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Except that’s the 1% of the 1% of the 1%.
Sure but underestimating the power of conspiracy, fringes and non-traditional media is partly how we got Trump and the Jan 6th insurrection.
These people are noisy empty vessels, but some of them have hundreds of thousands of followers and plenty more that don't follow but still see their content, believe it and repeat it.
A lot of the anti-mask anti-vaccine rhetoric getting spread at the moment is linked to the same nut jobs. Just as all the child-trafficking stuff was before.
There are people that take Lin Wood seriously! And Simon Parkes!
Except that’s the 1% of the 1% of the 1%.
No, it's a lot more than that.
The majority don’t even own a gun, not even the majority of households.
If you go to rural areas, I think you'll find gun ownership is pretty normal. If you go to cities in Democratic states, much less so. Republican messaging is targeting the nutty people in Republican states, they're the voters that dominate Republican primary elections. Keeping them happy is the only thing that matters if you want to go to Congress.
Except that’s the 1% of the 1% of the 1%.
It's not.
A few years ago, I worked with an-ex US Marine. He came across as a normal person.
When the electoral fraud stuff was all over the internet, he posted something on a mutual friends FB post. It was a link to a right wing nut job, Trump is still president, the Clintons are peado, blood drinking satanists.
There are a lot of Americans who believe that stuff.
And by that argument is everyone to the right of you in UK politics a supporter of this guy?
Sure but underestimating the power of conspiracy, fringes and non-traditional media is partly how we got Trump and the Jan 6th insurrection.
The other part is a complete inability of the left to be much better ("we" put Corbyn up as a candidate for PM don't forget).
The ability to empathize with another person's worldview and construct arguments around that seems to have been lost in favor of ad hominem attacks from both sides.
Republican messaging is targeting the nutty people in Republican states,
Exactly.
(and the overall figure for gun ownership is IIRC somewhere around 10-15% depending on what estimate you use for unregistered firearms and how you distribute them)
And by that argument is everyone to the right of you in UK politics a supporter of this guy?
No no, not at all, I was trying to say that as fringe as those views are, they still have enough of a movement in US politics to vote in loonies like Greene who has views that are seen as valid to them. Apologies I wasn't clear.
And we elect fringe people too.
Remember at their peak UKIP won 13% of the general election vote (but thanks to FPTP only one seat).
Remember at their peak UKIP won 13% of the general election vote
Not really fringe though when given the chance 52% voted for their policy of Brexit
It's not often that I agree with gobuchul but
It’s not.
A few years ago, I worked with an-ex US Marine. He came across as a normal person.
When the electoral fraud stuff was all over the internet, he posted something on a mutual friends FB post. It was a link to a right wing nut job, Trump is still president, the Clintons are peado, blood drinking satanists.
I've experienced this from a friend who is also an ex-US Marine. It's obviously nuts, but certain media outlets have made stuff like this mainstream - once again you only have to look at the posts made by our resident non-sequitur loving troll to see how the loonier assertions are accepted as fact by vulnerable people.
Not really fringe though when given the chance 52% voted for their policy of Brexit
People love simple solutions and explanations for complex problems. People were told that the EU is coming for our tea/light bulbs/sovereignty etc and thanks to social media, the disseminators of this guff found a way to reach their target audiences. The same is true for Trump - billions of dollars have been spent in attempts to remove context from slogans and thus persuade people to vote against their own interests.
The only real short term answers are to hold those disseminators of counter-factual material to account, which is no easy thing when there are vested corporate interests involved from some of the largest and most powerful businesses in the world.
Speaking of right-wing nutters, the NRA just took a brutal thrashing in court.
Professor Adam Levitin, a bankruptcy expert at Georgetown University, described the NRA’s bankruptcy strategy as “remarkably hare-brained” that raised the question, “what the hell were they thinking?” He pointed to several specific problems in the NRA’s case that led to the bad-faith determination.
