another windrush in the making
You say it like it would be a bad thing - which it would, if you are a sane, empathetic person with more than a handful of brain cells.
For your average Mail/Express reader Windrush was the start of something, the throwing off of the shackles of political correctness, a cowardly nation finding 'the right stuff' again etc etc.
Mean spirited insularity. Plain and simple.
Why the hell would I (in Wales) have more in common with some Brexit-voting insular English Express-reading idiot than an outward looking resident of say Brittany?
👏👏
🇪🇺🇪🇺🇪🇺🇪🇺
What is this expensive process? So far gov.co.uk only mentions the pre-settled/settled status
https://www.gov.uk/settled-status-eu-citizens-families
It took my an afternoon to sort it out, and when I had some questions the person at the phone was extremely helpful…
It is a relatively simple process, but already my Finnish wife has been asked to provide evidence of settled status (which you cannot, as there is no documentation provided) and it is also wholly reliant on this shower of a government not reneging on the agreement, and settled status only applies to EU nationals already here doesn’t it?
Still shouldn’t grumble because Iraq or something.
while no doubt Johnson and his successor tell us why those loses, costs and hassles are worth it, so that… well… something about using deregulation to help the North… somehow… time to check out “Britannia Unchained” again…
I agree, Britannia is now truly unchained. What Hannan, Raab, Patel and the rest of them failed to take into account was, we were riding a bike.
National boundaries are stupid. Why the hell would I (in Wales) have more in common with some Brexit-voting insular English Express-reading idiot than an outward looking resident of say Brittany?
Or the majority of Welsh people who voted Leave.
Regarding settled status, the email you get when approved basically says Until we change our mind.
The official way of proving you have it is to log on to the website and show it there.
It is a relatively simple process, but already my Finnish wife has been asked to provide evidence of settled status (which you cannot, as there is no documentation provided)
Yeah that is annoying. You get an e-mail saying, "hey you have given settled status", and also, "hey this e-mail is not evidence of it". Thanks.
FYI: "I am pleased to inform you that your application under the EU Settlement Scheme has
been successful and that you have been granted Indefinite Leave in the United
Kingdom under Appendix EU to the Immigration Rules. This is also referred to as settled
status.
If you were within the UK on the date of your application, you have been granted
Indefinite Leave to Remain. If you were outside the UK on the date of your application,
you have been granted Indefinite Leave to Enter. This means that you have a secure
status under UK law and there is no time limit on how long you can stay in the UK.
You can continue (as set out in the important information below) to:
work in the UK
use the NHS
enrol in education or continue studying
access public funds such as benefits and pensions, if
you are eligible for them
travel in and out of the UK
Your status takes effect from the date of this letter, which can be found above.
You can continue to rely on any rights that you may have as an EEA or Swiss citizen
under EU law whilst those rights remain in force in the UK. Further information can be
found at www.gov.uk/right-to-reside.
Read the section below entitled important information to find out more about viewing your
status online, including how to share it with others, and about your status and rights,
including your right to work and to access benefits and services.
This letter is your written notification of leave, which you may wish to keep for your
personal records, but it is not proof of your status and cannot be used to prove your
status to others.
Instead, you can view and share details of your status with others using the Home Office
online status service 'View and Prove your Settled and Pre-Settled Status':
www.gov.uk/view-your-settled-status."
What Hannan, Raab, Patel and the rest of them failed to take into account was, we were riding a bike.
👏🏽
I’ll be stealing this one.
‘View and Prove your Settled and Pre-Settled Status’
It does seem designed to be easily retracted at a moments notice. I don’t think that’s on the cards… but it hasn’t exactly been designed to reassure nonUK citizens that their places here, and rights here, are secure, has it.
National boundaries are stupid.
Totally agree. I've said many times we should have completely open borders with all countries, but I've been shouted down more than once on here for saying that. Sadly those of us who think this are in a tiny minority, and we've failed to persuade others how their jobs and incomes would be protected from a race to the bottom wiith imported labour. We can't have it both ways, if we want free movement, you have to protect incomes and provide economic security, and we failed to do that, so hardly a surprise then that those affected vote to take it away.
odd - just tried to renew my EHIC before the portcullis closes and cannot.
