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was that the half spear tackle that he did but the ref already blowed the whistle and wasnt paying attention?!
I reckon Powell looks like Justin Lee Collins - similar too, fat and useless. The most overhyped player on tour?
I think all 3 Scots may figure on the bench this w/e.
Blair is different from Phillips / Ellis and offers a much faster service.
Ford & Hines would both shore up the scrummage (though Shaw would also)
On the flip side it is perfectly possible that no Scots will appear
Not sure anyone strongly stated their case last night. Still would love Hook to feature at some point
so Hines got a week and will miss the 2nd test
Pity as I think he is just the man to 'noise the S African's up'.
anagallis_arvensis - Memberso Hines got a week and will miss the 2nd test
That ridiculous. If it was a dangerous tackle then the ban should be months.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/8118816.stm
The team for saturday - pretty much as expected I think!
Yep
Wonder if Hines would have got the nod in front of Shaw? Moot point now but I reckon it would have been a close call
I am on a flight at the time of the match 🙁
Hope I get to see a re-run later in the day
Bench seems odd, neither halfback replacement would change anything. O'Gara is pointless on the bench as he has the attacking instincts of a snail and if the team are winning might as well stick with Jones. Hook might not be a steady player but if they have 20 mins left and are loosing he's the man to shake it up. Also what is the point of Sheridan on the bench? Gethin will be made to look a numpty trying to play tighthead and the scrum will go backwards if he switches negating any use of bringing on Sheridan.
Replacements: R Ford (Edinburgh and Scotland), A Sheridan (Sale Sharks and England), A-W Jones (Ospreys and Wales), M Williams (Cardiff Blues and Wales), H Ellis (Leicester and England), R O'Gara (Munster and Ireland), S Williams (Ospreys and Wales).
I think the bench it wrong on two accounts
Hook missing - for exactly the same reasona as AA has highlighted.
Ellis instead of Blair??? Ellis was poor on Tuesday and again offers little to change the game.
Not sure what to do about the front row cover. Unless you bench 2 props.
Maybe Ford can tight head? That seems pretty risky!
Do they seriously think that Harry Ellis is a better scrum have than Blair or are they just convinced he has the potential if they give him enough chances? Surely having blair on the bench would have given them a quick ball option rather than the pick-pause-step-pause-pass action of philips and ellis.
I think Ford deserves his place on the bench as he's played himself into a bit of form. And we can all get back to the Shane debate now as he should get on for the last 20 and get some decent service from BOD.
Blair has been useless this tour, and Ellis not much better, but overall, on this tour Ellis just about edges it.
I'd still rather have Care for impact though.
Blair has suffered from the "Shane effect" he's trying too hard playing with the midweek team that aren't securing good ball or protecting it on the ground for him. I'd love to have seen Blair and Hook on the bench to come on and push the level up for the last 20. maybe next week?
Hugo - you echo my sentiments exactly
I hope I'm wrong, but I think we're going to get a right thrashing.
I just think that the boks (among others) have far far more talent in their team than the we(Lions) have.
What on earth did fitzgerald do to get picked? aside from lose the ball a lot.
It is an odd bench, no real centre or full back cover. Hook, Kearney or earls would offer more versatility than S williams or o gara.
backhander - Member
I hope I'm wrong, but I think we're going to get a right thrashing.
I just think that the boks (among others) have far far more talent in their team than the we(Lions) have.
Personally I think that the Boks are pretty one dimensional - good at what they do but not a huge amount of footballing talent, and I think that's where the Lions shine. How many of the Boks backs would you swap for the equivalent Lion?
But it depends on being able to bludgeon the Boks forwards into submission.......
If Ellis get on the pitch I give him 5 minutes before he's yellow carded the bocks will target him knowing hes a hot head
I think our backs have huge potential. However Phillips' service does not look to maximise that.
I think and hope we will beat them at the w/e. Maybe that is blind optimism though as on Saturday i reckoned it was definietly 3 - 0 to them
Bowe has played centre a lot for Ospreys and Roberts was a fullback until this season. Vickery for all his faults should be on the bench as he can cover both sides of the scrum. Gethin will be destroyed at tighthead.
How many of the Boks backs would you swap for the equivalent Lion?
