I know many of us appreciate good value cycling and other outdoor kit from Decathlon (most of may favourite cycling base layers are from there), but before your next purchase you might want to take a look at this.
"Our hunting engineers designed this developed this powerful, consistent cartridge, specially adapted for thrush hunting. This cartridge performs at both medium and long range and has a consistent spread. This makes it the ideal cartridge for hunting thrush, songbirds, redwing, fieldfare, and mistle thrush."
Change.org petition here.
I thought you were ment to use yogurt.
So you have good warm clothing, yogurt free sex and don't get woken up by the dawn chorus.
Which bit are you objecting to, Made in Chine?
Are "thrush, songbirds, redwing, fieldfare, and mistle thrush" endangered or is this just a "people enjoy an activity I dont and it should be banned" petition?
What is the point of killing small birds? Just mindless killing?
I know there is a weird delicacy in France (ortolan) but really, they're just blatted for fun.
On that basis I'm for banning it.
but really, they’re just blatted for fun.
Are you a vegan? Etc
I've replied to this several times now and deleted it, but I rather think the root problem here - assuming there is one, I've no idea - isn't Decathlon. Different cultures have different ideas of what is acceptable, In the US you can buy assault rifles in Wal-Mart and no-one is lobbying them not to sell them or blaming them for mass shootings.
If this is a problematic issue then we could and should raise it in European Parliament in order to suggest legislating against... er, oh, wait, yeah.
What is the point of killing small birds? ... I know there is a weird delicacy in France
You're going to have a lot of delicacy left after hitting it in the beak with a shotgun cartridge.
Redwing and Fieldfare are protected species in England. I doubt a company as big as Decathlon would deliberately advertise a product for unlawful use.
Decathlon UK don't actually seem to have any stock of these anywhere, they aren't linked to from their content pages and they don't come up in the site search. So I suspect this is just a website glitch.
Harsh crowd tonight. I can't imagine Decathlon makes much money selling cartridges to kill small birds, so it's possible that they might be dissuaded from doing so if there's enough pressure.
In the US you can buy assault rifles in Wal-Mart and no-one is lobbying them not to sell them or blaming them for mass shootings.
https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-walmart-guns-pressure/walmart-faces-pressure-to-stop-gun-sales-after-latest-u-s-mass-shootings-idUKKCN1UV22X "Years of public pressure led Walmart, the largest U.S arms retailer, to end assault rifle sales in 2015"
Decathlon UK don’t actually seem to have any stock of these anywhere
The petition is to stop them selling them in France (or wherever).
The petition is to stop them selling them in France (or wherever).
The petition asks people to contact Decathlon UK and makes no mention of France.
Harsh crowd tonight.
"Tonight"?
I can’t imagine Decathlon makes much money selling cartridges to kill small birds, so it’s possible that they might be dissuaded from doing so if there’s enough pressure.
It's possible that they might. And that will achieve what, exactly? Do we think they're the only company in mainland Europe selling ammo?
“Years of public pressure led Walmart, the largest U.S arms retailer, to end assault rifle sales in 2015”
I was not aware of that. Cheerfully withdrawn, thanks for the correction.
This is the same point as above though. Wal-Mart no longer sells assault rifles (specifically, it still sells other guns and according to that article it refused to revise its policy after a mass shooting in a Wal-Mart store ), but it's not like that made any difference to anything other than their profits. You're not going to reduce murder by lobbying supermarkets.
“Years of public pressure led Walmart, the largest U.S arms retailer, to end assault rifle sales in 2015”
Perfect example of customer pressure working. I’m in with this one… signed.
