Unless you run a crack den in Fenham..
oldmanmtb - Member
Chewkw I was born in 1963 in Newcastle upon Tyne i have lived through multiple governments and resided in the same part of the world for 53 years (including the Miners strike) no incumbent Tory and few labour governments have given a **** about poor people.
If you are cheering for the elite crack on.
If you are cheering for the poor have a think.
Yes, of course they don't give a toss about you because you keep voting for the same old same old party. You are a sure bet. You are the ticket for the MPs to get career progression. You have not made them sweat for their positions but instead you sweat for them. Labour even think that it is their god given rights to have MPs starting their career from North East.
Keep life simple and you shall be fine.oldmanmtb - Member
Oh and Chewkw you may find that doing enough to survive just ain't good enough....
That place is a mixed bag.oldmanmtb - Member
Unless you run a crack den in Fenham..
The bullying the PM (or trying to) is a grand British tradition going way back. If you don't have that, you don't have democracy.
IGM - think about this for a second. We have a UK PM who was a remainer, executing the mandate of the majority of voters, whose wishes are at odds with the majority of MPs and that is.........bullying? It seems the antithesis to me.
Having said that she does seem to have bigger balls than Dave at the moment! 😉
Apparently the Great Repeal Bill will be subject to EVEL, Theresa May says.
Scottish MPs won't even be allowed to vote on the bill that will pull Scotland out of the EU against our wishes.
teamhurtmore - Member
... she does seem to have bigger balls than Dave at the moment!
... and many others ... 😆
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If there is no EU will SNP still want an independence? 🙂bencooper - Member
Scottish MPs won't even be allowed to vote on the bill that will pull Scotland out of the EU against our wishes.
[b]Apparently[/b] the Great Repeal Bill will be subject to EVEL, Theresa May says.
Scottish MPs won't even be allowed to vote on the bill that will pull Scotland out of the EU against our wishes.
What a wonderful word - apparently. EVEL doesn't even exist, now it could be created of course. What I think you may find Ben is that Scotland will be asked to draft their own Great Repeal Bill in terms of tye detail and consistentbwith Scotland's devolved powers. If they decline they will have no EU consistent laws or workers rights. Sounds like another smart move from May.
By the way did you see page 3 of the PM's letter I posted.
Here, from 12:17:56
http://www.parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/968c0454-8a67-451e-8303-3715de963555
Are you saying that EVEL doesn't exist? It's been used already!
Yes I am saying that, it doesn't exist yet. Will watch the link thanks.
First link in google:
https://www.parliament.uk/about/how/laws/bills/public/english-votes-for-english-laws/
EVEL has been in use since the end of 2015!
I think you misheard the PM ben, but thanks for the link BTW
Examples ? Interested to see how its been used to date. Bl00dy glad to hear it's been done frankly.
Ben lsitened to first 15 mins no reference there (Scottish Questions) I assume its a PMQ matter but my briwser only shows elapsed time not clock time.
Makes sense that Scotland needs it own Bill to deal with the issues which it has devolved power and hence responsibility for. Of course A50 is not one of those things. It is not approproate for the Scottish Westminster MPs to vote on legislation specific to England aand which Holrood has devolved power.
Its a throw a line to the second question after Berkow has reprimanded the SNP members for their poor behaviour.
Maybe I'm being naive here, but looking at the paper's this evening they're all jubilant that PMT MAY is saying "Give us a deal or there's no deal, we're going anyway", why the hell would anyone want to do a deal on those terms? Most people would say cheerio surely?
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Also... "gives mps vote" should be followed by "as long as it isnt about brexit"
EVEL is very simple. First it only applies to whole Bills, so if a Bill has a Scottish implication, even partial, (or Welsh) it doesn't apply and the Grand Committee doesn't sit. Second, if the government decide to bifurcate the Bill so it only applies to England (or England and Wales), then by definition it doesn't effect Scotland, the Grand Committee can stop the Bill. Third, if the Bill passes through the Grand Committee, then Scottish MPs get a vote even if it doesn't apply to Scotland, as was illustrated with the Sunday Shopping Bill where it was overturned with the help of Scottish MPs.
