[Closed] Been asked to make a 'donation' for a lesbian couple I know.

As long as the legal/financial side of things is sorted I'd say yes, but it does mean masturbating in the next room to your mate!

You'll always be financially responsible, should the parents wish you to be, regardless of any agreements drawn up.

Personally I wouldn't do it, unless of course you donate in the traditional sense. All of you. 😀

Its not really my place to offer advice yes or no - this is a decision only you can make,

Couple of things spring to mind to consider though. Firstly, at some point it is likely the child will want to know who their father is. Could you deal with this / would you want to deal with this?

Secondly, if you do decide to offer up some of your finest lust milk get a contract in place that details what is expected of you financially and emotionally in the future (i.e nothing). Recent story in the news where a guy did offer up and is now being stung for child support etc as there is no contract in place to the contrary. Take as much legal advice as you need and get the couple in question to pay for it.

Finally, think long and hard about it. Have you considered their motives for a child - do they really want one or is it because its the 'trendy' thing to do, can they cope do you think both emotional / financially etc. Do not rush a yes decision.

[img] [/img]

[b][i]"but it does mean masturbating in the next room to your mate! "[/i][/b]

I think you have to be selfish about this and think only about you, the impact on you short and long term. It could become very complex very quickly and long term the potential for things to go wrong for you, in terms of your involvement, future relationships, your decision to have your 'own' kids with your partner etc. on top of that there is the potential for psychological issues for you, them and maybe the child ( unlikely).

Likewise I'd be very flattered and overwhelmed and the thought of 'gifting' someone something like that would be incredible, but personally it is not the sort of complication I would want in my life.

Good luck with your decision, whatever it may be.

Are they in a civil partnership?

If not, then three words: Child Support Agency

If you don't go via a recognised agency, then you could find yourself paying for the next eighteen years! (and forget contracts, the CSA/CMEC law is clear, your only protection is a licensed agency or their civil partnership)

Check any CSA issues, even if they're not likely to do it you never know whether DWP or the like could involve them if there was a benefit claim.

I thought you were liable if they come after you for maintenance whether your jizz gets there from you or a pippet ?

[img] [/img]

2 logins ban him

*skip to the end*

You are Binners, and I claim my £5.

I got asked once I said they had to collect it themselves

On the one hand it is an act of kindness on another it is abandoning a child that is yours
If you maintain contact with them what happens if they start doing things you dont approve off with the child [ a roadie for example 😉 ]or what happens when the child asks you for advice about finding its father or has known you all its life and does not know you are their dad etc

Bit of a minefield IMHO unless you donate and then do one - could you do this as in never see your friends or the child?
Its a no from me personally and anonymity is a better option IMHO

never see your friends or the child?

^^This^^

Anonymous or fully involved. Never the twain shall meet, IMHO.

As Junkster sort of says, effectively you have not been asked to 'give a donation', but to become a father and then basically give up any involvement with [b]your [/b]child.

Nice of them to ask you, but they nay have asked a few others, why dont they adopt,also i always think the donation is better coming from a gay man, as they dont have the added problem of the girl freind/ wife either being told or finding out and not liking the idea later in life.

Tread very carefully

Since contracts can't overrule statute, no contract you sign will get you out of legal parental responsibilities eg CSA etc if they split up and end up on benefits.

I have a Lesbian friend who bought sperm from a sperm bank, all above board, regulated etc. She now has a lovely daughter and is happy as anything.

From the HFEA website:

What are the risks of using donated sperm?

If you use donated sperm from a registered donor at an HFEA licensed clinic, the risks are minimal because:

donors who give sperm through a licensed clinic must answer a series of questions designed to ensure that they are suitable
licensed clinics check donors’ family histories for inherited diseases
all donors go through stringent screening checks to ensure they are not carrying infections, such as HIV, Hepatitis B and C, cytomegalovirus(CMV), syphilis and gonorrhoea. Donated sperm is quarantined for six months whilst the donor is being screened
there are limits on the numbers of families created by each donor where sperm are used to treat you at a licensed clinic.
Back to top

Legal considerations

Any child born from sperm donated through a clinic is the legal child of you and your partner, if you have one. The donor has no legal rights or responsibility for the child.

