🙁
2nd amendment....Why?
It's their choice and the price they pay to have firearms in the country which is unlikely to change seeing as guns will always be available illegally and the right to keep and bear arms is part of the constitution. There will be the usual emotional knee jerk reaction but the status quo will return once the fuss dies down.
Didnt see much in the news today about the 100people killed on the roads in America on the same day.
The victims choice?
I wonder if obama will feel secure enough fresh into his second term to grab the issue by the nuts and do something about it. The 2nd amendment should be viewed as americas embarrassment.
What a tragedy.
Somebody on STW watches Sky News, amazing.
I once heard some American on the radio (presumably after the last school shooting) saying that the 2nd amendment was written to allow 'the people' to prevent an authoritarian government forming (democracy being sacred to them, and all that) and had no relevance to 'allowing people to protect themselves'
Ban guns and psychos will disappear? Even Goldie Lookin Chain know this is bullshit.
Sounds like a similar theme to the war on drugs where nobody looks at the buyer in a society that's made most of us addicted to something.
Fair to say that guns allow a certain cowardice in such tragedies. Some disconnected being may not take such measures if they had to stand toe to toe.
No single, simple answer.
Another very, very sad story.
awful day
It's their choice
20 children chose that, did they?
There will always be an individual of a species who feels they aren't and never will be where they want to be, connected in a certain heirachy.
In this case the individual may, for want of a better expression, turn rogue. I don't believe this can ever be changed. It's animal nature and we as a species can't monitor the mental health of every individual all the time.
Some people can't get their head around this. The world will never be perfect.
Didnt see much in the news today about the 100people killed on the roads in America on the same day.
One person did all that deliberately mowing folk down and it did not make the news
Sky news really is shit then or its a very slow troll day
You are neither subtle enough nor stupid enough for here
Ban guns and psychos will disappear? Even Goldie Lookin Chain know this is bullshit.
When I was a teenager, I sometimes got mad at my parents. What I could do is go upstairs, slam my bedroom door, and play music very loud. What I couldn't do is go to school with an assault rifle and take it out on the rest of my class.
Guns don't make people go psycho, but they make it a hell of a lot easier for them to succeed.
First page and we're already into personal abuse.....
I know we only get news from English speaking nations or close neighbours but is this type of shooting happening else where?
You don't need a Gun.
[url= http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/man-attacks-22-kids-knife-china-school-article-1.1220230 ]Clicky :([/url]
Yes, and tragic as the event in China was, notice that none of the kids died.
[quote=zippykona ]I know we only get news from English speaking nations or close neighbours but is this type of shooting happening else where?
Breivik in Norway.
The Swedish guy that was shooting immigrants.
It happens elsewhere, but is even more newsworthy when it does as it is so infrequent.
It does happen other places, and other places also have lots of guns without this kind of thing. Everyone in Switzerland is armed to the teeth.
There's a toxic combination in the States of ready availability of weapons and a culture of violence.
Where as here we have alcohol and a culture of violence so much less deaths
That's a good question and I have no idea. Seem to recall it in France (I think). In countries where girls are shot for going to school and people are blowing themselves up to kill others, I'd guess it is though.
I get the 'their choice' comment, as in USA has to put up with things like this if weapons are that available, but on a personal, individual level, it's truly devestating.
I've also just remembered Norway...
Edit: and I'm a slow typer on the phone!!
Dear NRA
How many childrens' lives is the right to own an assault rifle worth?
Yours
Confused.
what is absolutely amazing is that the school was designated a 'Gun Free Zone'
that right there shows how ridiculous the levels of gun ownership must be when you have to create a special zone around a school where you're not supposed to have weapons
[i] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_Connecticut [/i]
And fully automatic machine guns are legal..., kinda puts the intended (from the lady who's son was killed, said on radio she's been promised this) Scottish Airgun ban into perspective 🙄
what is absolutely amazing is that the school was designated a 'Gun Free Zone'
Indeed - if the teachers had been carrying, then they could have stopped him in his tracks!
maybe the debate on gun control should come later , lets just spare a thought for the people that have died.