Jimster there is mutual benefit in a deal, what May is saying is we won't accept a bad deal. The EU keep saying our deal must be made worse than current deal in order to dissuade others from leaving. IMO the threats where all coming from the EU so far, its the UK which is saying now we may just move on if the deal is a bad one.
Liam Fox says we are having "informal discussions" with 12 countries with a view to announcing formal negotiations immediately on exit in 2019
Norway
Australia
New Zealand
China
India
South Korea
GCC (Kuwait, Saudi, Bahrain, Oman, UAE, Qatar ..)
Add to that list US when Trump is inaugurated and soon Canada (imo)
what May is saying is we won't accept a bad deal.
We wont get a deal, then she will blame the EU and then we will turned into some tax haven for corporations and they will manage to care even less for people who arent rich.
They have already started to talk about "deregulating the labour market" which we all know means, less rights for workers for holidays, sick pay even wages
Love the Tony (grade a arse hole) Abbott poster, good to see the idiot is still trying to get his old job back rather than sitting on the back benches.
. The EU keep saying our deal must be made worse than current deal in order to dissuade others from leaving
Or back in reality, the UK says it won't accept some of the things that are a underpinning the eu deal so of course we can't have the full fat option and it's going to be a worse deal.
Norway
Australia
New Zealand
China
India
South Korea
GCC (Kuwait, Saudi, Bahrain, Oman, UAE, Qatar ..)
We had a deal with Norway via the eu, Australia is doing an EU one now not sure on the rest.
Interesting term informal discussion, I had some of them in the pub, it means nothing. It could simply be arranging to talk in 2 years when the UK might have hired some trade negotiators
Errrr, Jamby. You may want to have a brief look at why Tony Abbott is the [u]FORMER[/u] Prime Minister of Australia.
If you believe anything that useless pair of flappy ears says, let alone place trust in his knowledge, then you sir are a very unfortunate individual.
And as for Chewky:
It's good chewkw has it all sorted out. Someone we can rely on. To be fair he sounds no worse than Boris.
Are we quite sure he [i]isn't[/i] Boris?
It matters diddly skwat what deal one makes if the government has no national economic strategy. And a strategy is not free trade all round.
From sitting in another county and as a direct benefactor of free movement the migration argument and control from EU also looks nuts. The UK not being in schengen and the euro meant that we do have control of our own borders and economic policies. So many people I talk to here from other European countries think it's nuts.
And now with the threat to make the UK into a low tax economy it seems kind of obvious that we are being led to somewhere that most people in the UK do not want to go but is quite acceptable and good from the point of view of the neo liberals in charge. If the choice had been. "Do you want to leave the EU and turn into a low tax economy of the American model with a worse health care, social, education, workers rights and environmental protection?" Then it would not have got very far but we were promised the opposite.
Now because the only thing that matters now is leaving the EU then policy can be radically rewritten and dearly held principles can be disregarded for the greater good. In someways it is good to see where the Tory's red lines are.
DrJ should have added the caveat that the offer was on the basis it was reciprocated, she and other Ministers have made the offer many times including shortly after the Referendum. Also see point 6 in PM May's letter below.
Pfft. Means zero. Consider the facts. Brexit was a vote to get rid of foreigners. May was home Secretary and failed to deliver on a commitment to reduce immigration. Now she has the levers and mandate to make up for that failure. Two plus two is four. Some vague words (what rights? For whom? For how long) might as well be written on a bus for all the confidence they give.
All the EU seem to have said on British immigrants is you haven't started to leave yet, we'll talk when you have.
And on deals for the UK - club member tells club you're not doing a better deal for non-members than members now and club says no we won't be.
I fail to see any threat in either of those positions.
