[Closed] Is Scottish cooking really that bad......

How hard can it be to deep fry everything? 😉

I think the deep frying joke is wearing a bit thin now.

Scottish cuisine? offal, tizer and whisky? how could you go wrong? 😆

Yawn. a Michelin starred restaurant across the road from me, 2 more in Edinburgh, 13 total in scotland. More per head of population than any other part of the UK.

Tizer is English - I think you mean IrnBru

How many of them have Scottish chefs?

Hope so. We're on Scottish C2C next month, and everywhere we're stopping boasts great cuisine.

How many 3 star jobbies?

TJ, whats the betting that 90% of the menus are ether French, English, Spanish or Indian?

wild tay salmon - what's the name of that famous english salmon river?
arbroath smokies
aberdeen angus beef
single malt whisky
strawberry cranachan
cullen skink

salt herring and tatties
tatties and salt herring

At the risk of being boring, this is the email I sent the others regarding food:

Evening Meals

Hopefully we’ll be up there in time to eat in the Captains Table Restaurant at The Ship in Stonehaven:

We offer a wide range of freshly cooked dishes using the finest ingredients. Fresh, locally caught fish and seafood are a speciality but we are also pleased to offer fine steaks, chicken dishes, pasta, home-made burgers - something for everybody, in fact!

The Braemar lodge also boasts fine food:

Our award-winning chef takes the best of local produce and prepares it using natural flair and innovation

From the conservatory which extends our dining room, guests can enjoy panoramic views across to Ben Avon whilst enjoying the best of Scottish produce freshly prepared by our excellent chef.

Scotland is famous for its quality produce and we take advantage of the best Aberdeen Angus beef, Scottish fish and game. All the meat we prepare is of Scottish origin and we also offer a vegetarian alternative.

As does the Scot House Hotel, Kingussie:

Dining at the Scot House is a very relaxing, informal experience. Our Dining Room enjoys an excellent reputation with discerning local visitors and residents alike for imaginative, creative cuisine, featuring a fine range of fresh local produce in season, and of vegetarian dishes and healthy food options.

Enjoy excellent, uncomplicated and honest cuisine, where local flavours shine through. Complement your dinner with your favourite wine or a whisky from our carefully chosen stocks.

Personally, I don’t give a shit about the ‘carefully chosen stocks’ bit, you can slaughter the whole herd for me(sorry Jane) 😉

The Lady at the Caledonian has already said she’ll cook for us at £19.50(and that’s a reduced price, because we’re guests). She said it’s all home cooking etc.

In Cannich we’re in the Hostel. I did think we’d have to make our own breakfast, and possibly evening meal. However, the guy from the hostel has recommended The Slaters Arms http://www.glenaffric.info/slaters_arms.html where:

Choose from our extensive a la carte menu which is all fully prepared in our country kitchen. Aberdeen Angus steaks are our speciality!

Steak’s good by me. They also do breakfast, so that could get us out of that too.

Finally, our victory meal, and once again our place of accommodation - The Dornie Hotel - rates itself highly:

The Dornie Hotel's resident Chef takes a particular pride in preparing a wide range of cuisine to suit all tastes, from the comprehensive à la Carte and Table d'Hote menus available in the attractive, non-smoking restaurant to the popular daily menu of Bar Meals.

The North-West of Scotland is famed for its locally caught fish and shellfish, including salmon and trout, prawns and lobster. Supplemented by superb Highland meat and game, including venison and pheasant, Chef makes imaginative use of these fine natural ingredients (subject to seasonal and local availability) to create an exquisite menu to tempt your appetite.

I think a few bottles of Champagne may be in order too!

Lunch

Day one

We can meet up with the support for lunch. I recon we’ll be riding by Aboyne about lunchtime. It’s about 30 miles in, but they’re fairly easy miles, so shouldn’t be a problem getting there for lunch. It’s also half way for day 1.