How many of the lions backs do you thin would get a look in the boks team?
BOD, Roberts and maybe Bowe. That's it. None of our forwards would (OK possibly Jenkins).
Come on then, lets hope Shaw is better than I think, cant help but wonder like Worsley how come sure can now be good enough but wasnt in his prime......
Gethin will be destroyed at tighthead.
I hope you're not right, but it's a worry for sure. I dread the first scrum and line-out
Aye it will be a nervous time until we see how the scrum and lineout hold out.
I'm also worried that the Boks will have worked out the centre pairing of BOD and Roberts and the penetration that they got in the last test will be strangled at birth.
Still come on you Lions.
[rugby cliche] The front five win the game and the backs will decide by how much [/rugby cliche]
I still think that if the front five can match the boks, or even run them close, then we're there with the backs.
Going well! Phillips and Carny playing a blinder. Can they up it in the 2nd half?
Loved O'Driscoll fronting up Matfield : "Bring it!"
Even more nervous now! Anybody got Sky and seen the gouging incident? Really sounds like should be the Lions game for Burger's foul play should have seen him sent off for the whole game by the sound of it.
Go Kearney, sounds like he is having a great game.
Gouging was pretty bad, but yellow was enough. We coulda walked it with Berger off though
O'gara you ****ing pillock
Idiot ref
Who put Ronan O'Gara in the Lions squad??
ffs
****, found a P2P feed and watched second 1/2 but the Lions lost too many players to contol the game as well as the did in the 1st.
What the hell happened there we bloody well blew that. Fitzgerald forgot to tackle on the line the rush defence turned into a mess with more dogs legs than a golf course we fell off tackles. You could say the ref was a bit harsh with some of the high tackle calls I mean its not wendyball but why were so many of our tackles above the chest did our lads forget how to tackle. I hate to say it but Paul O'Connel was a bad pick as skipper and Ronan O'Gara we know hes a pillock when the pressure is on why oh why did he garryowen with seconds on the clock and then make a complete ar*e of it. Kick for position you stupid potato head your facing 2 guys who hit 50 metre drops for fun go long go long AAAAAAAHHHHHHHH I am going to get pished
o'gara got run over twice in lead up to the try and then gives away a mind blowingly soft pen.... cock.
Burger should have had a red no question, ref shit out in a massive way
Oh and fair play I was wrong about Shaw, he played well. Who would have thought that the scrums going uncontested would favour a SA team against anyone.
Gouging was pretty bad, but yellow was enough
Explain that to me then. Gouging deserves bans measured in months rather 10 mins rest.
Never mind lads...
There will always be a next time.. 
😉
anagallis_arvensis - MemberGouging was pretty bad, but yellow was enough
Explain that to me then. Gouging deserves bans measured in months rather 10 mins rest.
How soon you forget, last week you had Hines getting off lightly for a somewhat dubious tackle..
Meh, its only a game.
Highlights on S4C now.
Just seen the 1st half, gouging was deliberate and he knew he was walking as soon as the ref called him over. Had a huge S**t eating grin when he realised the ref had bottled it by opting for a yellow card only.
Touch judge states 'at least a yellow' he should have said straight red too!
We looked great in the 1st half, shame the 2nd half was so poor.
How soon you forget, last week you had Hines getting off lightly for a somewhat dubious tackle..
Hines didnt get off lightly he got a 1 week ban, Burger should have got a red, even the touch judge said so but not in a straight forward manner so the ref who spoke poor english missed the point and got an easy way out of a big decision in the first min of his first big match... anyway Burger has been cited and should get at least 12 weeks, Bakkies Botha cited too. Suprised that Sheridan got away with a punch to nuts as well.
Adam Jones and Gethin out of next weeks game.
Unfortunately too many refs bottle it now they give a yellow and leave it to citing commisioner to punish. I do understand the pressure the ref is under though, right at the beginning of the match and a home player. Its going to take some bottle to go for red but gouging is the one offence were it should be marching orders.
There are other heinous offences Spear tackling, taking out a player while in the air but those can be accidental but gouging how can you not know youve got your fingers in someones eyesocket. It happened to me years ago and I still shudder at the feeling of a finger groping round my face till it found my eye then digging in and my viison distorting as my eyeball was squashed.