I left the U.K. 5 months ago, in a large part due to brexit.
I am upset at having my European identity taken from me. I was born a European and I believe that identity has been taken from me for all the wrong reasons.
I will no longer contribute to the U.K., at least until the nation’s course is corrected. I am the beneficiary of a good Russel group education, followed by decades of European economic development funding. I’ve taken that experience elsewhere where it will securely provide for me and mine until the time is right to return.
It’s an entirely selfish decision I’ve taken because I’m not contributing to the solution to Brexit, I’m simply running away.
It feels like the right decision at the moment though.
so hardly a surprise then that those affected vote to take it away
It shouldn't come as a surprise to them, then, when no one else gives a shit if they are affected first and worst by their own actions.
🤷♂️
It shouldn’t come as a surprise to them, then, when no one else gives a shit
Why would it come as a surprise when they already know no one gives a shit about them? This isn't the result of brexit, it's the cause.
Why would it come as a surprise when they already know no one gives a shit about them? This isn’t the result of brexit, it’s the cause.
Politics born of envy and resentment is never good politics.
Politics born of envy and resentment is never good politics.
Bloody poor people with their petty jealousies!
The solution to which is to elect a government of Eton-educated spivs who will deliver the ultimate far-right project to remove what rights they have left and turbo-charge inequality
Well done to everyone involved
Bloody poor people with their petty jealousies!
In terms of effort needed to have a roof overhead, most likely a smartphone, pretty likely a car etc. people in this country are among the best-off in the world. But hey, spit in the soup so we can move a bit closer to the realities of much of the rest of the world! Genius move....
The solution to which is to elect a government of Eton-educated spivs who will deliver the ultimate far-right project to remove what rights they have left and turbo-charge inequality
Well done to everyone involved
Don't forget about appealing to a bit of nudge-nudge racism into the bargain.
Not saying this is any more accurate than other views I’ve read but does seem quite succinct regarding the overall position.
https://www.cer.eu/insights/ten-reflections-sovereignty-first-brexit
+1
Well worth a read/
most likely a smartphone
That's a cracker. The entire brexit debate summed up in one stunningly ignorant, patronising and arrogant point. You should get some sort of award.
This feels like a “squirrel!” sidetrack… but what the hey… about half the people in the world have a smartphone, and about half do not. Everyone I know in this country is in the more privileged half as regards being digitally connected. There are exceptions, of course. What was the point…?
https://www.statista.com/statistics/289167/mobile-phone-penetration-in-the-uk/
Bloody poor people with their petty jealousies!
Got any solutions daz? I mean other than just coming on here slating people who didn't vote for brexit and also held their noses and voted for Corbyn? I'm not sure what else we were supposed to do in practical terms?
Why would it come as a surprise when they already know no one gives a shit about them? This isn’t the result of brexit, it’s the cause.
I thought it (the cause) was ‘for our sovereignty’ and just the small issue of ‘bloody foreigners’ and ‘look after our own’ (and also the small but not inconsiderable efforts of half a century of jingoistic tabloidism drip-drip-drip telling us that we’re being stiffed by Johnny Foreigner and that ‘educated people’/‘the elite’/bloody do-gooders/students, etc etc are all in cahoots with/are useful idiots for the foreigners/commies/Islamic takeover/shadowy cabal of Jewish media etc etc etc?
Or did I miss all that and it was some nationwide tendency of middle-class families in a BMW sneering at ‘the poor’? I was a ‘poor’ street sweeper (it’s all relative) and some people sneered at me. To my face. Didn’t mean that I was ready to subscribe to the Daily Heil and take all of my opinions from mr jingo down the pub in his cups. I do though also remember being socially sneered at by some of my ‘peers’ for (ironically) picking up my own litter and seeming to care about ‘foreigners’ as well as myself and ‘mine’. Seriously. Bloody hell what a mess this country is. And I’m still poor (in debt, no property, hand me down car about to fail the MOT) should I feel angry at my Dr, or my neighbour with the Tesla?