“If you’re going to do a sketchy filing, the lesson from SGL Carbon was don’t tell everyone that you’re solvent and doing the filing to stiff a single creditor in your press release,” he wrote on Tuesday. “Yet, that’s exactly what the NRA did. Additionally, the pre-filing governance moves were really iffy (never telling the board of directors!), the creation of a forum-shopping sub completely blatant, and the NRA and its counsel never had their story straight about why they were filing.”
https://thereload.com/experts-paint-grim-picture-for-nra-after-bankruptcy-gamble-goes-bust/
Easy to mistake this article for parody.
Basically a large proportion of the people who worked with Trump came away deeply dismayed by his mental capabilities. O’Keefe, Ledeen, et al., looking at this epidemic of Trump appointees who consider him a complete moron, decided the problem was a deep-state cabal subverting Trump. And then, despite investing large sums of money, the expertise of a British spy, and several attractive women, did not get anybody calling Trump an idiot on camera. This would be like luring a group of tourists into the desert without air conditioning in the goal of getting somebody to say they’re hot, and failing.
https://twitter.com/jonathanchait/status/1392956877491904517
Wait, what? That is a pro-Trump trying to honeytrap normal workers into telling a camera that Trump is an idiot? What?
@willard that's how I read it too. Were they trying to draw their anti-trump members out into the open so they could be identified and expelled? That doesn't seem right, I'm scratching my head..
Yes, they wanted to try and identify deep-state agents within the Trump administration working to sabotage the Ranting Shitgibbon's plans.
Republican who runs that Arizona county has lost his patience...
https://twitter.com/stephen_richer/status/1393662268542386178?s=19
Until more genuine Republicans stand up and call out the "insane lies" he will continue to draw in the weak willed and wishful thinkers.
I think the sooner that Republicans realise that their party is now a Trump/Lie promoting machine, the better. There's talk now I think of a 3rd party.
FFS, is there a single honest person in MAGAland?
https://twitter.com/nwjerseyliz/status/1394535668315877377
Morecash, nickc,
I was watching Beau of the fifth column on YouTube and he was emphasising that if the 'real' Republicans are thinking that they need to split from the Trump party then they have to act now. They have to put up candidates in the mid terms else it will all be too little too late.
BBC News - New York prosecutor says Trump inquiry now 'criminal'
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-57166735
About to get very shouty, I suspect.
But he's such a great businessman...
Do they normally announce that an enquiry is now criminal? I've never seen that sort of announcement before. Is this just a warning shot to the Trump followers. A shot across the bows so it's not a huge shock when he gets arrested?
If not, what is the purpose of this announcement?
Do they normally announce that an enquiry is now criminal?
I think when it's cases like this, yeah mostly they do, it's a public investigation, so they may as well get the announcement out there under their terms.
I'm guessing they put it out there ahead of the colossal smokescreen he's going to put out about Democrats bring mean to him.
what is the purpose of this announcement?
From what I read elsewhere, they informed Trump's lawyers that the inquiry had been expanded to potentially include criminal matters. I assume they are required to keep the Trump side informed of developments and this is just keeping the public informed as well.
Did we already discuss the quote from the "QAnon Shaman"'s lawyer?
Watkins, the “Q Shaman” Jacob Chansley’s attorney, said his client had Asperger’s syndrome and indicated that Chansley’s mental state — and the impact of Trump’s “propaganda” efforts — would play a role in his case.
“A lot of these defendants — and I’m going to use this colloquial term, perhaps disrespectfully — but they’re all fing short-bus people,” Watkins told TPM. “These are people with brain damage, they’re fing retarded, they’re on the goddamn spectrum.”
“But they’re our brothers, our sisters, our neighbors, our coworkers — they’re part of our country. These aren’t bad people, they don’t have prior criminal history. ****, they were subjected to four-plus years of goddamn propaganda the likes of which the world has not seen since f***ing Hitler.”
Amazing.
More in the Talking Point Memo article: Capitol Rioters’ ‘Trump Defense’ Comes Up Again And Again. Will It Make A Difference?
One of Trumps losing 2020 temper tantrum
Miller told associates he had three goals for the final weeks of the Trump administration: #1: No major war. #2: No military coup. #3: No troops fighting citizens on the streets.