Edit: brands don’t stop at national borders… pressure from UK customers about operations in France is entirely valid
the reason to avoid decathlon is their price gouging tactics during coronavirus. Their shops were shut so you couldn't buy in store (not their fault, I completely agree) - but realising the popularity of their stuff they removed free postage, and appeared to reduce the size of stuff you could c&c at asda - my stuff even arrived in a box saying 'free postage over £30', when I spent a chunk more than that. The postage wasn't even a reasonable amount - £7 for a skateboard.
the costs of shipping stuff obviously didn't rise during coronavirus, this is just them taking advantage of the situation and ripping folks off
Different cultures have different ideas of what is acceptable
But in this case, many of the bird species named as targeted by the product are migratory. The treatment of a migratory population in one nation can have a wider impact on conservation efforts elsewhere. So there's that.
I do think it's sad that enough people specifically want to target these bird species, enough to market a specific cartridge for it.
Don't think I'll let a company selling a legal product in another country stop me buying good quality cheap gear.
You could see this as someone else problem, or sign the petition to give Decathlon an idea about the strength of feeling in the UK. It’s quicker to sign the petition than taking the time to post about not caring, or not seeing it as your concern as a shopper. Whatever sits well with you.
The petition asks people to contact Decathlon UK and makes no mention of France.
Despite what the petition might say, Decathlon is a French company. There is no such thing as "Decathlon UK" to the best of my knowledge.
The petition lists a .co.uk URL so one of two things will happen, assuming anything at all happens:
1) The .co.uk site will kick it over the Channel to head office or
2) The .co.uk site will go "what are you bothering us about this for, we don't sell them?"
The last review on that page is six months old. It's not searchable from the front page. It is - obviously - not something you can buy online in the UK outside of the Dark Web. If Decathlon are "actively promoting and profiting from the killing" then they're doing a pretty poor job of it.
And the current version of the EU Birds Directive is 2009.
The UK URL is useful, because it describes the product in English.
For French speakers:
The treatment of a migratory population in one nation can have a wider impact on conservation efforts elsewhere. So there’s that.
There is and I agree. My point was rather that if it is a problem then it needs legislating against, not picking on one random retailer amongst many.
I do think it’s sad that enough people specifically want to target these bird species, enough to market a specific cartridge for it.
I wholeheartedly agree, I didn't know this a thing that existed as a 'sport' until this thread. But who am I to demand that others in different cultures conform to my sensibilities? We all know how popular "preachy vegans" are.
I also think it's sad that this time last year we could have actively done something about it.
Doubt we could have done much about it, if you are suggesting our government forcing something from above at the EU level… many EU countries would want to keep their exceptions for this kind of stuff… France isn’t nearly the worst culprit when it comes to shooting small migrant birds… plenty of other countries are for more into it, Malta springs straight to mind. As an EU member, we had to persuade other EU states to jointly adopt protection measures… we couldn’t force them on them. Anyway, customer pressure often leads the way and legislation follows behind… no campaign should sit back and wait for the law to be changed if they want things to happen. Consumers do have power.
You could see this as someone else problem, or sign the petition to give Decathlon an idea about the strength of feeling in the UK.
I want you to be correct, I really do.
But really, what's the argument here? We don't like that a product that they don't even sell in this country is being sold in other countries where it's both legal and culturally normal? Doubly so given that we've spent the last four years telling the EU exactly what we think of them, do you really expect we have any goodwill left here? You've seen that "behold my field..." meme, yes?
That's the fundamental problem with this goddamn country, we've got a massively over-inflated sense of our own importance. It's the attitude that gave us brexit, "they need us more than we need them." By this time next year I wouldn't be at all surprised if Decathlon had decided that we were a) too expensive to deal with any more and b) too much of an arrogant pain in the arse, then given a Gallic shrug, shut all the stores and pulled out of the UK market.
The point is that brands do respond to negative attention… and pressure on them to not sell products that consumers find questionable. If we decide that we all live in silos, and only challenge brands for what they do in our own countries, well… you can follow that logical route to its obvious conclusions yourself…
Yes, and I do take your point and I agree with it. But they aren't selling those products to us, they're selling them to consumers who don't find them questionable. Plenty of countries routinely eat horse meat though it's generally considered unpalatable (sorry) here.
