low down on down jackets

I have a down jacket by Jack Wolfskin, and it is excellent. I have never worn it on its own in the rain, as I always put my rain shell over top if there is any risk, but between the two jackets together, winter days are made quite nice indeed.

Otherwise, it is light and cozy, and I can’t understand how I lived without it before!

I bought one of these:
decathlon
...for winter paragliding.
It's very cosy, packs down small, and doesn't weigh much (those last two factors probably less important for your usage). I've started using it a lot for general use (going out for walks locally etc) as I can sling it on top of a t-shirt and it's warm enough on its own down to around freezing without layering up when walking around.

With 2 layers underneath (thermal base layer and a midweight layer) I can do multi-hour flights at around 0°C in comfort (so basically sitting still in a 40 km/h wind). I too have Reynauds - a down jacket won't stop me getting cold hands in these conditions, I use massive electrically-heated gloves when flying if <5°C or so.

EDIT: it's my first down jacket, so can't compare with other brands. Most of my other gear is Rab - I'm sure a Rab one would be better, but as I haven't had a down jacket before I didn't want to commit to Rab prices from the get-go. As above, I wouldn't be without a down jacket now and I wouldn't hesitate to buy another decathlon one.

So any recommendations and real vs synthetic down? Budget £50-100 each but can flex it a bit.

Go synthetic. The main advantage of real down is that it packs really small and is really light, so it's warmer for a given weight/volume than warmer per se. The weight/volume thing is important if you're climbing a mountain but not really when you're walking along with your kids, especially as real down is more expensive for a given 'warmth'.

I'd have a look in the ski section at Decathlon (in fact I was looking there myself at the weekend) or Mountain Warehouse, you're bound to find a warm coat with a reasonable level of waterproofness for that money

For round the house, I'd look at getting a gilet (down or synthetic).

And you could wear the same garment under a waterproof shell jacket for outdoors stuff.

I was all about the fleece, but I'm a convert to the down jacket mainly because they only work zipped up, so when you get on a warm train or in to the car you just pull the zipdown and you don't boil yourself alive like I was with my fleece under a wax.
As I understand it, unless you're going to the arctic all down jackets will work just fine.
I have a napapijri which works great but was a bit pricy. Best time to buy these things is usually spring. I'd be quite happy with a Decathlon or a Regatta if the price was right.

I bought one from primark a couple of year ago for about £8 it’s the warmest lightest jacket I’ve ever had. I wear it under my jacket on my motorbike when it’s stupidly cold and stay super toasty.

It’s got a hood though which is bad because it’s not as comfortable round the neck as a mid layer. Will probably be wearing it at lunchtime today when I go for a walk with the boss

I'd agree re synthetic if it's for general walking around. Down needs more looking after and can't be left wet.

If going for down I'd choose a company that has traceable/higher ethics down also (ME for one, must be others) - a lot of down production is pretty horrific I believe.

https://www.uniqlo.com/uk/en/men/outerwear/down-coats-jackets-vests

But I'd go machine washable synthetic. At the start of first lockdown there were some crazy bargains and I got a new synthetic parka to replace a down. Just as warm, and no worries slinging it in the washer or dryer when the dogs muddy it up.

some good tips to get me started there thanks! Also lots of resonance; I was also all about the fleece, have a nice thick one but can't seem to get another similar.

@kenneththecurtain I also spent some time looking at gloves at the weekend, which heated ones have you tried. Again as with most things I always seem to need two sorts; a more dextrous pair that I can drive in and do other bits but power usage less of an issue and a pair for out and about.

That decathlon jacket was actually the one I was thinking of getting, although perhaps a synthetical alternative may be more versatile.

I got an Alpkit filo yonks ago, cost £90-It's now called the Fantom, and is less down-700 compared to the Fantom at 650 fill and is priced at £199

It only comes out in winter, and is stored unstuffed.

Absolute godsend, in fact I'd be seriously uncomfy not to have it come winter. Mine is XL, but ive got a waterproof pacamac in xxxl i put over the top of it in extreme rainy weather. The huge size allows it to puff naturally so i dont lose the insulation

They do come up on ebay now and again and you can expect to pay about 70 or 80 quid.

I was also all about the fleece, have a nice thick one but can’t seem to get another similar.

If you're talking about as a mid-layer, or as an around-the-house type thing, you cannot beat wool. Thinner than a fleece of the same warmth, and not made from, you know, plastic.

