[Closed] Britain and Snow

not been here long then...

Why do you say other countries arent affected? Flights cancelled from Paris today. (going to Madrid)

But other countries just get on a deal with it! what make's us different in the way we react to snow!

We're a nation of idle bastards, constantly looking for an excuse to bunk off work for the day. And our public services are managed by incompetent half-wits

Next question.....

what makes them better at dealing at it or do we just try and wrap everything in cotton wool?

They get this type of weather often enough that it is financially viable to take the extra steps required to keep things running. We don't for us it is cheaper to let things slide (deliberate, if poor pun) for a couple of days a year.

Evidence of other countries coping with difficult weather?

I've been in Northern Italy when it was snowing. Absolute chaos, despite the legal requirement to have snow chains and winter tyres in/on your car.

"But other countries just get on a deal with it! what make's us different in the way we react to snow! road become a nightmare as we can't clear them yet in other countries its cleared straight away and driving is really a problem, is that because we don't have snow very often so it's not cost effect to implement more snow plough's and strategies in snowy circumstances. "

stopped paying attention after this because its complete BULLSHINE

go to ukraine or most FSU states where they dont bother cleaning the roads at all . the difference is that winter tires are mandatory. life carrys on like normal. I spent 3 weeks there during the -28 crisis and we drove about no bother in bolgas and ladas - they had more agressive winter compound tires than my land rover on them though !

thats what the uk is doing wrong. The folks with winter tires speeding and those without blocking the roads. its not the government that are not prepared its the people. people have been mollycoddled into thinking the roads should be cleared so they need not spend money on what should be essential items for COLD WEATHER not just snow.

my way to work today was blocked by a audi with winters upfront and normal tires on bac trying to decend a hill, bit of the brake and he was wedged at 90 degrees between two drystane dykes with 3 inches either side to move.

my way to work today was blocked by a audi with winters upfront and normal tires on bac trying to decend a hill, bit of the brake and he was wedged at 90 degrees between two drystane dykes with 3 inches either side to move.

you need to find the threads on winter tyres, 2 or 4? then

Personally, I have all 4 winter tyres, but don't need to use the car most days. 🙂

also,

but when we do [u]everybody[/u] panics

Sheffield council seem to have done well. Our road, a small residential road but with a secondary school at the end, was ploughed twice last night, once about 10pm and once at 5am. All the main roads the same.

The problem is the people and their cars. In counties with regular snow winter tyres are required by law, here it's not cost effective so people get stuck.

The airports issue is one of capacity, we can't recover as there is no slack in the schedule. Geneva, for example, still gets closed for snow but once it's cleared they have less capacity issues and can therefore receive a few extra flights to catch back up.

Heathrow runs at something insane like 98% capacity, with a take off and landing every 30 seconds. So any time required to clear the runway will have a huge knock on affect.

Winter tyres are such good all-rounders these days and we rarely get truly hot summers where the compound might not be suitable. For those reasons you could just have them on year round. I know that's what the taxi drivers around my way often do and I've done the same myself. I used to have some Vredestein winter tyres that were better tyres in the summer than the non-winter tyres they replaced. People need to accept some responsibility and be prepared for the snow before they slither and slide all over the road.

(been said so many many times before on STW)

No. The population who live in the cities of the south-east do (I admit, that's a large perecentage).

That Sir is a slur upon my good name and character and I demand satisfaction. You may select either pistols or rapiers, we'll meet at dawn. Unless it snows again in which case we'd best postpone

"here it's not cost effective so people get stuck."

its also not cost effective for me to give up my time to tow muppets that decide that the journey is so essential to them that they cannot invest in winter tires.

its also not cost effective for me to give up my time to tow muppets that decide that the journey is so essential to them that they cannot invest in winter tires.

Just leave them stranded until it thaws?

they cannot invest in winter tires

but when we do everybody panics it causes major disruptions

But other countries just get on a deal with it

Most people round here are just getting on with it or going sledging

i guess he just HAS to have that car.

he knows he has to travel alot , he knows that its cold for 4 months of the year - he could pick a car that doesnt have a pair of road rollers for back wheels.

That Sir is a slur upon my good name and character and I demand satisfaction. You may select either pistols or rapiers, we'll meet at dawn

Snowballs?

