[Closed] Got my winter tyres fitted...

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All you need now is a snow plow and a jacket...

Plow?

Tick!

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Not worth the expense for me for the couple of days of snow I get to see around my way per year, if any at all.

Winter tyres <> Snow tyres

@deadkenny: see all 500* arguments** in favour of winter tyres regardless of snow.

*may be slightly exaggerated.
**many made by me.

Long term forcasts to Feb down south are of 8 degrees average over the period. What's the point.

[quote=Kryton57 ]Long term forcasts to Feb down south are of 8 degrees[b] average[/b] over the period. What's the point. 🙄

Forecasts are always wrong, and it's winter.

You might be able to keep up with a proper 4x4 now 😉

PS just off to fit my winter tyres when my coffee and porridge has kicked in.

Not enjoying driving on my summer tyres in these temps with all the mud and standing water on the roads as is common in winter and WINTER tyres excel in these conditions...

PPS you need some big guns mounted to the side to go with the new wheel look 😀

[quote="kryton57"] are of 8 degrees average over the periodyou not so good at maths then? Or physics.

Just done the last of ours this afternoon. Think the in laws will want theirs doing tomorrow.........

Not long before its time for studded tyres on the bike too.

You may have missed my posts in the other thread. I appreciate the Mornings / evenings will be colder, tyre physics etc but I live in London, and have a haldex 4wd alternative with all seasons next to mine in the garage. I do however do 2-3 journeys at 5am to Oxford Kent a month and they'd be well worth it for that. Is the £521 I'd pay worth it for 2-3 careful journeys...

So when you say what's the point, you really mean "I've got them on the other car"

No, I mean what the point for the car I'll use for those 2-3 journeys and some potential short runs in town.

The other car is "accidental". It's a Ford Kuga, and has Conti 4x4 contacts rear and Pirelli scorpions front - not proper winter tyres by any means the for,we are OEM the latter fitted without research. It's the family car used for school runs so 9 times out of 10 it's not available to me.

Conti 4x4 contacts rear and Pirelli scorpions front

no idea if the Kuga is a real or more a faux-by-4 but be very careful with different makes of tyre front and rear as the mismatch can kill 4x4 systems, especially when just used on the road as there is no slip like you get off-road and especially on motorways as the speeds and thus axle RPM difference is higher.

It's haldex - normally fwd, but 4wd kicks in when it's needed. TBH we've driven it in snow as if it's a normal fwd, I'm under no illusions about its 4wd capability.

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Kryton57 - Member
Long term forcasts to Feb down south are of 8 degrees average over the period. What's the point.

For me, they are more for the muddy sites I work on. They are an all terrain tyre - just so happens that they've been given a snowflake rating

When you talk of £500 expenditure...it doesn't really compute unless you are investing in new wheels.

In my case, the car needed tyres, approx £80 a corner whether I got Summer tyres or All Seasons. The All Seasons will stay on permanently, although I wil refit the two good summers in the Spring simply as they still have plenty of life in them.

I suspect we may get a few thousand less miles out of them but seeing as All Seasons and even Winters only have a small performance drop in dry summer conditions compared to Summer tyres having a significant performance drop in cold winter conditions, they are a good choice. And Snow...well, summer tyres are practically useless whether they are fitted to a 2wd, a 4x4 or an all wheel drive/Haldex type system.

AndyL, pretty sure the modern Haldex/Faux 4x4's are fine with slightly different tyre circumferences, as the diffs are all open, with the braking system used to slow down the wheels that are spinning and divert power to the wheels with grip. It may confuse the wheel speed sensors but you'd think the car would be clever enough to calibrate each wheel speed during normal driving.

When you talk of £500 expenditure...it doesn't really compute unless you are investing in new wheels.

Is for 4 X steels shod with Conti TS830P RFT. Dunlop m3's are £30 cheaper.