Since April 2005, identifying information about donors is held on the HFEA Register and may be given to any child born from a donation once they are 18 years old.

For more information on donation, and donating, see:

For donors
For the donor conceived and their parents
Back to top

Obtaining sperm via the web

There are an increasing number of websites which offer services which match women with sperm donors. Donors and recipients may then meet and arrange insemination privately, without attending a clinic. If you are considering using these services it is important to bear in mind the very real risks and consequences of obtaining sperm in this way.

The safest and most reliable way of obtaining sperm from a donor is via a clinic that is licensed, inspected and regulated by the Human Fertilisation and Embryology Authority (HFEA). The Authority is the UK’s independent regulator of treatment using eggs, sperm and embryos.

Licensed clinics must meet standards set by the Authority (outlined in the HFEA Code of Practice) and they must supply information about treatments, patients, donors, gametes (sperm and eggs) and children conceived which is kept on the HFEA’s Register.

If you obtain sperm from a web-based service, you may be putting yourself at serious risk. It’s worth bearing the following points in mind:

If you have treatment outside a licensed clinic the legal situation regarding who the second parent of the child will be is complicated. For example:

- The donor may be the legal father of any child born. The law says a man donating sperm through an HFEA-licensed clinic is not the legal father of any child born through that donation (this includes cases where the donor is known to the recipient). However, when donation occurs outside a licensed clinic, this guarantee does not exist.

- [b]In cases where a female couple, who are not civil partners, have treatment outside a licensed clinic, the law does not recognise the female partner as the second parent[/b]
There is a risk that the sperm may not come from the person whose picture or details you saw on the website.
The donor may not have been properly screened before donating. This means that there is a risk that sexually transmitted infections, including HIV may be passed on to you, and that serious inherited medical conditions may be passed on to your child.
The children who are born following unlicensed donation will not have an official way of finding out their genetic origins, as the HFEA will not hold information about their donor on its Register.
If the donor receives payments above the amounts permitted by the Authority, then licensed clinics may not be able to provide treatment with sperm from that donor at a later date.
Our advice is simple. Only use a licensed clinic. That way, you can be assured that all the quality checks and legal requirements have been met.

Note as others have said its the if they're in Civil Partnership that determines who the second parent is if the donation is private.

Worth having a read through the site in general - [url= http://www.hfea.gov.uk/79.html ]Link[/url]

I say yes. How often does this kind of opportunity come up? As above, get all your ducks lined up first though.

My cousin is a lesbian and together with her partner they asked their gay next-door neighbour for a donation. I'm not sure what sort of agreement they had in place prior to the event, but he also contributed again about 2 years later. I now have a delightful niece and nephew who seem very well adjusted and balanced. They see their dad relatively frequently. The only issue I know about is his mother wanting more contact than the mothers are keen on.

The first fertilisation was via him coming to the back door with a jam-jar full of his finest seed, the second was done in a slightly more medically approved manner!

That might be another thing to consider - how would your parents react to having a grandchild that the mothers may not be particularly enthusiastic for them to have much contact with?

Cheers, Rich

I have to say that the above reaction from the hip cool happening members of STW is provoking a bit of a giggle.

I suspect that of the fathers among the commentators, not one of you, not a single solitary one of you, gave the same amount of thought to the moment you impregnated someone...

what will the delivery method be?

[img] https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTKYN6m8jZKX2oJoLGtbVIKZ4HTxbm1W3uFd0DUlTfkjTafSi5_ [/img]

I suspect that of the fathers among the commentators, not one of you, not a single solitary one of you, gave the same amount of thought to the moment you impregnated someone...