Day two

We’ll be miles from anywhere for most of the day. When we do get spat out of The Cairngorms though, the first civilisation we hit is at Loch Morlich. This is a mere 25 miles from our start – but I think even if we set off early, we’ll be lucky to get here before 2. That said, if we can wait, there’s a watersports centre http://www.lochmorlich.com/ that has a café, and is a great setting for lunch, where we could again meet our glorious support crew. Support crew may be interesting in hiring out canoes or something there too. I’m happy to string it out for there, but I’m a bit camel like, and can go long periods without sustenance.

Day three

Miles from anywhere all day. No-where to meet, no-where to eat. I think we’ll have to ask the hotel if they could prepare us a simple packed lunch – perhaps local smoked salmon gateau , followed by local high game pie , and Cranachan Scottish desert? Alternatively we could ask for egg & cress sandwiches, and jelly. Let me know which you’d prefere?

Day four

We’re cycling up Loch Ness for 16 miles to Urquhart Castle. A few miles beyond is Drumnadrochit where we could call at the Benleva Hotel, Camra Highland pub of the year 2005 http://www.benleva.co.uk/ .

Day five

Realistically, it’s a packed lunch day. We don’t get near civilisation for about 30 miles, and there’s no roads near us untill then.

So, I propose booking into those places for evening meal, and alerting the appropriate people to our packed lunch requirements, unless anyone has any objection, or better ideas? If I’m booking into those places, I’ll also ask if they would like us to pre-choose off a menu as there’s so many of us – the lady at the Caledonian said it would help. Are there any dietary requirements I should mention?

For those from this island, particularly those slagging off Scottish "cuisine", could you enlighten us about your regional culinary delights - that are FROM THE ISLAND (i.e. UK).

Hmmm.... bara brith.....

Yes, a bit sad but I do miss it here in Eng-er-land.

those who follow flags don't deserve them, we all live (and eat) on the same lump of dirt! 😀

the Ship in Stonehaven does (or did when I stayed up there) an awesome cullen skink, and they used do the strawberry cranachan I mentioned earlier.
There's plenty lobsters in the bay next to Dunnottar Castle, and some of them end up in The Ship.
cracking pint of ale as well.

StevetheBarbarian, as a Stonehaven resident, i'd say avoid The Ship and go to The Marine (only a few doors along). The food is much better! 😉

When are you up these parts?

(sorry for the hijack)

StB - rather than the Loch Morlich water sports centre, you'll get fresh home-made soup and better scran at the FCS visitor centre.

Futureboy77

We're in Stonehaven on the 19/5. I've already booked restaurant there - as that's where we're staying(or 13 are, they're building more rooms now apparantly) - I should have spoken to you sooner.

Druidh

That's out of date. Due to advice not to ride Strath Nethy(yourself I think), we're now bikes on back over Cairn Gorm(I remember the pic of yours up there). They're all gonna hate me, but it'll be worth it, and a bonus is it's gonna make a better day for support, as they can catch the funnicular up the the Ptarimigan restaurant and meet us there.

🙂

futureboy/steve - damn me and my failing memory - the Marine is the place to go, not the Ship. it's the white one.

StB - nice. Make sure your support guys don't look like they're trying to "escape" onto the plateau or they'll be stopped at the bottom. If they have rucksacks and stuff, they might need to explain to the train crew.

That all sounds a bit serious. They'll not be taking rucksacks anyway, but is there somewhere you shouldn't go - and will we be going there? (I know TJ doesn't want us up there at all)

best steak i have ever eaten in my life (and i have eaten a lot) was at the moor of rannock hotel.
and boy i lurve scottish breakfast, the fried variety.

Steve - leaving aside the debate about cycling on the plateau - you are not supposed to get the train up and then leave the restaurant area.

Just stay on the main paths what there is of them. The whole plateau is a very special and delicate area. No one particularly special area

MrNutt - Member

TJ, whats the betting that 90% of the menus are ether French, English, Spanish or Indian?

I'll take you up on that. How much?

