, but removing them will mean less people will apply to the courses.
Why should their training be paid for? Why would anyone want to do it? 3 years in Uni, split with doing 12.5 hour shifts doing real nursing work in hospitals (under some supervision) all to qualify to do a incredibly tough job for a massive £22k a year - add a big pile of debt into the mix and you'd be even madder than you'd need to be now to do it.
There's already a supply and demand problem with Nurses, it's hard to fill posts, and when they can't fill them they have to sub the work out to agencies - who are already making £5m+ a year from the NHS.
Why pay for nurses training upfront when some opt to leave and work abroad
Good job all the nurses presently working in the NHS were trained in the UK, paid for by the UK taxpayer. Otherwise, if we imported them, once they'd done their training in another country, then that statement could be deemed as rank hypocrisy
Fortunately thats not the case
Oh.... wait.... hang on a minute.....
Bloody foreigners, coming over here and saving our lives in our hospitals!
I think it's very kind of the South African, Portuguese and Pinoy peoples to pay for the education of many of our nurses. I think we ought to send them a Christmas card or something.
[url= http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/autumn-statement/12019911/Taxes-may-have-to-rise-to-get-the-economy-in-surplus-by-2020-IFS-says.html ]Taxes may have to rise to get the economy in surplus by 2020, IFS says[/url]
Isn't that a rather old Labour solution ?
Or at least what the Tories claim is a Labour solution.
Why pay for nurses training upfront when some opt to leave and work abroad
For the same reasonvwe pay teachers to train I suppose.
Taxes may have to rise to get the economy in surplus by 2020, IFS saysIsn't that a rather old Labour solution ?
Or at least what the Tories claim is a Labour solution.
Don't worry, they'll still blame Labour for it....
[quote=footflaps spake unto the masses, saying]Taxes may have to rise to get the economy in surplus by 2020, IFS says
Isn't that a rather old Labour solution ?
Or at least what the Tories claim is a Labour solution.
Don't worry, they'll still blame Labour for it....
The sad thing is that the electorate will believe them.
Isn't that a rather old Labour solution ?Or at least what the Tories claim is a Labour solution.
There was a bit on the FT website about this statement being very close to the Ed Balls solution...
[quote=jimdubleyou spake unto the masses, saying]Isn't that a rather old Labour solution ?
Or at least what the Tories claim is a Labour solution.
There was a bit on the FT website about this statement being very close to the Ed Balls solution...
However hard you try to parody the Tories, the reality is always more absurd.
The sad thing is that the electorate will believe them.
Well an important minority of the electorate will believe them. A lot of people like the Murdoch press to do their thinking for them - it requires less effort than thinking for yourself.
Same old, same old. Let's blame that nasty Tory press eh ?
Not all nurses are earning £22k are they, my friends partner has just completed her PhD 3yrs study / research full time at full pay and another year working and studying mixed 50/50.
As an aside @aa I think Teachers should be asked to pay something towards their training too.
Having Labour and Tory policies be close or even identical should be seen as a victory, sensible behaviour in the middle ground is what we need more of.
Same old, same old. Let's blame that nasty Tory press eh ?
I'm sorry, are you suggesting that the Tory press reports and represents the Labour Party's policies fairly and without any bias in favour of the Tories?
😆
I'm sorry, are you suggesting that the Tory press reports and represents the Labour Party's policies fairly and without any bias in favour of the Tories?
Do the labour party have any policies? I'd like to see a list. As far as I can tell they're desperately avoiding announcing any policy of any kind.
Is that why the Tory press doesn't show any hostility towards the Labour Party......because "they don't have any policies"?
😆
