[Closed] Cultural politics: meat without slaughter

[i]has recently developed a way to grow muscle under lab conditions - by feeding pig stem cells with horse fetal serum.[/i]

sounds Yummy

as Yummy as any other flesh surely..?

Funny, I was thinking about this the other day - if we could grow meat that was indistinguishable from the real thing but obviously didn't the involve the waste, slaughter and potential ethical issues would veggies (and non) eat it?

Not keen to be honest Clubber. It's a texture/taste thing for me though.

That's obviously a different issue but most veggies/vegans I know don't dislike meat, they just don't agree with how it's derived.

I think after a while, the whole idea of meat (however it's delivered) is just a bit unappealing. It's like those fake bacon and steak things made of quorn, just something weird about them really.

meat tastes better because you know it was once living and breathing
there's something visceral about it

brakes that's horrible LOL, Are you a zombie? 😆

Dead flesh!!! yuck

Err no thanks 🙁

I'd prefer to stick to the natural order of things personally: Human kills animal, eats animal. I'm quite happy killing my own too.

Funny, I was thinking about this the other day - if we could grow meat that was indistinguishable from the real thing but obviously didn't the involve the waste, slaughter and potential ethical issues would veggies (and non) eat it?

But if (and I accept that it's a big if) it was completely indistinguishable from the real thing, PP?

EDIT - same question to seosamh77

Has anyone answered how they get pig stem cells and horse fetal serum without real animals yet? So I foresee a time where we grow meat in a lab but keep thousands of animals for the ingredients

I think you'd have to not know that it wasn't the real thing

most veggies/vegans I know don't dislike meat, they just don't agree with how it's derived.

Not all people are vegetarian for the same reason.

I don't eat meat because I find the idea of eating dead flesh repulsive. Nothing to do with "aw, the poor fluffy piggy-wigs," it's just rank. For that reason, I'm oot.

I think it's a good idea though, because a lot of vegetarians are so for moral reasons, and I'd have thought that many meat eaters would have been happier being able to get the same food in a more ethical manner but maybe not.

I don't eat meat because I find the idea of eating dead flesh repulsive. Nothing to do with "aw, the poor fluffy piggy-wigs," it's just rank. For that reason, I'm oot.

If it's artificially made it was never 'alive' so how can it be 'dead'?

It's just an animal product, in that respect not much different to milk.

Same reasoning that some people get squeamish at horror movies I guess.

I guess, in order to consider eating it, I'd have to think there was a good reason. I can't think of one.

But if (and I accept that it's a big if) it was completely indistinguishable from the real thing, PP?

Big 'IF' yes! 🙂

If I knew about it, I would refuse to eat it. Just the same as I buy freerange chicken & eggs, and my meat from a local butchers. There's limits IMO. I'm not eating that crap!

Soylant Green anyone?

I don't eat meat because I find the idea of eating dead flesh repulsive

But this is really just tasty 'stuff'. It's got less of a concept of being alive than a vegetable!

Yuck, that sort of thing should be banned, along with Quorn and other non-foods.

I buy my sausages form a bloke called Dan who makes them himself using his own herb and spice mixes. The meat comes from a couple of the local pig farms I ride by on the way to some of the local trails. The pigs are well looked after and I see no welfare issues. they are slaughtered less than five miles from the farm and delivered less than five to Dan, Trev and the gang who do the rest. Same with the beef and lamb (not so local due to our terrain), full traceability and from places I've been myself. If I ride local I could probably point at the group of animals and guesstimate how soon I'd be eating them and in what form. why would we want to change that?

Edit: There's now an interDan and interTrev too if you want some!
[url= http://www.wilkinson-butchers.co.uk/butchery_awards.php ]iSausage[/url]

I have not eaten meat for about twenty five years about two years in to being veggi i went to france for a month and rather than cause a fuss i ate meat . I found it hard to digest and got quite ill from really well prepared high quality meat . For that reason i would not want to eat even vat grown ethical meat .

There very quickly came apoint when i stopped asociating meat with food .

I do love vegi bacon though and fish so i am technicaly a veggihypoctyte.

But if (and I accept that it's a big if) it was completely indistinguishable from the real thing, PP?

