[Closed] Exercise related "Over-training"... please share your knowledge and experiences.

If that's how you feel about spreadsheets you should start an inane thread about exercise or diet or something?

If that's how you feel about spreadsheets

No, I'm quite enthusiastic really...I've just overdone it today.

TSY.

Found something....

Do you want me to post here or PM you ?.

'pends what it is Solo? Is it a linky to SSF stuff?

I've PM'd you.

Yes, its what you asked for.
Please play nice.

Nice one, ta... now about Paleo 😉

[i]Please play nice. [/i]

Now, wrt the SSF mail.

Are you [i]buying[/i] that ?.
Genuine Q.
(Sorry, don't want to hi-jack your thread)

My week currently looks like

Monday - 2 hours Muay Thai (padwork only)
Tuesday - 3 hours MMA (padwork, BJJ and sparring)
Wednesday - 1 hour Muay Thai (padwork only)
Thursday - 1 hour boxing, 2 hours MMA (padwork, BJJ and sparring)
Friday - 1 hour circuits
Saturday - 1 hour sparring, 1 hour boxing, 1 hour strength and conditioning
Sunday - 2-3 hour bike ride

I use a foam roller 2-3 times a week along with some other stretching stuff. Every 4 weeks or so I'll go for a full body massage.

No signs of overtraining here.

Sorry, don't want to hi-jack your thread

's ok Solo...he does it to everybody else's 😐

I think that it makes a lot of sense. The 16 hour fasting thing is interesting... means I've got to eat my last meal today, sometime around now to have a pure fat burning swim tomorrow morning.

I think the most interesting thing is the difference between men and women and it does make me wonder if I should start tailoring the advice I give the mrs and possibly (heaven forbid) start accepting her opinion a bit more. 😕

DD - as part of "the contract", Article 27:J, I have to start endless threads that can ultimately be about anything to keep me within my limits for posting nonsense on other peoples threads.

TSY.

The difference between Chicks and Dudes was pointed out also, by iDave and his diet.
IIRC, he said that the Ladies are expected to get to around 15-18 percent BF ?, on the initial diet.
However, I stress IIRC, as iDave normally rocks up and corrects me.

What I found most fascinating was the chemical model for locking / unlocking fat from its cells.

I'm really not sure what application this info has for you.
Aren't you super lean now anyway ?.

[i]DD - as part of "the contract", Article 27:J, I have to start endless threads that can ultimately be about anything to keep me within my limits for posting nonsense on other peoples threads. [/i]

Isn't there a mandatory EU quoter for that ?.

Yeah, I know women aren't (or shouldn't be) looking to get as lean as blokes but it's the strategy required for getting to the goal I'm interested in.

I've not read the link to his book as it's not working here.

I'm really not sure what application this info has for you

Genuinely... I'm just interested in it all. My metabolism has gone pretty mental of late, I don't know if it'll stay this way, whether it's complete luck or if there's a science behind it all that I'm yet to fully appreciate.

FWIW... bar all the cake I've been topping up my diet with this year, my staple meals probably aren't dissimilar to your own... even making scotch eggs this week a la Heston though.

Tentatively goes to search out Heston Blooming-Heck's recipe

If you think you're "over training" you're just training badly 😆

Solo - http://www.channel4.com/4food/recipes/chefs/heston-blumenthal/scotch-eggs-recipe

[i]If you think you're "over training" you're just training badly[/i]

I'm not really sure I understand this training stuff, yet alone competition.

I know I've got to get my pumper going occassionally.

But, ultimately.
Isn't competition just a demonstration of the genes you were born with ?.

TSY.

Aye, found it.
Bit of extra faff, compared to the ones I make and obviously being an iPedant, I miss out the bread crumbs.
😳

Never thought people insisted on the yolk still being liquidus.
😯

EDIT:

TSY.
I sent you more SSF stuff.
Just the 2nd part.

Wunundred 😀

compared to the ones I

I'll have a read. The Mrs is very lean too, but her view on intermittent fasting is different to mine. I hope you haven't jsut helped her win an argument... 😉

Solo - Member

I'm not really sure I understand this training stuff

You need to differentiate between exercising and training, if there's no end-point or goal, it's not training.