A lot of these defendants — and I’m going to use this colloquial term, perhaps disrespectfully — but they’re all fing short-bus people,” Watkins told TPM. “These are people with brain damage, they’re fing retarded, they’re on the goddamn spectrum.
or as Trump put it watching them on telly "low class".
they informed Trump’s lawyers
He still has one? After the A-Team, the Tiger Team, the Ninja-Squad, the Lawyer SEALS and all these other indefatigables ran away crying, I suppose there's always the public defender
“A lot of these defendants — and I’m going to use this colloquial term, perhaps disrespectfully — but they’re all fing short-bus people,”
A beautiful quote in isolation but this is more pertinent:
hey were subjected to four-plus years of goddamn propaganda the likes of which the world has not seen since fing Hitler.”
The biggest danger to democracy in the US isn't "short-bus people", it's the organisations that have crafted an alternative reality and have force fed the vulnerable with narratives like Q-Anon etc. While the capitol rioters need to face justice, I'd say that it's imperative that the personnel involved with Cambridge Analytica and Aggregate IQ, together with their investors are more culpable and should be dealt with accordingly.
Regarding the Arizona/Maricopa CyberNinja "audit", the official reply letter from the Maricopa Board of Supervisors is well worth a read.
Some highlights:
These accusations are false, defamatory, and beneath the dignity of the
Senate. ... Their stunning lack of a basic understanding for how their software works is
egregious ... You have rented out the once good name of the Arizona State
Senate to grifters and con-artists ... We are stunned that you are asking us this question. It demonstrates a spectacular lack of understanding on your part...
We will not be responding to any additional inquiries from your “auditors”. Their failure to understand basic election processes is an indication you didn’t get the best people to perform in your political theatre.
We have wasted enough County resources. People’s tax dollars are real, your “auditors” are not.
You are using purple lights and spinning tables. You are hunting for bamboo.
These are not things that serious auditors of elections do.
Bear in mind that most of the board writing this letter are Republican 😁
Worth following "legaldad" on TikTok for some good takes on the "audit". He's a lawyer with ties to Arizona.
Also worth looking at the results of the genuine audits that were already completed in Maricopa by two experienced independent firms (Pro V&V and SLI Compliance) that specialise in election audits, are accredited by the Election Assistance Commission and don't employ "ninjas":
https://www.maricopa.gov/DocumentCenter/View/66843/SLI-Compliance-Forensic-Audit-Report
https://www.maricopa.gov/DocumentCenter/View/66844/Post-Audit-Report
Funnily enough, they found nothing of note.
Bear in mind that most of the board writing this letter are Republican
Yeah, but Bill Gates was involved and he was mates with Jeffrey Epstein.
And now the Hamburglar dude is running for the U.S. Senate.
https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/1394962218173751302
Guess which gun-toting lawyer shares a lawyer with the QAnon guy.
Times they are achanging - possibly, maybe, hopefully
BBC News - Republicans defy Trump to back Capitol riot probe
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-57180679
Only the senate, it still has to pass the upper house I think. iirc it was the same with impeachment.
Yes, it will probably die in the Senate, but that is a surprising number of Republicans in the House that voted for it.
I'm still seeing lots of people online claiming that the Capitol riot was all just Antifa in disguise. 🙄
You'd like to think an official probe would help, but these people are already blindly ignoring the fact that no one arrested was antifa, and that right-wingers livestreamed it from their own social media accounts, so I doubt it.
I’m still seeing lots of people online claiming that the Capitol riot was all just Antifa in disguise.
I thought the Republican party had decided that the Capitol riot looked like a normal tourist visit?
See the guy on the left.? He now thinks it was just tourists.
So they lawyer claims the rioters were "brain damaged" etc. How many of them turned out to be in the services/police? Says a lot for their recruitment vetting!
Yeah, that's the alternate gaslight story. They have a few variants.
The rewritten narrative appears to be something like:
- The speeches beforehand didn't encourage any violence because Trump said "peacefully" (once, near the start. He also used the word "fight" 20 times and had the crowd chanting "Fight For Trump").
- It was a perfect peaceful protest. There was no violence or damage.
- The violence and damage was all caused by Antifa/BLM in disguise.
- There is no evidence of violence or damage and the fact that there is so much video evidence of violence and damage from live-streams shows that it was a frame up by Antifa.