Now how do I politely cancel our Ship booking?

They were a bit funny, in their email, they said there's a 10% surcharge for parties over 10?

SteveTheBarbarian - Member

That all sounds a bit serious. They'll not be taking rucksacks anyway, but is there somewhere you shouldn't go - and will we be going there? (I know TJ doesn't want us up there at all)

The idea is that the train won't take up people to walk around on the plateau. You can of course walk, or cycle, up. To get to your support crew, you'll have to sign in at the back door and leave the bikes outside. You're then allowed back out - they aren't.

If this sounds like too much faff, just meet them at the bottom station - by the car park.

OK Jeremy. We're not looking to cause trouble, or be a nuisance. I was going to take an alternate route - for the sake of ourselves, but have been told: 'We'll lose the will to live' if we go that way - so it's back to plan 'A'. We will be respectfull of the area.

Cheers druidh. That wont be a problem - they'll not want to roam, but I will explain.

Steve - interestingly I took a straw poll amongst the folk I know who love the mountains and it came out about even as to whether bikes should go up on the plateau.

The food must be great in Scotland, otherwise it wouldn't have the highest obesity rate in Europe 🙂

Getting back to grub for a moment...

http://theglenkindiearmshotel.com/

Best stovies I've had in years . Couldn't believe they were on the menu when I first went in .

I'll take you up on that. How much?

ok, say your right, I'll give you the privilege to cover the airfare, food bill and accommodation, I'll cover the drinks!

Cheers for that info Jeremy.

[edit] There are other ways round, but having seen pics of Loch Avon, I just need to go there.

according to the international task force on obesity it shows a massive rise in obesity in england,doesn,t mention a problem up north,their data,their words

Its not obesity thats the issue in Scotland - its heart disease.

Like anywhere there is good and bad food. Its certainly loads better than it used to be for sure - and much pride is taken in using local produce. So much so that much of the scottish produced food is exported - especially the seafood - some of the best in the world.

Yeah I read that. You'll be lucky to get a Dublin bay prawn near Dornie, as they're mostly exported to Spain.

Getting back to grub for a moment...

http://theglenkindiearmshotel.com/

This is from their website:

Over 20 Malt whiskies and a comprehensive selectio of soft and non-alcoholic drinks.

This is also the main dining area , but should you so desire somewhere slightly quieter we do have a small separate dining room.

Menu
We offer a selection of homemade soups including Cullen Skink, Scotch Broth, Broccoli and Stilton, Mushroom, Onion, Chicken and Vegetable, Game Broth . (subject to change)

Starters include Prawn cocktail, Garlic mushrooms with garlic mayonnaise ,Venison patties, Crispy potato skins, Japanese prawns with a sweet chilli sauce plus many many more to choose from .

Main courses include Haggis, neeps and tatties , mince and tatties, Steak and ale Pie, mushroom and chicken pie, traditional Scottish steak and whisky and mushroom stroganoff, rib eye and sirloin steaks, again this is just a snippet of the main menu. There are also Fish and vegetarian dishes available in addition to a range of curries and spicy dishes.

Desserts include, Belgian chocolate waffle meltdown, clootie dumpling, mixed berry sponge, spotted dick and sticky toffee pudding."

Originality of dishes and proofreading of menus presumably not included in this exclusive (and oh so typical) Scottish dining "experience"

Steve - if Loch Avon is your target, you could do worse than checking out the Lairig An Laogh, which you can follow to Derry Lodge, then loop back over the Lairig Ghru. the Lairig Ghru would be kind of tricky on bikes, bit it's awesome country.
There is a bothy in Choire Etchacan (Henderson Memorial Hut).
Personally, on bikes, I'd take the lower route rather than dicking about on the plateau

Ah - but then you'd miss this....

