[Closed] Everyone been out to vote then?

later couple over here in Wales , lacking in choice some what 😐

I did my duty too after dropping the kids at school. Polling station was deserted, different from the last time when I had to queue for ages.
You strike me as a Yes man TJ

Who wants to guess / know how I voted?

Monster Raving Pink Wafer?

😉

NO to pink wafers! 👿

You voted Tory didn't you. All this Alex Salmond SNP cheerleading is just a front to hide your deep-seated, lifelong admiration for Thatcher. And you're quietly ecstatic at Call-me-Dave is continuing her legacy

And you voted No to AV to see the Tory hegemony continued indefinitely

I'm right aren't I?

Yeah - Postal vote last week, three votes but did not get involved with the Welsh Assembly one, foregone conclusion on AV it would seem from the polls.

Did you vote Yes to AV as your first choice, and No to AV as your second?

🙂

We had three votes each by post. I filled out the AV one but intentionally spoiled my paper for the borough and parish elections. No one has made any effort to inform me what they do or why I should give them my support. The wife and I spend an evening searching the web to try and find something out about these people and there was nothing. The few bits of paper that have been shoved through the door were all of the "vote for us because we're not the other lot and they did this and that and the other". We wanted to make an informed choice but that's pretty difficult without information.

Aye, postal vote already sent some days ago.

[img] [/img]

Who wants to guess / know how I voted?

FWIW I'll never vote.

Onzadog - Same here as well local elections a none event this time although i voted for the same bloke in the Parish one as last time as i felt he deserved another term.

Just had the Jehovas Witnesses at the door. I asked them if they had voted. They don't vote!

I suggested that voting for a change in the voting system wasn't the same as voting for a particular party.

They didn't see it.

Went on to discuss whether they would take part in politics to get rid fo a dictator (they wouldn't) or vote against Mugabe (they wouldn't). Neither were they prepared to express a preference for who we should put in charge of keeping the roads mended and the sewers clean. Apparently it will all happen spontaneously once God has established his own government on earth.

I voted Yes, but ironically I suspect that it was a "wasted vote" - no disrespect to anyone who has made a principled decision to vote No, but I suspect that the majority of the population are too stupid/apathetic/lazy/fearful for the Yes vote to win.

My wife is a teacher and was discussing AV with her colleagues yesterday (you would have thought a reasonably thoughtful bunch) - one of them said that she didn't know enough about poilitics to be able to rank all the parties, another said that you would get 5 votes under AV - honestly, it seems we do indeed deserve the Governments that we get.

GW,

Do you want me to run through the arguments I put to the Jehovas Witnesses?

Are you one?

I postal voted last week. Yes to AV. Somewhat limited choice on the local elections - Greens, UKIP or conservatives. I voted for the person that I know (was in the same class at school as his younger brother, and he's only a few years older), hopefully he won't have been spoilt by too much party politics!

was that today then? oh.

Voting simply gives credibility to a system that is fundamentaly flawed in its philosophy and application.

The argument is that without voting you cannot affect change, the reality is that the vote you cast has no value and means nothing.

The only real change in this world will be made by those willing to put in the effort and who embrace a different philosophy from systematic incompetence and social delusionment 😯

In short politics is a load of shite and all you are doing is wasting your time.

Money/resources governed by competent innovative individuals is what our species requires, not more talk or idiotic delusional nonsense!

Have a nice day! 😀

very sadly ironic that a vote on electoral reform is in itself a first past the post vote, very cynical that government have decided to offer a poor form of proportional representation as the only available option thus guaranteeing safe seats for the future

Money/resources governed by competent innovative individuals is what our species requires, not more talk or idiotic delusional nonsense!

Riiiiiiiiiight.

So basically every man/woman/child for themselves and **** anyone that doesn't have money/resources.

Yeah, you're right - that sounds like a much better system 🙄

I don't see how you could run a referendum which has a 'yes' or 'no' answer on anything other than first past the post.

What did you have in mind?

yes I fought my way through the crowds wishing to influence parliamentary democracy and placed my vote with all the other throng of passionate people

very sadly ironic that a vote on electoral reform is in itself a first past the post vote

There are only two choices: Yes or No

You can consider it an AV vote if you like - if your first choice doesn't get in then your second will be considered 😀

I think I may have just committed electoral fraud. I took my 14mth old grandson in with me, so he could witness a momentus political event in the making.