Unfortunately we kinda do now live in a silo of our own creation. We live in a soggy little island and fairly recently threw away what was left of our global influence because something something brown people buses.
Bastards shit on the bonnet of my M5. ****-em give-em both barrels.
Nobody likes thrush in the bush!
That seems like odd behaviour from an outdoor pursuits equipment and apparel company. Were you parked across two bays or something?
If you're lucky, the petition will result in the product description on the website just getting amended to be less specific about what it's designed for.
But the most likely outcome is that somewhere in a decathlon corner office, a frenchman shrugs.
I'm all for trying to change things for the better - but one has to ask what you're hoping to achieve here? If you think a small number of brits can change the behavior of ANY number of French people, let alone the demographic of French people that goes out hunting songbirds for fun...... well: I admire your optimism.
I don’t like it but have to agree this seems a fairly pointless thing to get angry about. They don’t sell this product in the UK, and nothing in France will change as a result of this petition.
In a seemingly divided world ravaged by corona virus, with climate change looming and the risk of mutually assured nuclear annihilation only a mistweet away here we have people giving a **** about what a shop in France may or may not sell to people who maybe do something legal but unpleasant with it in another country.
Of all the things wrong with Decathlon, France and even the world this is the one you go out to bat for?
But really, what’s the argument here? We don’t like that a product that they don’t even sell in this country is being sold in other countries where it’s both legal and culturally normal?
Just because an activity is legal and culturally normal it does not mean most people in that country support it. It is also perfectly valid to petition a multi national company for activities done in a country different to yours. I really cannot understand your objection.
Exactly; plenty of people object to bull fighting from outside Spain.
That’s a very specific use for a cartridge. Does that mean you can shoot it at baby rabbits etc and it won’t harm them ?
Pointless.
They are selling a cartridge of 29 grams of no. 8 shot.
Available from any shotgun ammunition seller, and used by thousands of shooters in the UK every weekend when they go clay pigeon shooting.
There is no such thing as “Decathlon UK” to the best of my knowledge.
"Decathlon.co.uk is operated by Decathlon UK Limited trading as Decathlon (we, us and our). We are a limited company, registered in England. Our registered company number is 03140144, and our registered office is at Canada Water Retail Park, Surrey Quays Road, London, SE16 2XU. Our VAT registration number is GB679262296."
Whilst the directors/owner are French and Italian Decathlon UK Limited is not owned by Decathlon France according to Companies House.
Maybe we could use these to kill cats
poah
Member
Maybe we could use these to kill catsPosted 5 minutes ago
😃
Signed and shared, thanks.
It's a shitty thing to profit from. Also weren't people going bat shit about giro/camelback owners funding the NRA? This is the same, nowt wrong with using your spending choices to try and change the behaviour of organisations and incrementally societal and legal gubbins. Signed.
It's not the same though, is it? If you're funding a lobbying organisation it's quite easy to be accused of promoting something. Or at least enabling others to promote it on your behalf. Selling a sporting product as part of vast range of sporting products isn't really promoting something. You could say enabling maybe, but by that token every neighbourhood newsagent is promoting smoking. Every car manufacturer is promoting road death by selling cars that go above 70mph.
The petition starts off with a big giant strawman. Hysterical nonsense for the permanently outraged.
Also weren’t people going bat shit about giro/camelback owners funding the NRA?
I was going to say exactly he same thing!!
But who am I to demand that others in different cultures conform to my sensibilities? We all know how popular “preachy vegans” are.
Presumably you are also fine with the killing of endangered wild animals for use in 'traditional medicine'.
but by that token every neighbourhood newsagent is promoting smoking.
They were. That is why cigarettes in shops now have to be kept in locked cabinets with no advertising or even mention of the product.
Whilst the directors/owner are French and Italian Decathlon UK Limited is not owned by Decathlon France according to Companies House.
