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You actually made me laugh there! Well done
The man is an absolute embarrassment - I'm ashamed to have Brewdog 'shares'. Brewdog's HQ is around where I'm from and I've heard tales of him being a throbber.
Is this an annual BrewDog p1ss off their clientele yet again thread - I've been getting confused reading up the thread as last year's contributions was all around 13/14 Feb as well. It's all still true
how do the shares work? I mean, I own shares in various companies, and if I don't like them I can just sell them on the stock market?
And wouldn't alarm bells ring when:
Phil Halsey, 47, has invested about £2,500, in 2011.
and received freebies with monetary value, such as an all-expenses-paid trip to the annual meeting in Aberdeen.
That doesn't sound like wise use of company money for small scale shareholders? His jolly probably cost him 20% of his investment??
"If anyone owns the shares, I would recommend selling if you have the opportunity before everyone realizes the consequences of the venture capital investment"
Hopefully people heeded the advice I gave on here a couple of years ago.
From the Guardian piece
The backlash came after the loss-making “craft” beer firm confirmed that it had appointed the consultants AlixPartners to “evaluate the next phase of investment for the business”.
Love the use of "craft" in there. Bringing in Alix usually means it's flirting with bankruptcy/ break-up, right?
And given its distribution across a surprisingly large number of pubs and restaurants, why's it losing money?
weren't they a totally illiquid thing?
why's it losing money?
Falling sales
Must say I would be sad to see them go - the Brewdog pubs much like Wetherspoons keep the asshats off the streets.
why's it losing money?
I'm only guessing but I'd hazard that, fundamentally, if your business is edgy marketing for a supposedly premium product which as it turns out is actually a bit crap then there's only so long you can sustain that model before everyone gets wise to it.
weren't they a totally illiquid thing?
Ill liquid more like...
I'd be sad to see them go. I may well be the target demographic, but I'd much rather visit my local brewdog bar than 90% of the other pubs in the town. That abomination at Waterloo is a different kettle of fish though.
They've never really made any money and have been consistently loss making for the last few years and last year, as noted above, they had falling sales. They raised funds at outrageous multiplies in the pretty much unregulated crowdfunding space and made sure they cashed out significantly when PE came in.
Ah, BrewDog. I'm very conflicted. They made an arse out of purchasing a local estate, evicting workers and their families from their tied cottages and planting shitty trees to get government subsidies. I do love a can of Hazy Jane though.
They've never really made any money
It's almost as if money can be disappeared into pet projects rather than declared as profits to be taxed.
purchasing a local estate
Yeah, that sort of thing. Or private jets. You know, "costs" that are really just about enjoying your riches.
"
It's almost as if money can be disappeared into pet projects rather than declared as profits to be taxed.
It wouldn't achieve that.
Plenty of other beers to enjoy.
But with the original founders cashing out I can choose Hazy Jane without the associated guilt. Win/win for me I reckon.
I'm only guessing but I'd hazard that, fundamentally, if your business is edgy marketing for a supposedly premium product which as it turns out is actually a bit crap then there's only so long you can sustain that model before everyone gets wise to it.
But but but... it was equity for punks!
From the ultimate rebel with a cause, a bold, edgy, irreverent, uncompromising and iconoclastic brand, with a mischievous yet witty, transparent yet opinionated approach that's unlike any other drinks brand!
Not those stuffy old stockbrokers, this was a whole new paradigm - breaking the rules, taking risks and sticking it to the man! Instead of an Annual General Meeting, they had an Annual General Mayhem!! Equity for Punks was the ultimate incarnation of their philosophy!!!
Yes, I am just copying and pasting from their investment prospectus here
But that's because they're not always conventional; a mix of edgy positioning, courting controversy with an undeground vibe and a strong online presence!!! They created a new set of communication rules – The BrewDog Way!!!!
But with the original founders cashing out I can choose Hazy Jane without the associated guilt. Win/win for me I reckon.
Nah, giving money to private equity does not salve your conscience. Much rather give money to local real craft beer brewers.....