[i]Link...?[/i]

[url] http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-scotch-eggs/ [/url]
😐

Not to be confused with Cave eggs...

EDIT:
[i]I hope you haven't jsut helped her win an argument[/i]

What was / is your view ?.

Fast whilst you sleep, exercise and eat within 2 hours of waking.

Mainly because I become an irritable bastard after much more time without food.

[i]You need to differentiate between exercising and training, if there's no end-point or goal, it's not training.[/i]

That'll be it then.
Thank you.
🙂

I have no competative goal, no event to enter and [i]win[/i].

Obviously I'd just lose and by doing so, demonstrate that I was born with inferior genes to the fitness dreadlord who beat me.

[i]Mainly because I become an irritable bastard after much more time without food. [/i]

I have noticed a change in mood when I become properly hungry and can't help wondering if thats Grehlin related.

I've always called it a sugar low...

Solo - Member
I have no competative goal, no event to enter and win.

So just "normal exercise" then,
mix up what you do, when you do it, rest when tired and have fun 😀

Oh, and remember to start a forum thread every time you visit the gym, have a swim, ride a bike or eat some cake......

Oh, and remember to start a forum thread every time you visit the gym, have a swim, ride a bike or eat some cake......

This is very important. You can start them after running too. Or visiting the loo. Or just when bored.

[i]I've always called it a sugar low... [/i]

I'd attibute that to bonking or feeling generally lethargic, esp after exercise.
I think this will be when the glycogen is depleted.
No glycogen, no ATP ?.

Grhelin release is in response to an empty stomach (different signal), not sure its blood sugar related / senstitive.
Being a hormone, it can have an effect on thought, temprement ?.

So, eating something low GI, may maintain a low insulin level and allow the process described in the mail to subsist ?.

Where as eating something high GI will produce the insulin response I'm learning about ?.

Just an idea.

The Southern Yeti - Member

This is very important.

Of course; if no-one knows you've done it, it doesn't count 🙂

Solo - my reference to 'sugar low' was more a tribute to my own and more general ignorance... I don't get them half as frequently eating a more sensible low GI diet.

Hilldodger... you should be grateful you're not on the other forum I go on. I start threads there about the fact that I've started threads here*.

*This is a lie. I don't cheat on STW.

[i]So just "normal exercise" then,
mix up what you do, when you do it, rest when tired and have fun

Oh, and remember to start a forum thread every time you visit the gym, have a swim, ride a bike or eat some cake......
[/i]

😆

Yes.
I have a routine.
Bike in the gym, aerobic activity.
Then some resistance work in the form of weights.

So, back OT, I have an ache in my right shoulder, sort of a cross between cramp and as if I've pulled something.
AND
I have slight discomfort on the outside of my left elbow.

Am I injured through over / incorrect training ?.

Seriously, I have my gym kit in the car.
Should I go to the gym tonight in light of ^^^

If I do need to rest.
How is that controlled ? wrt to limitation of movements and duration of rest period ?.

When do you feel the pain in your elbow?

I used to have something similar... notice it most if carrying a heavy shopping basket.

Trained through it and starting using a trolley instead.

Have you considered just doing legs tonight?

Solo - Member
So, back OT, I have an ache in my right shoulder, sort of a cross between cramp and as if I've pulled something.
AND
I have slight discomfort on the outside of my left elbow.

Should I go to the gym tonight

Go, just do some legwork and/or core so you're not stressing the injury...

[i]When do you feel the pain in your elbow?[/i]

Going a bit mad with Curls perhaps ?
.

[i]legwork and/or core[/i]

I always hit the gym bikes.
I do not want to increase the size of my leg muscles though.
I set the machine to 10 out of 25, on the resistance.
Spin at anywhere around 80 - 100.
HRM is very suspect on these machines, so try to go by feel.
Do between 30 - 60 mins, more 60 mins lately.

You won't grow massive legs doing some light leg work...

Just do body weight stuff this evening.