My brother in law (travels lots with his work) has a BMW 5 Series with run-flats and he was quoted £600 per tyre. Is £2,400 a reasonable 'investment'?

1. Run flats aren't compulsory.
2. Yes I'd say it was a reasonable investment. You can't buy a car like a 5 series and then start to complain when the running costs are high.

with run-flats and he was quoted £600 per tyre. Is £2,400 a reasonable 'investment'?

Buy 5 steel wheels with winter tyres on and keep the spare in the boot?

Snowballs?

Can I wear gloves?

You are either somewhere which gets lots of snow and is reasonably well prepared or you are somewhere which gets infrequent snow so is less well prepared. e.g. in the French Alps you expect people to be well equipped and organised. I have a client in the south of france who seemed to be acting like she lived in the home counties with the snow hysteria and traffic issues she was facing.

I am told a Canadian I used to work with that the first week of proper heavy snow over there is not that different to here. The difference is after that everyone adjusts. Here is melts and the cycle restarts.

I wondered how long it would be before there was references to snow and winter tyres...

£2400 - well if people will insist on buying a fancy set of alloys wheels from BM... I picked up a genuine set of BM alloys and almost new non-runflat tyres for £450 on eBay so if you brother in law looks at the second hand options he will get a much more reasonable price.

This said though £2400 is a fraction of the value of the car and one low speed slide into a curb is likely to do far more damage. You makes choices and you takes your chances...

Having experienced winter tyres for the first time on snow / ice my personal opinion is the Government should make them mandatory in the winter months - braking and steering isn't far off what you'd expect on wet tarmac.

I am told a Canadian I used to work with that the first week of proper heavy snow over there is not that different to here. The difference is after that everyone adjusts

Norway is apparently the same.

binners - Member

We're a nation of idle bastards, constantly looking for an excuse to bunk off work for the day. And our public services are managed by incompetent half-wits

Next question.....

Health & safety will get you ... 😆

I need this ...

[img] [/img]

But bought this before Xmas ... two sets (for all 4 wheels) at a discount with free delivery for approx. £80. Haven't tried it yet as snow is not deep/thick enough.

[img] [/img]

Have you seen how much they can cost? My brother in law (travels lots with his work) has a BMW 5 Series with run-flats and he was quoted £600 per tyre. Is £2,400 a reasonable 'investment

My brother in law (travels lots with his work) has a BMW 5 Series with run-flats and he was quoted £600 per tyre.

He doesn't need run flat winter tyres, in fact steel rims and narrower tyres will probably set him back less than a grand.

I have a set of alloys + winter tyres for 30% less than the cost of just tyres for my Alfa. Winter tyres are definitely worth it (and they're compulsory here).

In other countries, you get a proper winter. The first week or so is chaos, after that everyone adjusts and it stays sub zero/snowy for a couple of months.

Over here, you get two days of snow which mostly thaws, then freezes again to become ice (which really IS dangerous to drive on unlike snow), then it melts, then a week later there's another day of snow. Then that's it.

Couple that with our entire transport infrastructure which runs at 95+% capacity at the best of times and any slight disruptions have a massive knock on effect.

We live in northern Europe, snow in winter is not rare - sure the number of snow day is quite low but significant snow fall occurs at some point each winter for most of the country

Some sort of mandatory winter equipment would make sense.

So either winter tyres or carrying socks / chains if you are on summer tyres.

🙂
Classic STW.
[the mention of a BMW] 🙂

[i]In the midst of battle was a sight to behold. As it was sailing hither unto the breach, came upon a vessel of such vanity, of such frailty, of such uselessfulness that each man of disregard of lines drawn, felt upon a compulsion to fire upon the vessel of vanity. And sunk before a huindred eyes it did on that day. [/i]

Winter tyres aren't just for snow, they are generally better for most of the conditions through winter, especially wet slippery roads.

Anyway the weather here in Germany has been causing problems the past couple of days, Frankfurt airport was closed for a while yesterday. Trams aren't running in the town I live in, and few buses are are running.
And even though its law to have winter tyres, they plough and grit many more roads and pavements, and there are rules about clearing the pavements outside your house.
The main difference seems to be that people look at it and go "oh look the weathers shit, that's going to cause problems" and just accept that that's what happens.