I am not saying the old days were the good days but years ago Burger would have finished that match with a face like a pound of tenderised steak and more stud marks on him than a Leopard has spots. A forward was often considered fair game for a bit of treatment but a winger! His own backs would probably have stuck the boot in.
2 weeks for Bakkies Botha for dangerous charging, haven't really seen what he did so can't comment but does augur well for a good lengthy ban for Schalk Burger.
As several others have commented the loss of Burger won't really weaken the Boks as he has been comprehensively outplayed by H Brussow.
Still would be good for the game if the SA management could have the decency to condemn his actions.
he got 8 weeks which seem a little short for me
he got 8 weeks which seem a little short for me
Yes considering Quinlan got 12 weeks just before the tour started. I actually thought 12 weeks was the norm - especially with something so clear cut!
Game was enjoyable and nail bighting. I really think the loss of personnel is what did it in the end as the team became disjointed in the second half.
The loss of the props and the subsequent depowered scrum were the biggest factor, then loosing the centres and finally bringing on that useless prat O'Gara
anagallis_arvensis - Member
The loss of the props and the subsequent depowered scrum were the biggest factor, then loosing the centres and finally bringing on that useless prat O'Gara
If the bench selection had been sensible then this wouldn't have been an issue. I said before the 1st test that we needed a full front row on the bench - sure that would have caused some problems with back/2nd row but nothing like the depowering of the scrums caused.
Also as several people said, Hook should have been on the bench not O'Gara. I still can't see what the thinking was for having ROG on the bench in the first place.
If Hook had been there when Roberts and BOD went off, then the midfield would have been Hook, Bowe with Fitz and Shane on the wings. Not as good as the starting combo, but not too bad, and importantly still strong defensively.
For me, the series has been lost by the selectors.
But of course if O'Gara hadn't played like a headless chicken when he was on, the Lions may not have conceded 10 points, so I'm going to blame him for losing the game and the series as well. With any luck I won't see this idiot play rugby for a long time. To think that he was telling the world that he was the best OH in world rugby during the 6N?
He had to make one important scramble tackle on Fourie, and despite making contact his technique is so bad that he didn't even slow Fourie. Unbelievable. And as for kicking the ball away in a random garryowen, with 45 secs to go and then deliberately taking the player out. I was speechless. I've always credited ROG with some intelligence, but maybe I was wrong. (Irish by birth, Munster by grace of God, thick by design!)
Tell you what though - it was an absolutely classic match.
Shame those who wanted the Lions to win feel so let down (mainly by the selectors' choice of O'Gara and his throwing away of the entire game)
I've been writing posts for a couple of days and then deleting them because they just turn into a rant about O'Gara.
Must calm down........
I wouldnt worry about ranting about O'Gara! I expect next saturday to be a pretty poor game now. Will be two second string squads probably with the boks resting players and the Lions lacking players!
Check the link pantsonfire posted here:
http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/british-and-irish-lions/page/6
Might cheer you up. Seems like it was destined!
Here's a question - Should Sheridan also be cited for his rather obvious punch in a place you really shouldn't punch?
I think so.
"I don't think it should have been a card at all," De Villiers said.
"For me and for everybody, this is sport. This is what it is all about. This is great if everything is clear cut in this environment we are in we shouldn't try to prepare even.
Just reading various newspapers websites this morning and it seems that De Viliers wont even accept that what Burger did was wrong - seemed pretty clear cut to me and I dont think that is biased.
CFH - Is that because of where he punched him or that he threw a punch at all? Mind you at least we saw some emotion from the guy!
robbo, both. A punch is a punch, that's a card at least. But there? Just not good sporting conduct, IMO.
AS to de Villiers, he should also be banned for those comments.
A punch is a punch, that's a card at least. But there?
Not that I disagree with you and agree that especially there is bad but there does seem to be very little refereeing/citing for punching at all. generally they seem to tell them to calm down unless someone catches someone properly!
Sheridan's sly dig to the nuts should have been cited. What Botha did was illegal but happens all the time so he is unlucky, Burger is lucky to have got such a short ban and DeVilliers should be charged with bringing the game into disrupute and sacked. BOD was lucky not to be cited for a shoulder charge also.