Can I just ask if it's worth fitting just two winter tyres and if so, which wheels to fit them on - I was thinking diagonally opposite just to even things up across all four corners of the car. 😉

Re: the cost per corner. If winter tyres save you from slapping a kerb and bending something or avoiding you abandoning your car overnight then I'm a fan. Last year the M62 was gridlocked so alot of cars came off at Saddleworth and attempted to drive over the tops. I passed two cars in a ditch, one being pulled out and a woman/two boys in the middle of the road in a Fiat500. She was shaking like a leaf and had panicked when her summer tyres almost sent them over the edge of a big drop (used by paragliders etc). Now, that £80 a corner? Worth every penny IMO. I also drove one set of winters well into summer (as they were <4mm so not worth saving for another winter)

Unfortunately, fitting snow tyres to my car doesn't move the 10,000 totally clueless other people who couldn't drive a greasy stick up a pigs a**e out of the way too..........

Sadly I concede you are 1000% right on that. It's bad enough when it suddenly raibs on the M60 and the accidents start because people think TC, ABS, stability control etc will save them. Cometh ice and snow they still drive at a warm summers day pace everywhere.

Artist, are they bigger than the original tyres, they look fairly chunky..?

Artist, are they bigger than the original tyres, they look fairly chunky..?

Yes, they are - according to a tyre comparison calculator, 5.4% bigger. According to GPS, the Speedo is now accurate.

Unfortunately, fitting snow tyres to my car doesn't move the 10,000 totally clueless other people who couldn't drive a greasy stick up a pigs a**e out of the way too..........

Mine have paid for themselves several times over in avoiding accidents.

The best was some old codger driving the wrong way down a dual carriageway as he had got disorientated in the snow. I clearly won the traffic light GP as everyone else was wheelspinning and then the guy appeared and I was able to swerve around him and left the carnage to unravel behind me. Not good!

Won't be fitting winter tyres but I do need to refit my front prop, took it off to replace the bearings 3 months ago! I'll fitting it in the snow at this rate

Our last set saved my wife from a night on the A23...she'd sat all evening in traffic and did about 10 miles in four hours before properly grinding to a halt.

As they were shunting along she found a completely snow covered slip road, after some persuasion from me she went cross country and the biggest problem she had was maneuvering around all the stranded cars on the hills...mostly 4x4's as they thought they could go the hilly route!

FWD Ford Fusion with Kleber Quadraxer All Seasons, they were definitely worth it that night. It may have taken her over 6 hours to do 40 miles and arrive home after midnight, but a lot of people spent the night in their cars.

Had my Michelin Cross Climate's on since July and they've been ace in the wet/summer and still biting in -2C.

My car is rear wheel drive and makes me poop my pants with a grin while driving in winter.

I would have winter tyres but can't afford to buy the scientific "control" car with or without winter tyres to follow me about everywhere so I can back up my driving war stories in massively different conditions concerning luck or lack of it.

We are all talking rubbish. Apart from the op. There is no doubt they will work better in snow.

Down south at least I'd say the ability to drive in snow is fairly pointless unless you're out in the sticks, as the country shuts down at the slightest hint of a flake of snow, so nowhere will be open anyway.

Aside from that, never once had an issue with regular tyres in winter conditions other than snow, and tyres last me long enough to not care if the performance during colder months is fractionally worse.

Anyway, while down to near freezing this weekend, back up to 9C during the week in Surrey.

And screw it, if it snows, it's a snow day. I can work from home or ride my bike, which works in all weather (and I don't need spikes for the snow, a set of Minions work great on a fresh layer of snow 😀 ).

I've had mud and snow tyres on my Ranger, then on my Amarok for the past three years.

It hasn't snowed here for three years, but they are good in the mud. I'm tempted to put some summer tyres on this winter to see if it snows.

This is the thing. Fit slicks and it'll snowmageddon. Fit full on winters and sods law itll be the warmest winter ever ..

i bought an A3 quattro after two bad winters commuting across dartmoor. has barely snowed since.

Can someone explain how changing to winter tyres works? I'd like to get some as I need to regularly drive down muddy tracks to collect logs.

I've a fair bit of wear left on my summer tyres and don't want to bin them. If I change them to winter tyres do the garage give me the partly worn summer tyres To store over the winter and get them to refit in summer?

