[Closed] Employee Rights - Hospital Appointments

Either talk with HR or read your handbook - I'm sure been a Govt Agency they have both.

I would expect them to let you go without a fuss, but would have to make the time up or take it as holiday.

Bazzer

I work for a government agency too. In my case I would certainly have to make the time up but taking the time off in the first place wouldn't be a problem I reckon. Friendly chat with team leader would be good beforehand.

I can't see any justification for [i]not[/i] having to make the time up. Why shouldn't you? Not your employers problem it's at a fixed time each time.

..... Unless it was a work related injury. I'm assuming it isn't.

Ours (local government)states that in certain circumstances time off will be given for hospital appointments, however where time off for appointments becomes frequent or regular the line manager has the discretion to ask the employee to make the time up or grant time off without pay.

They have no obligation to give you the time off, simple as and don't see why they should. If you're lucky you mat get some discretion.

This means I have to leave work three hours early.

Playing devils advocate here, that seems like an awfully long time to get to a doctors appointment!?

Have a word with whoever is in charge, get in an hour early so you're there before anyone else and can say you arrived at whatever time you like, work through your lunch, get your work done before you go, sorted.

I find asking for the time off for free never works, but offering to get in early and work my lunch I sometimes get told "don't worry about it"

No clue on the legalities but I'd certainly be expecting to make the time up if I had to leave 3 hours early on a regular basis.

As I remember you have a right to go to the appointment but not to be paid for the time. so yes you either have to make the time up or suffer a deduction to your pay.

Playing devils advocate here, that seems like an awfully long time to get to a doctors appointment!?

I'll be leaving at 3, the appointment is 3:45. I normally finish work at 6. The sessions are an hour and a half, plus whatever waiting time is involved. The office closes at 6 regardless, so won't be any point going back.

Problem solved, just found this on our intranet:

[i]If you have a long term medical condition and for the purposes of treatment, you need to attend medical appointments, the Agency doesn't expect you to make up the working time lost. [/i]

Thanks for your input all.

Its alright quoting that to your line manager and trying to make it all official but you're just going to make yourself a pain in their side. I'd make up the time despite what it said in my T&C's, if it was due to outside activities.

What caused the injury?

EDIT. I know TJ will say you are entitled to it, but by making up the time might get you a favour you need "outside the rules" later on. It's only 3 hours, it'd be a good investment.

Don't wade in quoting policies etc - that will simply annoy everyone concerned.

If I were your boss, I'd want to be sure that any key bits of work were done on time and you were seen to be making an effort to meet in the middle and make some of the time up.

If they are getting silly just take the whole day off as sick leave. What would they prefere, an early dart or a whole day lost... Can you get in early to make up a bit of the time?

robdob - perhaps look at my post above?

TandemJeremy - Member

As I remember you have a right to go to the appointment [b]but not to be paid for the time[/b]. so yes you either have to make the time up or suffer a deduction to your pay.

I was anticipated you quoting the T and C's the OP has quoted as a solution to the problem, not your post you have just quoted, which I would agree with.

Yeah cracking advice from martyn there.

Hmmm, yes. Employer already knows when the appointment is. You ring in sick, manager phones home and gets no answer. Rings hospital, finds out you are at your appointment. Bingo - problem solved! You have no job to go back to so your sorry ass can attend any appointment you like.

If you have a long term medical condition

That would be handy if your knee was a long term condition.

I don't get it, you're getting the time off to go to the appointment, so you need to make the time up afterwards. Or you're just being paid to be in hospital, which is idiotic. I'm afraid you'll have to put in the 3 hours of work just like everyone else.

Or you're just being paid to be in hospital, which is idiotic. I'm afraid you'll have to put in the 3 hours of work just like everyone else.

Do you also think, that if someone has had cancer treatment and has regular follow up appointments they also shouldn't be paid for that time?

you're just being paid to be in hospital, which is idiotic.

...but true.

Do you also think, that if someone has had cancer treatment and has regular follow up appointments they also shouldn't be paid for that time?

What if you're paying a painter a day rate to decorate your house. Do you pay him a full day for the days he's at the hospital?

I don't think the " long term medical condition" covers the damaged knee. That is usually intended for things like diabetes, cancer, that sort of thing.

Do you also think, that if someone has had cancer treatment and has regular follow up appointments they also shouldn't be paid for that time?

That's where discretion comes into play. A bit of an iffy knee get on with it, serious illness or life potentially life threatening condition a good employer would help out. Say for example.

If you have a long term medical condition and for the purposes of treatment, you need to attend medical appointments, the Agency doesn't expect you to make up the working time lost.

Exactly, discretion is needed. The cancer patient is still "just being paid to be in hospital" but I can't see how that can ever be 'idiotic'

Our work policy doesn't cover long term medical conditions unless they can be classed as a disability. Luckily for me the hospital are a lot more accommodating at arranging appointments outside of work hours.