Your powers of prediction is as poor as your attempt to provoke a reaction is obvious

I suspect that of the fathers among the commentators, not one of you, not a single solitary one of you, gave the same amount of thought to the moment you impregnated someone...

My wife and I have discussed it near enough every other day for the past year. We are still no closer to making a decision on whether to have children or not. The biggest decision we will ever make, shouldn't be taken lightly under any circumstance.

Your powers of prediction is as poor as your attempt to provoke a reaction is obvious

I think you meant to say 'Your powers of prediction [b]are[/b] as poor' and you misinterpret my post. However, I know you like arguing even though you are not very good at it, so if I can be of service, do let me know.

I suspect that of the fathers among the commentators, not one of you, not a single solitary one of you, gave the same amount of thought to the moment you impregnated someone...

All the more reason to learn from our mistakes!

Dont do it!

[url= http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andy_Bathie ]Link[/url]

I know you like arguing even though you are not very good at it, so if I can be of service, do let me know.

First reaction reading the first post?

Ultimately the child will be yours. If you can't honestly say that at this time in YOUR life that YOU want a child, then don't do it.

Ultimately the child will be yours. If you can't honestly say that at this time in YOUR life that YOU want a child, then don't do it.

This. That is the essence of what they are asking of you.

I would suggest against donation.

We have some lesbotic friends who now have 3 kids, all from the same anonymous donor. (although interestingly enough they took it in turns to be pregnant so only 2 of the kids are siblings, one is technically a step-sibling).

Having sprogged twice, My view of kids is somewhat changed. I went into it 70% sold on the idea. The second I looked into my sons eyes I knew life was different. I would find it very very difficult to donate to any couple I knew and NOT get involved.

I disagree vehemently with some of the parenting approaches my best friends follow, but that is their choice and I respect that (not like they're sharing drugs with the kids just that they are more authoritarian than we are). However if I knew the child was genetically related to me, then I would not be able to keep out of it, which would spell trouble in the future.

For this reason, I would suggest they seek anonymous donation. (From someone better looking :-p )

You would be the Father but you will never be the Dad. Pretty important distinction there which could be a good thing or not, depending on you. If you want kids yourself, that would be for the Dad side of thing.

I would go with your gut instinct on this, but be very, very careful.

Well done for even thinking about it though, would be great to be able to help mates out like that if you are sure about it.

lots of different avenues to go

[img] [/img]

You would be the Father but you will never be the Dad. Pretty important distinction there which could be a good thing or not, depending on you. If you want kids yourself, that would be for the Dad side of thing.

A lesbian couple of my acquaintance always refer to their donor as 'the donor'.

As has been said above, tread very carefully - it's not clear how much they're asking you to get involved beyond donation, you need to weigh up how you will feel about a child that is genetically yours but who you may not have any involvement with, and there are the legal ramifications.

Anonymous donor might be best all round.

Sorry I wouldn't. You'll understand why later. You'll want to be part of his/her life. Really regret those years. Resent maybe. I was asked once. At first I felt virile, honoured then thought about the mind-**** of not being a parent. My child brought up without me. Now I've had my own son it all clicks loudly into place.

If you get to the age of 45 and haven't had your kids then consider the Lesbian approach.

Personally I would say no, I think they should adopt or accept 2 women cant make a baby.

Kids need mothers and fathers. Are you ready to be the father? Are you ready to accept the responsibility that goes with that? Are they ready to allow you to take that responsibility?

This is a person we're talking about creating here and that person needs a dad just as much as it needs two mums.

I was asked by a very good friend if I would help her with a course of IVF. I was rather stunned, but agreed. Went through the whole thing, but sadly it failed. Cost to her was around £5000, cost, to me, nothing, although it was somewhat upsetting, having gone all the way through.
We're still very good friends, and always will be.

The traceability issue is large. You will be liable for the child regardless of your contracts. But this same constraint will also stop any others they might ask. Maybe suggest the Monte Carlo method. Get allthe possible donors together, drink some vodka, hand out some blindfolds and off you go.