Ahh well, there goes my £95 investment donation I made after coming home from the pub, probably around 2012?
Have definitely had much more than that back in discounts over the years, when TSG bought 1/4 of the company my shares on paper might have been worth about £4.5k but I only wanted to get rid once it became clear James Watt was indeed a massive Throbber, and the opportunity never arose.
Seems my crowdfunding get-rich-quick ambitions (see also Alpkit) have been a bit underwhelming to say the least, will have to go back to AI and BAE systems I guess, probably more ethical.
I imagine they will struggle to get rid of the bars. I've called into one in Manchester a few times for a discounted burger and a free pint on my birthday, and it was always very quiet, which means lots of people will lose their jobs, which is shit.
Plenty of other beers to enjoy.
Thanks in part to Brewdog. Win win.
Falling sales
There's a Brewdog bar in Berlin (they moved production to Berlin to get around Brexit import tax, I think) that is heaving.
Told my ****y Berlin mates what a shitshow Brewdog are and refused to go in there. Ended up in some Irish pub.
I'm more upset about rumours of Overtone's demise, although thus far it's just one Facebook post from someone claiming to be in the know, and a Herald article based entirely on said post 🙄
Big shame what happened to them although last orders should've been called long ago. They were a truly excellent, groundbreaking brewery in their early days, especially in the realm of imperial stouts which no-one else in the UK was really doing at the time (certainly not as well). If you only heard about them after they started selling in supermarkets you'd probably not know anything about that though! That was probably the start of the decline. Of course, founder JW was probably a bellend the whole time but this wasn't generally known back then (at least by me!)
Tried to grow too fast (what other brewer has gone from nothing to opening up international bars worldwide in exotic/expensive locations in less than 20 years?) and focused on quantity over quality of beer. Their best stuff is the oldest stuff - Punk and Hazy. Some of the absolute filth they've produced though should rightly condemn the company. A few years on the bounce I bought/got bought their advent calendar. Some nice stuff, some drinkable and some absolute monsters - there was a Palma Violets thing that me and my mates still joke about now.
Anyway, shame the bar in York closed down as it was on my way in/out of town. I'm not anal about my beers or who makes them so I'd be sad if I never had a Punk/Hazy ever again but there are plenty of other decent beers out there which I hope find their way into my local Tesco in place of the huge Brewdog section full of 80% filth.
Ah, BrewDog. I'm very conflicted. They made an arse out of purchasing a local estate, evicting workers and their families from their tied cottages and planting shitty trees to get government subsidies. I do love a can of Hazy Jane though.
Evicted tenants' tears are actually the secret ingredient that makes Hazy Jane so tasty
there was a Palma Violets thing that me and my mates still joke about now
That was appalling. Utterly disgusting. But there was a time , before all the stuff about Jamie being an absolute arse became public, when they were genuinely exciting. B-Corp, carbon neutral, punks - and some decent beers (5am Saint a particular favourite of mine). So sad to see it all fall apart like this.
which I hope find their way into my local Tesco in place of the huge Brewdog section full of 80% filth.
This, along with the falling sales, will be where the money is being lost. That big wall of Brewdog in the supermarket comes at a cost. It's not a mark of consumer demand, it paid position. Supermarkets make around 10% of their income not from selling to customers but from charging suppliers for giving them prominence.
So Brewdog will have been paying for that shelf space (which seem to keep getting more and more prominent, they're sort of branded shrines now) but Brewdog also then also need to fill the shelves. Colgate do the same thing - theres a baffling array of different colgate toothpastes all of which are somehow both 'total' and also seemingly having something extra, basically different arrangements of superlatives and metallic foils and graphics of stripes on slightly size boxes - but really they exist for no other reason than to fill up so much shelf space you don't notice their competiton. But the key difference - its all toothpaste and tastes like toothpaste - people can just imagine they perform in a way that suits them specifically if they like, but they'll largely just buy what they always buy and all the other stuff doesnt matter
Brewdog has similarly created a situation for itself where it has to come up with as many novel variations on a can of beer as possible to fill the space they are paying for, all with witty names to fit their brand, just to fill out the shelves. But most of those will be, at best, and acquired taste and more typically quite grim. But they all exist for the purpose of crowding out competition and fill the shelves they're paying for. Most people would really buy the two or three core beers and those sales would have been making all the shelf-stuffing weird stuff pay off, right up to the point when they started giving their customers reasons to look at other shelves.