He doesn't half love crayons, so I let him do a couple of Xs on the ballot form.

[i]What did you have in mind? [/i]

More options. As the second half of the post fairly clearly implies.

[i]There are only two choices: Yes or No[/i]

He means you could have an AV vote for FPTP, AV, PR etc...

GW,

Do you want me to run through the arguments I put to the Jehovas Witnesses?

Are you one?

Kaesae - if you'd kept that wee rant shorter I'd have had to agree with you 😯
😉

Ooh I must do that before I bugger off for the weekend.

I voted yes to AV. Can't afford to upgrade to HDMI at the moment.

And you can bet your boots that any time reform is mentioned from now on the Tories will be saying:

"The electorate were given the opportunity for voting reform and have clearly chosen FPTP as the voting system for this country for all of eternity."

"[i]Voting simply gives credibility to a system that is fundamentaly flawed in its philosophy and application.[/i]"

Voting simply gives respect to the countless people who, over the centuries, have argued, fought and died to win political power for the population as a whole, rather than just the privileged elite, and represents support for that as an evolving process. We as a population continue to debate voting reform as a way of seeking better representation of the views of that population. This is a key part of that process.

The idea that you gain some sort of intellectual or moral high ground by abstaining is frankly absurd, certainly unless you have a better system which you are actively fighting to see implemented. And if you do then you'd be well advised to vote for pretty much any electoral reform that's on the table in order to make your point that you dislike the status quo.

He means you could have an AV vote for FPTP, AV, PR etc...

We have a Tory majority coalition government. I reckon you'd have more chance of seeing every cabinet member parading through the streets of London naked than that option ever being put to the electorate

Bez - Member
There are only two choices: Yes or No

He means you could have an AV vote for FPTP, AV, PR etc

correct that is what i meant

[i]We have a Tory majority coalition government. I reckon you'd have more chance of seeing every cabinet member parading through the streets of London naked than that option ever being put to the electorate [/i]

Oh, I agree. And PR is a massively different system anyway, whereas AV is highly compatible with the existing electoral infrastructure, so I don't think it's a reasonable option in the short term.

But I was just clarifying the point.

As an aside, can someone explain to me why in this day and age we have to either physically go to a Polling Station (on a work day) or remember to register for a Postal Vote in advance and then send it off before the debates are complete?

Surely some boffin can devise a way for these shiny computery things to transmit information to each other and allow us to communicate our votes through some form of inter-connected network, or [i]"internet"[/i]?

I never bothered reading all the other AV threads. I presume it's already been pointed out that David Cameron got to be Tory leader via an AV system?

I am not around and I didn't register for postal ballot, I didn't even know it was happening soon enough.

Anyone planning on abstaining want to vote Yes for me?

Labour and NO

GW,

Basically what I said to the Jehovas Witnesses was the last para of Bez's last (edit: second last) comment, though not so eloquently.

But it's not too late to change your mind - get out there and vote!

Surely some boffin can devise a way for these shiny computery things to transmit information to each other and allow us to communicate our votes through some form of inter-connected network, or "internet"?

I think Sony have implemented something like that.

"[i]As an aside, can someone explain to me why in this day and age we have to either physically go to a Polling Station (on a work day) or remember to register for a Postal Vote in advance and then send it off before the debates are complete?[/i]"

Because those options are readily accessible to more people in the country than the Internet is. Plus the "if it ain't broke" argument.

Flipside: Can someone explain to me why in this day and age, when transport is easier and more accessible than it has ever been, people object to having to actually go somewhere which is probably roughly one mile from their homes in order to have their say in the running of the country? Or why in this day and age, when information is more readily available and filterable than ever and many people have devices which can tell you to do things at certain times, people can't be bothered to remember to sign up to have their say in the running of the country?

I mean, I'm with you, Internet voting would be nice - but it's not like you've got to trek 20 miles barefoot and hand-carve your vote in a tablet of granite.

I presume it's already been pointed out that David Cameron got to be Tory leader via an AV system?

no because you are wrong, it was Ed who was elected due to second/ third/ fourth preferences

the tory system is a series of FPTP ballots with an ever diminishing number of candidates. hence the electorate can review who to vote for at each stage

HTH

I voted yes to AV. Can't afford to upgrade to HDMI at the moment.