So the French managers at my local store are coincidence. 🤔
This does seem a pretty pointless petition. If the advert made no reference to killing baby robins and just let the baby robin shooters figure out which Decathlon cartridges would do the job, no one would have noticed.
So I'll await the petition to try and get Decathlon to stop selling fishing tackle next.
Wow, where to start with this. Well I can start by saying I'm not into blood sports. BUT - what is the difference between shooting small animals and shooting big ones? One would assume that the French have legislation protecting endangered creatures, so like anything else it is up to the shooter to only shoot what is allowed. So this website listing does not violate that. And what about fishing? Is that okay? It's still killing small animals.
Also weren’t people going bat shit about giro/camelback owners funding the NRA? This is the same
It's nowhere near the same. The NRA exist to lobby against the control of guns, particularly offensive anti-personnel weapons. It has little to do with sport shooters or hunters, in fact a lot of those people are vehemently anti-NRA because it makes them look like nutters. The Decathlon listing is sporting equipment, not that different to fishing tackle in my view.
Now, if you want to protest blood sports or shooting in general that is a legitimate position in my view and is something that you need to petition government about. But good luck getting the French govt to listen to you. You might've had a route through the EU govt but that's out of the window now.
Presumably you are also fine with the killing of endangered wild animals for use in ‘traditional medicine’.
That's absurd extrapolation. You can be okay with killing non endangered species but against killing endangered ones, for very obvious reasons.
At least fishing is a little more fair as there's a chance the fisherman would die of boredom before catching anything.
I'd suggest mols you have a look at the impact of trapping and shooting in the med and eastern Europe on migratory birds. It's one of the big factors, alongside habitat loss, driving some species close to extinction.
At least fishing is a little more fair
You're getting closer to home (assuming anyone here still rides bikes). Shimano is a major manufacturer of fishing gear.
Oh and rod and line fishing, in the UK at least, is a net benefit to biodiversity due to the habitats it protects.
Oh and rod and line fishing, in the UK at least, is a net benefit to biodiversity due to the habitats it protects.
You could equally say the BASC does the same. Full circle, again.
A bit, yeah. I'm not anti shooting per se though. Just anti the way birds are being hunted to extinction.
I'm going to own up to not really caring about this one.
If a French company want's to sell French people kit to legally murder birds in France I'm kind of not bothered. It's more of an issue for the French to decide if they want the sale of baby bird murder tools banned or not.
Us Brexitty Brits can have all the opinions we like even boycott their cheap badminton rackets and rucksacs, but a petition telling a foreign business how to operate on foreign soil is both pointless and a bit self important.
BUT – what is the difference between shooting small animals and shooting big ones?
The size is not the issue, the issue is killing animals for fun that have declined massively in recent years. Song Thrush in the UK are down by about 50% in the last few decades, I imagine it's a similar picture in France.
This:
I’d suggest mols you have a look at the impact of trapping and shooting in the med and eastern Europe on migratory birds. It’s one of the big factors, alongside habitat loss, driving some species close to extinction.
This is worth a look as well for those insisting that killing migratory birds is legal and nothing to be worried about.
but a petition telling a foreign business how to operate on foreign soil is both pointless and a bit...
Would it be STW without disagreement?
A petition by definition (if I’m correct) is a request, an appeal etc, usually to a power/authority.
Quite the opposite of dictating to someone.
...
self important.
See above
If these birds are being killed for fun, that's not cool and I don't agree with it at all.
However, there are far greater crimes in the frozen food isle in supermarkets, which most of us are party to. It perplexes me that people are so vocal with their outrage on these matters, but more often than not completely unwilling to change their own behaviour which would have a far greater impact in terms of reducing the suffering of animals.
I was unaware that they use glue-traps to live-trap songbirds as decoys. There’s even a robin for the STW fans of memelore. Not personally aware of the origin/meaning of the ‘baby robin’ meme so apologies if it mixes messages.
