Forum menu
Gotta say rugby is way better to watch as a neutral.. Althoug in theory I should be supporting Ireland, but I don't have any emotional feeling over either side so it makes it so much less painful. 😳
A few of things occur to me re England. 1. Steffan Armitage is a fat blob and wouldnt last 30 mins in a fast paced international game. 2. You missed the Kiwi gouger, a lot. 3. Ford, May, Tuilagi, Joeseph, Watson, Brown could be very good. 4. Ben Morgan was not fit and did nothing, you missed Vunipola combined with Wood and Robshaw not being great. Surely you have some other flankers.5. The tictacs that involved flinging it wide whilst playing with that backrow wre seriously flawed.
@aa is spot on IMO with 1, 2 and 3 and his other post on Stefon. Big Billy V we did miss, he is big but a dynamic ball carrier. Not sure about the flankers and in tactics we where 10 mins and a few poor decisions away from beating Wales and finishing second in the group. Based on what we've seen so far Wales have zero chance of defeating Australia assuming they play as well again
We'd have wanted to win the group but we picked the wrong team against Wales (should have been Ford and anyone but Burgess) and still should have won. That's the game that was a disaster. Australia where excellent and beat us fair and square whilst we contrived to lose to Wales, snatched defeat from the jaws of victory and all that. We had no idea about how to close out the first game when 10 ahead and should have taken the kick for the draw as damage limitation. We selected the sh1t or bust option and we know what happened. Hopefully we'll clear out Lancaster and Farrel senior and put Farrell junior back on the bench. Burgess should prove himself over a season at Bath and then if he's performed he can have another go.
Jesus DD, this is like watching England!
Ireland slightly struggling to get past Italy, although Ireland should get it done.
Australia looked brilliant last night, best I've seen any tan play so far.
I hope Hogg feels suitably embarrassed today, that dive was shocking.
Isnt wales under 20 effectivly the b team so its representative?Wasnt there a row about some dude caught between wales and scotland over the same thing?
I don't think so but can't find a source to back this up
Jesus DD, this is like watching England!
It's worse.
O'Squeaky bum time
And I thought thecwelsh game plan was limited. If Italy were any use you would have lost that. Outplayed in 2nd half.
Ah well, the win is the most important thing and best to get a shit game out of the way today.
Impressed with Italy though - good discipline and troubled the Irish scrum and forwards in general more than I thought.
Right, onwards towards losing to France then. 😀
snt wales under 20 effectivly the b team so its representative?Wasnt there a row about some dude caught between wales and scotland over the same thing?
It was hence McShingler couldnt play for Scotland. Not sure if it still is.
Sam Underhill was the player i was thinking of
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/meet-young-english-rugby-star-9836983
Ah, Underhill. Problem is that the Ospreys have been so terrible that it's difficult to know how good he actually is.
We'll have him cheers.
The point about Armitage (and Pocock, Cooper, Tipuric, Warbs indeed any decent openside) is that they can link and play out wide with the ball in hand - none of our Flankers currently appear able to do that at international level. Launchbury looked better with the ball in hand.
AA is right you can of course construct a game plan that just relies on big back row smashing it up (as we used to) but that's never been particularly successful and getting less effective as the professional era moves on. Haskell's never been particularly effective at the international level because just hitting it up and making hard yards doesn't cut it against decent opposition. 2003 was the only time we had an all round game.
On the subject of turnovers of course it's not the seven's job to prevent them - that's a whole team responsibility but he should be the best placed to make them if his lines of running are half decent.
DanW - MemberHow does Brown still manage to come across like a total jebend, even in an apology note? Two lines in.... "some of us".... great team spirit
That's pretty harsh, you could take it as a criticism of "some of us" or you could say not everyone in the team has been part of the process for the 4 years so it's been so much work, "some of us for 4 years"
Maybe... but it doesn't come across well. Nevertheless the whole thing is a bit grovelly and odd for a pro as Kryton says
Sam Underhill was the player i was thinking of
From the same link... I wonder how long it is before Dirkson gets a call?
Tipuric would get a game in the centre forbade lot of teams!
For a. Not forbade!
its going to be a pretty ugly week if even a fraction of the stuff (ructions in the England management team) doing the rounds on Twitter turns out to be true.
Never understood the game was on another site today said code of rugby was described as kick and clap? Anyone explain.
@infernoprotv DD?
Explosive if true.
Indeed.
You are speaking in riddles!
