[Closed] EU Referendum - are you in or out?

you're right - but what's going to make them do it?

at some point, the govt would have to rescind A50 and the 27 agree to it.

I really don't see a refusal, it wouldn't require unanimity and I don't see a problem getting 55% representing 65% of the population on board even if it ever came to a vote which I doubt it would.

Question is whether the govt could ever bring itself to vote for it. Would be hard to stomach after all they've said over the months and years. Indefinite delay and transition may turn out to be the most plausible route, even though it's unquestionably shitter than the status quo (pre-ref when we still did things like take the presidency in turn).

The foaming at the mouth 'betrayal!!!' of the hard-of-thinking Brexit nutjobs on Twitter is hilarious!! 😆

I'm following the wrong people.

Question is whether the govt could ever bring itself to vote for it.

Yeah there's the rub.

I'm following the wrong people.

Aaron Banks.

you're right - but what's going to make them do it?

Nothing, they stand to make too much money from trashing the economy. The tories have a one off chance to do what they really want, to rule un-opposed. If things get messy declare a state of emergency ad rely on the more extreme elements in the military to do their duty. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41241153 seen plenty of comments from people who claim to be former soldiers espousing similar views.

Just put #florencespeech into twitter and enjoy. The Maybot has managed to please absolutely nobody. Inevitable I suppose

Just put #florencespeech into twitter and enjoy. The Maybot has managed to please absolutely nobody.

My word there are some angry people out there, no wonder Gina miller needed police protection!

More worryingly some don't have a clue what Brexit entails

My word there are some angry people out there, no wonder Gina miller needed police protection

Question Time was exactly like this last night, brexitters still not understanding why we are paying anything at all. Even the EU membership they don't get.

It's so black and white to them. Ahem.

http://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/james-obrien/james-obrien-this-decision-is-brexit-in-a-nutshell/

run along and let your betters deal with the difficult decisions.

.

Autocorrect turned #florencespeech to #flounce speech when searching Twitter.

Somehow seems more appropriate!

https://notthetreasuryview.blogspot.co.uk/2017/09/citizens-rights-will-theresa-may-keep.html

interesting take on Mays speech, did she really mean what she said?

two good quotes from twitter

'I could have written a better speech by dragging my scrotum across the keyboard'

and

'No speech is better than a bad speech'

The best thing May could do now is resign and nominate Boris as her chosen successor.

"Right, you ****er, you sort this out. ****."

Or words to that effect.

[quote=binners ]The foaming at the mouth 'betrayal!!!' of the hard-of-thinking Brexit nutjobs on Twitter is hilarious!!

What a load of snowflakes.

Though I mostly seem to be getting remainers saying her speech was rubbish when I search - it appears my echo chamber is blocking the other stuff.

[url= http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/politics/politics-headlines/may-makes-generous-offer-to-remain-in-reality-for-further-two-years-20170922136280 ]Nicely summarised by the Mash[/url]

😀

More worryingly some don't have a clue what Brexit entails

They would feel quite at home here then

Speech msde - boxes ticked - next steps...

All moving along.

Mogg is on Newsnight, complaining about … well, all of it really.

All moving along.

To where, nothing substantive, just kicking the can a couple of years down the road.

And either May is lying or she is happy to see EU citizens keep the same rights they have as now....

So make your choice.

He's worried about the delay in poor people getting the, er, benefits they're expecting when we leave. Mogg that is.

Mogg was looking very glum on newsnight, funniest thing I've seen in ages.

If he wasn't so shit scared of being PM a leadership challenge would be on the cards

Gonna be some very grumpy brexies tomorrow morning...

[img] [/img]

Mogg has Mills to build and Pits to dig, them chimmneys don't sweep themselves - no wonder he is upset.

Frankie Boyle on a very dark and bleakly funny state of affairs.

[url= https://m.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=850318501816181&id=100005141178530 ]Long Rant[/url]

That's excellent from Frankie Boyle. 😀

So do we reckon that Boris's ego will allow him not to take advantage of the brexiteers righteous fury at this betrayal?

No chance!

I'm sure his minions are presently scurrying around pointing out his Telegraph article as an alternative manifesto and gathering the requisite 15% of signatures for his leadership bid

The closer the govt gets to coalescing around a concrete plan, the more in-fighting we'll see in the Tory party.

Can't wait.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/sep/22/florence-machine-maybot-theresa-may-brexit-speech

Headline fail !

Conservative MP just on 5 Live was scary, contradicting himself in the same sentence. Apparently we have the EU over a barrel 😯

The Maybot wants the closest and most cooperative relationship possible with Europe.

Shoot me down, but didn't we already have that?