“Those are verguettes: sticks covered in glue. The callers call, other birds come, land on a verguette, and they’re stuck. The more they struggle to get away, the more they become stuck.”
Decathlon say
By committing to eco-design, we give millions of plastic bottles a second life. We stop them from filling up and polluting our environment and hurting other humans and creatures, meaning you can wear our clothing and use our equipment in good conscience.
From mountain tops to local parks, sports halls to ocean waves, the pleasures and benefits of sport can be shared anywhere, by anyone.
And
Protect our mother nature
We help people stay healthy for longer through sports and, at the same time, aim to have a positive impact on the planet.
https://www.decathlon.co.uk/about-decathlon.html
It perplexes me that people are so vocal with their outrage on these matters, but more often than not completely unwilling to change their own behaviour
Haven’t personally seen any ‘outrage’ on here. May have missed some posts. Just the characteristic STW understatement, snark and/or ‘meh’.
But if it makes you feel any better - I signed the petition, true. Do you know want/require me to tell you all of the other things* (activism, employment, habits, diet, footprint, purchasing, campaigning, fiscal support) that I do and have done? Or would that be ‘virtue-signalling’? TBH I’d feel uncomfortable to have to do so every time I comment on a post about something related. Do I have to prove that I’m a card-carrying UK anti-bloodsport campaigner* in order that my appeals to the French aren’t motivated by xenophobia? Not so far-fetched a concern hereabouts.
*causes/issues/environmental/wildlife/anti-cruelty/humanitarian etc
These things aren't a simple mathematical sum of whether X or Y causes more suffering.
Much like fox hunting, I think why people find it so distasteful is that the birds are being killed for entertainment, and most people don't like the that now. Especially when it's grown men killing tiny songbirds with shotguns (struggle to call this hunting).
It's also more than just the cruelty aspect. The turtle dove is a particular favourite but is on the brink of extinction. These activities are a genuine threat to biodiversity.
think why people find it so distasteful is that the birds are being killed for entertainment, and most people don’t like the that now
Possibly for some but (as always) doesn’t pay to assume that is the only motivation for objection. That’s speaking for them, ie black and white generalising - yet the subject is not so much. There are still people alive who actively care about biodiveristy/healthy ecosystems as much as they do cruelty. Probably some who don’t even care about cruelty but do yet care about the environment. I’m not (I don’t think) the pass-me the smelling salts type having shot, trapped and mutilated quite a few birds and animals for ‘sport’ when younger.
Meh, Whatever...
I don't disagree that little birdy murder is a bad thing, it's certainly not my hobby of choice.
I just lack your conviction that Decathlon should be the focus of any anger over it, I just think there are bigger issues to deal with right now.
The size is not the issue, the issue is killing animals for fun that have declined massively in recent years.
Ok but as above - this is not a songthrush-specific piece of equippment. It's a small shotgun cartridge. The problem is if people choose to shoot endangered birds or animals with it.
I just lack your conviction that Decathlon should be the focus of any anger over it, I just think there are bigger issues to deal with right now.
Am pretty sure the OP has been suitably shamed by now. Maybe they should have not come over so angry about the widdle-biddy birdywirdies (and so uncaring over bigger issues?)
Songbirds - 2
STW - 10
Next?
It is also perfectly valid to petition a multi national company for activities done in a country different to yours.
We've literally spent the last four years banging on about "Brussels telling us what to do" and we're proposing now to tell Spain and France what to do? Hypocrisy much? We've made our bed here I'm afraid.
I really cannot understand your objection.
I don't object to it, I think it's laudable. I also think it's pointless.
It the 'hunting' is problematic - and I don't know enough about it to form an opinion on it either way - then it needs legislating against and enforcing. The problem here is not Decathlon.
(For the avoidance of doubt: I don't support hunting of live targets for 'sport' in any form whatever the target.)