Do I need to buy a set of cheap wheels for the winter tyres so I can swap them myself?

Stand to be corrected,
Different rubber compound designed to give better grip at lower temp than Summer tyres. Wider and deeper tread pattern that is less likely to get clogged up with snow.
Some folk get cheap wheels to put Winer tyres on so you can switch between summer \ winter wheels without having to go to a garage (and pay a garage).

You can do either, new rims or keep swapping tyre.

A set of steelies used to be about 100-130 quid, so you don't need to wait very long before swapping and balancing 4 tyres twice a year gets to that sort of money.

Thanks for clarifying. Reckon I'll try a tyre swap this year and maybe invest in some wheels if i get some benefit from the winter tyres.

Are a number of annual changes going to harm the tyres or wheels? It looks a fairly brutal process.

deadkenny - Member
Down south at least I'd say the ability to drive in snow is fairly pointless unless you're out in the sticks, as the country shuts down at the slightest hint of a flake of snow, so nowhere will be open anyway.

Not a former boyscout, then, deadkenny? Not a big fan of 'being prepared'...

One thing I was taught as a young driver is that I shouldn't have a license if I didn't know anything about cars other than to propel them forward. In light of this, I learnt some basic mechanics and - in the past at least - took care of much of my own maintenance. When my own kids learn to drive, they too will be made to learn something about mechanics. They may have an RAC membership and never have to use their knowledge in their lives, but at least they will be prepared should they need to call upon the knowledge.

Andy, I suggest you check (steel) wheel + tyre prices somewhere like mytyres dot com.

I would recommend not driving in snow and staying home from work, but sometimes you don't have the choice. I might get sent away at the befinning of a week, and have to drive home in unforecast snow...

The reason I put mine on steels, is that the 18" version of the tyre is more expensive than the 17" and I scratched my alloys to bits in deep stony mud earlier this year. Going to use the steels and big tyres for winter and have the alloys re-furbed and stick the road tyres back on for summer. It's a bit more clear cut for me with the places I go

I haven't had 'winter tyres' since I had some studded one's on a Mini Pickup in about 1980, & that was cos I got them cheap.
I've never been housebound cos of snow or actually been stuck in snow since, & have driven as normal every winter (North East England)
What's so special about winter tyres again?
(Ok, if your'e a Scottish gamekeeper or something I kinda get the point, but wer'e not in bloody Manitoba FFS!)

but wer'e not in bloody Manitoba FFS!

Whoa, there. Some of us sometimes like to pretend we are.

😉

What's so special about winter tyres again?

They allow those of us who aren't fit to lick your driving boots to carry on as normal during the coldest weather.

Gods such as yourself are few and far between, by all accounts.

(Leaves thine presence backwards, 'flecting and that...)

SaxonRider - Member
Not a former boyscout, then, deadkenny? Not a big fan of 'being prepared'...

I was actually, but I f'cked it off as couldn't be doing with it and used to just mess about 😀

Bought a new car a month ago and since I'm planning to keep it until it dies I decided a spare set of alloys with winter tyres was a good investment. PSA - I fitted them today and learned 3 things:

- the self adhesive balance weights that mytyres.co.uk fitted fell off during 1 months storage. If you buy wheels fro mytyres, photograph where the weights are so that you don't have to get them rebalanced

- the locking wheel nuts on a Focus are 35mm diameter. The recesses on Enzo wheels are 30mm diameter.

- Unlike most summer car tyres I've used, winter tyres have a direction of rotation, so you need to put them on the correct side of the car !

Not singling this out in particular but statements like this

Mine have paid for themselves several times over in avoiding accidents.

really worry me.

Why? Well, you shouldn't be relying on special tyres to avoid accidents. If that sort of thing is true for anyone I suggest it's you at fault, not the weather!
Slow down and watch what you're doing FFS!

Ok look at it this way- they aren't needed/make no difference for you= new tyres that give you 20,000miles service. They work just that one time that they'd make a difference = saves you your excess, mucking about for hours etc.

I like to drive over the tops etc 365 days a year. Winter tyres help me do this in conjunction with common sense and abit of driving ability.