- The people that tore down the American flag and erected the Trump flag in its place were also Antifa.
- Ashli Babbitt was a brave patriot who was murdered by security for no reason at all and/or she was an antifa agitator and/or she never really existed.
nickc
Full MemberSee the guy on the left.? He now thinks it was just tourists.
It's really bizarre, this. Because there's 2 photos of him during the attack that really stick out, one being that one where he is quite reasonably shitting his pants. But in the other, he was helping barricade the door against the mob, just a few yards from where Ashli Babbitt was killed. That's bloody brave and deserves recognition. (and self-interested, sure, but most people in the chamber were not doing what he did)
And then, he decides to rewrite history. So now instead of being the brave military veteran who stood the line between his colleagues and friends and a riot, he'll be remembered for the picture where he's shitting his pants, and as a completely dishonest terrorist apologist. Why would you do that to yourself? There's no shortage of other people who were spreading the lie...
as a completely dishonest terrorist apologist. Why would you do that to yourself?
Even weirder is that answer to that very sensible question appears to be; so an narcistic amoral embezzling orange shit-gibbon will think favourably of him.
I think you missed out increasingly irrelevant from that list of Trumps "qualities", which makes it even more peculiar.
Apparently 51% of Republican voters believe the storming of the Capitol building was done by the radical left seeking to discredit Trump.
As I posted earlier, Republicans like those voting in Congress are doing nothing more than virtue signalling. They need to shit or get off the pot and start another party else they are just enablers.
Half of the Republican party's support is bat shit crazy and the number of Republican representatives that are bat shit crazy is increasing as well. If you think you are hanging in there to try and save your party think again, your party is lost, see that 51% figure. The best that virtue signalling vote will get you is deselection or a Trump candidate standing against you come the next election cycle.
Does anyone on here think that there is any chance that the Republican Party will return to normality? That it will stabilise?......
Thought not, and given that thought, every day that so called non bat shit crazy Republicans procrastinate they are assisting the demagouges, traitors and fascists that they sit alongside (until they themselves get kicked out). They are destroying their country by backing a lie and that's bat shit crazy too.
Liz Cheney's primary challenger getting the dirty laundry out before oppo researchers do.
https://twitter.com/kenklippenstein/status/1395790033383301120
Apparently 51% of Republican voters believe the storming of the Capitol building was done by the radical left seeking to discredit Trump.
When he was in power, he was able to control the narrative and feed the big lie, now I would be surprised if the figure was still that high as he has been much less effective in communicating that lie in the face of reality. I think it will still be too high but I would expect it to be a bit less than 50%.
It is still a dangerous narrative to spout, but unless the democrats **** up big, it isn't a winning narrative. They may further radicalise those already too far along that path, but they are not winning anybody over with this stupidity.
Amazon buying MGM may get Trump nervous.... MGM own Apprentice outtakes
Amazon buying MGM may get Trump nervous…. MGM own Apprentice outtakes
The Orange Buffoon has closed his "From the desk" blog page. Probably because nobody was reading it. Hopefully he's becoming increasingly irrelevant. Fingers crossed!
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/02/trump-blog-page-shuts-down-for-good.html
cheque bounced.
Yeah, saw that last night. People like Sidney Powell, Steve Bannon, that creepy My Pillow guy and Michael Flynn are apparently vying to provoke an insurrection. It'll either be a treasonous plot that'll land at least one of them in jail, a means of signalling to wannabe GOP presidential candidates that team Trump are the only show in town, pure grift or the insane mutterings of an increasingly irrelevant bunch of loonies.
It’ll either be a treasonous plot that’ll land at least one of them in jail
That sounds a very fine line for them to be taking - or are they so far down the rabbit hole they are hoping their arrest will actually start it?
That sounds a very fine line for them to be taking – or are they so far down the rabbit hole they are hoping their arrest will actually start it?
There are elements funding the GOP who apparently believe that democracy is a barrier to competing with China amongst other things. It's a fair bet that there's a whiff of grift from the likes of the useful idiots like Powell et all, knowing that they can fall back on the "shortbus" defence.