Got any solutions daz?
There aren't any quick ones. The core problem IMO is the lack of political engagement of the public. We have a system where the people have very little involvement or agency in how they are governed, and they're asked to trust politicians and others to act in their interests. The trouble is our political representatives and other leaders repeatedly fail to do that and instead act in their own interests or those of their friends at the top. How often do we hear 'they're all the same' or 'they're only in it for themselves' when people talk about politicians?
The only way to solve that is to find ways of giving power back to people, and rebuilding trust between them and their leaders. Rightly or wrongly I think that's what brexit voters think they're doing by leaving the EU. They're going to be disappointed of course, and things will get worse before they improve. It probably needs a new party to emerge like in France to as the two ruling parties (in england at least) are busted flushes. Trouble is in England we're more likely to go down the reactionary nationalist path than the centrist liberal one like the french did with Macron.
The core problem IMO is the lack of political engagement of the public.
Farage was great at that. So more of him then?
It does seem designed to be easily retracted at a moments notice. I don’t think that’s on the cards… but it hasn’t exactly been designed to reassure nonUK citizens that their places here, and rights here, are secure, has it.
Windrush. of course there is a reason why there is no evidence.
The core problem IMO is the lack of political engagement of the public
Well, at the first opportunity of 'direct democracy' 'we' ticked the box marked "pant-shitting xenophobic far right wing tantrum".
Not off to a great start, then.
The only way to solve that is to find ways of giving power back to people, and rebuilding trust between them and their leaders. Rightly or wrongly I think that’s what brexit voters think they’re doing by leaving the EU. They’re going to be disappointed of course, and things will get worse...
I agree.
I took out “before they improve’… because you haven’t explained that bit… we can see how the ‘get worse’ bit is going to happen… how does that end up with anything but a spiralling in on increased unilateralism and anti-foreigner little England driven politics?
Trouble is in England we’re more likely to go down the reactionary nationalist path than the centrist liberal one like the french did with Macron.
I agree.
These are all easy things to agree on. You were asked what the solutions look like…
Farage was great at that. So more of him then?
Like all populist snake oil salesmen Farage is very good at speaking to people as equals and making them think he's one of them. If mainstream politicians don't start listening and acting on the concerns of normal people then Farage will gain more popularity and more power.
The core problem IMO is the lack of political engagement of the public.
Which in turn is down to education. Lots of people don't know what any of it means so they don't bother to vote or they just vote based on what their families do or how the candidates dress or some other sentiment. Lots of people say stuff like "they're all the same what's the point?" Well they really aren't all the same, not at all.
Farage was great at that.
That's not political engagement, that's just persuading people to do what he wants. Political engagement means questioning, thinking, and challenging. Farage aimed for the opposite of this.
Political engagement means questioning, thinking, and challenging. Farage aimed for the opposite of this.
Populism. It works on people who don't like to think too much.
It’s being debated now. I’ve heard more convincing door-to-door brush salesmen.
I'm avoiding listening to it as it'll make me far too angry. It's pretty much nailed on that this shitty deal will be passed anyway, the interesting bit will be in seeing who the abstainers are and who went against their party. I've written to my MP explaining my position on the matter, not expecting a reply though. It was bad enough biting my tongue while talking to my mum and dad yesterday as they blathered on about the new opportunities and that we're better off alone in the world etc.
Starmer is in the familiar position of quoting the detail of a treaty that the buffoon across from him clearly hasn’t bothered to read. Boris is doing his usual bluster and bullshit, using his slogans to try and deflect from the fact that he hasn’t actually got a clue about any of the details of what are incredibly important issues for the future of our country
This paper-thin deal is being driven through today purely for political expediency on behalf of that mop-headed charlatan
It’s a truly sad day
True. I'd go out on me bike but it's still icy. Starmer is making some good points, sounds like he's read it. Or his researcher's have.