It’s the reduction in quality that got to me - punk, hazy and elvis were a decent spread early on but they’re all thin and insipid now, and there are much better alternatives - i thank them for shaking up the market though - it needed it
I hadn't realised they'd expanded so far into running actual pubs - given how many pubs are closing each month around the country, that's clearly not a way to stay financially comfortable
This, along with the falling sales, will be where the money is being lost.
Brewdog sales haven't fallen - they're still (slightly) in growth - it's just not enough to counteract the losses from over-ambitious expansion (opening loads of bars - now closed - in India for example) and most significantly the insane levels of interest they have to pay to the private equity group they sold out to in 2017 (how punk 🤣), who despite only paying for 22% of the company at the time now effectively control everything as they are, due to the interest, owed the same or more as the total valuation of Brewdog!
Some might say that was a terrible business deal, but the two founders walked away with over £100M (in actual cash) so I guess not (for them). The other shareholders - including crowdfunders & staff who were gifted £100M in shares by way of "apology" for the company/founders shitty behaviour - will get nothing, of course.
This, along with the falling sales, will be where the money is being lost.
Some might say that was a terrible business deal, but the two founders walked away with over £100M (in actual cash) so I guess not (for them). The other shareholders - including crowdfunders & staff who were gifted £100M in shares by way of "apology" for the company/founders shitty behaviour - will get nothing, of course.
That's not quite true. At the time shareholders could sell 15% of their shares at the deal valuation or get some free beer.
Some of the absolute filth they've produced though should rightly condemn the company.
Lost Lager 🤮
Rubbish!
I visit half a dozen of those on the list on a regular ish basis. Such a shame for the staff.
£33M is all they got.....not the £2Bn bandied around not so long ago.....
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2026/mar/02/brewdog-us-cannabis-drinks-500-jobs
FT taking a dim view of things too.....
That's a real shame. I visited the one in the Glasgow Merchant City pretty regularly. The staff were lovely and it was kid and dog friendly too.
I can’t read the FT link as it is behind the paywall, but I am not sure what the FT has got to gripe about. Whilst it is a surprise how bad a position they are in - the valuation suggests there is no part of the business that is viable without additional investment, they are paying assets values. What is not a surprise is the “equity for punks” have ended up with very little. This was pretty much inevitable as soon as the TSG deal happened and was obvious at that time for anyone who did a modicum of due diligence. When the deal was announced, I was stunned Brewdog was being valued at £1 billion, I had always been very critical of the valuations that they issued equity at to small investors, but this valuation suggested they were reasonable so I looked at the deal. The 18% preference that TSG’s shares were entitled to in addition to the other rights which they shared with the other shareholders wasn’t difficult to find. Brewdog wasn’t being valued at £1 billion because the shares without the preference were clearly worth an awful lot less, how much less is a difficult question, but considering Brewdog were only making £1 million a year at the time and they would need to make £36 million a year before the non preference shareholders became entitled any share of profits, there was a very high risk the other equity holders would get diluted out. Unfortunately no financial journalist bothered to look at the deal, including the FT - who finally twigged last year - and it was widely reported Brewdog was a £1 billion company, when it never was.
Note to future investors in anything... if you can't buy the shares on the open stock market, you're not really buying shares, you're just making a donation to the company.
no, lots of genuine investment is done in unlisted companies in return for shares. But if you have no mechanism to sell those shares they are worthless! If they are a different class of share from other shareholders then alarm bells should ring (may still not be automatically crazy).Note to future investors in anything... if you can't buy the shares on the open stock market, you're not really buying shares, you're just making a donation to the company.