Commissioners are not elected by anyone - they not even individually ratified only the Commission as a whole is ratified by the Parliament - it is pretty ridiculous to suggest that is more democratic than a government in power because it can secure a parliamentary majority.
true. But I can't see anyone wanting to do this again for a whileIf it goes one way.
true. But I can't see anyone wanting to do this again for a while
divisive nonsense.
Paddy Power
In 1/9
Out 6/1
I wouldn't wait up.
no exit polling so we won't have any idea till a least midnight
I bet David Dumbledore will have a prediction as the clock strikes 10 tonight. Gryffindor or Slytherin though?
divisive nonsense
2 words to sum up the whole thing]
true. But I can't see anyone wanting to do this again for a while
Have you not noted how absolutely mental a lot of the Out brigade are? This whole thing has been an absolutely irrational blind obsession with them for decades.
The rest of us will rightly tell them to **** off, obviously. But they're going to keep banging on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on on and on and on and on and on and on about it no matter what happens
They're unhinged!
always Gryffindor, bbc bias for the "good" guys 🙄
scotroutes
Of course it could be that some folk actually know they are petty, small-minded, insular, backward looking, racist bell ends but don't feel the need to advertise it
I don't think that is feasible 😉
I think that, however it is in actuality, there are huge advantages for cameron's team pushing the message out that it is close, through the bbc and so on, and scaring people. that way they can really hold people hostage to the tory agenda, carry the momentum and claim they 'saved' the country from leave. basically save themselves from the consequences of the almighty rift in the tory party europe has always caused. I am skeptical that remaining is the best thing to do but suspect the remains will have it by quite a margin.
I also think they booted Ian Duncan Smith out so that someone who was from cameron's class and cohort could 'run' the leave campaign. Teresa May, who had been very noisey on the subject of the eu until the actual campaign came around, has also been 'sat on' by the tory top brasses.
with leave, i don't think cameron could continue and I don't think boris could win an election: so we'd get corbyn, which is fine as far as I am concerned.
Apparently the midday count has it 72% remain....
Apparently the midday count has it 72% remain....
Have they started counting?
edit and if they have nobody is allowed to be reporting it as it could influence further voting
first time you've voted?wobbliscott - Member
I'm more concerned/surprised at the fact that when I pitched up today to vote I forgot my poll card, just gave my name and address, was struck off a list and handed my voting slip, voted, posted it in the box without the need to provide any form of identification or any means to prove I was who I said I was. I could have gone in again and given my neighbours name and got a second vote with the only thing to prevent that from happening is that the person at the desk didn't recognise me....or to get around that, given the name and address of someone from a different part of my village which would have meant I checked in at a different desk altogether.
I also think this has nearly nothing to do with business and trade in the way it is presented, and everything to do with the ability to trade euros in london on the foreign exchange markets, which, after the crash, have emerged as the most liquid form of city trading.
osbourne poking around a factory in a hi-vis vest hides the fact that all this is about the city of london.
I think her son/grandson posts her (from the Mash today).
"A RACIST nan who is fuelled entirely by hate has began her slow and unsteady journey to the polling station.
89-year-old Mary Fisher confirmed plans to get herself down to the local community centre and cast her vote against foreigners, even if it took half an hour just to get her coat on.
Like a salmon swimming upstream to spawn and then die, Fisher plans to expire shortly after the referendum and leave the younger generations to deal with the consequences.
She said: “I am old now, and my life is behind me, but that doesn’t mean I can’t bollocks things up for everyone else.
“Not all old people are racist, that is a tired stereotype. However I am very racist, particularly against the Chinese, who are not even in the EU but I see this as I step towards keeping all the buggers out.
“Also I want to make it harder for people to go on foreign holidays because they should be satisfied with a weekend in Tenby, going on the donkeys and drinking Slush Puppies.”
Neighbour Roy Hobbs said: “You have to admire her determination, but she did try to poison my cat last year so she’s definitely not all good.
“I’m driving to the polling station to vote against her. I said she could have a lift but she accused me of being a filthy pervert.”
Leave have not woke up yet as they don't have jobs due too the immigrants stealing them
Your new overlord ...
[img] 
[/img]
... the one on the left.
😆
@ nipper
ah, I see the random sentence generator has come online again. Downtime to update the database, was it?
Saw this comment in the Indy regarding the pen/pencil/MI5 conspiracy thing
I am appalled yet fascinated by the response to this from the brexiters posting here as they seem to be taking it as a badge of pride that so many of them openly endorse such paranoid conspiracy theories.
Sound familiar?
She was right ...
[img] 
[/img]
edenvalleyboy - Member
Apparently the midday count has it 72% remain....
Im sure I read that the 'labour heartland'- north of england etc postal votes a few days ago were looking very bad for remain 🙁
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/23/when-are-the-eu-referendum-results-what-time-will-we-know-the-wi/
Again, polls close then votes are counted, there are no exit polls. Your also not allowed to talk about results while the polls are open either as it can influence voters still to vote. So I would take anything beyond the last opinion poll as fiction.