DO you not think that all those touting a coup think they are safe because if they do get arrested/jailed it'd be 'proof' theres a consipiracy and it'll kick start the rebellion (whilst the mob frees them from jail)?
I see the 'audit' in Arizona are now going to give 'tours' of their work. Presumably other republican states will be given the VIP tour to see how they can join in. That starts getting a little creepy and dangerous. This stuff needs to be shut down now but it it does everyone is going to shout coverup.
a person familiar with his thinking said
"Thinking" here doing a lot of heavy lifting.
The former president had heard from friends that the site was making him look small and irrelevant
I love the emphasis on "small and irrelevant". Marvellous.
a means of signalling to wannabe GOP presidential candidates that team Trump are the only show in town, pure grift or the insane mutterings of an increasingly irrelevant bunch of loonies.
I hope people aren't thinking that now Trump has gone, so are his politics. The GOP have become infected with it, their recent actions demonstrate this, all it takes is for them to field a presidential candidate with trumpian politics, but without the trumpian idiocy, and the dems to do too much cosying up to corporate America, and 2024 could see a return.
This is by no means over.
The appeal of Trump to the Republicans was that his daily theatre on social media was a distraction while the functioning apparatus of the state was quietly neutered or dismantled. Make no mistake here, there are a number of candidates waiting in the wings to repeat the cycle and they will rely on an energized voter base overcoming apathy from the liberally minded to retake office, perhaps permanently.
This all goes back to spending limits on personal donations - a small number of sympathetic billionaires with deep pockets and one hand on the policy tiller are probably the greatest threat to American democracy right now. Fascism isn't a spontaneous movement - it relies on sponsorship to flourish, cut the funding off at the source and it withers and dies.
The appeal of Trump to the Republicans was that his daily theatre on social media was a distraction while the functioning apparatus of the state was quietly neutered or dismantled. Make no mistake here, there are a number of candidates waiting in the wings to repeat the cycle and they will rely on an energized voter base overcoming apathy from the liberally minded to retake office, perhaps permanently.
I don't think that's what happened. Trump said out loud what a lot of people thought. The Republican establishment initially believed he'd be a flash-in-the pan so they ignored him. Once he showed that the extremist voters supported him, other Republican politicians realized that opposing him would be the end of their careers. He just terrorized the Republicans and they were too scared to oppose him.
Guys like Ted Cruz and Josh Hawley are quite smart, but utterly dishonest. They know that Trump will eventually leave the scene so they are just hoping to pick up his supporters when that happens. It has nothing to do with policies because the Republican party basically has no policies anymore beyond cutting taxes and trolling liberals.
"This all goes back to spending limits on personal donations"
This is definitely what happened. The changing of the limits to personal donations which was forced through a few years back was the straw that broke the camel's back. That action was the 4th horseman of the apocalypse if you like, following on from the creation of fake news by removal of broadcasting standards and the courting of white evangelicals (citing them as the 'true' Americans) under Reagan, closely followed by Bush removing the controls on assault rifles etc, thus arming the mob.
Trump is only a symptom. The Republicans are the cause and they own this. I also have to agree with PJM with regards Cruz and Hawley circling an ageing Trump like the supplementary characters in 'The death of Stalin'. If I were Trump I would be nervous of accepting a cup of tea from either of them. It's all a bit more game of thrones rather than house of cards.
Trump is only a symptom. The Republicans are the cause and they own this. I also have to agree with PJM with regards Cruz and Hawley circling an ageing Trump like the supplementary characters in ‘The death of Stalin’.
The future of the GOP could lie with the opportunistic Ted Cruz, or the bible belt's choice Josh Hawley, or it could lie with Eric, Donald jnr or Ivanka. In congress we see the likes of Boebert and Taylor-Greene who are highly belligerent and have nailed their colours to the mast of the loonies - neither are particularly bright, but are sufficiently gobby to grab headlines with "own the libs" type narratives and policies which are basically a series of political non-sequiturs.
It all adds up to the conclusion that the GOP is collectively very, very sick - perhaps terminally so if they falter in the mid-term elections, we could see them replaced with something much worse unless the influence of individual donors across the political spectrum is drastically curtailed. There will no doubt be senior Republicans who'd privately breathe a sigh of relief if political funding was reformed.
david packman coup, interesting takes on the GOP back story....