THM - I may have been misinterpreted. Not accusing May of bullying - not yet. Rather that bullying of the PM (not by) is a grand British tradition. Some PMs are more resilient than others. That said meekly doing the bidding of Farage and Murdoch even when (assuming she is a remainer) she knows it to be wrong doesn't make me think that May is too bully-proof. But then ultimately neither was Cameron.
GEDA, agree.
The older I get the more obvious it is that people on the whole do not understand 'unintended consequences', whether privately, politically or quite often in business.
But this is where we are, Project Fear eh?
Utter contempt for those promoting it and those who support (the majority of who didn't and haven't a clue).
Pfft. Means zero. Consider the facts. Brexit was a vote to get rid of foreigners. May was home Secretary and failed to deliver on a commitment to reduce immigration. Now she has the levers and mandate to make up for that failure. Two plus two is four. Some vague words (what rights? For whom? For how long) might as well be written on a bus for all the confidence they give.
DrJ sums it up nicely
Maybot doesn't really have a plan as such, she's just reset to her factory default and is repeating Theresa 1.0 from her home office days
The UK not being in schengen and the euro meant that we do have control of our own borders and economic policies. So many people I talk to here from other European countries think it's nuts.
It is
And now with the threat to make the UK into a low tax economy it seems kind of obvious that we are being led to somewhere that most people in the UK do not want to go
Speak for yourself
And now Toyota questiong how they can stay in post Brexshit Britain.
So far so good leavers.
Stop being negative. Who needs foreign carmakers when Rover are on top of their game. 😆
The CBI are saying (somewhat obviously) this morning that far from 'cutting red tape' as stated, the added bureaucracy involved in doing business outside the single market and customs union will add enormous costs to British business
You really couldn't make it up
Just noticed the 'Britain is back' poster above
Small print says - Tony Abbott
It's like when you see a movie advert ;
[b]5 stars, Film of the year ![/b]
(Tadcaster Gazette)
Is maybot going through her 12 PowerPoint slides at Davos right now? that'll be a laugh
https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/10151/lord-kerr-time-press-may-insecurity-her-hard-brexit-plan
The CBI are saying (somewhat obviously) this morning that far from 'cutting red tape' as stated, the added bureaucracy involved in doing business outside the single market and customs union will add enormous costs to British businessYou really couldn't make it up
Yup gonna make my job slower and cost the institute more
On the plus side the brexies have given up the right to bang on about the laffer curve, as they drive all those high rate taxpayers from London to Frankfurt and Paris 🙂
?
Thm curse of the last post on a page!
What bit of economics do you need explaining? 🙂
your 'interesting' interpretation of the Laffer Curve!! 😉
[But best not mention the Laffer Curve on here as it upsets those with a sensitive disposition]
Norway
Australia
New Zealand
China
India
South Korea
GCC (Kuwait, Saudi, Bahrain, Oman, UAE, Qatar ..)
How are these other countries we're doing trade talks with going to feel if they think we will become a tax haven their companies can move to?
The two don't seem compatible to me.
Well we've been reminded that the Prison camp guard's tax reforms drove the high rate payers from Paris, brexishambles promising to do even better
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUKKBN1520SO.
HSBC, UBS to shift 1,000 jobs each from UK in Brexit blow to London[/url]
OK but nowt directly to do with Laffer Curve - but get what you are trying to say (just!)
I think that Britain is in a stronger position for these negotiations than we imagine. European business has a huge investment in the UK in many differing areas but, a lot in transport. To limit the UK in any severe way will negatively impact these investments.
Who needs foreign carmakers when Rover are on top of their game.
Owned by an Indian company if memory serves...
Chinese
Jaguar Landrover is the Indian car manufacturer you're thinking of.
We are in an ok position - look, the grown ups know the danger of a lose:lose situation. The kids have had their fun and now they need to go and have a nap and let the grown ups sort the mess out.
They will - we have seen the more sensible ones on both sides indicating this already. Doesnt make good news or clickbait though!!
ChineseJaguar Landrover is the Indian car manufacturer you're thinking of.
Ah, you may well be right.