I would like to say that the roads and paths have been well gritted in Surrey ,so no problems around here .

deleted. Others got in before me

Getting snow in the UK isn't hugely common

because we don't have snow very often so it's not cost effect to implement more snow plough's and strategies

Not sure where the UK should go re chains / winter tyres...

Bought chains last year as we drove down to the Alps for skiing - didn't need them.

Thought about fitting them on Friday, but worked from home instead...

Fitting the chains would have got me the 500m to a treated road (side roads impassable without), but then I would have had a 14 mile [s]journey[/s] traffic jam to get to work - and the chains wouldn't have been needed.

Do we need to just stop salting the roads?

Have you seen how much they can cost? My brother in law (travels lots with his work) has a BMW 5 Series with run-flats and he was quoted £600 per tyre. Is £2,400 a reasonable 'investment'?

Councils/airports/train companies face the same dilemna but in the £ millions. It's all cost/benefit, risk/rewards, investment/pay back trade offs.

In scotland shed loads spent on the latest gritters and salt supplies after the snow in 2010/2011 shut the m8 for nearly a week. In winter 2011/12 it wasn't needed.

As for your brother in law. Tell him I got a full set of winter tyres for my deisel astra for £320.

Another country coping well with a cold spell.

gonefishin - Member

My brother in law (travels lots with his work) has a BMW 5 Series with run-flats and he was quoted £600 per tyre. Is £2,400 a reasonable 'investment'?

1. Run flats aren't compulsory.
2. Yes I'd say it was a reasonable investment. You can't buy a car like a 5 series and then start to complain when the running costs are high.

worth pointing out that the vast majority of these cars will be fleet ones, where the driver has no control over what tyres and wheels they come with. I know this through personal experience of trying to get winter tyres on a Company Car

For the number of days when we actually get snow, I suspect it's just cheaper to put up with a bit of disruption than have everyone switch to snow tyres. It's not really a big deal in the grand scheme of things.

what make's us different in the way we react to snow!

Do you:

1) use winter tyres?
2) shovel or otherwise clear the path near your house?
3) own a truck with a snowplough on the front?
4) get out and shovel anywhere else it's needed?
5) always make contingency plans for bad weather between November and March includive?
6) just accept that there's going to be snow disruption and not make a big deal when it happens?

Does your employer:

7) have a snow or bad weather policy so you don't get fired if you don't snow?
8) make sure you can still do your job in bad weather?

Do business near you:

9) own and operate snow clearing equippment in their car parks and premises?

Does your council:

10) spend millions of taxpayers money on a continuous round the clock snow plouging and moving and disposing operation all winter long - not just with road snowploughs but snow shifting devices of every size and application?

Cos that's what snowy countries do. 1) and 2) are legal requirements in some places.

There IS always a couple of days disruption in snowy countries, just as there's always a couple of days here. Just figure out how to deal with it instead of whining about it.

In our hilly street the only other person besides us to lift a finger to clear snow or do anything useful was the chap from three doors up who's from Zimbabwe. So it's not about being 'used to it', it's about showing some bloody initiative and being useful.

"For the number of days when we actually get snow, I suspect it's just cheaper to put up with a bit of disruption than have everyone switch to snow tyres. It's not really a big deal in the grand scheme of things. "

Ok i get it. Keep off the roads while those of us who have forethought to prepare can go about life as normal

signed - the general thinking public.

as for lease cars .... no winter tires - no drivey , HSE policy and all that - and i know someone whos taken that quite far in Scottish and southern energy when they were told to drive somewhere in their company car in winter.

For the number of days when we actually get snow, I suspect it's just cheaper to put up with a bit of disruption than have everyone switch to snow tyres. It's not really a big deal in the grand scheme of things.

I'm more than happy for everyone to have a pop at my BMW's inability to move out of it's own way when it's snowy (except it's the driver, not the car, and my one has got me everywhere i've wanted to go in all conditions) just as long as i can reciprocate and complain bitterly about all those hopeless FWD cars holding me up at junctions and roundabouts as they vainly spin their front wheels and loll all over the road like a dog sniffing out a track, at the slightest sign of any moisture on the roads for the OTHER 360 days in the year.......

(i'm also entering that into "this years longest sentence" 2013 award)

l-)