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When the most exciting bits of the race are someone breaking down on the formation lap & someone else with a wheelnut that wouldn’t come off, you know it’s been a bit shit.
I don't think that's fair. Schumacher and Mazepin fighting over last place was the most exciting bit.
thols2
I don’t think that’s fair. Schumacher and Mazepin fighting over last place was the most exciting bit.
What....? More exciting than the mechanic skilfully whacking the side of the wheel gun hoping that it would somehow fix the damaged nut?! No way!
Actually, the most exciting bit was probably Vettel & Gasly scampering up the hill side by side, but the editors decided to cut from that action in case it woke people up.
And I was quite pleased to see Vettel get a decent finish & some points. I'm not sure that will carry over for the rest of the season, but at least it gets him some points on the board & perhaps a mental boost. He's looked like he needs a big hug for too long now.
+1 for Monaco generally being a bore-fest, F1 cars generally outgrew the circuit decades ago and with modern reliability it's more often than not the first car into Sainte Devote off the lights that takes the chequered flag.
Remember that one of the all-time Monaco classics was 1992, the defining feature of which was a few minutes of edge-of-the-seat lack of overtaking
Yep, Mansell climbing all over the back of Senna's McLaren Honda was edge of the seat stuff until it became clear that Senna's car was practically the same width as the tarmac. 1996 was pretty entertaining though - Schumacher stuffed it early on, Hill was way out in front and set to win at Monaco for the very first time until his engine blew, then it rained and only three cars made it to the finish with a well deserved win from 14th place for a man with (almost) a very amusing surname.
IIRC, in addition to the 1998 debacle, Rosset crashed at Monaco in the 1996 race, on his way to the hilarious statistic of twenty retirements or DNQs out of 33 races. On that basis, Nikita Mazepin has proven himself to be better than Rosset having actually finished the race yesterday.
I don't understand why merc thought bringing hamilton in early would work in monaco. I thought he'd definitely run long
in other news:
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/bottas-wheel-nut-still-stuck-mercedes/6514622/
It was a completely dull race, really felt like a waste of time. It may have spiced up the championship table for a while and I'm happy for Norris with his podium but as a spectacle it was pointless. It only needs one genuine overtaking spot to be made though, then it would be at least possible to race. As it is now they all know they can drive at 7/10ths, not risk hitting a barrier and there's nothing a following driver can do to get past on-track. The strategists take care of when to take the mandatory pitstop and that's the fun sucked out of it, barring a mechanical or a driver getting frustrated enough to try a dive somewhere.
I remember when BBC sold out and started mainly highlights with a couple of full length races one of the races they took full length was Monaco! Who the **** decided that was a good one to take in its entirety?! If ever a race wants highlights only its this one.
It was a 'quirk' of the deal they did with Sky. The BBC had half the races live, the rest highlights. The only guaranteed live one was Silverstone, after that it was an odd choice system. The BBC picked one then Sky told them one they would be doing live then the BBC picked another etc. It basically resigned the BBC to having all the boring tracks live and only a few of the interesting ones. So the BBC would choose Spa then Sky would tell them to have Monaco, BBC goes for Canada then Sky tell them they have to do Bahrain etc. It was designed to essentially force fans to get the Sky F1 channel if they wanted to follow the interesting stuff while making sure the BBC couldn't get the best races as live ones.
I don’t understand why merc thought bringing hamilton in early would work in monaco.
The Merc doesn't work its tyres as aggressively as the Red Bull and other cars. That makes it harder to get the tyres warmed up for qualifying. The Monaco circuit is easy on tyres because of the low speeds and smooth surface so Merc tried to set the cars up to work the tyres more aggressively to get them up to temperature for qualifying. Hamilton wanted them to go further with that approach, that's why he was upset. However, that left them with much higher tyre wear. Both Bottas and Hamilton had to pit early because their tyres were getting quite badly worn. That's why Bottas started dropping back from Verstappen, even though Verstappen wasn't pushing hard. Merc simply didn't have any choice but to undercut, the overcut was not an option for them. All Verstappen had to do was cruise around and wait for the Mercs to pit then put in some fast laps.
Every year pre race hype about how great Monaco is blah blah blah, every year same dull race, quick sprit to the first corner and race done pretty much. This yea commentators waffled on about how much it was missed from 2020...really was it?
Rosset crashed at Monaco in the 1996 race, on his way to the hilarious statistic of twenty retirements or DNQs out of 33 races
He was mostly driving absolute dogs though
really was it?
I suspect it was if you can afford to be in Monaco and enjoy the entire Weekend experience surrounding the whole event, with the race being watched from a balcony with a few beers. Very different from watching the race on a sofa in North London.
Max Mosley has died.
Quiet in here.
Max Moseley and I share a birthday (albeit 34 years apart). He had dubious dabblings in right-of-centre politics over the years, what with association with the Union Movement in the 1950s, the Conservative Party in the 1980s and him being a member of and donor to the Labour Party in the late 1990s.
Have I missed anything important?
