Caroline Ansell on R5live there, resigned after voting against the government on this, my god I've never heard such nonsense from an MP. Resigned 'because it's the rules' after voting against the government (what kind of democracy is that?) but wouldn't disagree with said government! how do these people get into these positions? She made Diane Abbot seem like Stephen bloody Hawking.
A few people struggling not to talk about Diane Abbott too. There’s a surprise.
2017 was a high for Labour though.
Err, Labour didn't win the election.
There's no hidden agenda in that post Darcy, DA was the first name that sprung to mind for car crash interviews, if in your eyes that makes me racist, sexist or whatever, batter on.
I have little or no interest in the Labour party either, never mind their internal nonsense, the post was in response to the topic.
Err, Labour didn’t win the election.
Still a high from which Labour had been slipping ever since. This year has seen a return to that previous high (well, nearly).. but yes... if we had an election now, I don't think Labour would win that either. And, as it happens, I still don't think Labour under Starmer can win outright in four years time either. Not sure it could win outright again that soon under any leader, sadly.
Genuine question - Why should schools deliver food outside school hours?
How has it comes to point that an already very overstretched education system is now in charge of feeding children? There are so many systemic failings that has lead to the 7th largest economy in the world letting children go hungry - I wish everyone was taking about these.
Still a high from which Labour had been slipping ever since. This year has seen a return to that previous high (well, nearly).. but yes… if we had an election now, I don’t think Labour would win that either. And, as it happens, I still don’t think Labour under Starmer can win outright in four years time either. Not sure it could win outright again that soon under any leader, sadly.
That's not true: Labour held a polling lead at various points in 2017, 2018 and 2019.
I said "slipping". Both graphs show support for Labour falling almost continually for two solid years.
[ please post sources for graphs ]
Genuine question – Why should schools deliver food outside school hours?
To feed the kids. And it's not the schools... it's us... all of us.
It's a sticking plaster... but one that is needed. I know teachers helping to feed pupils from their own pockets... we should all be helping to feed kids that otherwise would go without, via our government... while also changing things to reduce (ideally to zero) the number of kids in that situation.
It's fair comment that it's not "school meals for children" that are necessarily required, but "meals for children" seem like the kind of basic that a government should be providing where required.
I know what you said. The graph clearly shows Labour with a lead over the tories at various points in 2017, 2018 and 2019. The Tories had a lead over Labour at the 2017 GE, which you described as "a high".
Diane Abbot read history at Cambridge. I've heard her characterised as mentally ill, stupid, and other delights in only the last two days on the supposedly liberal lefty bastion of STW.
At one point she was receiving half of all the abusive tweets directed at MPs. Is she really so terrible that she deserves that?
Genuine question – Why should schools deliver food outside school hours?
Because no one else is doing it well enough and they have the facilities/staff to do it?
The Tories had a lead over Labour at the 2017 GE, which you described as “a high”.
It was a high level in support for Labour. Yes. And their best result in a general election since...
Genuine question – Why should schools deliver food outside school hours?
Because they are best placed to do it. They already have the facilities, the recipes, the staff are trained, they have a database of children and dietary requirements and a position of trust in the community.
Of course, that doesn't mean that a company in charge of pest control wont get a 100million contract to do it in the future though
It was a high level in support for Labour. Yes. And their best result in a general election since…
No it wasn't, as I have clearly demonstrated. And please don't tell me that you're using total vote share as a measure, because you must surely know that it's not an effective measure of electoral success. In 2017, Labour achieved a higher share than Labour (2005) and the Tories (2010, 2015). Perhaps you can spot the problem...
we should all be helping to feed kids that otherwise would go without, via our governmen
Yes of course, this is why we pay taxes. It's a complete failure of government if the solution is for schools to feed children.
Because no one else is doing it well enough and they have the facilities/staff to do it?
But they don't really do it do they? It's a private company.
Diane Abbot read history at Cambridge. I’ve heard her characterised as mentally ill, stupid, and other delights in only the last two days on the supposedly liberal lefty bastion of STW.