[img] [/img]

Cheers for advice, but it's all kinda set. We're booked in at Braemar, and Kingusie, so need to get between. Also, support crew are a consideration, and making it a enjoyable day for them. I am aware that I/we may not be doing the sensible, easy, or even best option - but I do look forward to doing it. We are going over Mount Keen too, so I guess we'll qualify as 'Munro Baggers'?

See, how could I miss that?

That's the pic I remember druidh, awesome!

🙂

the alternative is [img] [/img]

..and
[img] [/img]

.. and no deep fried shit in sight

I think I can see a deep fried pizza about a mile to the left.
Or is it a sheep turd ? pretty much the same tbh 🙂

never tried either - but thanks for the info though

The alternative looks great also -you're making me wish I was there now. The English C2C that I did last year was definitely 4 of the best days of my life. I think the Scottish is going to trump it though.

[i]what's the name of that famous english salmon river?[/i]
Which one? The Eden? The Ribble? The Tweed?

I can see the attraction in the train thing but it does kinda detract from what is otherwise a real wilderness experience 😉

Also, you're really travelling in the wrong direction to get the best out of the Gorms and so the Loch Avon / Coire Raibert ascent is a sh1t load of grief with a bike to descend off what is basically the highest vehicle track in the country. No disrepect Druidh but it's p1sh imo apart from the view. Feshies a good call in that direction but as you've made plans to rendezvous further the East the Lairig an Laoigh offers a much better riding proposition than your intended route - nip up to Loch Avon for a swim then double back? I'd also change the meeting place to Glenmore Lodge which this trail spits you right out at. This is where real mountain men hang out;-) Seriously though it has lots more to interest you / walls lined with climbing memorabilia etc, great food, good beers and stonking views out over the Gorms.

Its 'the Hutchy hut' in Coire Etchachan btw

Oh, and Scotland has fantastic food - dont know why it's even being questioned

Regarding the michelin stars:

72 michelin restaurants in England. Half of these are in Mayfair, most of those are French restaurants. About 1.4 restaurants per million population.

14 Michelin restaurants in Scotland, all spread out over the country, [u]ALL[/u] of these serve SCOTTISH menus. About 2.7 restaurants per million population.

SO, in summary, scotland has more top-class restaurants serving more local food than England. Can we forget this debate, let the English go back to munching their intestine-filled white and black puds and chips and let the scots continue roaming the glens and eating wild lamb and salmon... 😉

Half of these are in Mayfair

You need to get your sock & shoes off & count it again

IMAGE.GUARDIAN.CO.UK "http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-files/Observer/documents/2009/01/17/michelin2009.pdf"

StB - The Braemar Lodge is a good stop for cyclists. We stayed there last year on a "Tours des Cairngorms". The food is good and they have a washing machine and drying room you can use.

You need to get your sock & shoes off & count it again

IMAGE.GUARDIAN.CO.UK "http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-files/Observer/documents/2009/01/17/michelin2009.pdf"

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Here's an idea...you take your sandals and socks off, count it for me, and present the numbers in the same format I did previously. Are the overall proportions going to be very different?

Typical, average, STW pedant!

You know that list is a bit surprising. First off I'm surprised that there aren't any starred restaurants in Glasgow as it's the largest city. The second surprise is that The Three Chimneys isn't on the list.

They don't have a michelin star gonefishin. That's key to the restaurants on the list! 😉 It's a nice place though. I personally don't pay for restaurants of that standard because I don't feel I get value and would sooner spend money on really good ingredients and do it at home. That way you get whatever size of portion you want and it's usually nicer (assuming you're a good chef!).

[i]Typical, average, STW pedant! [/i]
I wouldn't say that's anything to do with pedantry.
It's just someone pointing out that someone else is trying to argue a case whilst using incorrect data.

........... Are the overall proportions going to be very different?

given that your quoted figure of 72 is around 100% out - probably

The numbers may be out becuase I used a different source http://www.caterersearch.com/Articles/2009/01/18/306085/top-michelin-rated-restaurants.html but the outcome is the same. More local top restaurants per capita in scotland. Agree? Do the maths for me and show me the results to support any argument against this please.