Exactly; plenty of people object to bull fighting from outside Spain.
And as a result, bullfighting was outlawed.
Oh.
Presumably you are also fine with the killing of endangered wild animals for use in ‘traditional medicine’.
Presumably you're also against killing animals and turning them into burgers?
https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/logicalfallacies/Appeal-to-Extremes
Do you think an effective way of controlling the illegal hunting of endangered species would be to start a petition asking Decathlon China to stop selling bullets that can kill rhino?
Do you think an effective way of controlling the illegal hunting of endangered species would be to start a petition asking Decathlon China to stop selling bullets that can kill tigers?
See again ‘appeal to extremes’ and an ‘either/or’ fallacy ^
The OP petition doesn’t explicitly call for Decathlon to stop selling cartridges that can kill songbirds.
Decathlon must stop promoting slaughter of songbirds and migratory birds
This petition calls for Decathlon to:
- publicly condemn the slaughter of songbirds and small migratory birds,
- revise their product range* and marketing accordingly, and
- make a meaningful contribution to wildlife protection.
*open to interpretation. The petition’s focus is more on Decathlon’s explicit promotion of shooting songbirds
These activities are a genuine threat to biodiversity.
This.
You can be perfectly accepting of killing animals for food, sport, or whatever... and still want species to be protected... and pressure on brands and other commercial interests can often be at the forefront of change when it comes to that protection... rather than waiting for governments and/or transnational bodies to legislate. See also habitat protection...
Ah, you're right, it's asking them to change their advertising. That'll be far more effective, then.
"Mon deiu et zut alors, I went on to ze Decathlon for ze thush bullets and all I can find are zese 9mm shotgun rounds! Fancy a game of Backgammon instead, Claude?"
These activities are a genuine threat to biodiversity.
Assuming this to be true (and I don't know if it is) then it needs banning, or at least tightly regulating.
pressure on brands and other commercial interests can often be at the forefront of change when it comes to that protection…
Fair actually, you have a point here.
You know, I'm coming round to this way of thinking now. I still think that this isn't the root of a solution but sometimes to affect change you need to take baby steps.
I find it really depressing that Brits want to sign a petition to force a French company to change what they do in France.
I still think that this isn’t the root of a solution but sometimes to affect change you need to take baby steps.
I agree that it feels a bit [edit: 'very'] futile to sign this petition in the grand scheme of things... but so does so many actions we could take, or choose not to take... that inaction then fast becomes the default, sadly.
I find it really depressing that Brits want to sign a petition to force a French company to change what they do in France.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. You are effectively saying that no one should comment or campaign on anything that happens "abroad"... despite the fact that what happens in other countries directly impacts what happens here. See migratory birds.
kelvin, what johnhe is saying is that a bunch of Brits telling the French what to do in a self-righteous way is not likely to have the effect they want.
Imagine the situation reversed; the Daily Mail and Telegraph would be urging their readers to going out and jump on baby robins, just to show Jonny Foreigner
*edit - Can’t be arsed.
Sad face.
I find it really depressing that Brits want to sign a petition to force a French company to change what they do in France.
For me it rather hinges on a question I don't know the answer to, which is "is this a problem?" Are other countries doing something which is wrong or something which we don't like? Two very different propositions.
If the former then more needs to be done than just signing a petition and then patting yourself on the back for a job well done, you might as well offer hopes and prayers. Anyone on here care sufficiently about the issue to have written to an MEP about it yet?
If the latter, well, Tibetan monks might be appalled that they could walk into a UK Decathlon and buy a fishing rod. How do you think Britain, collectively, would respond to a petition from Tibet calling for them to publicly denounce the maiming / murdering of fish for sport and rebrand the rods as water retrieval systems? Half the country would go take up fishing out of spite.