Deep squats.
Lunges.
Step Ups
Step Downs.
Explosive Jumps
And a load of core stuff... you'll be all good and the additional range of motion you move your legs through will be great for you.

I was going to guess at bicep curls... ditch them. Waste of time IMO.

[i]I was going to guess at bicep curls... ditch them. Waste of time IMO.[/i]

...... Now you put it like that, theres not much reason.
Its true.
😯

OK, I'm off then to see if I can actually get to use any of this equipment.
Some people seem to do about 6 sets on one exercise and take over an hour, while also chatting 🙁

Just ask them if you can use the machine between sets.

If they say no. Touch their bum.

Oi Yeti I want a word with You 👿

I just logged off to go home Tazzy, seeing as it's you, I'm back... what do you want? 5 mins and I'm out of here only got to send back some comments on a presentation see...

I tried your Idea of "make up sex" from the belly fat thread.......It's rubbish I've now got this

[img] http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTMXflFurEJXVyfSwneVpO2jXXYyljg_RGGJ6-m6HbQ8wzGAN4UOYPNyfoIbQ [/img]

stuck up my

[img] [/img]

It's the last time I listen to your bloomin advice!!

😆 x4 Great minds! I was thinking something similar when I typed it!

Just tell the Dr you slipped, and be thankful it's not the sort that's attached to a dog.

LOL. FOOL!! xx

edit: why would a dog have a sheriff badge unless it's

[img] [/img]

which is wrong on many levels!

Bye x x

[i]the belly fat thread[/i]

Groans

No, don't go there.

[img] [/img]

How did your visit to the gym go last night Solo?

Day off for me today.

Is that in the spreadsheet Darcy?

Is that in the spreadsheet Darcy?

Oh yes. 😀

my deltiods felt over trained this morning. but its worth it because i'm wearing a top today that i bought as a "only when you're looking good enough" motivational gift for myself. it cost me £2.95 from a charity shop so i'm pleased i haven't wasted my money and finally am able to wear it 😀

TSY, DD.

Good morning chaps.
🙂

Gym, was very busy.
I joined around Sept Last year.
I watched as the gym got busier around Xmad.
When I guess people were [i]burning off[/i] Their Dietary endulgences.

The gym then went slightly quieter through to Feb, but now its gone ballistic.
I never really believed that people would think that 8 weeks in the gym will get them into shape for their Hols sometime in July or August.

Which, I assume is the reason they are there.

For me.
It was Bike then deadlifts, finished off with pull-ups.
I realize that some will look upon my 1 3/4 hrs in the gym as [i]light-weight[/i].
But I need to be home at a resonable time.
I've been in the gym until 9:30pm and I do not find this to be ideal, for me.

TSY.
How did the morning session go ?.
What did you do ?.
Are you going to try what was outlined in that stuff I sent to you ?, if so.
How long will you give it ?.

EDIT:
GM to Phil too.
🙂

my deltiods felt over trained this morning.

#ihavethestrangest

i'm wearing a top today

#ohdear

only when you're looking good enough

#aaahhhhblessedrelief

i'll send you a photo through teh facebooks deadly, do you want the pout or the "oh my god its my surprised face as i didnt know i was about to take a photo of myself" pose?

Morning solo, 1 3/4hours is more than i do at the gym, apart from spinning i dont do any cardio at the gym... its basically:

monday - 30 mins weights, 30 mins stretching
tuesday - 10 minutes weights, spinning
wednesday - 30 mins weights, 30 mins stretching
thursday - 10 minutes weights, spinning
friday - 30 mins weights, 30 mins stretching

i dont give my upper body any rest days during the week, thats what weekends are for. the rest of my cardio is from riding 2-3 times a week with friends

so you probably do more in one gym session that i do in 3!

I pushed myself a bit harder last night at the gym and did a few more press ups in a T position and am a bit sore this morning.

On my training plan tonight is either unstructured jumps or a tempo time trial which sounds erm, interesting - a 20minute warm up then 3 miles with hr 10b below zone5a. Got the women's road race championships on Sunday so i shall mostly be doing active recovery and or resting after tonight 8)

Phil.

Intriuged by the order of exercise.