Yes but that basis of our relationship is changing. We had a vote about it recently

teamhurtmore - Member
Yes but that basis of our relationship is changing. We had a vote about it recently

Objectives?

I think we were going to give lots of money to the NHS and definitely stay in the SM

Are those someone else's hands in the telegraph photo?

Oh yeah unicorns

[img] [/img]

That vote we had recently...

1.2m was the swing to leave, so wjen the deal is put on the table in 2021 do we all not have the right to say yes or No? Or do we have to abide by the 1.2m swing?

The above applies no matter what you view is? Democracy is not a one shot option? That's monarchy or a junta

All I'm picking up is the subliminal History Challenges Future part not sure what it means but it doesn't sound good and probably involves Dr Who. Actually speaking of the Dr, perhaps Peter Capaldi could actually head to the real Downing St now he is free and deliver a Tucker style wake up call to them all.
6 Months in and nothing achieved.
18 Months to come up with something, who is hopeful apart from T(H)M?

Someone on here asked a page or two ago how the plug will be pulled on Brexit, it already has via the 2 year transition, the steady match towards a single market/customs union continues - the two years will get extended to 3 or 4 and the next GE will arrive, the Tories withRees Mogg and Boris at the helm will have even less appeal, labour will capitalise on this and campaign on a Norway style deal - this will be supported by business as it provides the sensible option for trade and FOM. Labour will win that election and the Tories may slide into short term obscurity (average supporter age will be 80 at this point)

1.2m was the swing to leave

No, 600,000.

I like to see it this way - 33 people in a room, 16 go to each wall, the one left in the middle, probably mis-informed thinking their health service will get more money, or just doing a "protest vote", gets to make the call.

It's that fine.

Will of the people my ****.

Someone on here asked a page or two ago how the plug will be pulled on Brexit

That was me. The think is, we've left when the transition starts not when it ends.

This also assumes the EU agree to the transition, which basically means we get a 2 year head-start on competing with them. That's by no means certain.

I can see also though it may work for the EU as it allows more orderly moving of the supply lines, car factories, banking jobs, brain drain etc onto EU turf. Better than being rushed. The fabled death of 1,000 cuts for the UK.

perhaps I'm just a bit of a pessimist.

but I don't buy the "relax it'll all work out OK in the end". I'd point people thinking that way to read some history, it can all go horribly wrong.

That was me. The think is, we've left when the transition starts not when it ends.

This also assumes the EU agree to the transition, which basically means we get a 2 year head-start on competing with them. That's by no means certain.

The UK must provide more clarity about its negotiating position on Brexit, the French president has said.
Emmanuel Macron said the issues of EU citizens' rights, the exit bill and the Irish border question must be settled before talks could be held on trade.

But backbench MP Jacob Rees-Mogg criticised the PM's stance on freedom of movement - saying it should end in March 2019 - offering the union money, and the role of the European Courts of Justice on Britain.
He told BBC Newsnight it was a "red line" if the UK was still subject to the ECJ after March 2019. If it was, "we have not left the European Union", he said.

Yesterday just seemed like another piece of colonial style arrogance to me. Just dressed up in a slightly more conciliatory, moderately less confrontational tone.

However you dress it up, it still amounted to issuing a list of demands, and then just blithely assuming you're going to get them

[url= https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/sep/22/theresa-may-speech-brexit-prime-minister-florence ]Marina Hyde hits the nail on the head more often than most [/url]

[i]santa's ****ing dead![/i]

Great article this bit...

For the past few months, May’s messaging strategy has been predicated on the fact that the EU doesn’t have the internet. Thus you can spend a year being as rude and dismissive about them as you like for the benefit of the media back home, then fly to Europe and smilingly urge them to “be creative”, and everyone will take kindly to it.

To call the speech optimistic didn’t really cover it. Many of the lines had the flavour of something you’d say if you were leaving your wife of 40 years for a Babestation presenter who’d once read out one of your texts. This period could be remembered “not for a relationship that ended, but a new partnership that began”. Well, I mean … it COULD be. If you’re drinking Bacardi. (Incidentally, my favourite story of the week suggested that civil servants in David Davis’s department are so concerned about the lack of preparation for a no-deal scenario that they have begun writing emails stating the perils, to cover their backs in preparation for the inevitable Chilcot-style inquiry when it all goes tits up.)

Also the last bit about brexies expecting a cakewalk, is very true, all the frothing and outrage on Twitter is because people believed it would be quick and easy, Mogg last night was paralysed because his lies have been exposed.

ICYMI, Moody's downgrades UK again: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41369239

Faisal Islam says "... this is the first ever time a major rather has cut us to third rank"
https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/911460452315561985