They don't have a michelin star gonefishin. That's key to the restaurants on the list!

Okay let me rephrase my second sentance for the "hard of thinking"

"I'm surprised that The Three Chimneys, a restaurant that has previously featured in the the 50 best in the world list, doesn't have a michelin star."

Edit: I don't know the code for smilies and they don't show up on IE5

A ";" followed by a ")" for a wink, colon for a genuine heart-felt smile! I guess the 3 chimneys not having a star is down to them perhaps not chasing one, or not meeting the critera for the examiners. It may be in the top 50 for the customers, but the michelin examiners are more stringent and want slightly different things to the average punter.

As with all these types of competitions there is a application stage, menu design and submission, heats, quarters, semis and final prior to going on to the 'British' part of the competition.
Most chefs are very busy, not all have their own restaurant, nor do they all want to get on the telly. Many are happy with rosettes and stars or just can't get the time to get away from work. The comps to win are the industry recognised ones as Tom Kitchin has in the past and, as it happens, my cousin's husband won this year. There is a HUGE amount of work in comps....just to add fuel to the fire...He's a NZ national 😀
Tom Kitchin is actively pursuing a 'TV chef' career so he was always going to be in the mix and with his talent it would have been surprising not to see him in the final.
The opportunities are limited and as such the way for up and coming chef's to make their mark is to start their own place, a very pricey option. The talent is here, the big money isn't hence the migration south of the border. It's a shame really. That's not to say that the food up here is disappointing, far from it!

Cheers

Paul.

PORRIDGE.

Best food ever invented. End of argument, you can all get back to work now.

what's the name of that famous english salmon river?
Which one? The Eden? The Ribble? The Tweed?

These are famous for their salmon are they? Well if I ever hear of them again, I'll try and remember that.

What's Michelin stars got to do with good food? S'just a mark of exclusivity, really. An 'award' given on the strength of reviews by poncy food critics, and that system is surely awash with backhanders and doing yer mates a favour, anyway.

I don't need to know if a place has a stupid star; I'll judge it on what food I get. Service is always secondary. And it's sooo subjective; surely, a Full English, following a heavy night, can taste just as good, if not better, than some ponced-up bits of Patagonian Ptmarmigan with quince jelly and wild nettles...

Goes without saying, that a city like London (or Edinbugger) will have a greater variety, but many of the more remote places will be very heavily dependent on their reputation, to ensure future trade, so may make more effort. A bad eaterie does not in any way survive long, in the Wild.

I'd love to come up to Scotland, and sample the cuisine of these fine places. Doubt I can afford it, mind...

What I found a bit depressing when staying in a B&B near Ullapool was that the owners had a fishing boat but sent their ENTIRE catch of langustines to Spain as "there is no local market"

In my experience (only a few weeks worth on various jaunts up there) it is pretty difficult to find good quality pub/ cheaper restaurant food.

Did you try the white hotel on the right on the way into Ullapool? I found their steaks to be the best I have tasted to date. The pub on the corner at the Harbour does great pub food. There are many gems in amongst the regular places...try the Inn at Plockton, or the Bosville in Portree, not to mention the Applecross Inn - the best seafood-based pub in the UK.

On a recent visit to Applecross, I visited the Applecross Inn and had the langoustines. They were huge and delicious. When I asked where they came from, the waiter pointed out into the bay.
But it's true, most of the seafood goes overseas.

RudeBoy - thanks for that, I always appreciate you giving us the benefit of your inexperience.