How did it come to this? The wrong question, at the wrong time in the wrong context.
@Stoner's post above ..
Because we live in a democracy
What is the right question ?
When should we have been asked it ?
Even at EU bureaucratic level you cannot compete ...
[url= http://www.economist.com/news/europe/21636778-british-are-down-germans-and-east-europeans-are-up-friends-right-places ]The Economist.[/url]
[img] 
[/img]
that graph ^^^^ 🙄
Exacterly. Why would there be so many belgians eh, and not one single zm
Because we live in a democracy
So given that you can't ask everyone everything, what questions should we ask everyone?
kimbers - Member
that graph
Be remain/in to affect the EU policy?
You have Nil chance.
[img] 
[/img]
All hail the kill file
So junior admin staff run the EU?
[img] 
[/img]
[img] 
[/img]
So tomorrow night's dinner:
Brexit - pie and mash
Remain - bratwurst und kartoffelsalat
jamba - a more adventurous leader should have spent the last 3 yrs coordinating a reform club of those other EU nations that teeter on popular majority for exit. The ridiculousness of the question of Out vs In is all babies and bathwater. That question should never have been asked of the UK population, but rather a question of proper EU reform should have been put to the Council of the European Union. Reform proposals put together over time with thought, care, negotiation and the weight of more than one member state behind them.
Even now, despite my distaste for Juncker, he is one of a number of federalists who are mooting calming down the rush for enlarging the EU in fear at the growth in popular unrest, since it “does not reflect the inclination of member states.”
Tusk saying: “We must take a long, hard look at the future of the Union. We would be foolish to ignore such a warning signal as the U.K. referendum, and there are more signals of dissatisfaction coming from all over Europe,”
Guy Verhofstadt, the former Belgian prime minister: “Whatever happens, it is clear that we have to reform the EU.” And reform should be swift: “We should use this momentum to fundamentally change the EU and start a discussion about the future of the EU.”
Cameron should have harnessed that sentiment and used it better, long before stumbling into his own bear trap of a referendum. The question should never have been asked of the UK voters.
[i]It has always surprised me you don't need ID to vote[/i]
Because that is one of the benefits of living in this fantastic country, we don't have ID cards - and nor do we want them.
I'm surprised that no Brexit has come up with a "EU will force ID cards story".
+350,000,000 Stoner. Each week.
Best case scenario - narrow remain.
Stoner speaks much sense it would have been better to get support rather than us being the lone wolf winging on the side-lines
TBH - not just a party political point but partly- I don't think Dave does all that well in diplomatic terms.
we don't have ID cards - and nor do we want them.
It was not a point for ID cards and I don't support them. However there are many cases when I must prove who I am.
Its not like I can just walk in the bank and ask for money or sign on without ID. It just surprises me that your name is enough for a vote as it [s]encourages[/s] makes it dead easy to commit fraud
and voting is quite important
grips - as I said in another thread, there's part of me thinks a best case scenario is a v narrow Leave vote, but Cameron having the backbone to defy the public while he restarts negotiations with a coalition of "Exit-ish" countries under threat of invoking our Article 50 if the EU as a whole dont play along. DC would have until the next GE to run with it. According to: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35616946 he has a majority in his own party and the parliament for REMAIN so in theory could survive long enough to pull it off.
His only risk is pissing off 24 million + people who already hate him.
Not to feed the demented troll (who has just woken up); apparently the reason there are very few Brits in the EU admin staff is you need to be fluent in two languages; and as our education is based around teaching one language that can be used at higher volumes when speaking to foreigners.
I blame the EU.
Well for those who believe in omens, the sky over Wales is a lovely EU blue at the moment.
Good post from Stoner.
Yes, the lack of legal binding onthe referendum result is interesting.
grips - as I said in another thread, there's part of me thinks a best case scenario is a v narrow Leave vote, but Cameron having the backbone to defy the public while he restarts negotiations with a coalition of "Exit-ish" countries under threat of invoking our Article 50 if the EU as a whole dont play along. DC would have until the next GE to run with it. According to: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35616946 he has a majority in his own party and the parliament for REMAIN so in theory could survive long enough to pull it off.
That's my only hope if the choice is to leave.
@molgrips might I suggest French, Spanish or Italian food. Germany for cars only
Interesting Stoner. I do find the "we should never have had a referendum" a concerning argument, the EU and its performance and future direction have a massive imoact on our country. We very much should be asked as the campaign has shown its a cross party issue and our normal elections don't focus on such a specific issue.
As for reform we've have tried exactly that and its never worked, we've got nowhere. I am also highly cynical about Junker and Tusj's review/reform comments. All hot air, they may take a breather but the European superstate juggernaught knows no other way.
@ stoner
We cannot ignore the will of the people to that extent even with a very narrow vote for leave- possibly if we are talking hundred of voters but even 51v 49 is a largish number of people
I suspect what will happen is he wont article 50 - will re negotiate and actually get something then re referendum for the new deal
Again it will still piss off a lot of people