😛

That explains what I've been doing wrong. Sitting here all morning hitting the AV button on the remote but it still didn't register a vote.

Haven't voted as I'm 220 miles away from my polling station and card. Bloody work.

Bez - Member

............whereas AV is highly compatible with the existing electoral infrastructure,..........

In scotland we already use two different forms of PR with no great problems.

some great answers chaps - gave me a few chuckles
[size=18][b][u]Vote pink wafer!!!!![/u][/b][/size]

rightplacerighttime - if you are referring to any of this:

The idea that you gain some sort of intellectual or moral high ground by abstaining is frankly absurd, certainly unless you have a better system which you are actively fighting to see implemented. And if you do then you'd be well advised to vote for pretty much any electoral reform that's on the table in order to make your point that you dislike the status quo.

Did I mention any of that shit (sorry Bez)?

still interested to hear what arguments you put to the nice polite (but sadly deluded) Jehova's witnesses

going later because the polling station is IN THE PUB

vote beer mmmmmm!

no because you are wrong, it was Ed who was elected due to second/ third/ fourth preferences

the tory system is a series of FPTP ballots with an ever diminishing number of candidates. hence the electorate can review who to vote for at each stage

HTH

Not really. Looks like AV with people just putting their crosses on the paper each time.

Looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, waddles like a duck and has the work 'duck' written in large flashing lights above it.

Polling station was empty bar 2 people working (is that the right word) in there, normally vote in the evening but got today off so thought would beat the queues, last time i had to wait over an hour to put and x in a box.

Internet voting or via txt would be a great option next time round.

Did I mention any of that shit (sorry Bez)?

You asked me to run through the arguments I put to the Jehovas Witnesses.

TandemJeremy - Member

Vote pink wafer!!!!!

Always knew you were that sort of deviant. 😉

Not really. [b]Looks[/b] like AV with people just putting their crosses on the paper each time.

www.specsavers.co.uk

HTH

A Polling Stration in the pub. What an inspired idea

But if all the polling stations were in pubs, would you get possible objections from Muslim voters?

And where do Jehovah's witnesses sit on the whole pub thing?

"[i]no because you are wrong, it was Ed who was elected due to second/ third/ fourth preferences the tory system is a series of FPTP ballots with an ever diminishing number of candidates. hence the electorate can review who to vote for at each stage[/i]"

Heh. That is [i]precisely[/i] how AV works. It's just that you specify all your preferences up-front rather than on an 'as needs be' basis (which is thoroughly impractical as a national ballot).

You fill in your favourite. If your favourite goes out, you can opt to vote for one of the remaining contenders or you can walk. And so on. AV is precisely the system you describe, it just saves on time and paper.

Because those options are readily accessible to more people in the country than the Internet is. Plus the "if it ain't broke" argument.

True, but over 30 million people in the UK access the internet every day and around 75% of households have internet access. So it's not exactly a minority interest.

I'm not saying it should replace polling stations (yet), but it would be a useful addition!

I mean, I'm with you, Internet voting would be nice - but it's not like you've got to trek 20 miles barefoot and hand-carve your vote in a tablet of granite.

True, but there are already two people on this thread who haven't been able to vote for whatever reason, who probably could if we had internet voting system set up.

Surely some boffin can devise a way for these shiny computery things to transmit information to each other and allow us to communicate our votes through some form of inter-connected network, or "internet"?

Designing a system to do this would be pretty easy. Designing a [i]secret and secure[/i] system that isn't open to abuse to do this would be considerably more difficult. The simple pencil & paper system has a lot going for it. Alternatively you could register for a postal vote.

Yeah, I agree. Internet voting would, in principle, be A Good Thing.

But if all the polling stations were in pubs, would you get possible objections from Muslim voters?

Our polling station is church hall at local C of E.
Should the same question be asked?

Heh. That is precisely how AV works. It's just that you specify all your preferences up-front rather than on an 'as needs be' basis (which is thoroughly impractical as a national ballot).