Mine getting a full QA prior to fitting.

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I'm going to find some snow this winter. 😈

I like your hallway/stairs colour

If it's below 7°C then winter tyres have better stopping distance. That's what interests me when I'm driving on the motorway with my kids in the car. But it's also nice to know I won't get stranded at my parents if it snows (I carry snow chains as well).

Yes, I paid £800 for a spare set of alloys with Conti T850s. But during the 6 months of the year I'm running those, I'm not wearing my nice Goodyear shod 'summer' wheels. In the long term, the only 'extra' cost will be the alloys, which were only about £300 for the set.

The part I don't enjoy is swapping the wheels round twice a year, but at least I get to check the brakes properly at the same time.

What tyres are they pictonroad?

Got mine fitted 2 weeks ago - I would recommend them especially safety with kids in the car..

PeterPoddy - Member
Not singling this out in particular but statements like this

Mine have paid for themselves several times over in avoiding accidents.
really worry me.

Why? Well, you shouldn't be relying on special tyres to avoid accidents. If that sort of thing is true for anyone I suggest it's you at fault, not the weather!
Slow down and watch what you're doing FFS!

Clearly a guy driving the wrong way down a dual carriageway is my fault for driving too fast. What about when I've been stationary and able to move out of the way of someone sliding out of control? Or being able to brake and steer safely when someone has been coming round a bend too fast and slid across your path. My fault too I guess?

Mickey Thompson Baja Claw, going on a Hilux Surf once I remove all the bits in the way...

Got mine fitted today, so that means temps above 10C all winter:

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PeterPoddy - Member

Why? Well, you shouldn't be relying on special tyres to avoid accidents. If that sort of thing is true for anyone I suggest it's you at fault, not the weather!
Slow down and watch what you're doing FFS!

Aye, when someone else comes round a corner too fast and loses control, and you're able to stop in time because you have winter tyres, you're definitely doing something wrong. Sometimes you cause your own "accidents" but sometimes, it's up to you to avoid someone else's.

andrw13 - Member

I've a fair bit of wear left on my summer tyres and don't want to bin them. If I change them to winter tyres do the garage give me the partly worn summer tyres To store over the winter and get them to refit in summer?

Do I need to buy a set of cheap wheels for the winter tyres so I can swap them myself?

A good way to do it is to look for used sets- people sell their cars then sell the wheels separately. If it's a common car you'll probably find some pretty easily, though, it's also worth being picky about exactly which tyres. For some cars, you'll find a lot of variants fit- I got mine cheap because they were advertised for a jaguar but they fit a mondeo, frinstance (on account of, it's basically the same car).

(OK, I also got them cheap because the alloys are hideous, but still)

pictonroad - Member

Mickey Thompson Baja Claw, going on a Hilux Surf once I remove all the bits in the way...

Interesting to see how the chunky all terrain type 'winter tyres' lack the many many sipes and cuts of a car/van style tyre. Makes you wonder if the manufacturer even bothers to use a winter compound or just hopes the typical user will use them in deep snow and not on ice. Saw some comments on a US video about how commercial/small truck tyres don't need to meet the same criteria as a car tyre and hence the manufacturers are able to stick the winter snowflake/mountain symbol on anything they want to market to the winter tyre market.

Fitted mine yesterday, 20 mins with a trolley jack and socket.
Good timing really considering it was raining slightly and about 2 degrees on the way home this evening

Why? Well, you shouldn't be relying on special tyres to avoid accidents. If that sort of thing is true for anyone I suggest it's you at fault, not the weather!
Slow down and watch what you're doing FFS!

I can't speak for everyone else, but I've been driving on winter tyres for the last four winters and far from using them as a performance aid, I simply drive with a greater margin for error, not more recklessly. They're a safety aid, not a performance enhancement. People skid on compacted snow, not necessarily because they're reckless or going too fast, but because - guess what - it's bloody slippery. Ain't physics a bitch...

Have you ever actually driven with winter tyres fella?

Going to get some winter tyres for the stealth camper - transit connect LWB. Any recommendations?.