I do my cardio stuff, Bike, first.
Then move weights.
I note you are doing the reverse.

Is there any significance ?.

When I get to exercise, Fasted.
I'm thinking that the bike will see the body have to run on the glycogen, which may have a knock-on effect on any stored BF ?.

I was advised not to exercise the same muscle group on consecutive days.
So, one day might be chest and shoulders.
another might be back and biceps, or whatever.

EDIT:
[i]so you probably do more in one gym session that i do in 3[/i] 😳

In mitigation, until very recently I have been without a bike.
But I now have the TCR and I have just completed a new build.
So I should be getting more road miles from now on.

I try to use the bike for all trips possible.
When the weather improves I'll be bringing the bike to work and when I go shopping, I want to leave the car at home and take the pushy as I use to when I lived in Norwich.

I'm in meetings all day so I'll be brief..

Solo 1 3/4 hours is longer than I do in the gym for a normal session.

I was going to go for a swim in the lake this morning but the frost on my windscreen put me right off the idea so did an hour in the pool instead.

solo, not sure why philly does his in that order but years ago i used to do weights and then spinning or a run. I wanted to get the most out of my weights session so i did it first when i was fresh. Now i'm trying to fit in more of my training plan, i'd still do it that way round.

I over-train my mushroom tip regularly.

Nice to see Solo staying true to form and still talking crap.

Solo - I read some stuff on the effects of cardio and resistance training on certain hormones that accelerate and inhibit the benefits of the two.... I've forgotten it so I'll have to dig it out.

I think you're better off doing it the way Phil does unless you can allow for a significant rest period between the two.

Dirty the Tempo TT is part of the Chris Carmichael training program... for Advanced level as a guy the 3 miles needs to be done in under 8 mins.

[i]Solo - I read some stuff on the effects of cardio and resistance training on certain hormones that accelerate and inhibit the benefits of the two.... I've forgotten it so I'll have to dig it out.

I think you're better off doing it the way Phil does unless you can allow for a significant rest period between the two.
[/i]

Yes, I am interested.
Anything you can provide will be read, ta.
🙂

the weights before spinning is purely down to timings, gym opens at 06:30, spinning runs from 6:45 to 7:35-40ish, i need to be on the road on the way to work essentially before we've finished stretching after spinning so the only way i can fit in any weights is before hand, no theory or science behind it, just timing really 🙂

i exercise exactly the same muscles 5 mornings in a row, but its only 1 set of reps on the spinning mornings. i focus on protein a LOT in my diet and sleep is important, if anything the 2 day rest over the weekend makes the weights more challenging come monday morning. i'm not looking to bulk up with resistance training, its all about strengthening my back and shoulders, promoting a healthy metabolism to counteract a relatively sedentary day job and improving my core strength. for example i've never once done a bicep curl and dont do any weights to focus on my arms, only deltiods and the various back muscles.

i understand the theory behind rest days, but the way i look at it is if my job involved lifting some stuff every day i'd adapt pretty quickly, and thats what happened with the gym.

i forgot to mention, the 30 mins stretching is started with some core exercises whislt i'm in the corner on the mats like a loner 🙂

It was in a magazine... I'll try and find something online.

Re the fasting stuff... I just don't think it's for me. Suppose I could try a 16 hour fast... then eat nothing but lean protein for a day and see what happens...

Phil - you should shake up that routine!

for Advanced level as a guy the 3 miles needs to be done in under 8 mins.

Actually i've just looked at my zones and my hr only needs to be around 174...that's less than a race or the recent TT I did so maybe not that nasty after all. BTW i have some good info on hr zones i can send you if you like? Its broken down into my 7 zones (what they are) plus what happens to your body/fuel burnt etc during each zone.

[i][b]i'm not looking to bulk up [/b]with resistance training, its all about strengthening my back and shoulders, promoting a healthy metabolism to counteract a relatively sedentary day job and improving my core strength[/i]

Me too.
When I first went to the gym, I was surprized how little weight I could move.
So the weights are as you say, to kick the metabolism up the backside, as I too am a desk jockey.
People talk about [i]toning up[/i] and while that may not be techincally correct, I think you know what I mean.
🙂

phil, i've seen huge improvements using the TRX and also press ups into a T position. If you don't have TRX at your gym, do you have olympic rings - TSY tried some of the stuff my PT set me using olympic rings instead of the TRX and IIRC it worked just as well.