You fill in your favourite. If your favourite goes out, you can opt to vote for one of the remaining contenders or you can walk. And so on. AV is precisely the system you describe, it just saves on time and paper

it's not how the tory system works, many people switch allegience in the tory leadership campaigns which is what causes all the hoopla. In the tory system your first (only) preference can change at each ballot, in AV it doesn't unless your candidate drops out in a round. A simple but fundamental difference.

of course you can continue to oversimplify if you want if it makes you happy to be right 😉

Our polling station is church hall at local C of E.
Should the same question be asked?

No.

It's no wonder we have so many problems with race relations in this country.

What do you suppose the "offence" would be?

Hmmmmmmmmmm. This raises some interesting questions. Would an alcoholic feel comfortable if the polling station was in a mosque. Indeed... would Allah mind if the alcoholic felt comfortable in the mosque?

Hmmmmmmmm... indeed.

I've already voted [u][b]NO[/b][/u].

It's no wonder we have so many problems with race relations in this country.

Not really. Looks like AV with people just putting their crosses on the paper each time.
http://www.specsavers.co.uk

HTH

Erm:

[img] ?&k=Duck[/img]

[img] [/img]

Designing a secret and secure system that isn't open to abuse to do this would be considerably more difficult. The simple pencil & paper system has a lot going for it.

Good point. Someone would need to know my address AND date of birth to fake my paper vote. Inconceivable.

Alternatively you could register for a postal vote.

I did and I used it - but it does have distinct disadvantage that you have to send it off before the public debates have finished.

"[i]many people switch allegience in the tory leadership campaigns which is what causes all the hoopla. In the tory system your first (only) preference can change at each ballot, in AV it doesn't unless your candidate drops out in a round.[/i]"

Yes. This is true. But internal party wrangling is, I rather suspect, a messy and polluted game. The two systems do differ but I disagree that it is a fundamental difference: it is entirely incidental and immaterial.

If, as should occur in a general election, the parties and candidates all set out their cases up front, then the relative merits are set. The only reason for anyone to change their preference after any given round is if the policies materially change.

If you're proposing policy changes between voting rounds then yes, there is a difference. But if there is no policy change then the benefit analysis will pan out identically each time and there is no need to build in a mechanism for people to change their mind.

Bez - Member

"no because you are wrong, it was Ed who was elected due to second/ third/ fourth preferences the tory system is a series of FPTP ballots with an ever diminishing number of candidates. hence the electorate can review who to vote for at each stage"

Heh. That is precisely how AV works. It's just that you specify all your preferences up-front rather than on an 'as needs be' basis (which is thoroughly impractical as a national ballot).

You fill in your favourite. If your favourite goes out, you can opt to vote for one of the remaining contenders or you can walk. And so on. AV is precisely the system you describe, it just saves on time and paper.

dont think this is correct- only the second choice [i]of those who voted for the least popular candidate[/i] gets counted, not eveybody's second choice- a fundamental difference.

would Allah mind if the alcoholic felt comfortable in the mosque?

Allah, could not, would not mind or not mind. You cannot attribute human characteristics to Allah

Not yet. Will be voting SNP, SNP and YES when I do go though.

You cannot attribute human characteristics to [s]Allah[/s] a non-existent fairy

You are right there as well, Woppit. Mark this day in your diaries!

A sort of AV system then 🙂

I did and I used it - but it does have distinct disadvantage that you have to send it off before the public debates have finished.

Not true. You can take it along to the polling station on the day.

Calling Allah a fairy? You'll be drawing cartoons next 😉

Boom, boom, shake shake the etc... 🙂

The simple pencil & paper system has a lot going for it.

At the same time I'm not convinced that it is a secure system, there's no ID check and no requirement to take your poll card with you.

I know during the last general election some people who were EU nationals got a vote because they'd not declared their nationality on the electoral register. It was only when I was discussing how the OH didn't get a vote that they realised they shouldn't have either!

Not true. You can take it along to the polling station on the day.

Brilliant - yes true, I could register for a postal vote and then effectively avoid the whole point of it by traipsing to polling station anyway!

Alternatively why can't the "postal vote" just give me a one-time password so I can log into a website with my voter number and vote there?

Voted yes to AV.
The party i would usually vote for say that if they will get in they would save £25m by scrapping a new velodrome here in Derby. Difficult decision to make!

Calling Allah a fairy?

I seriously doubt that even Woppit would do this.