I can't speak for everyone else, but I've been driving on winter tyres for the last four winters and far from using them as a performance aid, I simply drive with a greater margin for error, not more recklessly. They're a safety aid, not a performance enhancement.

Pretty much sums it up for me.

Fitting a new set next weekend.

That said, if I live in the south of England I wouldn't bother.

Interesting to see how the chunky all terrain type 'winter tyres' lack the many many sipes and cuts of a car/van style tyre. Makes you wonder if the manufacturer even bothers to use a winter compound or just hopes the typical user will use them in deep snow and not on ice. Saw some comments on a US video about how commercial/small truck tyres don't need to meet the same criteria as a car tyre and hence the manufacturers are able to stick the winter snowflake/mountain symbol on anything they want to market to the winter tyre market.

Mine aren't marketed as a dedicated winter tyre and I haven't bought them as such, despite the thread title. They are tyres that I've bought for winter. Very few off road tyres have the snowflake I don't think and I'm pretty certain those Mickey Thomson's don't ^^. The fact that the BFG's do have it did influence my purchase though.

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same reason i bought the BFGs for my landy STR. and like you i refuse to have the stupid looking white advertising on the outside.

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(snorkles below roof level now .... i do understand the stupidity of having a vehicle with an air intake above my breathing level....- since i dont carry a diving snorkle and periscope....)

Remember the day my neighbour in his rangerover came back past my house at 6am and said no point heading out - you cant get out the road the snows fence deep.......

yeah right - LSD in the rear ,a locked front diff , significant clearance- coupled with 33inch mud terrains and a tiny bit of offroad driving experiance.....

Got through no bother. Neighbour took his rediculous rubber bands off and fitted general grabbers from that day on .... - nothing quite like getting shown up by a vauxhall frontera.

DiscJockey - Member

If it's below 7°C then winter tyres have better stopping distance

And above 7C ...

"At temperatures above 7C they offer significantly poorer grip in dry conditions than the best summer tyres. This can mean a marked increase in braking distances and poorer handling and grip in bends."

http://www.which.co.uk/cars/driving/car-tyres/winter-tyres/

Alternative option below 7C is drive for the conditions, slow down, leave more room.

deadkenny - Member

"At temperatures above 7C they offer significantly poorer grip in dry conditions than the best summer tyres. This can mean a marked increase in braking distances and poorer handling and grip in bends."

Those are the situations where you have the most grip and also generally the best visibility. Giving away grip in the best conditions to gain grip in the worst seems like a pretty good deal to me. How often do you find yourself concerned about traction in the warm and dry?

At temperatures above 7C they offer significantly poorer grip in dry conditions than the best summer tyres

How much above 7C? Is it certain death at 10C?

https://ralphhosier.wordpress.com/2012/02/10/winter-tyres-the-truth/

deadkenny .

ill go with the other option - drive carefully in the odd occasion i drive when its above 7......for the reasons northwind states.......

*edit - not sure if hes actually trolling -- its a pretty good troll if he is because it seems like serious stupids....- or lives in south of spain .... scotroutes needs to post his graph of days when at peak commute it is under 7...

STR, at least there are some sipes on yours...it seems sizes of those come with a winter rating and others don't, but not sure what the rationale is. I know they are not aimed at the same market but just surprised by the lack of any roughage on that second set of tyres.

At temperatures above 7C they offer significantly poorer grip in dry conditions than the best summer tyres

Define significantly...they say the 'best' summer tyres which to me sounds like they compare well with an average summer tyre for braking.
I'm recall the performance drop for a winter tyre in summer is something like 5%, whereas a summer tyre in cold winter conditions is 20-30%, and in snow, something like 80%.

That said, if I live in the south of England I wouldn't bother.

Why's that then?

Why's that then?

To be fair. It depends!

How many untreated back roads do you deal with, at what time of day, etc, etc. Remember this is me viewing the value through my own experiences, not yours.

@Kenny, average maximum temp at my address is 4.9C to 5.2C between now and the end of February according to the Met.

I guess everyone without winter tyes is assuming that the councils can afford to grit the roads this winter...