The idea that a little 'toot' button makes a vehicle this size cyclist-friendly in any way is hilarious.
Maybe I'm being a 'fun sponge', but I happen to feel quite strongly that this kind of car makes using road space far less fun for just about every other road user.
I hope it makes a "Poop-Poop" noise like Mr Toad's car in The Wind In The Willows.
All it does is encourage sounding your car horn with the clear inference contrary to the actual facts of who has right of way to get a cycle rider to move over. If you are driving in accordance with the highway code you shouldn’t need to sound any horn at person riding a bike
Doesn't the highway code state that a horn is for use as an audible warning that you are there & nothing more, quite happy to receive an audible but friendly warning myself.
mechanicaldope
Full MemberIt is a secondary less aggressive horn. One for regular use that is mounted in the steering wheel centre and a ‘cyclist-friendly’ alternative that lets out a lesser ‘toot’ when the red button on the steering wheel is pushed.
Maybe that's what the engineer/designer thinks. Will that survive contact with the public? Not a chance. In practice, it's a button that says honk at cyclists.
Amazing
Cycle team owning car producer adds a jokey little nod to being polite to cyclists and the utter bellend brigade are outraged.
I really can’t make head nor tail of it.
Are folk really this stupid and bitter ?
The more I read the more amazed I am.
Thanks for the video scotroutes.
Is it just me that thinks this honking and tooting is all a bit Johnny Fartpants?
Cycle team owning car producer adds a jokey little nod to being polite to cyclists and the utter bellend brigade are outraged.
I really can’t make head nor tail of it.
Are folk really this stupid and bitter ?
The more I read the more amazed I am.
Other than "I'm here, move over" would a car driver need to "toot" at a person on a cycle. If you are in front you have right of way, if they sit behind you what danger do they pose? Oncoming, would you hear it and why "toot"? From the side, why "toot"?
When was the last time you sounded your horn at a person on a cycle?
I’m inherently opposed to it because I don’t like the founder, but it is interesting. It seems a bit of an odd mix of retro and modern. I half expect the radio to be set up to only play the band of the Coldstream Guards! 😀
So from Scotroutes video, it appears that the 'secondry' toot horn is indeed a safety feature to let cyclists know youre there without scaring them with a big standard horn - sounds quite a good thoughtful design to me
Probably good for sheep on the road as well.
So from Scotroutes video, it appears that the ‘secondry’ toot horn is indeed a safety feature to let cyclists know youre there without scaring them with a big standard horn – sounds quite a good thoughtful design to me
Why do they need to know you are there?
and the utter bellend brigade are outraged.
You don't seem that outraged.
Despite the cultural problems identified by some posters here (entrenched hatred of cyclists, who in turn anticipate aggressive intent from drivers), it might be a really useful feature in countries where a friendly toot is just that.
And it might be seen as part of the solution in terms of building more respect for cyclists.
But you'd have to separate that from the Brexit promoting, offshoring, polluting billionaire behind it and from any residual distaste for huge motorised lumps of metal.
I listened to what the designer said, he must be sounding his horn a lot more than I do to alert cyclists, is he "making progress" when he does this?
Big LOL that it's an unpowered mockup, can't even demo the "toot"
And it might be seen as part of the solution in terms of building more respect for cyclists.
Explain why I should feel "respected" when a driver "toots" at me. Please.
Explain why I should feel “respected” when a driver “toots” at me. Please.
Because you've not been collected on the bonnet.
Maybe that’s what the engineer/designer thinks. Will that survive contact with the public? Not a chance. In practice, it’s a button that says honk at cyclists.
Maybe it makes a cheery "Hello! Have a nice day" toot.
Amazing
Cycle team owning car producer adds a jokey little nod to being polite to cyclists and the utter bellend brigade are outraged.I really can’t make head nor tail of it.
Are folk really this stupid and bitter ?
The more I read the more amazed I am.
This is - arguably - a cycling forum, isn't it? Guess not. Carry on gammoning.
Explain why I should feel “respected” when a driver “toots” at me. Please.
Because if you ride anywhere outside of town it's entirely possible to be subject to a headwind or just general wind noise and higher car speeds which makes it impossible to hear traffic coming up behind unless they have to slow right down behind you long enough to be noticed?