Yep send it over Dirty...

IIRC it was a min and half / 2 mins down for a girl.

Essentail was picking a flat 3 miles, relatively free from traffic. You need to know the wind direction / temperature any other conditions that may impact and try and recreate the TT under the same conditions in 4 or so weeks time.

perfect timing, walked over to the mats to do my core/stretching routine this morning and walked straight into a set of olympic rings that had appeared from nowhere 🙂 i'd need to ask the gym guys to show me how to use them properly though!

agreed yeti, i do need to shake up the routine... i'm considering ways of doing so, but at that time in the morning i'm very much on autopilot and only really remind myself i need to shake it up when i'm not at the gym.

Solo, i've been in and out of gyms for the past X years with varying results, when i've tried to bulk up i've ended up taking it too far, when i've then taken a break and started at a new gym i always go in 'too big, too quickly' and shock myself at how much strength i've lost.

this time i've found the level of weights that i want to stick to (gotta make sure i still fit in my wedding suit!) so any shaking up has to mean i can maintain a size, not increase it

and also press ups into a T position

Into a side plank??

eugh, i should re-add the plank into my morning core work shouldn't i....

i dont want to be one of the guys who wanders around with a checklist, but it sounds like i might need to go that way.

with regards to upper body strength i think i'm where i want to be, goal would be to maintain it. core however can always be improved.

[i]Solo, i've been in and out of gyms for the past X years with varying results, when i've tried to bulk up i've ended up taking it too far[/i]
I haven't been to a gym for 20 yrs 😳
But when I got as far as I thought the iDiet could get me.
I then felt a desire to try some gym stuff.
A friend of mine was working on my office at the time.
He was a real gym rat.
So I just tagged along with him.
The rest is history.

[i]so any shaking up has to mean i can maintain a size, not increase it [/i]

Yes.
I can now move greater weights, but I do not think that any of the muscles are signifcantly larger.
It would seem that they have just got better at moving weights ?.
I have plateaued on the weights I select.

Fortunately, there are a few very large fellows in the gym.
I look at them as a warning how not to turn out, physically that is.

I also agree with your opinion that had I been born in a different era, I might have had a more physically demanding job.
To which I would have had to adjust.

This thread is making me tired with all he talk of training.

I'm still proper demotivated. Haven't done any intervals, tough rides, training, racing for over a month now.

Always wondered how much fitness you lose after no activity?

(Saying that I'm doing a bath crit tonight which I'm told is 30 minutes full bore racing with lots of sprints to stay on)

I need to get motivated again 🙁

[i]I need to get motivated again[/i]

I've been reading a lot of cycling books recently.
Its defo made me want to get out on the road bike.

Into a side plank??

Plank is great for core. Once you have mastered the olympic rings phil, put your feet in them and do press ups into a jack knife. My core has never been better as a result of these! Having issues linking sorry 😳

anyone tried this beetroot larky?

[url= http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22526247 ]Influence of acute dietary nitrate supplementation on 50 mile time trial performance in well-trained cyclists [/url]

[url= http://www.andjrnl.org/article/S2212-2672%2811%2901948-4/abstract ]Whole Beetroot Consumption Acutely Improves Running Performance[/url]

Yes.
I can now move greater weights, but I do not think that any of the muscles are signifcantly larger.
It would seem that they have just got better at moving weights ?.
I have plateaued on the weights I select.

my muscles have got bigger, the way i look at it is that if i'm at my limit on what i'm willing to lift then if it gets to the point where it doesnt feel like a challenge to do 3 sets of 12 reps, i need to do more reps, not add more weight.

although at present it still feels like a struggle getting through the second half of my 3rd set so i'm not rushing to add more just yet!!

I think my core is really good, partly form having to carry my kids about.

anyone tried this beetroot larky?

DG> in what way do they work?