BigButSlimmerBloke - Not wishing to get drawn into a tit-for-tat Scottish/English debate as I have family allegiances both sides of the border (unlike that plastic Scot who normally turns up in any thread remotely associated with Scotland) but my take on the 'Tay Salmon' thing is this. In a country that has seen its industries ravaged by both government meddling and an inability to compete against the far-east Scotland has rightly fallen back on marketing anything it can to turn a profit and 'Tay Salmon' is a fine example of this. Its a catch-all (excuse the fishing pun) term thats used both for line caught samlon as well as by those selling cage reared, intensively farmed salmon. Its not nessessarily a mark of quality, just a mark of geography. Be proud of Scotland's magnificent line caught salmon and the rivers its caught from but don't be fooled into thinking a geographical tag adds quality. There are many factories surrounding a certain town in Lincolnshire churning out mass-produced meat pies but only geography makes them Melton Mowbray, not nessessarily quality.

RudeBoy - thanks for that, I always appreciate you giving us the benefit of your inexperience.

What on Earth are you on about now? Drop the vendetta- s'just making you look bitter.

Oh, and FYI; I've eaten in all sorts of places. Michelin star places, and tatty cafes. In the middle of town, and right out in the middle of nowhere. As much 'inexperience' as most people, I'd say. And I've eaten in places Michelin woon't even look down their poncy noses at, but have been excellent.

I'd like to try some proper Scottish beef; you know, the stuff they send to Japan. The really spensive stuff.

Tay Salmon' is a fine example of this. Its a catch-all (excuse the fishing pun) term thats used both for line caught samlon as well as by those selling cage reared, intensively farmed salmon

i almost posted the same thing about RB

I always appreciate you giving us the benefit of your inexperience

What's Michelin stars got to do with good food? S'just a mark of exclusivity, really. An 'award' given on the strength of reviews by poncy food critics, and that system is surely awash with backhanders and doing yer mates a favour, anyway.

I'd like to try some proper Scottish beef; you know, the stuff they send to Japan. The really spensive stuff.

What on Earth are you on about now?

or just your own [vast] culinary experience?

I take it the schools are closed today?

BBSB - I'm afraid the "la la la, I can't hear you" approach to ignoring facts was out-ruled by the 1982 'Now now children' Act. Try a Google search for 'Tay caged salmon' and as well as a site called 'Salmon Farm Monitor' which has articles on large scale escapes of farm salmon into the waters controlled by the Tay Fisheries Authority you'll also find that Loch Tay has a large number of caged salmon farms, all of which can be legally sold as Tay salmon, unlike line caught salmon which is illegal to sell.

Well, seeing as eating is an incredibly subjective thing, being 'objective' about it is surely impossible.

And the Michelin bods tend to go to the 'best' restaurants, whilst praps missing the hidden gems. And someone mentioned that half the starred restaurants in London are French, or something. Considering the vast diversity of cuisines available, I find that surprising, as this 'mark of quality' does not in any way really seem to reflect on all what's on offer. IE; why is there not a kebab shop, or 'greasy spoon', on Michelin's list?

I really do feel, based on my experience of eating in different places, that there is a great snobbishness attached to eating out. Sure, it's sometimes nice, to ave a really posh meal, in a nice restaurant, with proper tablecloths and lots of spoons, but it can be an equally pleasant sperience, eating somewhere a lot less pretentious, as well. Just 'cos you're paying more, does not in any way necessarily mean it will taste any better, surely?

My point is, that you shoon't just rely on the subjective opinion of others; the proof of the pudding, is most definitely in the eating.

Last Saturday, I had fish and chips in a small riverside pub in Limehouse, the grapes. A place well-known locally, and highly regarded. Nowt fancy, just simple grub.

T'was absolutely delicious. The reputation was well deserved. Perfectly fried fish (pretty fresh, as they get their stuff from Billingsgate market, less than a mile away), and the chips were just right. Lovely. Service was top-notch too.

About £7/8. Proving that good food needunt cost the Earth.

Druidh is that a scottish onion? 😆

Still, at least the Haggis farmers look likely to have bumper herds this season. Apparently the hills are awash with the little blighters, so much so they're having to install anti-haggis fencing alongside the Fort Bill DH course, though only down one side of course.

Druidh is that a scottish onion?

LOL!

And LOL! Too, @ djg!

[img] [/img]