A polite 'toot' would have been appreciated in those circumstances even if they did cross over the white lines to the other side for the overtake. Modern horns designed to be heard through soundproofed car panels and double glazed windows on the other hand are bloody terrifying!
But it's not particularly easy when you're safely ensconced in your massive 4X4 to tell if there's a headwind, or a sidewind, and/or whether it's blowing at quite a sufficient velocity to drown out your ridiculous diesel engine or not. So you're supposed to 'toot' at all cyclists, just to be on the safe side?
I think nickc needs to back away from this thread before he gives himself an aneurysm.
I quite like that dash, at least it's a bit different to most things out there. Sadly I'm not the target audience seen as I'm not a 50-something entitled golf playing gammon (or whatever... 🙄).
Imagine people actually liking different things. Crazy.
Toot button is a bit random though (unless it's a less aggressive version of the horn, then it makes more sense)
So you’re supposed to ‘toot’ at all cyclists, just to be on the safe side?
Er... no.
But I can think of plenty of occasions, especially on country lanes, where being made aware of the presence of a vehicle, without being made to jump out of your skin, would be useful.
Toot button is a bit random though (unless it’s a less aggressive version of the horn, then it makes more sense)
Got it in one.
But it’s not particularly easy when you’re safely ensconced in your massive 4X4 to tell if there’s a headwind, or a sidewind, and/or whether it’s blowing at quite a sufficient velocity to drown out your ridiculous diesel engine or not. So you’re supposed to ‘toot’ at all cyclists, just to be on the safe side?
Doesn't seem like the worst idea in the world, does it? A polite toot from 400m back has got to be more pleasant than the more common surprise-but-safe overtake.
We manage to ding bells for walkers without turning into a frothing at the mouth Brexit voting gammon?
It would have to be a [i]really[/i] nice sounding horn for me to get on board with that 🙂
scotroutes
Got it in one.
Exactly, it's the ogmios "gentle beep", isn't it.
So you’re supposed to ‘toot’ at all cyclists, just to be on the safe side?
Er… no.
But I can think of plenty of occasions, especially on country lanes, where being made aware of the presence of a vehicle, without being made to jump out of your skin, would be useful
My first day cycling in France I couldn't work out why drivers seemed so angry at cyclists- getting horns honked at me in little country lanes - until it began to dawn that they were little toots of encouragement with an occasional 'Bon Courage' out the window.
Theres quite a range of emotions that people communicate with what toot of a horn - difficult for the person being tooted at to know what the tooter intended.
A dilema described perfectly here (5m32s)
Edit
Exactly, it’s the ogmios “gentle beep”, isn’t it.
Great minds think alike
When was the last time you sounded your horn at a person on a cycle?
Saturday, (as I said on the previous page).
Sounds like a great idea for France, but in the UK I imagine most car drivers would prefer their bike tooter looking like this
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I can't think of any time a motorist has ever honked at me and it's been a good thing. It's always meant "get out of my way"
An awful lot of people on here are projecting their own prejudices onto other people’s actions. I am reminded of when I give a polite ‘ting ‘ting warning on the bell on a cycle path & the pedestrian construes this as ‘get out of my way’
Because if you ride anywhere outside of town it’s entirely possible to be subject to a headwind or just general wind noise and higher car speeds which makes it impossible to hear traffic coming up behind unless they have to slow right down behind you long enough to be noticed?
A polite ‘toot’ would have been appreciated in those circumstances
Why? What are you going to do on hearing a 'toot,' throw your bike into a hedge?
If I'm riding somewhere where I'm likely to encounter traffic then I'll tuck in when it's safe to overtake and take primary when it is not. Who or what is behind me is irrelevant, it's just safe and considerate riding. They can toot all they like, if it's not safe to overtake then it's not safe to overtake and they can wait the several seconds until it is.
We manage to ding bells for walkers without turning into a frothing at the mouth Brexit voting gammon?
This is kinda the same argument. People go apoplectic about cyclists riding two-abreast, yet will cheerfully take up the entirety of a path half a mile wide. The bell shouldn't be necessary and wouldn't be necessary if folk acknowledged that they weren't the only people on the planet.
Why? What are you going to do on hearing a ‘toot,’ throw your bike into a hedge?
I think you might just be looking for an argument here.