Kids need mothers and fathers

Careful, you'll have the PC brigade on you in no time with comments like that!

[url= http://web.archive.org/web/20091107193215/http://www.rollingstone.com/artists/melissaetheridge/articles/story/8856161/david_crosbys_a_daddy ]David Crosby[/url] did.

Some friends here did it via a Clinic, everything vetted, basic info about the donor and no come back to the donor down the line.
How not to do it.
[img] [/img]

Kids need mothers and fathers

Kids dont need mothers and fathers what a load of rubbish. I effectively didnt have a father. Kids need love and care. Having said that i would say no in this case.

FWIW have a look at yesterdays Guardian Magazine - insightful piece by Yottam Ottolenghi (the Chef) on the issues he and his partner had! HTH

Going through an agency will will probably cost money etc but so would setting up any contracts etc and as pointed out they won't stand up in court.

Then you have to ask yourself the moral questions of are you happy for them to bring up your child etc - I am assuming having got this far you think they would make good parents.

I'd do it, but only if I was covered for the future. Yes the kid will be 50% yours but everyone on in the world has 99.9....% the same DNA (I have no idea what the real figure is) so the difference between yours and a kid next door is tiny really (except in the eyes of the law) and what makes a parent is the parenting side in my eyes and it doesnt matter if the kid is yours or adopted, it is the parenting that really matters.

Make sure you can handle it, you are happy with it and you are covered legally.

On a lighter note...i think you should get to live out a lesbian threesome fantasy as payment 😀

Kids dont need mothers and fathers what a load of rubbish. I effectively didnt have a father. Kids need love and care. Having said that i would say no in this case.

Unfortunately the data doesn't support your argument. All the studies consistently shows that kids do better (by various measures) when brought up in stable family unit, I.e. with both parents present. You can't argue with the data but you can claim that your own experience isn't consistent with the data and that might well be true.

Was your upbringing made better by, worse by or no different as a result of not effectively having a father?

There's no answer is there because you've got nothing to compare it to, but I bet given a choice you would still have chosen a present, loving and actively involved father?

There are many threads on here where fathers bemoan their lack of access, their lack of rights with their kids after they separate from their partner. Fathers are discriminated against in so many ways when it comes to being fathers and it makes me angry. If you're going to donate your sperm and then not take an active involvement in your child's upbringing then in my view you're simply undermining and further marginalising the importance of fathers in kids lives.

Your call but don't be surprised if you're harshly judged for your decision.

My sister in law is one of the leading fertility lawyers in the uk and she specialises in this sort of thing. If you send me an email I can send you her contact details and she can explain all that you need to know.

Geetee care to share.the data and explain how all the other socio economic factors were.accounted for? The post also said "need" not ideally would have so the statement was clearly bollocks.

Anagallis you're a grown up do your own research. The studies are numerous and are regularly referenced by many agencies including politicians on both sides of the house. It's really not a point for debate. There are other debates such as what does the data imply from a policy perspective, is there legislation we can pass to make things better, should governments be doing that at all?

But the question of whether kids do better in households with both parents present is unequivocal.

However that said a quick scan does suggest that the gender of the parents has no bearing on the rearing of children. Two parents are generally better than one but two same sex couples tend to as good as heterosexual couples at the job.

That said, I'm still deeply uncomfortable with either role being marginalised, father or mother though generally its the role of fathers that is so affected.

Anagallis you're a grown up do your own research.

It's really not a point for debate.

But the question of whether kids do better in households with both parents present is unequivocal.

One loving parent v two drug addicted prostitutes - nor room for debate? Unequivocal??

Your broad point has some merits, despite you overstating it and refusing to substantiate it but A_A makes a reasonable point that other factors may also be a factor in deciding what is good- you can do your own research 😉
it is quite possible that those parents who divorce [ on average not all of them] were the worst parents anyway and their is no way to control for this in research.