@grum -I agree that is a concern, although I must confess I had no idea until I read the blurb on the decathlon jacket about the sustainable sourcing of the down for their jacket. All others seem silent on the matter.

@kenneththecurtain I also spent some time looking at gloves at the weekend, which heated ones have you tried. Again as with most things I always seem to need two sorts; a more dextrous pair that I can drive in and do other bits but power usage less of an issue and a pair for out and about

I had similar needs, I bought heated liner gloves which come with massive overgloves - so I can remove the overglove when I need dexterity without leaving my hands totally exposed. I can also choose which overgloves to use depending on conditions. I use these ones, others are probably available and again I've no experience of other brands so I can't really say how these compare. They last a good while on lower settings though, and are mega toasty when on the max setting.
gloves

I did have some wool jumpers but they seemed to get eaten pretty quickly! My thin merino base layers seem to have survived for years and years though. Where can you get a decent thick knitted real wool jumper from these days, they seem to be out of favour.

Where can you get a decent thick knitted real wool jumper from these days, they seem to be out of favour.

I got one in NEXT, but that was years ago and its pretty much felt now.I once wore it into the town shopping at an xmas under the down jacket and near passed out from the heat 😆

https://www.woolovers.com/mens

I've felt the cold a lot more since getting Long Covid. Re wool, I have one of these, which I think is a bit of a bargain (picked it up in Ireland tho, don't know what shipping is like these days):

https://arancrafts.com/product/fishermans-rib-crew-neck-sweater-c761/

...and I got one of these for Xmas which I'm wearing now, and it's very very toasty:

https://communityclothing.co.uk/collections/crew-neck-collection/products/roll-neck-jumper-navy?variant=39756194840630

Also, Uniqlo's heattech range isn't bad - I've got a couple of the Ultra Warm 't-shirts' which are more like thin fleece-lined jumpers really. But they're quite slim so sit nicely under another jumper: https://www.uniqlo.com/uk/en/men/innerwear-loungewear/innerwear/heattech-ultra-warm-thermals

Someone mentioned Primark we've also had a number of down jackets from TKMaxx often cheap enough you don't need to worry about oil / mud. Occasionally super light and real down too.

If you’re talking about as a mid-layer, or as an around-the-house type thing, you cannot beat wool.

Agree. I'm currently wearing a lovely merino hoodie and a woolly hat in the home office.

Where can you get a decent thick knitted real wool jumper from these days, they seem to be out of favour

As well as the excellent suggestions above, charity shops are often an excellent source. I'm sitting here in a lovely Ralph Lauren merino number that cost me twelve quid 🙂

Second hand clothing apps like depop and vinted have plenty of wool jumpers too.

My Tk-maxx £40 down jacket seems just as warm as my £170 north face one. Very slightly bulkier though. But a bargain.

But really we should all stop buying that stuff and look for things with responsibly sourced down, which the £40 one probably isn't.

Go synthetic if it's going to get at all wet (or dirty, and need washing every now and then).

For cold hands in the house, the things below are very effective.  Unlike most fingerless mitts, there's no material bunching up between your fingers reducing dexterity or making outer gloves too tight and the long wrist section keeps the blood warm on the way to your fingers.

https://www.outdoorgear.co.uk/Manbi-Micro-fleece-Wrist-Warmers-sku36120101.asp

For cold hands in the house, the things below are very effective. Unlike most fingerless mitts, there’s no material bunching up between your fingers reducing dexterity or making outer gloves too tight and the long wrist section keeps the blood warm on the way to your fingers.

See also the old-school wool equivalent:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/122662640420

I would probably go with a synthetic fill for what you want to use it for. You can get down jackets quite cheap, but I'd prefer too avoid the ethical issues that Grum pointed out, which probably means paying a lot more.

I've got a synthetic jacket from Decathlon which is absolutely brilliant for the money: https://www.decathlon.co.uk/p/men-s-mountain-trekking-padded-jacket-trek-100/_/R-p-176951?mc=8501971&c=BLUE Available with a hood too, but I find it more useful without.

I suffer with Reynaud's too, and have something similar to those things Chaos suggested, and they're really good.

Where can you get a decent thick knitted real wool jumper from these days, they seem to be out of favour.

Alpkit oddly does wool pullovers now. The missus bought one and absolutely loves it. Looks good and is apparently very warm. Not cheap, but decent. Hers is the Rathlin, which I think is the thickest one they sell.

I always find puffer-type jackets feel weird worn indoors, it's a bit like wearing a waterproof shell inside, just feels wrong unless you're stuck in some sub-zero mountain but / bothy.