Is there no subject you wont troll 😕
I know we only get news from English speaking nations or close neighbours but is this type of shooting happening else where?
You forgot about this one then http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunblane_school_massacre
It does unfortunately happen in this country, but it is thankfully very rare. Gun crime is far less of a problem.
tails - MemberThink they have some crap in the constitution thing bout right to bare(sic) arms!
It's been interpreted that way, but was actually intended to allow for a 'militia' to defend the local population at time very different to now. ie. a de facto Police/National Guard raised in time of need, not for disgruntled young lads to go on the rampage at a school, cinema, shopping mall etc. if they felt the urge. The modern spin on it is based on a fallacy. The Police and National Guard are now formally organised. The general population need not concern themselves with it.
There appears to be a sort of paranoia about "bad guys with guns" (and, therefore, guns being comfort blankets for some people, whether it would help or not) and a fear of the government removing "freedoms" (at what cost?).
The only winners are the gun industry.
The 'tradition' of almost anybody having access to fairly serious weaponry that makes mass murder relatively easy/straight-forward for anybody who wishes to carry it out seems nonsensical to me.
The fairly similar Europeans and Australasians manage to function reasonably well without assault rifles stashed in the car/bedroom or the legally permitted concealed carrying of handguns by large numbers of people on a trip down to Sainsburys.
I'm not opposed to hunting or sport shooting, and I even took part in it when I was over there, but as far as I'm concerned, the mass possession of firearms in the USA is not a good thing.
Interestingly, gun laws in the UK were changed after the dunblane shooting, from same wiki article I linked above.
The Gun Control Network was founded in the aftermath of the shootings and was supported by some parents of victims at Dunblane and of the Hungerford Massacre.[12] Bereaved families and their friends also initiated a campaign to ban private gun ownership, named the Snowdrop Petition (because March is snowdrop time in Scotland), which gained 705,000 signatures in support and was supported by some newspapers, including the Sunday Mail, a Scottish newspaper whose own petition to ban handguns had raised 428,279 signatures within five weeks of the massacre.The Cullen Inquiry into the massacre recommended that the government introduce tighter controls on handgun ownership[13] and consider whether an outright ban would be in the public interest.[14] The report also recommended changes in school security[15] and vetting of people working with children under 18.[16] The Home Affairs Select Committee agreed with the need for restrictions on gun ownership but stated that a handgun ban was not appropriate.
In response to this public debate, the then-current Conservative government introduced a ban on all cartridge ammunition handguns with the exception of .22 calibre single-shot weapons in England, Scotland and Wales. Following the 1997 General Election, the Labour government of Tony Blair introduced the Firearms (Amendment) (No. 2) Act 1997, banning the remaining .22 cartridge handguns in England, Scotland and Wales, and leaving only muzzle-loading and historic handguns legal, as well as certain sporting handguns (e.g. "Long-Arms") that fall outside the Home Office Definition of a "Handgun" due to their dimensions. The ban does not affect Northern Ireland, the Isle of Man, or the Channel Islands.
Security in schools, particularly primary schools, was improved in response to the Dunblane massacre and two other violent incidents which occurred at around the same time: the murder of Philip Lawrence, a head teacher in London, and the wounding of six children and Lisa Potts, a nursery teacher, at a Wolverhampton nursery school.
It makes me so angry that they have these stupid gun ownership laws in The U.S. Does anybody need to own assault rifles and hugely powerful handguns? It's ****in ridiculous. It's not like it's the first time this terrible sort of thing has happened is it? If the guy didn't have access to the firepower, it wouldn't have happened. Ohh, but it's in the constitution. Well, rip up the f****** constitution, it's ancient and out of date. or just arm everyone with pitchforks instead. Imagine how sick the parents of children killed in columbine are feeling, knowing that nothing has changed.