Booooooooo...... snopes says false ^
Nice revenge for the Biden wasn't driving nonsense 🙂
Huh?
https://twitter.com/harrysiegel/status/1402045666516480004
https://pagesix.com/2021/06/07/bill-oreilly-to-go-on-qa-tour-with-donald-trump/amp/
Full text:
Network throats hawk Joe Boredom. Newspapers wrap around fish and Pelousy.
Refugees speak about no-kan-do Kamala. Donald’s newfound silence isn’t golden.
Comes now a never before thing. Shove tweets. It’s D. Trump himself, once the dominant decisionmaker and most powerful person in the world, on a historic speaking tour. Former President Trump will provide a never-before-heard inside view of his administration. In itself that’s historic.
Bill O’Reilly grew the seed. His newie 16th best seller, “Killing The Mob” is No. 3. His 2018 “The United States of Trump” unloaded half a million copies. Bill’s no shrunken violet.
The idea’s an unprecedented December/January national tour prepped with care and caution. Four venues. Start with Fort Lauderdale, Houston. No grand banquets. No hustling franks. A Q-&-A history of Trump’s administration.
Exactly how things were accomplished as well as what did not turn out well. “President Donald J. Trump’s Conversation with Bill O’Reilly: The History Tour.”
O’Reilly: “After Biden’s inauguration, the idea rummaged around in my head two months. I flew to Mar-a-Lago April 4. I know the man 30 years. He asked how we do this. I said, ‘No pandering. No politics. It’s your handling of China, Putin, the economy, ISIS, getting the vaccine. I’ve done the research. The key is it’s all history and people don’t even know how or what. I’ll ask the questions. We’ll record it. Two hours 15 minutes. Hockey and basketball arenas that seat 18,000. My own production company books it.
“What’ll it accomplish? It’s to know what actually happened. Frustrated millions never got actual reports from anyone. They only heard haters. It’s what he did and why — and what he didn’t do. Look, he wants to make history? It’s this. No president besides Lincoln experienced this much hate. It’s not being flamboyant. It’s tell the people what you did and why. Tell us your four years. Get your version on record. Show us how it works. Anyone who loves their country champions free speech.
“So not to badger him, I put it in writing. A 45 minute Q-&-A oral history. Then intermission. People can have a cocktail. Some may even need it. The Q-&-A will be on cards from the audience.
“Interested in the concept, he trusted me. He’s a businessman. He saw it right away.”
And then soft spoken, retiring O’Reilly grinned: “Who knows? Maybe I even sing a few songs.”
Isn’t that nice?
The city, state, country, the world having such great joy, comes now a reprise of a 1978 serial killer who killed five women in a spree. A film’s now being made of it called “Rodney & Sheryl,” starring Anna Kendrick. Also, to add to that, what could be better and merrier now than news that we’re also getting a redo of TV’s antique game show “The Dating Game.” Oh boy, oh joy! What next? Fatty Arbuckle in drag? Rudolph Valentino with a crew cut?Gavel bangs for Bailey
We just lost legal goliath F. Lee Bailey who defended sweeties such as O.J. Simpson and the Boston Strangler. Disbarred, did a little bit in jail, blew his retainers before the cases started, had four wives, and carried a rabbit’s foot for luck. I knew him well. Once so front page famous that comedy writer Bruce Vilanch’s answering machine chirped: “This is F. Lee Bailey.”Clutch the pearls
The pandemic’s checkerboard housing game has now infected Greenwich, Conn., which for the most part is inoculated against poverty. Parking on its crowded main drag, one local sniffed: “I hate all these awful New York license plates that we suddenly see all over here. It’s an infiltration. Disgusting to have these people invading us.”True story. This well-to-do Park Avenue couple needed a housekeeper. A highly recommended helper came for an interview. Wages, hours, duties were set, everything OK until this possible employee saw the husband in another room — age 90 — and reclining. Said this possible helper suddenly, “No, thanks. I don’t want this job. I’m looking for longtime permanent employment.”
Only in New York, kids, only New York.