FWIW the last time i looked it showed that same sex couples did as well as divorced couple but not as well as married couple- its fun saying things about research without citing it isn't it ?
It will be interesting to see what the data will show for divorced same sex couples and children now they can marry.

Its also worth noting that it would be somewhat difficult to find a causal mechanism in the marriage vows or ceremony that somehow transforms people into better parents so it seems other factors should also be included rather than just marriage per se.

Unfortunately the data doesn't support your argument. All the studies consistently shows that kids do better (by various measures) when brought up in stable family unit, I.e. with both parents present. You can't argue with the data but you can claim that your own experience isn't consistent with the data and that might well be true.

This entirely fails to support your argument: both parents. Not mother and father.

Your call but don't be surprised if you're harshly judged for your decision.

On the upside, judgemental bigots are a minority.

Geetee, your argument almost makes sense but, you have some built in assumptions which are false

when brought up in stable family unit, I.e. with both parents present

For example.

This donation, can you chose where/how?

(Facial?)

Lol!

No easy answer to this . I would have to think about a theoretical issue. If the person in question was straight would I consider her as a potential wife/partner. As a father of a child you would be taking on a lot of the big issues you can expect to face in a marriage. If you wouldn't consider her as a potential wife then how would the relationship as donor/father work?
Good luck whatever you decide.

So Geetee in summary a quick scan does indeed suggest your wrong?

FunkyDunc - Member
.... I think they should adopt or accept 2 women cant make a baby.

So long as they're happy to have girls, that's technically not true.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/1431489.stm

OP never, ever, leave yourself open to the CSA. However unlikely you think it is they could ever get involved don't risk it. Speak to anyone who has ever had the misfortune to have dealt with them, from whatever side (absent parent or parent with care) and they will confirm this. Nasty organization staffed by nasty people. The powers they have to make your life a misery are unbelievable.

For example a friend (genuineley not me I'd prefer to keep my story of dealing with them private) who's maintenance is always paid direct from his wages worked for a company that went into receivership. On his last pay packet the deduction was made as usual but it would seem the CSA never recieved the payment from the firms administrators. As it would be easier to harass him than them the CSA went after him to pay again - the money had already been deducted from his wages remember- as he was now unemployed and couldn't pay they confiscated his driving license! They are above the law and fully able to do things like this there is [b]nothing[/b] you can do about it. He worked as a carpenter, needed his van too look for work and worse still was no longer able to drive over and collect his daughter for their usual visits. He has an excellent relationship with his ex partner and she was equally astounded by what happened but there was nothing either of them could do to get the decision overturned until the £200 "debt" was paid. IIRC she lent him the money in the end as neither of them wanted the daughter to have an out of work Dad who couldn't get over to see her.

NO NO NO much as though its a nice thing to do, resentments etc will build and the financials will never go away say one or both lesbians decides on a lifestyle change and have new partners maybe a man even.. how do you know they ll still honour your original agreement the truth is keep them as friends dont be a father to either of thems kids. emptionally and finacially it ll cost A LOT

NO NO NO much as though its a nice thing to do, resentments etc will build and the financials will never go away say one or both lesbians decides on a lifestyle change and have new partners maybe a man even.. how do you know they ll still honour your original agreement the truth is keep them as friends dont be a father to either of thems kids. emptionally and finacially it ll cost A LOT

Thats a good point. Keep them as friends.

My Sister in Law's Sister (that make sense?) is a lesbian and is going to be inseminated by a gay friend of theres.

Not sure I agree with it to be honest, not least for the fact that her partner is unstable. It all seems very Jerry Springer to me.

I'll probably get flamed for this but the PC brigade have basically said that Fathers (or in the case of gay men, Mothers) are no longer needed.

Surely a Child needs a Mother and a Father figure?

Also what will happen when that kid gets to the playground and his classmates ask him about his parents. Kids can be incredibly cruel.