Ohh, but it's in the constitution. Well, rip up the f****** constitution, it's ancient and out of date.
...and, as I pointed out earlier, misinterpreted by people like this:
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Gun advocates say that guns don’t kill people, people kill people. The truth, though, is that people with guns kill people, often too efficiently.
Circa 80 people die per day and 120 are seriously injured from guns in America.
America needs to remove guns from the public domain but it will never happen, there is too much political support for the gun lobby and its antiquated mistaken support for the right to bear arms. The country must live with this or change, they won't change.
But it still has some great biking and some great people! 😉
Indeed - if the teachers had been carrying, then they could have stopped him in his tracks!
Wow.
Just.
Wow.
The Zulu (your words, not mine...that's how you're referring to yourself these days isn't it?) stoops to a new low in his STW trolling career. The meltdown I foresaw yesterday continues into one of your most inappropriate posts recently. Gold...even for your type. Take a look at yourself.
You are neither subtle enough nor stupid enough for here
Not interested in personal attacks on people (forums not weapons) especially tit for tat with moronic posters but I was merely commenting on the reactions to an emotional event and offering a view as to why the gun law will not change in the U.S despite the tragic loss of life.
A car culture that see's 100 people die every day but any tightening of laws is seen as a threat to civil liberties and not a vote winner, the same with firearms.
There were plenty more homicides involving firearms in the us that day (over 9000 per anum) it's just that they are not all grouped together or vulnerable children so not really newsworthy or likely to elicit such strong emotions.
40,000 killed in Syria yet the western world ponders it navel and I don't see many posts/tweets about that.
Zulu-Eleven - MemberIndeed - if the teachers had been carrying, then they could have stopped him in his tracks!
That's actually a relatively common (albeit wrong, in my opinion) viewpoint on US internet forums when this sort of school/college/cinema/mall shooting occurs ie. every few months.
The concept of escalation seems not to occur to some people.
Ohh, but it's in the constitution. Well, rip up the f****** constitution, it's ancient and out of date.
Have you thought of writing to the president or local member of congress?
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Not interested in personal attacks on people (forums not weapons) especially tit for tat with moronic posters
You might need to try harder then 🙄
Not sure saying you lack subtly is a personal attack- is it really?
Pretty sure that saying you are not stupid is not one either.
When they drew up the US constitution it was a new country and people wanted to protect their new found land and property from outlaws or whathaveyou I guess. But I suspect when they drew it up they didn't quite forsee the actual firepower a person could have at their disposal 200 years later. Probably a bolt action rifle would be as far as it'd go. No one except the miltary should have access to some of the weapons that ordinary Americans have at their disposal. It's really ****** up IMO.This shouldn't be able to happen in the first place 🙁
Seems to me there are far more pressing issues to be reviewed before they get to the gun laws in the US. First thing we hear when someone shoots up a school/cinema/mall is "ban guns", never "more care, understanding and help for those with mental health issues" - while the easy access to guns doesn't help the situation there needs to be a strong change in how the country treats its citizens and the fear they ram down their throat on a daily basis.
The US does seem to do a bloody good job of creating these disturbed individuals like no other country can
The US does seem to do a bloody good job of creating these disturbed individuals like no other country can
They have The American Dream. Most people can't live it. Some people can't accept it. Be it socially or financially.
I'm no gun advocate and would agree that a ban would reduce the 'efficiency' as was pointed out but whenever there is a ban called for it's easy to focus on this and ignore underlying problems which cannot be got rid of by such a simple single action.
Oh definitely, people with mental health probs should have access to the treatment they need. But In my limited experience, people come on the mental health issues radar after something has happened for the worse in one way or the other. How often to you hear about someone going at someone with a kitchen knife? it happens. No one has a perfect life, and people lose the plot all the time. Usually best if no automatic rifles were available though eh?
As sad a reflection of modern western politics as it is, the only time such a decision will be made is not for the safety of a country's children but whether more votes will be gained from the ban than those lost.
