Some of those comments from Brexiters are incredulous-
Of course it's the job of judges to say how the law works
People like IDS know this very well they just can't st lying can they?
Can we all get a badge that says Enemy Of The People?
Can we all get a badge that says Enemy Of The People?
Yes, and we can wear them in the prison we will be placed into - as that is where enemies of the people should be.
So glad my kids get to foot the bill for Brexshit 😐
Bollocks We love Boris.
If you haven't worked out by now that Boris says whatever he thinks will help 'Boris' at that precise moment and nothing else, then there's no hope for you.
50p says he's out by the next Cabinet reshuffle.
International trade policy? With whom will this exist?
USA - Donald ain't sharing his American Pie
India - requires free movement for a trade deal
China - they want to sell us stuff and buy our expensive houses - a form of asset stripping
Africa - needs to sell us stuff not buy Range Rovers (oops forgot we don't own them)
South America- mostly bankrupt
Turkey?
Offices I work in that are full of people from all over Europe would be only British.
Something I've not got about the desire to cut immigration: it's the van drivers etc (not denigrating, I know a few) who are meant to suffer from being competed against. But I'm likewise surrounded by people from all over, and wouldn't for a second feel we were doing anything other than benefiting from good people, even if I might be beaten to a job now and again...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-37995606
Sort of sums BJ and other Brexiters up really, at best delusional.
as that is where enemies of the people should be.
😯
I'm trying to work out if you were being sarcastic there but if not then perhaps you should think about that comment and what it means.
Has Boris actually read the Treaty of Rome?
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https://twitter.com/GuyVerhofstadt/status/798589132264116224
What price dignity?
Pretty sure Kissinger wouldn't have conducted diplomacy via Twitter...
What're you saying?
If there's one silver lining to this farce, it's that Boris has been revealed to be the two-faced **** he's always been. He'll never be PM and will never lead the Tories, which is a good thing.
I completely agree with Molgrips: I get into the lift every morning and hear French, Spanish, Portuguese, Arabic, Polish and other accents and I don't think 'spongers', I think how fortunate we are to have attracted talented tax-paying individuals.
Are you sure Nixon's security advisor and person behind the bombing of Cambodia into the hands of the Khmer Rouge is the ideal example of diplomatic dignity?
Boris is an idiot BUT Verhofstadt is sinking to his level and should have exercised impulse control.
What has happened to our political class when they revert to point scoring on twitter (like Trump)? Whether Boris is an idiot or not, he is foreign secretary of this country. I may think he shouldn't be, but I don't need a politician from Holland who should know better telling me that. The only result from Verhofstadts behaviour is that he increases animosity between the U.K. And EU, and for what? He should have had the sense and dignity to criticise behind closed doors, even if Boris doesn't.
What price dignity?
Pretty sure Kissinger wouldn't have conducted diplomacy via Twitter...
In [i]some[/i] ways it is a good thing, as it increases transparency BUT yeah it does reduce a lot of nuanced debate down to soundbites and witty retorts.
PS Johnx2 - I just knew someone would respond like that, well done.
FYI I just couldn't remember the name of the Treaty of Vienna person, so Kissinger was the next diplomat I thought of. Don't worry, I am totally appalled by whatever Kissinger did or maybe even didn't do.
He should have had the sense and dignity to criticise behind closed doors, even if Boris doesn't.
It's difficult to win a war for public opinion if you only express yours behind closed doors while your opponents broadcast theirs to the world.
Borris knows full well what hes doing-
pandering to the tabloids, so it can all be blamed on the EU when the negotiations fail to deliver
Boris is an idiot BUT Verhofstadt is sinking to his level and should have exercised impulse control.
Don't think so. Boris is rambling ill-informed and actually incorrect rubbish just to try and curry public favour in a highly damaging situation for everyone, which has been created out of public opinion.
Someone has to push back, don't they? Preferably someone who knows what they are talking about.
GrahamS - since when is it a war for public opinion on this point? Who is Verhofstadt trying to persuade with that Tweet? He is either preaching to the converted, or antagonising the rest. If you think this situation is a war of public opinion then I suggest you are very wrong, it's much more important and we need our representatives to treat it as such (Boris and Verhofstadt included).
Is Verhofstadt just giving the Brexiteer's a reality check to counter all the "We'll get what we want" claims.
At the end of the day, it's all the biggest **** up ever.
Not countering the lies of brexiters properly is whats got us in this mess
@molgrips - that's nice, but who benefits as a result of that Tweet? Temporary schadenfreude is as good as it gets. The forum for 'pushing back' is in serious negotiation, not Twitter.
Fair enough if the press had pushed back in this way, but not Verhofstadt given his role.