EDIT - same question to seosamh77

been waiting for this to come along for a while the technology has been there just waiting to become economically viable I suppose

vat grown meat solves a lot of ethical and environmental problems - in theory

though so many luddites reject gm that it may take a long time to become popular

cows only for zoos in the future

is probably eat soylent green though so what do I know

I think that in the age of the pink, shrink-wrapped wobbly bit of supermarket flesh most people have forgotten what an effect age, diet, exercise, breeding has on the taste and nutrition of meat. I suppose they could add some flavour enhancers for salt-marsh lamb, or Berkshire pork, but I'll stick to growing or shooting my own or buying from my local farmer. If that sounds like total food snobbery, it probably is 🙂

In terms of politics, given the massive rate of increase of meat consumption in the BRIC countries, I can see real meat becoming a true luxury product (once again) and perhaps cheap lab-grown meat will feed those on middle and low incomes in the West.

Sounds better than quorn, which must win the prize for most processed food ever:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quorn#Production

[i]Quorn is made from the soil mould Fusarium venenatum strain PTA-2684 (previously misidentified as the parasitic mould Fusarium graminearum [20]). The fungus is grown in continually oxygenated water in large, otherwise sterile fermentation tanks. Glucose is added as a food for the fungus, as are vitamins and minerals to improve the food value of the product. The resulting mycoprotein is then extracted and heat-treated to remove excess levels of RNA. Previous attempts to produce such fermented protein foodstuffs were thwarted by excessive levels of DNA or RNA; without the heat treatment, purine, found in nucleic acids, is metabolised by humans, producing uric acid, which can lead to gout[/i]

Interesting. I was veggie from 12yrs old to 30something. Originally it was for health reasons and later just because eating meat seemed weird. I'm still a little funny about it so try not to have extraneous meat (e.g. in sandwiches or pies), and instead have steak and proper dedicated meat sessions.

I guess the article brings to mind up all the usual Frankenfood concerns and appeals to the precautionary principle. Still, given water shortage is a real concern on the horizon and the amount it costs to produce meat, the technology is at the very least worthy of attention. Could it be any worse than a kebab? 😆

But just think- this could only be the beginning - maybe one day we will be able to grow donuts and have free-running beer fountains.

There very quickly came apoint when i stopped asociating meat with food .

That sums it up quite nicely for me.

I do love vegi bacon though and fish so i am technicaly a veggihypoctyte.

Well, no, technically you're a pescetarian, not a vegetarian (unless you mean veggie fish).

Sounds better than quorn

Yet, people eat mushrooms.

Mmmmm, 'shrooms! Yummy! 😀

It doesn't meet with my middle class Waitrose derived Organic philosophy.

would rather support proper farmers

Different thread altogether but WTF's a proper farmer these days?

quorn, which must win the prize for most processed food ever

Tbh, doesn't sound [i]that[/i] processed. Fungus is grown, fed with glucose, then heat treated? Your average pint of shitty beer sees more processing than that. As for "cereals", canned food, many sweeties...Quorn sees very little processing.

And as Cougar says...people eat mushrooms.

And tbh, "Frankenfoods" will become more and more part of our diet if we continue to live as unsustainably wrt meat consumption as we do. (not "we" as in STW, but "we" as in the whole world)

Sounds better than quorn, which must win the prize for most processed food ever:

Doesn't actually sound all that different - an industrially processed foodstuff, targetted for a specific nutritional result.

But I wouldn't eat and I can't rationalise why not, it's still meat to me.

hugh fearnley whittinstall:

'we need to eat more veg, and thereby eat less meat... because vegetables are the food that do us the most good, and our planet the least harm'

pissing about with test tubes isn't going to help anyone, or anything, except probably monsanto.

and stuff your bloody Quorn, it makes me feel sick.

and breathe...

🙂

WTF's a proper farmer these days?

And I totally agree with the comment about Monsanto (substitute other agri-industrial business) - food should not be patented. It will be though.

Can't see the vegansexuals getting on board with it.

As it was done in the 50s? I hope they're not chopping down all the hedgerows 😯

Though I like the idea of the whole world getting their pork from a bloke called Dan, I suspect parts of the rest of the world might not be able to pay the premium I'm sure his meat deserves.

Even then, if Dan could step up his production to feed the world, I suspect his methods require an incredible amount of energy and space.

Options? 1. We could accept that mass produced meat from battery animals using low energy feed and no space provides reasonably cheap, efficient and tasty food, and not worry about animal welfare or the future of our planet.

2. Tell everyone poor to stop eating meat.

3. Grow our meat from the magical meat tree (am I the only one that can see the amazing sandwich possibilities of this option?)

Grow our meat from the magical meat tree

I thought I found one of these, then a gang of lads jumped me and beat me up.

Turned out to be a ham bush.

Seriously, we're here all night folks...