If only blood tests could be arranged the same way instead of turn up and queue behind 40 old people at 8am in the morning for a blood test.

Uluru - does it matter what age the 40 people in front of you are? Or are you assuming that they should ring you up to find out what time of day you'd like them to go for their tests so they don't hold you up.

I find early PM is a good time to go for a blood test at my local path lab. But then I worked fairly close to my hospital so easy to nip out for an hour or have a late/extended lunch.

Yes it does matter what age, they're retired and have got all morning 🙂

Tbh my problem is less with the old people and more with the lack of appointment system. Where I used to live it was no problem to make an appointment and turn up at the allotted time.

Current system is doors open at 8 (although plenty queue before this) but first appointment isn't until 8:30 so you've a minimum half an hour wait before you've started. Get there at 8.10 and there'll be 30 people in the queue before you. They only do blood tests in the morning so early pm not an option for me.

Maybe not a problem if you're having one off blood tests, but to go through this rigmarole every month is a bit tiring.

ShaunW1973 - Member
Problem solved, just found this on our intranet:

If you have a long term medical condition and for the purposes of treatment, you need to attend medical appointments, the Agency doesn't expect you to make up the working time lost.

That'll be Public Sector then. You wouldn't get T&Cs like that in the Private Sector.

* runs for the door *

*Boots druidh out of the door*

actualy you probably whould - its probably needed as a part of the disability discrimination act.

Druidh - that's a fair point. I work in the public sector now but used to work in retail. In every case if someone came to me while I was a manager and explained about a hospital appointment I would always let them go but expect them to make up the time. Unfortunatley when 2 employees developed cancer this meant lots of time off for regular appointments. Because the people involved came to us early and understood our position we did everything we could to help them out, time off at short notice, long unpaid holidays etc etc. We were not able to let them have time off paid but they knew they had a job to go to when they were well enough.
I'm reading between the lines a little, but the OP's attitude seems to be that everyone should work around him. Did he go to his boss when the injury happened and work out what he might need in terms of time off, coming to a workable compromise good for both sides? Or did he, as I suspect, just take the time off with little or no notice and try to wiggle out of the inevitable tense discussion with his now very annoyed boss?

TJ - I think if it's JUST disability then you're right, but a long term medical problem is not necessarily a disability. I would assume that there are standard definitions of disability which would be used by HR if there is an issue in this area.
I don't think the OP's issue is either - probably a sports injury which needs some regular therapy to put right?

robdob - yup - thats about right - we are getting into areas with no definition. I would doubt HR would have standard defintions

Myself I would have thought cancer, diabetes and similar would come under disability discrimination but it ain't clear. I would doubt the OP would fall under disability discrimination for this

TUC take on it
Am I allowed time off work to see my doctor?

There isn't a general legal requirement for your employer to give time off for medical appointments. Whatever entitlement you have to time off to visit the doctor will be governed by your individual employment contract.

You should check your contract and staff handbook, as this may specify what the regulations are in your workplace. Some employers may require you to take annual leave, or take the time unpaid. On the other hand, many employers will be flexible on this, and it may be worth asking your employer if you can make up the time later.

If you have a disability which requires you to make regular medical visits, then the Disability Discrimination Act (soon to be consolidated within the Equality Act) may also apply here. This states that employers need to make 'reasonable adjustments' to prevent disadvantage to disabled employees. 'Reasonable adjustments' are not well defined in relation to this issue (so it would be a good idea to seek individual legal advice from your union or solicitor), but they could include greater flexibility in your hours to cover gaps, or availability of time off (paid or unpaid) when needed.

FWIW - at our place if you had a hospital appointment for something like the OPs poorly knee, you'd be allowed to knock off early & just go
If it was a regular appointment you'd be expected to - say - work a couple of lunchtimes to make up the time to some degree but it wouldn't be measured.
Something more serious & you'd be allowed whatever time you needed without any pay sacrifice, they'll even help with things like transport or childcare if it was required

robdob - Member
I'm reading between the lines a little, but the OP's attitude seems to be that everyone should work around him. Did he go to his boss when the injury happened and work out what he might need in terms of time off, coming to a workable compromise good for both sides? Or did he, as I suspect, just take the time off with little or no notice and try to wiggle out of the inevitable tense discussion with his now very annoyed boss?

You don't know me, or anything about me, yet assume so much. All of which was wrong.

I'm always happy to make time up, I have also where possible arranged my appointments before work.

Making time up for me isn't easy as I have child care issues. The only real option for me is to work during lunch time. My employee won't let me take less than 30 minutes lunch, so I can make up 20 minutes a day, which is well short of the 3 hours a week I'll need off.