Now guys (and it does seem to primarily be guys on both sides) you've all been arguing hard - may I suggest a quick break for some music and relaxation. Themed of course.
Shall we start with Brexys Midnight Quitters and their tribute to Mrs May (it must be those heels) "She Got a Wiggle".
Any one else got a request? Not yet?
Ok how's about we go with a cover version?
Nigel Farage and "There'll Always Be an England - just maybe not a UK". Nice twist on an old classic there Nige - see you in panto.
And on with the Aaron, Borris and Nige (again - he does get about, though rarely at his day job in Brussels) in their supergroup the Brexy City High Rollers "Bye bye baby".
Anymore requests get them sent in - usual address, STE Chat forum
"Not countering the lies of brexiters properly is whats got us in this mess"
+1
Ad Homs can end a debate but they can't win it.
Mogrips you've just fallen into Boris' trap he really isn't badly informed and he certainly isn't an idiot.
It's reported this morning that Merkel is open to discussion around some restrictions on movement. Thing is the real debate and negotiations will go on behind closed doors and everything done in public is just pandering to the crowd and 'shadow boxing'.
Dragon - yep Boris is probably bright enough to know that Brexit is a bad idea on a whole variety of levels and also bright enough to try to arrange for someone else to get the blame.
mikewsmith - Member“It is not their job to tell parliament … how they should go about that business, that’s for parliament to decide.”
Beyond satire tbh.
. The Crown Prosecution Service are considering a "corrupt practices" case against the Vote Leave mob (which included high profile Tory government ministers like Boris Johnson) for lying to the electorate over claims like the "Let's give the NHS the £350 million a week ..." lie and their false claims that "Turkey is joining the EU
Bring that ON !!!
*High Five
One of the joys of spending 8 hours in a car yesterday was listening to the Deloitte story unfold during the day. The answer was always obvious, but the twisted road made for some entertainment on the metaphorical and real journeys!
The gov is split - no shit - there is not firm plan - really - because no one has done this before and its complicated - but we were told it was easy.....independence day!!!
Aye good point Dragon. Was just thinking that as I brought my coffee upstairs. They are playing either the public, the EU or both.
Hmm, a restrictive reading of article 3 ignores that it only applies for the purposes in article 2
TItle iii (Article 48-51) lays out in more detail what was actually proposed, in that it extended only to workers
Not retirees to the sun then old ninster?
biggest fourm ever?
Have we surpassed "crown race"?
Not retirees to the sun then old ninster?
I would take that as being the point that Boris was inelegantly stumbling towards like a drunken ape, yes.
Now then, no ape references, not even albino ape references.
😀
Interesting when you read those articles that it was also supposed to exclude all public sector jobs (I believe that ECJ case law decided this didn't mean what it said, and applied only to some public sector jobs)
Fair enough if the press had pushed back in this way, but not Verhofstadt given his role.
Interesting point about modern media.
Traditionally, a paper would've gone to Verhofstadt, asked him what he thought, and published it.
IF the paper's owners wanted to
IF the paper had the resources and prioritised it
IF the paper felt it ought to be seen to be responding but the owners are leavers and want to side with Boris so they selectively quote or misrepresent.
Should be even clearer than ever now that papers cannot be trusted to be honest. So if you want information reported correctly, tweet it yourself. If Boris doesn't want to be shot down, he shouldn't be tweeting bollocks in the first place.
I'm all in favour of this tweet.
It's reported this morning that Merkel is open to discussion around some restrictions on movement. Thing is the real debate and negotiations will go on behind closed doors
My point all along - Frau Compromise will deliver.
So in the end we will have slightly more expensive trade and less investment against slightly fewer darkies*... 😯
[* to be treated in the same manner as the sentence, not as reflective of my views]
I think the point is that Johnson is really getting under the skin of the EU ministers we have to negotiate with (Italian economic development minister, said aftera conversation with johnsons that the UK government’s stance was chaotic, yesterday)*
maybe its all part of a machiavellan plan to force them into offering us a hard Brexit that the public will reject it all and we can stay in like borris always wanted
or
hes just a dick
.
.
* re thms post- as Merkel is the one who wears die hosen in the EU, then there may be some sanity in there somewhere and the EU will throw us a bone, im not convinced the tabloids wont reject it or hail it as a great new deal
Should be even clearer than ever now that papers cannot be trusted to be honest. So if you want information reported correctly, tweet it yourself. If Boris doesn't want to be shot down, he shouldn't be tweeting bollocks in the first place.
Works two ways doesn't it, we don't know the full context of what Boris actually said, just a couple of choice quotes featured in a newspaper
Back to the themed Brexit songs, one of us wants to step up.
Apparently NINfan will be singing "Hurt"
True, but what he said did seem to be quite wrong. Hard to imagine what context would change that.
