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Today's CityAM:
Brendan O’Neill, editor of Spiked Online.The way people are talking about the Calais migrants, you’d think that they were a chapter of Isis. They’re trying to “storm” Britain, papers say. Tory leaders have held Cobra meetings, basically putting Britain on a war footing. All in response to a measly 5,000 migrants across the Channel, a few hundred of whom have crossed in recent months.
Some desperate people, from dirt-poor African countries or war-torn Syria, get to Britain, and we lose the plot. New York famously asked the world to give it their “huddled masses”; we see huddled masses and virtually declare a state of emergency. What illiberal meanness.
Much of Britain was built by Irish sweat, is nursed with Nigerian care, and has hospitality provided with a Romanian smile: migrants make this nation tick. We shouldn’t send soldiers to keep out the Calais hopefuls; we should send a welcoming committee. Let them in to do what they long to do: be safe, work, live.
Tory leaders have held Cobra meetings, basically putting Britain on a war footing.
He has no idea what Cobra is then. Just a fancy name for another 'look like we're doing something, but actually we're not' committee.
Only let 'em in if they're racists. Otherwise send 'em back to where they come from.
"COBRA" is an acronym for: Committee Office Building Room A".
Carry on...
Let them in and look after them is what rich peaceful countries like us and our European neighbours should do.
Mr Woppit - Member"COBRA" is an acronym for: Committee Office Building Room A".
Carry on
Cabinet Office Briefing Room
Carry on...
Ah yes. Of course. My bad. 🙂
🙂
Was listening to a program on the World Service last night.
Reporter was on a ship patrolling the Med near Tunisia.
They picked up 2000 migrants [i]in one day[/i].
Sicily is accepting the same number of people who are camped out in Calais on a daily basis. If we let the 2000 in Calais now in the problem wouldn't go away but it would take time for numbers to build up again which would enable security at the Eurotunnel terminal to be upgraded without nightly mass break-ins happening.
The least they could do is bring over some wine and cheese.
Seems pretty obvious to me.
If someone has made it as far as Calais then they are resilient, determined, motivated and full of initiative. Most likely in emplyment in their country of origin which has enabled them to pay to get this far. Exactly the sort of people we need. Let them in and embrace the opportunity.
If you want to pacify the Jeremy Vine / Dail Mail / UKIP brigrade then balance the number with a one in, one out policy. I would start by rounding up anyone htat has appeared on Jeremy Kyle show and air drop them into Somalia...*
*not entirely serious but you get the idea.
O'Neils advice is wrong. By accepting the migrants, you send a message to the people back home in North Africa, which encourages them to take to the boats risking life and limb.
What to do? Stop invading and getting involved in other peoples countries. This is very much the aftermath of Iraq and also Cameron's interventions in Libya.
Some desperate people, from dirt-poor African countries or war-torn Syria
If they really are [i]desperate[/i] then why haven't they applied for Asylum in France?
If someone has made it as far as Calais then they are resilient, determined, motivated and full of initiative. Most likely in emplyment in their country of origin which has enabled them to pay to get this far. Exactly the sort of people we need. Let them in and embrace the opportunity.
You think we should leave asylum policy to be decided by 'who is crafty enough to get here' rather than 'who is in greatest need'?
Surely a more humane policy would be to only accept refugees from legitimate agencies, such as the UNHCR, who prioritise those in need from the refugee camps. Anyone who subverts the system, or tries to short cut it, should be sent back.
Indeed, one could argue that the countries and refugee camps are most in need of retaining the determined, motivated and full of initiative to build a future.
the obvious response is 'because the french smell funny'
but, the interviews i heard on R4 suggest it's at least partly because a lot of them can already speak excellent English, and they think Britain is more welcoming than France...
[i]If they really are desperate then why haven't they applied for Asylum in France?[/i]
Why should it make a difference?
Either France or Britain could easily accept them, just give them a legal way of entry.
Close the Tunnel, simple answer.
because a lot of them can already speak excellent English, and they think Britain is more welcoming than France...
Right, so they're not [i]that[/i] desperate after all then?
If they really are desperate then why haven't they applied for Asylum in France?
By far the vast majority do.
If they really are desperate then why haven't they applied for Asylum in France?
They're not stupid. Like the professional French who've also decided to live in England...
If they really are desperate then why haven't they applied for Asylum in France?
Partly our colonial legacy in Africa, which means Britain is held in high regard by many people there and the common language.
Plus they've been reassured by people smugglers that they will have a great life once they arrive here.
You could, well you could just get a huge arctic lorry open the back up, let them all jump in, close the doors and then turn the truck around to say the South of France and open the doors back up and let them out.
Just sayin'
you wanted a discussion, heres something to moot.
Either France or Britain could easily accept them, just give them a legal way of entry.
+1 This whole sorry mess is because Dave and his chums decided to pander to the right wing loonies (and that's giving him a lot of credit by not lumping them in with them) and declare that Britain is full and we won't be accepting our share of the refugees that arrive in Europe.
That we're making refugees live in a makeshift camp under a motorway should be national disgrace, instead it's almost a vote winning policy to keep them there and build a bigger fence!
Partly our colonial legacy in Africa,
It's a French legacy in North Africa, not British.
Partly our colonial legacy in Africa, which means Britain blah blah
I prefer to think that it's because (from what I've seen of the interviews on the telly) they are intelligent, resourceful and motivated people who can make up their own minds.
thisisnotaspoon - Member
the refugees that arrive in Europe.
those poor buggers over in Calais are not refugees.