Lesbians and gays have chosen their alternative lifestyle and if they want to do that then I don't have an issue with it. The kid doesn't get a say, he/she just gets to live with the consequences.

[i]The kid doesn't get a say, he/she just gets to live with the consequences. [/i]

What consequences?

What consequences?

Bullying and general mind****ery.

a jam-jar full of his finest seed

Holy cr*p dude!! A FULL JAM JAR!! I must be doing something wrong...........

I'm not convinced myself. I grew up with someone who was brought up by lesbians. He didn't seem to suffer too badly and is certainly a well rounded individual now.

I might have missed something though because while I was brought up by straight parents, their poor genetic code which gave me a warped brain, dodgy teeth and terrible eyes, ensured I was a bully-magnet throughout most of my school life.

Now they should have thought about having children.

Holy cr*p dude!! A FULL JAM JAR!! I must be doing something wrong...........

I might have missed something though because while I was brought up by straight parents......Now they should have thought about having children.

the PC brigade

Surely a Child needs a Mother and a Father figure?

Also what will happen when that kid gets to the playground and his classmates ask him about his parents. Kids can be incredibly cruel.

Lesbians and gays have chosen their alternative lifestyle

and if they want to do that then I don't have an issue with it.

The kid doesn't get a say, he/she just gets to live with the consequences.

Its quite hard to ask a foetus for its opinion but if i was to guess i would guess at it choosing life ...perhaps it wont be as "troubled" by the "alternative" lifestyle as you are?

Lesbians and gays have chosen their alternative lifestyle and if they want to do that then I don't have an issue with it. The kid doesn't get a say, he/she just gets to live with the consequences.

And im sure they thankyou for your stupid comment as well as most reasonable people on here do.

Being gay or lesbian is not a lifestyle choice, although parts of the media and advertising do make it apear so,being gay or lesbian nowadays is living or sharing your life with a same sex partner, with laws that help to protect that lifestyle, where gays and lesbiabns are allowed to show their sexuality, just like hetro sexuals are, where gay adoption is acceptable and legal unless youre a catholic christian.

As for the kid,he grows up with kids his own age, kids who also have parents, and its from some of these stupid bigoted parents that the stupid and cruel comments come from and are repeated by the kids.

Its all about education and training, not what the church or some bigot says is correct.

OP - tough decision and not one I'd want to have to make. Personally I think I'd say no. When I was young and single I'd have seriously considered it and probably said yes as it seems like a noble thing to do, however now I have kids of my own it would be a definite no.

I don't think I could comprehend not seeing them every day and taking a back seat in their development. It's cliched I know, but they really do change your life and to be permanently apart from them would be unbearable IMO.

I don't think I could comprehend not seeing them every day and taking a back seat in their development.

Couples plan to have children and there's obviously a very strong emotional bond there.

Other people "accidentally" conceive, there the parents have a moral obligation whether they have any emotional attachment or not.

This is a bit different. If you donated blood or an organ to a stranger would you be taking a keen interest in the rest of their life? After all biologically you are a part of them...

Presumably plenty of "official" anonymous donors have unknown kids out there, do they sit awake at night wondering/worrying about how [i]their[/i] kids are being brought up? is there a way of looking at this dispassionately? Should it be viewed dispassionately? Conceiving is just a couple of cells banging into each other, being a parent is a lot more than that and arguably something completely different.

I understand your point D0nk, and agree that everyone is different which is why only the OP can really answer his own question. We planned our kids and dote on them, however until they were born I didn't realise how overwhelming the desire to spend time with them and help to nurture them would be.

Perhaps if I'd been 'donating' things would be different, and if I'd agreed to it I would only have done so assuming I could stay unattached, however knowing what I know now I think my feelings would have changed which would have complicated things and ultimately caused me a lot of pain.

Edit to add: Also the anonymous donor could no doubt be completely dispassionate, however the OP is talking about good friends so he would be anything but anonymous.

Surely a Child needs a Mother and a Father figure?

apparently not according geetee's quick google