The bell shouldn’t be necessary and wouldn’t be necessary if folk acknowledged that they weren’t the only people on the planet.
Ah, yes... yes you are.
This is kinda the same argument. People go apoplectic about cyclists riding two-abreast, yet will cheerfully take up the entirety of a path half a mile wide. The bell shouldn’t be necessary and wouldn’t be necessary if folk acknowledged that they weren’t the only people on the planet.
Not what the HC says.
Essentially you could argue that you should never need a bell/horn at all. After all, if it is meant as a warning, and you have time to give a warning, then you will also have time to stop or carry out an evasive manoeuvre. Yet it is a legal requirement to have a working horn on a mtor vehicle or a bell to be fitted to a new bike. So that's what its for, to give people a warning that you are behind them. Plenty of people seem to expect to get that warning, judging by the 'why haven't you got a bell' type comments you get if you don't use it. Don't blame me, but it seems to be an underlying assumption in law that there might be occasions when giving a warning is totally appropriate & useful.
@nickc
Try not to be a complete cock.
This is – arguably – a cycling forum, isn’t it? Guess not. Carry on gammoning.
Really ? You’re confident you come across as intelligent by posting that?
This is kinda the same argument. People go apoplectic about cyclists riding two-abreast, yet will cheerfully take up the entirety of a path half a mile wide. The bell shouldn’t be necessary and wouldn’t be necessary if folk acknowledged that they weren’t the only people on the planet.
So in this scenario, is the walker supposed to jump in the hedge? Or does the cyclist stay behind them until there's a sufficiently wide bit of path (I'm not looking for an argument, just repeating yours back to you).
"ping/toot" and overtake at a safe margin without making anyone jump out of their skin at the presence of faster traffic overtaking.
Your horn is there to announce your presence to other road users.
They have added a specific short “toot” function so that cyclists don’t feel threatened when it’s used .
I utterly fail to see why that causes the vitriol seen here.
Some of you are like professionally offended.
I’m sure it’ll only be Tories that buy them anyway.
I’ve registered my interest in pre-ordering
Just so long as the cable used to wire up the tooter is of sufficient audiophile quality, I don't see what the issue is.
I wonder if it's been tested with Schrödinger's microphone?
The problem i have with this interior is it is yet more pointless fakery in the name of something that has NO application in a car.
Aircraft have removable instruments that bolt into standard sized slots for two main reasons:
1) The instruments have to be regularily inspected, serviced and calibrated. Soemthing like a radar altemeter must be accurate or you'll fly into a mountain, so being able to remove a single instrument easily is a real benefit. When was the last time you had the heater controls of your car inspected? anyone?? anyone at all??
2) Aircraft instruments are NOT made by the airframe manufacturers, so std sized bolt in instruments allows an external instrument maker to design a standard instrument that will fit in all sorts of planes. if you make say artificial horizons, then you'll want everyone to use them, not just one airframe manufacturer. So again, bolt-in standardised instrument is sensible. The controls and displays in your car are (effectively) made by the people who make the car (or by an external supplier to there individual specs). Nobody needs to put say a BMW 3 series speedometer into a Ford Mondeo, and the manufacturers use these instruments as part of their styling and atributes, ie they are NOT standardised
And yet, here are Ineos, doing some naff faux aircraft type mountings, why? It doesn't even look very good imo, and all those extra fastners are just asking to come loose and rattle.
So, for me, it's another naff marketing lead load of bull, that adds nothing to the vehicle and is actually counter to the claimed ethos of the vehicle.......
why?
Did you watch the video? Easy access for wiring in any add ons or replacements/upgrades.
I utterly fail to see why that causes the vitriol seen here.
I have to agree. A less abrasive horn for other road users not cocooned in metal. Why is that such a bad thing?
Fasteners coming loose and rattling? It’s just staying true to the spirit of the original defender 😀 The real test though will be whether it leaks - I bet it doesn’t - nothing leaks like a landy!
I invented* the quiet secondary tooter years ago, very useful for getting the attention of other humans without scaring them witless.
I didn't realise I had become a cyclist hating, er, cyclist by doing so, nobody seemed to mind as it it sounded more like a well held note from a rectum.
*I don't claim to be the only one who did so.
I like this idea now.
Is it some kind of fun noise too?