DeVilliers should be charged with bringing the game into disrupute and sacked.
😯
Blimey, you really must get a great view form the top of you high horse..
Granted, it wasn't what you wanted to hear, but hey, thats his opnion, and must be respected, even tho you don't agree with it.
**** off if gouging is "part of the game" as DeVilliers said then I will stop watching it as it is I'm disgusted by the 8 week ban.
I'm [i]not[/i] saying I agree with what our coach said, just mearly pointing out that was his opnion of the incident...
"just mearly pointing out that was his opnion of the incident... "
For me if the coach says its part of the game and his play does it in first min then the logical conclusion is that it was planned.
There is no defence for gouging. It is one of rugbys taboos along with headbutting or kicking.
Pretty much what I expect from berger though and most of the SA team for that matter. I'm not going to moan about the south africans cheating-they're bloody south africa for gods sake.
I can see that the coach wants to support his player but condoning this in the face of the evidence is stupid.
I thought the Lions deserved a draw on saturday, would've been a fair result and set up a great game for sat.
I'm pretty sure this wasn't the first time anyone has been gouged, and I doubt it will be the last time either..
I agree completly, that Schalk was wrong to have done what he did, and no, and as a Rugby player myself, I can't condone gouging, but he's be punished for his crime, and shurly that should be the end of?
We can all go on about this until we are blue in the face, but it won't change anything..
I wonder what the reaction would have been if one of your guys was done for it??
"I wonder what the reaction would have been if one of your guys was done for it?? "
Quinlan missed out on the tour as he got caught gouging and got 12 weeks, burger will only miss 4 games, citing and punishment methods are a farce. Parisse on the same day for same offence got 8 weeks also but his doesnt start until the start of the season so will miss 8 games. 4 games for gouging, games he might not even have been picked for and he's done his time. Its bollocks and the retarded coach is still defending the actions saying the ban is harsh.
teetosugars = knob.
I've travelled this whole world of ours from Barnsley to Peru
I've had sunstroke in the Arctic and a swim in Timbuktu
I've seen unicorns in Burma and a Yeti in Nepal
And I've danced with ten-foot pygmies in a Montezuma hall
I've met the King of China
And a working Yorkshire miner
But I've never met a nice South African
No, he's never met a nice South African
And that's not bloody surprising, man
'Cos we're a bunch of arrogant bastards
Who hate black people.
I once got served in Woolies after less than four weeks' wait
I had lunch with Rowan Atkinson when he paid and wasn't late
I know a public swimming bath where they don't piss in the pool
I know a guy who got a job straight after leaving school
I've met a normal mOrman
And a fairly modest German
But I've never met a nice South African
No, he's never met a nice South African
And that's not bloody surprising, man
'Cos we're a bunch of talentless murderers
Who smell like baboons.
I've had a close encounter of the twenty-second kind
That's when an alien spaceship disappears up your behind
I've got Directory Enquiries after less than forty rings
I've even heard a decent song by Paul McCartney's Wings
I've seen a flying pig
In a quite convincing wig
But I've never met a nice South African
No, he's never met a nice South African
And that's not bloody surprising, man
'Cos we're a bunch of ignorant loudmouths
With no sense of humour (hah-hah-hah).
I've met the Loch Ness Monster and he looks like Fred Astaire
At the BBC in London he's the chief commissionaire
I know a place in Glasgow which is bright with daffodillies
I met a man in Katmandu who claimed to have two willies
I've had a nice Pot Noodle
But I've never had a poodle
And I've never met a nice South African
No, he's never met a nice South African
And that's not bloody surprising, man
Because we've never met one either
Except for Breyten Breytenbach
And he's emigrated to Paris.
Yes, he's quite a nice South African
And he's hardly ever killed anyone
And he's not smelly at all
That's why they put him in prison
Whoa, steady big feller.
Like I said, I pretty much expect it from Berger and it was the refs fault for bottling it and not sending him off. I think that recently the home nation doctrine is to turn the cheek a bit too readily so it was nice to see Phillips and Hines and even BOD give some back. Lions teams of old would probably have operated on the "one in-all in" principle which I miss. I can't believe that berger finished that game in one piece.
I would rather he was playing next week. He was crap,Brussow is far,far better.