Just been reading that too, it would make sense if true.
If true there's no way SL will be staying on.
The full text of the conversation is on the web no one is denying it.
I've been saying A.Farrell shouldn't be there. Burrell is twice the centre that Burgess is. The whole thing is rotten to the core. hashtagcleansweep
Billy Vunipola ?@bvunipola 44s44 seconds agoHearing some rumours that I've been saying negative stuff about England. Laughable! Complete rubbish and I don't even drink!
Anyone got a link to this?
I agree that Farrell must take some blame. From what's been said, perhaps most.
What's is / where is this?
Edit: see it. Holy shit - Catt walked out, Lancaster never coached and Farrell Snr ran the show? Team unhappy that Burrel went home, Burgess and possibly Farrell Snr universally unliked?
Jesus, if that's true....
Not so shocking though is it?
Well no. And it answers why Lancaster himself is questioning his tenure by not make a more positive statement. He - allegedly - knows he's been bullied and the players don't have faith, and the revelation of such post World Cup is a humiliation he doesn't want to bear.
Explains everything - Farell jnrs regular appearances, Burgess inclusion, League style back play. No wonder Catts been quiet...
And now it's all being denied...
If Lancaster let Farrel run the show then its Lancaster's fault ultimately.
Also what's "league style back play"?
Also what's "league style back play"?
Passing and running rather than kicking and clapping? 😉
I believe that refers to one dimensional boshing (and then putting in a grubber or high ball on the final tackle) 😉
Is anyone honestly surprised by this revelation?
SL is not a coach, he is a manager and this he does well but needs better coaches than AF to help him. Team lacks direction and a style of play which speaks of confusion from the coaches. No team can change how it plays so radically from one game to the next. They need to empower the players not dictate to them, give them the tools to perform and to recognise certain patterns and how to react to them.
Too often Engalnd only seem to be able to distribute the ball if people are on the X marks the spot. No ability to play what is in front. That I think is what Ford does well he reads the defence and picks the pass. Requires a certain set up, which if you watch Bath you will recognize but seems effective and adaptable.
One other thing surely Hooper will be cited for the Brown clearout in the first half? If OF got a yellow for similar?
I think I pointed out way back that when you looked at the histories of the people involved then Andy Farrell must be hard-as-nails and totally uncompromising to have achieved everything he did in RL.
Plenty of reports of rifts between Catt and Farrell too. The fact that Burgess was in the 31 and the subsequent match day 23s shows that someone with no understanding of Union was picking the team. It also seems that no account was taken of what the players thought.
On the plus side, although the RFU recently said that they'd make SL available for the Lions tour (seriously) it seems now he'll be able to devote all his time to it. 😆
Indeed they dont loose to Australia at football but both codes perform as well at World cups
Er, England made the semi final in the last World Cup losing to New Zealand by 2 points. Granted I do t think they'd have beaten Australia in the final....
I do love the major chip on its shoulder the RFU continues to have about "the other code", as if they're the sort of embarrassing family one doesn't want to own up to being related to.
kick and clap
Is just gentle ribbing: rugby union is a game of territory, rugby league is a game of territory and possession.
Beyond that both codes continue to have lots to learn from each other. The RFU and its fans would do well not to forget that....
Beyond that both codes continue to have lots to learn from each other. The RFU and its fans would do well not to forget that....
Whilst I agree, it's the manner that RL types are thrown straight to the top which is wrong. Andy Farrell demonstrably lacks the basics of RU. There is every chance that Burgess will be a world class back row player in a couple of years, but no; he makes the england team as a centre (despite not being good enough to hold a centre spot in an AP team). Just switching codes seems to be enough to get an england cap and it's wrong.
Farrel did OK for the Lions.
Hopefully Edwards wont be the next england coach then!!
So let me get this straight, Farrell bullied Lancaster into making player choices? Catt walked out, any news on Roundtree who IMO is rubbish. Jeez what a mess.
The Burgess situation is a joke, as has been said Iestyn Harris failed miserably for Wales when we tried to shoehorn him into the team.
The RFU are a rum bunch 😆
Iestyn Harris was really quite good when he went back to league. We didnt have many other option either. England with Burgess on the other hand were loking for the solution to a problem they didnt have.
Farrel did OK for the Lions.
He bloody well should have against the weakest aussie team for many years and the talent he had on tap. I read that dropping BOD for JD2 was his call ( just in case any of my fellow irishmen are undecided about him 😉 )