I have a couple of RAB jackets which I have had for a few years now (buy once etc) and a RAB gillet. All great kit but I went to Glasgow a couple of years ago with my daughter who had a Uni interview and when I got off the train in my Barbour and shirt I was freezing... Real schoolboy error. I bought a cheap gillet from Primark and still have it. Its not as light or warm as the RAB but was perfect for the day and only about a tenner.

I bought one from primark a couple of year ago for about £8

Agree with most of what's been said. I've got a posh down jacket (Arcteryx) and a cheapo one that I use for garage duties/ getting dirty (Decathlon). The Arcteryx one at RRP is almost 10x what I paid for the Decathlon one. Both are warm, the Arcteryx one is a nicer cut, a lot lighter weight and packs much smaller. If you're just using it to walk with kids then either will be fine - and there's definitely not a 10-fold difference in quality.

@grum -I agree that is a concern, although I must confess I had no idea until I read the blurb on the decathlon jacket about the sustainable sourcing of the down for their jacket. All others seem silent on the matter.

Decathlon talk about responsibly-sourced down in terms of animal rights abuses, not necessarily sustainability. I.e. it could presumably be made in high volume factories in Asia and then shipped half way across the world, while still satisfying that standard.

Where can you get a decent thick knitted real wool jumper from these days, they seem to be out of favour

Alpkit have added a few woolen jumpers to their range recently...

https://alpkit.com/collections/mens-midlayers

EDIT: just seen someone else mentioned them above...

For round the house, I’d look at getting a gilet

Agreed. I have a RAB Microlight down gilet and it is fantastic. Fits underneath a coat and the absence of sleeves makes it much more useful. Worth every penny and I would replace mine in a heartbeat when it dies (it's five years old). Packs down vert small into a pocket with zip closure. I also wear fingerless gloves when really cold as I too suffer from poor circulation.

I love my down jackets, but they are only worn when it's bone dry or under a waterproof shell.

For the grand majority of time, I'd say synthetic is much more suitable.

I'd also recommend gilets, much more flexible than a jacket and comfy under/over other layers.

If on a budget, Uniqlo do some good lightweight down.

I’ve got ultralight down jackets from Jottnar, Uniqlo and Decathlon, plus a North Face Nuptse I bought years ago, plus the gilet version, using my share of a lottery win at work. The Decathlon jacket moults tiny bits of down for a pastime, anything worn underneath that’s dark get’s covered in tiny bits of white down, the nylon really does need to be a finer deniers, or else have a coating on the inside.
The Uniqlo jackets, I’ve got both the hoodless jacket and the hooded parka, as well as the gilet, are highly downproof, and very light, but more expensive than the Decathlon, and the Jottnar is the best of the bunch, the down has a water-repellent coating, which I can confirm works very well, after a Sunday afternoon walk in cloudy, cool and windy conditions turned very damp and wet - about the last hour at least was in really pretty wet conditions, but by the time I got back to the car water had only penetrated slightly across a seam over the shoulders. I was very impressed. Mine was an early one, from seven or eight years ago, maybe slightly more, and I got it in an end of season sale; it was about £140. They’re up to Arc’teryx levels now, perhaps slightly cheaper.

Its seldom cold enough for the Nuptse, though.

This is a good read as far as Down ethics and sustainability go.

'The weight/volume thing is important if you’re climbing a mountain but not really when you’re walking along with your kids, especially as real down is more expensive for a given ‘warmth’."

As self-appointed leader of three small people I'd totally disagree with this. With British weather being as random as it is and children so bad at carrying anything, light packable insulation layers are invaluable for a day out with the children. I never had a down jacket before, after seeing how useful my wife's was now I have my own!

One thing that I’ve come to rely on is a dirt-cheap ‘waterproof’ nylon jacket with a hood, a Peter Storm for example. Easy to pack into its bag and shove in a pocket, and waterproof enough to chuck on over a down jacket if it pisses down, thus keeping the down from soaking through. And cheap enough to not worry about wear and tear. Even if water starts to seep through, it doesn’t matter, it’ll just get damp inside, and make the outer surface of the down jacket damp, without compromising in any way the insulation. It’s what I’ve done for several years working outdoors for eleven-twelve hours a day through the winter, wearing a Buffalo Special Six, with a cheap Peter Storm on top - snug and warm, and perfectly dry, just a hint of damp on the outer shell of the Buffalo.