Quite. I wonder how many other black, working class women made it to Cambridge in the 1970s?
But they don’t really do it do they? It’s a private company.
Some schools do it in house but lots do use a company. It doesn't really change anything though in terms of them being in a good position to provide the service outside school hours.
In 2017, Labour achieved a higher share than Labour (2005) and the Tories (2010, 2015). Perhaps you can spot the problem…
Still.. when talking about levels of support, I will look at levels of support. I'm fully aware that level of support doesn't map onto number of seats. But the point is... 2017, when Corbyn got me to swap my vote to Labour, was a high point for levels of support for Labour... higher than anyone had managed other than Blair in modern times... but it slowly fell away... never to be achieved again while Corbyn was leader. It was a high point as regards support for Labour in recent years... yet still not good enough to win an election. Support is now nearly back up to those levels... and... yes... that is not enough to win an election. So...
We seem to be back to where we were in 2017 – not the bounce many of us were hoping for.
...getting back to 2017 levels is a weird thing to describe as a negative for the new leader... but, yes... still not nearly good enough if your aim is to get the Tories out.
The absolute ****ing state of the Tories and their leader.
Happy to enoble Marcus Rashford with an MBE for his campaign on school meals and then days later to vote against continuing the scheme he was honoured for.
I mean WTAF
Even Nigel Farage has came out and said it looks mean given the money spent on "Eat out to Help Out"
That's were the Tories are, lower than Nigel Farage
NIGEL
****ING
FARAGE
So yesterday Rayner called a Tory MP scum (apparently) and then they vote against giving kids some food.... On reflection she should have said something worse. If I was Kier my first question next week would be why does the PM hate children so much he thinks they should go without food.
For those that voted for the Tories I would really love to know how you feel about this, are these the policies you believe in, ideals you aspire too and what you want from our country kids going without? And especially those who votes for their Tory MP who voted against feeding kids.
Still.. when talking about levels of support, I will look at levels of support. I’m fully aware that level of support doesn’t map onto number of seats.
So you're defining levels of support by a metric that doesn't equate to electoral success. I'm more interested in winning, but there you go.
…getting back to 2017 levels is a weird thing to describe as a negative for the new leader… but, yes… still not nearly good enough if your aim is to get the Tories out.
Eh? How many pages of comments did we see here, telling us that Corbyn was utterly useless, and Labour would be far better off under new Leadership. Now you're telling us that getting back to a point during his leadership is a sign of success?
Corbyn did well in winning over people in 2017. Starmer is in exactly the same position now. It could go either way in the next few years… steady decline in support, as happened under Corbyn, or perhaps, just perhaps, Labour can build on their current support… it’s a tall order though.
As for measuring support for a party by looking at the proportion of people that say that they’ll vote for that party... well, that’s exactly what I will do when talking about polling data… because that’s what polls do. You’re arguing for the sake of it. I’ve said poll results don’t map onto seats won… but you can’t work out seats likely to be won from polls… a poll of polls is a useful (but flawed) guide for putting the most recent individual poll into context. You were talking about recent poll results, and comparing them to 2017, I’ve just done the same, that is all.
Still banging on about Corbyn on the Marcus Rashford thread. Right.
This graphic is useful in these discussions:
As for measuring support for a party by looking at the proportion of people that say that they’ll vote for that party… well, that’s exactly what I will do when talking about polling data… because that’s what polls do. You’re arguing for the sake of it.
Well no, that's not all polls do. They also tell you how many more people say they'll vote for one party than for another one. Citing a high % share is meaningless without comparing it to what the main opposition is doing, which is how the 2005, 2010 and 2015 elections were all won with a party polling lower than Labour in 2017. It's immensely dispiriting that you seem to be claiming a close second place as an indicator of success. There's only one indicator that really matters.
There’s only one indicator that really matters.
Correct. Children in 21st century UK are going hungry. As a society this is pitiful.
There’s only one indicator that really matters.