Theresa May pointing out the ways in which this deal is considerably worse than hers, that Boris voted against saying it was a terrible deal for the UK
But she’ll vote for it anyway, as will the Labour Party, simply because it’s either this crap deal or the worst-case scenario of a no deal crash out.
That’s it! The only 2 options now available
You really couldn’t make this shit up
I wrote this on my Facebook page earlier this morning:
If anyone is expecting today's vote over the Brexit Deal to be the end of it you are very much mistaken. This is only the beginning. Here's why:
The Agreement is woefully lacking in any detail.
It's full of outdated references to Treaties, technology and even one case of a country that no longer exists.
There has been absolutely no time to scrutinise the text, leaving it wide open to challenges, legal clarifications and even having parts declared null and void.
This version is only a starting point. We will be stuck in a constant loop of revisions, amendments and challenges for decades to come.
It doesn't do what people think it does, namely we are still going to have to follow EU rules and standards if we want any chance of selling goods and services to any country inside the EU.
There is no provision set out in it for cross-border services ie FInance. Financial services are a huge part of the UK's GDP so if that is jeopardised in any way (clue: this agreement throws it under a bus) then we, as a country, will massively suffer.
The government have told a different version of what it contains to every different group that has asked. The only conclusion you can draw from this is that they either don't know what is in it or it doesn't do any of these promises and they're hoping that the lack of time to scrutinise it means they will not get found out.Nearly every promise that the Government have made about what they could achieve with this 'Oven-Ready' deal has been found out to be a lie. The deal that Teresa May brokered a few years ago was better than this one but Boris and Co voted against it as it wasn't good enough. Nothing is right about how this last-minute deal is being handled and 'sold' to the British public so there is going to be lots of uncertainty, mess and pain for the next few years while the ramifications of what happens today play out.
I fully expect certain people to disagree with me on this, I can guess who they will be, but this is what I fear is going to happen. The Government cannot be trusted on this right now so be vary wary about what you voted/wished for, it could be a bumpy ride.
Don't know if people agree with it on here but it's my thoughts. You can guess how quickly it got loads of comments and what they said!
The only way to solve that is to find ways of giving power back to people,
**** that, as a revolutionary yourself Dazh given half a chance the public would string you up. Most of the public are petty vindictive self centred conservative reactionaries who can’t be trusted to run a bath, let alone a system of collective local govt. there’d be poor houses, public flogging, and curfews before the end of the first week of “people power”
Theresa May pointing out the ways in which this deal is considerably worse than hers, that Boris voted against saying it was a terrible deal for the UK
It's almost as if Boris was against Theresa May's deal because it suited his own ambition to be leader, and not for the good of the country.
But she’ll vote for it anyway, as will the Labour Party, simply because it’s either this crap deal or the worst-case scenario of a no deal crash out.
Hold on a minute!
But she’ll vote for it anyway, as will the Labour Party, simply because it’s either this crap deal or the worst-case scenario of a no deal crash out.
It would still pass easily if labour abstain. voting for it is a huge mistake
Couldn’t agree more TJ. There’s no way Labour should be voting for this. Boris and his ERG chums should be left in complete ownership of this shambles, as the real-world implications of it become reality over the coming months and years.
Starmer is making a huge mistake today. There are no good options left, but the Labour Party should not be touching this with a barge pole
**** that, as a revolutionary yourself Dazh
Seems to be some misunderstanding cos I'm not suggesting anything revolutionary and I certainly wouldn't class myself as one. Not unless we now consider old fashioned social democratic policies as that. It wasn't long ago that working people had secure jobs, weren't being ripped off by utility companies, had pensions to look forward to, could get a doctor's appointment, and could send their kids off to university or college without worrying about how much debt they'll be in. That's the starting point, and its hardly revolutionary. If the balance isn't tipped back in the favour of working people and away from the landlords and spivs then they'll continue voting for shit like brexit and listening to the likes of Farage and Boris. That's all I'm talking about.
Brexit is happening, and Labour have no control or influence over it. By voting No or abstaining Labour will be essentially saying “we’d like no deal please”
its rubbish but that’s the reality, “would sir like his shit sandwich on brown or white bread...”