This is your bullfighting / endangered species argument. We're not objecting to it for reasons of cultural differences, we're objecting because it's objectively wrong to torture animals to death and drive species to extinction. A sternly worded petition to a sporting goods shop isn't going to stop the trafficking of powdered rhino horn.
We’ve literally spent the last four years banging on about “Brussels telling us what to do” and we’re proposing now to tell Spain and France what to do?
You may have I haven't and you point doesn't stand anyway as we are addressing decathlon with the petition.
Presumably you’re also against killing animals and turning them into burgers?
The two are pretty unrelated as far as I can see, maybe you could explain the similarities?
I get that you obviously don't want to sign the petition, that's fine, don't sign, it state why if you must and move on. Not sure why you have to be critical of those whose opinions differ from you.
And as a result, bullfighting was outlawed.
Not really. A form of it was limited in Catalunya by a motion pushed by the separatists in order to distance themselves from something that has been Spanish culture for a very long time.
You may have I haven’t
If you've looked at any of the political threads in the last five years you'll know full well I haven't.
we are addressing decathlon with the petition.
... a French company. Once more with feeling, if France sent a petition to Go Outdoors asking them to change their marketing about something they disapproved of and the red-tops got wind of it what do you think would happen? Do you reckon the Daily Express would run headlines praising it as an excellent notion?
If a brand present in both French and UK markets was promoting something in the UK that French customers thought was putting migratory species at risk, then I'd welcome French citizens petitioning that brand to stop doing so, why wouldn't I?!? This is all really odd.
Not sure why I'd care what the Express wanted me to think about it.
If you’ve looked at any of the political threads in the last five years you’ll know full well I haven’t.
So why post what you did then?
if France sent a petition to Go Outdoors asking them to change their marketing about something
It's a petition to a multi national company who operate within the UK to ask them to not promote the shooting of songbirds. It's nothing like the scenario you have made up in your head.
Do you reckon the Daily Express would run headlines praising it as an excellent notion?
I don't know about you but worrying what the Daily Express might think about any of my actions never happens
So why post what you did then?
Because they won we lost shut up and get over it, remember? Any dissenting voices are to be silenced, this is the new order.
More seriously - this has been an overpowering narrative for years. Assuming it to be a good idea, it's really bad timing politically to be "telling other countries what to do." And yes I know, that's not what were doing, we're asking someone nicely to change their marketing - but that's almost certainly how it will be spun. Which means it might well have the opposite effect to the one intended.
then I’d welcome French citizens petitioning that brand to stop doing so
Yes, but then you are (I assume) a normal, rational and compassionate human being. As the events of the last few years have proven time after time, from the referendum in 2016 to people in the middle of a global pandemic four years later who think the whole thing is a hoax and / or refuse to wear masks as an act of defiance because they don't want to be told what to do, you and I appear to be somewhat in the minority.
Some really simple words and concepts not being understood here.
‘Petition’ is by definition not ‘force’.
A petition is (was?) defined and understood to be an appeal to power. Usually an appeal to that power to change something.
A petition is not ‘force my beliefs on you’.
An appeal to power. A request.
It’s the very opposite of ‘force‘.
It’s a show of the potential/actual strength of feeling regarding some fact/issue and an appeal to act based upon said fact/issue.
If an international retailer doesn’t listen to international appeals then fine. But at least the appeal was made and the concern was more widely promoted which in itself may bear some fruit.
Neither does signing a petition exclude/disallow the signee from other forms of activism regarding this or other concerns, even if you think that it does. Neither if you project those thoughts onto the signee. It’s weird I know. Humans are weird and continually project.
^ These simple facts should clear up most of the objections and misunderstandings. I suppose if the time has come where ‘petition’ is now more commonly (mis) understood to mean ‘force someone to comply’ then I’ll step down and petition appeal* the Dictionaries to make the requisite changes 😑
*How long before ‘make an appeal’ is also defined as a ‘application of intolerant force‘? We seem to be eroding everyday language (and understanding) to black vs white tabloid levels.