You were the one talking about a recent poll of voting intentions, and comparing it to 2017 Ransos. That is the only reason why I talked about comparing recent polls to 2017 polls. I am fully aware that Labour have failed to win a majority of seats, or even the most seats, in a general election since… well, you know, him… but you were talking about a poll. I replied, and I really wish I hadn’t.
Can we get back on Marcus Rashord’s campaign, and all but a handful of Conservative MPs voting against feeding kids over Christmas, in the middle of an pandemic?
There’s only one indicator that really matters.
Have they ever grown a prize-winning marrow?
Quite. I wonder how many other black, working class women made it to Cambridge in the 1970s?
Not many, but I wonder if any of them would make a better job at political interviews.
Doesn't matter what the background, education or race - if somebody is useless at dealing with political questions then maybe don't be in a role when that is an important and VERY visible part of it.
See Marcus Rashford for someone who can handle it more effectively.
More importantly, theres no way Diane Abbott could have finished like that against PSG the other night
You were the one talking about a recent poll of voting intentions, and comparing it to 2017 Ransos. That is the only reason why I talked about comparing recent polls to 2017 polls. I am fully aware that Labour have failed to win a majority of seats, or even the most seats, in a general election since… well, you know, him… but you were talking about a poll. I replied, and I really wish I hadn’t.
Look, it's fine: you want to take being a closer second as evidence of success. We can agree to disagree.
Can we get back on Marcus Rashord’s campaign, and all but a handful of Conservative MPs voting against feeding kids over Christmas, in the middle of an pandemic?
By all means. What would you like to discuss?
Doesn’t matter what the background, education or race – if somebody is useless at dealing with political questions then maybe don’t be in a role when that is an important and VERY visible part of it
It wouldn't appear to be a barrier to being prime minister.
By all means. What would you like to discuss?
Do you think he's best played in the role of a central striker, or as a more traditional number 10 playmaker, with Tony Marshall as a target men? Or do you think it works when they switch roles with Tony out on the left with a license to cut inside or Marcus as a sort of false 9?
Do you think he’s best played in the role of a central striker, or on the wing, as a more traditional number 10 playmaker, with Tony Marshall as a target men?
Unfortunately, Starmer appears to be injured so Rashford will need to lead the line on his own.
More importantly, theres no way Diane Abbott could have finished like that against PSG the other night
I see DA as more of a Roy Keane style midfield enforcer.
kimbers
Full MemberHowever on those numbers Tories would have a slim majority
Eh, I'd like to see your working tbh.
These polls don't give enough information about seats etc to really go for or against that, but 42/36/8 is not much different than he last general election which was 43/32/4. That's a very crude comparison but thanks to FPTP and a century of gerrymandering that poll result could leave us pretty much exactly where we are now, except maybe with a few more lib dems. It's not a significant change and it's worse than the 2017, 2015, and 2010 elections for Labour and barely any better than 2019.
Neither a criticism of starmer or praise for Corbyn, it's jsut that they're both playing the same broken game on the same sloping pitch.
It looks like there are 5 tories who don’t have the morality of a snake
Amazingly they were happy to subsidise the “Eat out to help out” policy but not starving kids., I can’t actually believe I had to borrow something from one of politics repugnant sideshow exhibits but he dropped the mic when he rolled that one out.
Presumably there just aren't enough Tory donors/Brexit cheerleaders involved in the school meals catering trade.
Sometimes there's not even any profit involved at all! Imagine that - waste of time.
I keep thinking I can't get any angrier, then a new day dawns.
[url= https://i.postimg.cc/qNtL832K/121696072-670533683878227-4275823590477652645-n.jp g" target="_blank">https://i.postimg.cc/qNtL832K/121696072-670533683878227-4275823590477652645-n.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
For those interested on how their MP voted.
Thanks for posting the link Kiksy. Rather than argue on STW about the state of politics (not sure who is expecting what to change with that approach) I plan to spend the time to write to my No voting MP asking for an explanation.
Can you please share your letter so that we can copy and paste?
The Star and The Mirror aren't giving up on this story ..yet