I suspect it was if you can afford to be in Monaco and enjoy the entire Weekend experience surrounding the whole event, with the race being watched from a balcony with a few beers. Very different from watching the race on a sofa in North London.
Commentators said at one point that a room with a balcony view over whatever part of the track it was cost £17,000 for a night on F1 weekend! 😲
Do you think there will be a whip round for Max Mosley's funeral
I can't imagine that Ron Dennis will be chipping anything in.
PJM1974
Free MemberMax Moseley and I share a birthday (albeit 34 years apart). He had dubious dabblings in right-of-centre politics over the years, what with association with the Union Movement in the 1950s, the Conservative Party in the 1980s and him being a member of and donor to the Labour Party in the late 1990s.
Have I missed anything important?
That he was a driving force behind the safety improvements post '94.
I always thought he was a good dude for going to Ratzenburger's funeral instead of Senna's as "everybody else went" to that and he didn't want Roland's family to think he'd been forgotten.
That he was a driving force behind the safety improvements post ’94.
I always thought he was a good dude for going to Ratzenburger’s funeral instead of Senna’s as “everybody else went” to that and he didn’t want Roland’s family to think he’d been forgotten
I think that this is an excellent point.
always thought he was a good dude for going to Ratzenburger’s funeral
It was a class act. In interviews he always came across as decent - you may not have agreed with his proclivities, but his positions were always well-argued and rational.
I disliked the litigious way that he ran F1 - I'm sure there were more court cases, appeals and suchlike during his tenure than at any other time. He was undoubtedly a breath of fresh air after Balestre but I think the Mosely/Ecclestone era took F1 further from its fan base in the pursuit of money - though to balance that they did a lot to make it a professionally run series rather than a bunch of half arsed race meetings. He's due some recognition for the way he faced up to the press too, taking ownership of his private life rather than scuttling away.
I think the first Monaco GP I saw on telly was 1967 (when sadly Lorenzo Bandini was killed). There have been some incredible performances there over the years. Although today's F1 cars are less well suited to the circuit than back then I still love watching them race there.
The first thing that came to mind when I saw the Mosley news was Mo's funeral from Succession.
I disliked the litigious way that he ran F1 – I’m sure there were more court cases, appeals and suchlike during his tenure than at any other time
At least it was in the open. Teams could appeal, discuss and make changes that applied to everyone. Before it was literally 'gentlemen's' agreements in smoky rooms, backhanders and looking the other way.
At the start of every race we hear how drivers love this track and it's definitely one of the best track to drive. Every. Single. Track.
An old friend of mine is a bit minted and spends Monaco weekend in a yacht in the marina. It's about the deals not the racing.
Toto putting the blame on to Bottas for his wheel nut fiasco! I'm not a big bottas fan but seems a bit unfair. All not well in that relationship clearly
also, Alonso moaning that he's not getting the respect he deserves
Toto putting the blame on to Bottas for his wheel nut fiasco! I’m not a big bottas fan but seems a bit unfair. All not well in that relationship clearly
Coulthard was speculating that Bottas has already been told he's off at the end of the season
Coulthard was speculating that Bottas has already been told he’s off at the end of the season
The pairing of Bottas and Hamilton are never going to last for ever, given that Merc will need to consider succession planning for Lewis in the near future. Wouldn't be surprised to see Russell in a Mercedes proper next year and Bottas heading back to Williams with a few years' experience of being in a top team in his pocket.
Was a bit rich partly blaming Bottas for stopping slightly short in his pit box though, it's not as though that's a regular cause of rounding a wheelnut.
Can't help feeling desperately sorry for Ricciardo too right now. Him moving to McLaren seemed like a dream move three months ago, it won't be lost on McLaren that they let Sainz go to Ferrari where he finished ahead of Norris on Sunday and that Ricciardo has a three year contract. They have to find a way to get Ricciardo to gel with the car, especially as we've another street circuit coming up in a fortnight.
PJM1974
The pairing of Bottas and Hamilton are never going to last for ever, given that Merc will need to consider succession planning for Lewis in the near future. Wouldn’t be surprised to see Russell in a Mercedes proper next year and Bottas heading back to Williams with a few years’ experience of being in a top team in his pocket.
Was a bit rich partly blaming Bottas for stopping slightly short in his pit box though, it’s not as though that’s a regular cause of rounding a wheelnut.
Can’t help feeling desperately sorry for Ricciardo too right now. Him moving to McLaren seemed like a dream move three months ago, it won’t be lost on McLaren that they let Sainz go to Ferrari where he finished ahead of Norris on Sunday and that Ricciardo has a three year contract. They have to find a way to get Ricciardo to gel with the car, especially as we’ve another street circuit coming up in a fortnight.
Yeah I thought that was very interesting that Wolff named Bottas. We see drivers miss the marks by small amounts* all the time and I've never seen that happen before. Seems like there's a bit of a souring of relationships with Bot and Merc.