I can't help it but I want to field the biggest hardest dumbest pack. If the saffas want to mix it up, lets mix it up.
Rees
Sheridan
???
Shaw
Hines
Wallace (or call out that 'orrible ulsterman; Best)
Powell
Worseley
Duckman, you really are a gentleman sir.
And I'm sure the people you Teach would admire such an articulate argument.
I really, really hope we meet in the future.
TTS,
not one of "them" are you?? 😉
Gosh, is that a veiled threat Teeto? I am sure you come up to ride in Scotland from time to time, feel free to email me (in profile)and we can meet up.
duckman - Member
Gosh, is that a veiled threat Teeto? I am sure you come up to ride in Scotland from time to time, feel free to email me (in profile)and we can meet up. KNOB!
No, not a vield threat at all,
I just think you are getting [i]way[/i] to personal about the whole thing..
I have my views, and you have yours..
andylaightscat - Member
TTS,
not one of "them" are you??
If you mean do I support the winning side, then yes, yes I am " one of them.." 8)
Blimey, I knew there was a reason I didn't get involved in this thread earlier.
As I said. CLASSIC GAME WASN'T IT!?
TTS,
your team deserved to win, "Never Met a Nice South African" was after all just a Spitting Image comedy tune and getting chippy about it is just showing the stereotype might be true 😉
just hope the Lions trip to Australia is better planned/coached after all why should we bother,it doesnt seem to be of much benefit to the home nations
TTS is a big pussycat really.
Mind I wouldn't want him to get mad with me 🙂
See from Duckmans profile he does some boxing as well.
*wanders off humming 'eye of the tiger'*
And as to the Rugby the Southern hemisphere sides do seem to have a novel interpretation of rules, it's not like we weren't aware of it before we went.
"andylaightscat - Member
TTS,
your team deserved to win,
"
No they didn't.
They deserved to play with 14 men for 80 minutes and get the result that would have given, but, no surprise, the same man who hammered Vickery with unjustified penalties one week bottles it and says Burger needs "at least a yellow". No you moron, he needs a red, it was obvious gouging.
As to an 8 week ban, I totally agree with the above posts - he isn't even playing for two of those weeks! Ridiculous.
jones didn't get penalised,just face it Vickery is past it at this level and why they left him on the pitch for so long is beyond belief
do you think the touchjudge could see Burger put his fingers in fitzgeralds eyes? or just making contact with?
anyway it's only "sport" doesn't really matter does it? 😉
Only sport, doesn't really matter.
I think it did matter to Fitzgerald, who described himself as lucky to have his hands free to stop any damage being done!
The 8 week ban is below the reccomended 12 weeks of the IRB and can't be based on a history of previous good behaviour like the Italians players was.
This has been a great series. The Boks have been more clinical in all departments from the very start of the tour to try and ensure they won the series. However the Lions have done themselves proud unlike the SA coach who had to back down today from defending Burger presumably after a bollocking from his bosses in a meeting with the SARB.
I would love for the last match to be a classic and will still watch it.
Brilliant Test series, great to watch.
Some disappointing silly mistakes and a bit of bad luck from the Lions.
Disgusted with O'Gara.
Burger should have got at least 3 months. Gouging is banned in the UFC for crying out loud, there's no place for it in Rugby.
Well I have calmed down and has been said it is only a game. Burger is an oaf but are we suprised there are some really nasty pieces of work playing the game. Just like everyday life.
I thought the ref was let down by his linesmen, he cant see everything and has to rely on them. Lots of niggle but only Burger seems to have gone over the line. Was the try crossing, having seen it I dont think so, the dummy runner just does his job.
ROG (sigh) now that was a rush of blood, he will live with that mistake for the rest of his life. There is rumour that he is not the most popular man in Irish rugby well he just made a rod for his own back.
The best thing to come out of this tragedy is that the "Lions" are once again relevant. After Woodwards debacle last time in NZ doubt was thrown on whether they would ever be a force again. Pushing the Boks close in their own backyard has proved that the Lions are a part of professional rugby.
"ROG (sigh) now that was a rush of blood"
Its wasnt just the stupid non catch attempt non-tackle but also the gutless tackling when he came on including 2 missed tackles in the run up to the try, usless prick