That we're making refugees live in a makeshift camp under a motorway should be a national disgrace
WE?
[i]Under article 13 of the European Union directive of January 27, 2003, laying down minimum standards for the reception of asylum seekers (the reception directive), EU member states must provide “material reception conditions to ensure a standard of living adequate for the health of applicants and capable of ensuring their subsistence.”
Under French law, asylum seekers are entitled to accommodation in a state reception center (centre d’accueil pour les demandeurs d’asile, CADA), where they also receive social and administrative support while their asylum claim is processed.[/i]
So How exactly are WE to blame?
For the most part, they're not refugees, they're economic migrants.
Time for Sangatte II internment camp. Properly policed and secure where people can be processed and genuine refugees offered asylum and all the others returned to Country of origin.
People being squashed on a daily basis is not really an option is it?
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If we shared out the wealth of the world in an equal way, everyone who reads this would be a big loser, so we don't want to do that. The rest is trying to justify why we deserve to be the benefactors of the lottery of where we were born. (I do it myself, so I'm not claiming any moral high ground here).
If we shared out the wealth of the world in an equal way, everyone who reads this would be a big loser, so we don't want to do that. The rest is trying to justify why we deserve to be the benefactors of the lottery of where we were born. (I do it myself, so I'm not claiming any moral high ground here).
This is it really. We all do it, whether concious or not.
Dave seems to think that if we give a tiny percentage of our GDP to dodgy regimes to then dissapear into offshore bank accounts, then they should all be bally grateful, and that should stop them all coming here.
"COBRA" is an acronym for: Committee Office Building Room A".
No, it was named after this guy.. now there is someone who gets the job done.
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Dave seems to think that if we give a tiny percentage of our GDP to dodgy regimes to then dissapear into offshore bank accounts, then they should all be bally grateful, and that should stop them all coming here.
Instead of just letting in the very sort of self-motivated, resourceful and determined people that he says we need to be accepting as immigrants. Apparently.
I prefer to think that it's because they are intelligent, resourceful and motivated people who can make up their own minds.
You really think they chose to spend their days trying to jump on moving trains?
People smugglers told them that the journey would be relatively easy and they'd be welcome (or at least tolerated) when they arrived. Pretty sure Sangette is a massive shock to most of them.
.... and they've not seen Rochdale yet.
A few weeks a go Radio 4 were inerviewing the would-be migrants in Calais, all of them had been told, by the people smugglers no doubt, that once you arrive in the UK they immediately give you a house, and free money
If we shared out the wealth of the world in an equal way, everyone who reads this would be a big loser, so we don't want to do that. The rest is trying to justify why we deserve to be the benefactors of the lottery of where we were born. (I do it myself, so I'm not claiming any moral high ground here).
To be fair though it all revolves around the cost of living. It wouldn't actually cost that much to have a good standard of living in much of the developing world. I could actually have a better standard of living in the Philippines if both me and my wife were on 35000 pesos a month (around 500 quid) than we could here - you can get that wage with a half decent degree from UP Diliman or some of their other good universities. It's just that things like nice mountain bikes would be much more expensive.
What is needed is education and opportunities for people. If we shared the wealth equally (7500 dollars each), there would still be a lack of opportunities and education in the developing world. Rectifying this requires economic growth.
.... and they've not seen Rochdale yet.
Did you see the C4 programme about Romanians? There was a nice lady, a nurse, who had been told she was going to Grange-over-sands. Instead she was sent to Sheffield. Driving to the dingy house-share she'd been given she said "It's hilly. Like Rome". I shed a tear for her ...
I'm quite amused as I vaguely know Brendan. He's a full-on Libertarian, and spiked-online is a quirky mix of Libertarianism and properly "wide-eyed-loon", IMHO most of their stuff is published as a reaction piece.
I would start by rounding up anyone htat has appeared on Jeremy Kyle show and air drop them into Somalia...*
What has Somalia done to deserve that?
Theres an irony to the fact that the people who are most vocal about asylum seekers (foaming at the mouth, Mail Reading Little Englanders) have almost certainly never seen one. There are more in Rochdale than in the whole of the South East of England. Glasgow and Liverpool are other popular dumping grounds.
Let 'em all in I say.
Give them NI numbers, tax their income, no eligibility for benefits aside from basic health care until paid tax for five years.
South of England may be crowded but parts of Scotland are under-populated.
A few weeks a go Radio 4 were inerviewing the would-be migrants in Calais, all of them had been told, by the people smugglers no doubt, that once you arrive in the UK they immediately give you a house, and free money
What's the answer though?
Take a hard line, and you leave them to suffer (although clearly one of the issues is whether France is fulfilling its obligations under the EU rules)
Let them in, and you prove the people smugglers right, thereby perpetuating the problem.
Let them in, and you [s]prove the people smugglers right[/s] raise the number of hard working optimistic citizens, thereby [s]perpetuating the problem[/s] improving the economy and the general sense of collective well-being.
[i]Let them in, and you prove the people smugglers right, thereby perpetuating the problem.[/i]
Give them a legal entry and the need for smuggling goes away. Why is immigration a "problem"?
We should turn the service tunnel between the two Chunnel lines into a 20-mile 'Its a Knockout' style obstacle course. Complete it and you get a British Passport. We could compel Stuart Hall to do the commentary to earn extra money for fags and phone calls.
Means we get the fittest immigrants to work in the jobs that Brits are too lazy to do.