Ricciardo/Mclaren is a strange one. He was there or thereabouts with Max at RB and seemed to get good results out of the Renault once they sorted the aero out. Norris said he thinks Sainz was better at adapting his driving style to the car, maybe it's just that. I wonder if they have/will try swapping the cars temporarily to see if there is a problem with his.
* some more than others 😁
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Aye, they've ***ed it good n proper. Looks like nit-picking to me but I'd guess the wheel nut guy hit the button before he had decent spline engagement? Any Hollowtech II user knows this is a rookie error
"Formula One wheel guns spin at 10,000 rpm and have 3,000 newton meters of torque, so they go off with a real kick" - that would do it
The street circuit in 2 weeks time is a very different kettle of fish to Monaco though, isn't it. Supposedly the advantage Ferrari had at Monaco is because they are actually quite good in tight, twisty tracks where there is no long straight drag, where they are down on pace. Given that there is a honking long straight past the pits in Baku I would not be expecting to see the Ferraris as strong as they were this weekend.
Agree that it seems a bit harsh on Bottas for the wheel nut on Sunday - the mechanics have to be able to adjust their position as we regularly see drivers miss the perfect stopping point. Feel a bit for him as he was at least hanging onto 2nd at the time and you would expect him to have been able to stay there for the rest of the race and bring some good points in for the team. Where Bottas has a problem now is the other teams getting stronger. Merc are getting to the point where they need a strong racing number 2 driver. Bottas is usually very quick over 1 lap but all too often he disappears in the race and is consequently not in an optimal position to capitalise on issues or mistakes ahead of him. Merc being quite dominant these past few years has meant there wasn't quite so much pressure on him. This season is different. Not even sure he would get a seat back at Williams next year if Russell is indeed the one to get the Merc nod.
Toto putting the blame on to Bottas for his wheel nut fiasco
He's not though is he. Wolff has said, there's lots of reasons why stuff like this happens, the wheel nut material, understanding why it behaved like it did, Bottas not stopping in the right place was just one more reason.
F1 2021 – spoilers here
thols2
Free MemberThe Merc doesn’t work its tyres as aggressively as the Red Bull and other cars. That makes it harder to get the tyres warmed up for qualifying. The Monaco circuit is easy on tyres because of the low speeds and smooth surface so Merc tried to set the cars up to work the tyres more aggressively to get them up to temperature for qualifying. Hamilton wanted them to go further with that approach, that’s why he was upset. However, that left them with much higher tyre wear. Both Bottas and Hamilton had to pit early because their tyres were getting quite badly worn. That’s why Bottas started dropping back from Verstappen, even though Verstappen wasn’t pushing hard. Merc simply didn’t have any choice but to undercut, the overcut was not an option for them. All Verstappen had to do was cruise around and wait for the Mercs to pit then put in some fast laps.
Missed this post.
Hamilton's tyres still had plenty of life left, in fact if you listen to his team radio you'd hear that he'd been tyre saving to go long, then they stopped him first out of all the cars in the race.
It's not often that Mercedes have a shocker of a race, but when it happens they go all in.
I had to chuckle at the Mazepin/Leclerc meme. Savage.
I think Baku will see a reversal in form. Despite being street circuits Baku and Monaco couldn't really be more different.
Baku actually has the highest top speed of any track in F1 (although Monza is very close) and there are two good overtaking spots on the lap. It generally provides pretty entertaining racing as opposed to Monaco's high speed procession.
It basically a Mercedes track
Baku is normally a decent race too, I'm sure there's been a few interesting moments there. Isn't it where Ricciardo and Verstappen tangled?
And Hamilton/Vettel.
Hamilton’s tyres still had plenty of life left
I think they looked at Bottas' tyres and that concerned them. Also, even though Hamilton could have gone longer than Bottas, he still wouldn't have been able to overcut the other teams. Gasly, Vettel, and Perez just had to sit there and wait for Hamilton to pit so I think Merc decided that they might as well try for an undercut on their own terms rather than having to sit there and respond to others. It was a shambles, but the fundamental problem was just that the Merc is not well suited to that circuit.
I kind of assumed they figured Gasly’s pace was costing them too much and they had to roll the dice on an undercut, because it didn’t make any sense at all from any other angle. The problem with that particular roll of the dice, I think, was that they had two dice to roll and were hoping to get 13.
It basically a Mercedes track
Let us not forget the Red Bull Limbo wing...
Let us not forget the Red Bull Limbo wing…
My guess is that the flexy wing doesn't make as big a difference as Merc and McLaren are claiming but they see an opportunity to distract Red Bull and Ferrari and make them redesign their wings instead of working on other things, hence the threat of protests. I do think Merc have a point about the rear wings, but Merc and everyone else seem to have fairly flexy front wings too so I think it's more about throwing up obstacles than a matter of principle.
I'm curious how they got it on the truck with the wheel still on? They're normally so tight they travel with space-saver type tyres on.
Took the suspension off?
the-muffin-man
I’m curious how they got it on the truck with the wheel still on? They’re normally so tight they travel with space-saver type tyres on.
Brimmed the tank & drove it back? 🙂