Considering getting a 820 to use for monitoring my training and logging rides. But a quad lock and my iPhone 11 does appeal. Sorry to ask but with all the functionality of our smartphones why do we still get dedicated Garmin devices instead? Protect the expensive phone?
What (obviously very obvious) things am i missing?
Flame away 🤦🏼♂️
Protect the phone and to an extent a phone on the bars is too much of a good thing and too large. There's also battery life and the phones other uses to take into account, I.e. taking pics.
Large expensive phone attached to the handlebars will eventually end up damaged and if your really unlucky it will be as broken as you so cant be used to contact someone for help so they are best left in a secure padded pocket (keep mine in a neoprene pouch in a leg or jacket pocket with screen facing my body)
Garmin's are made for the outdoors, they are designed to be able to take a knock (rubber cases add more protection) are smaller than a phone so less chance of them getting damaged, battery will last longer and they have an array of different ways to be mounted on the bike
Some gadgets that do multiple things are great and very convenient but sometimes its best to have something that is designed for the job
Had my Garmin Edge Explore (been great) for a couple of years now and had an 820 (very buggy) and a 800 before that (was great, only replaced as i dropped it and the screen fell directly on to a pointy rock! and cracked)
Battery life, won't die in the British mud & liquid sun, in theory more accurate
Some sensible points to consider! Thanks
Protect the phone and to an extent a phone on the bars is too much of a good thing and too large. There’s also battery life and the phones other uses to take into account, I.e. taking pics.
I'd argue that the £300+ cost of a Garmin would pay for phone insurance, probably for the expected lifetime of the garmin at least.
Battery life is a red herring, spend a couple of quid on a USB battery pack, it still weighs less than a garmin.
Damage to the phone meaning you can't call for help? Possible, but that would require the stars to align very precisely.
You crash, and injure yourself badly enough to need to call mountain rescue.
The bike has to hit the ground directly on the phone.
You need to be insufficiently injured that you can get your backpack off and still use a phone, but still sufficiently injured that point 1 is still valid.
The phone has to have survived the crash in your packpack when ~80kg you landed on it Vs the 15kg bike.
And the phone you're relying on has to have the reception to make the call after all that anyway.
I have my phone on the bars for any sort of touring/exploring. However clunky komoot is, it's nowhere near as bad as a Garmin!
I'm also really interested in this as it's bugged me for years. So taking the points above into consideration, what about buying one of the Motorola G8 Powers that were linked to for about £150 notes the other day?
Protect the phone
Ok. It's a phone, but it's cheaper than the Garmin
a phone on the bars is too much of a good thing and too large.
Nah the G8 is reasonable size, and you can view much more map on the bigger screen
There’s also battery life
Nah. It's the G 8 power. Plenty of battery life for a 12 hour epic...
the phones other uses to take into account, I.e. taking pics.
I've still got the other phone in my ruksac for that
Damage to the phone meaning you can’t call for help?
As above, got my real phone in my ruksac
won’t die in the British mud & liquid sun,
Ok, granted.
in theory more accurate
Ok, I guess so
Garmin’s are made for the outdoors, they are designed to be able to take a knock (rubber cases add more protection)
Ok, again, good point. But presumably I could get a bad assed case for my phone. Not quite as good though.
So bearing in mind the above, why would I want s £300 Garmin instead of a £150 Motorola....
I've certainly considered the cheap phone option (assuming that my actual phone phone is kept warm and safe), and did so again before investing in a Oregon 700. Battery is still a thing for me though. I want something that can run off AAs without having to hook up other cables/battery packs.
Battery life. I can have the watch with GPS on all the time plus bits on the phone without worrying.
All day HR recording.
Usefulness for other sports. Yes most top end phones are supposed to be waterproof but best to avoid it taking a swim in whitewater. If I am bouldering then falling on the phone could be rather painful and expensive.
Risk of damage from crashing etc. I can wrap the phone up safely and leave it in a bag without having to faff getting it in and out to turn tracking on.
Running a watch plus iPod mini is far more convenient to carry than a phone.
For use as a cycling computer/route finder I think its a harder argument though and possibly a cheapish phone on the handlebars makes sense.
the £300+ cost of a Garmin
Except it’s not “£300+”. You can get perfectly good ones for around half that brand new, and a quarter of that secondhand.
The latest Garmin touchscreens worth in rain and with gloves (or you can get one with buttons). Phones don’t, nor do they unlock easily (Touch ID means taking gloves off and I’ve found Face ID rather less reliable once I’ve got a cycling cap on). Plus for all Garmin’s faults I’ve never found a phone app which is as good for navigation (on road at least).
Depends what you want from the device, though, really. Garmin have flaws and so do phones, they’re just different flaws. There’s no single correct answer.
I have both an Iphone 11 and a garmin 810.
The iPhone 11 is way too big for the bars, even on an out front mount
Down side of a garmin is, if you use it for maps it's pointless as far too small. And also, it's a garmin, so it'll undoubtedly break because they are utter rubbish.
I only use my Garmin now if I need it for navigating a route, or for a full day out.
Phone (but in my bag) if it's just recording for Strava.
I realise that it isn't necessarily representative of all cheap phones but the Moto G8 suggested above doesn't have a compass. Motorola seem averse to putting them in phones of late.
I only use my Garmin now if I need it for navigating a route, or for a full day out.
Phone (but in my bag) if it’s just recording for Strava.
Similarly. Oregon for navigating / big days / multi-days.
I use my Garmin watch if I'm just recording stuff, for running, swimming etc.
Better mounting options for a Garmin.
For example, I use a K-Edge out front Combo for mine, which is super sturdy, and has a light bracket underneath for my Sirius. Tidy bars are a good thing.
Also, as above, they're designed to be used outdoors, not just get a splash of frappacino on them in Hackney, dahhhlinhg. 😉 Work well in the rain, with gloves on, etc.
If using for direction and up to date info, then garmin will win out, if you want to monitor info on rides, then the iphone and a multitude of apps can gather that data while your phone is in your bag/pocket/etc, depends what you're after.
I tend to use both on rides, i use my elemnt roam for directions and information, i then use the phone to find stuff via strava and the likes, works well, but i could live without the phone, the elemnt is a little harder to live without unless i know the area i'm around.
Considering getting a 820
Having had an 810, 820 and 830 I would say don't get an 820, the touch screen is awful. The 830 is great.
For me the main benefits are
1) I haven't got a fragile, £1000 phone strapped to my bike;
2) An edge 830 is £350 not £1000 (see above);
3) They are designed with recording activities and training in mind.
And the annoying bit for a phone is that the 1% of the UK not covered by phone towers is usually where we ride, my phone is dead for most of FoD and Gloucestershire, which then causes issues with data capture on rides, if it feeds off the GPS unit then it's fine though.
Thanks for all of the advice and thoughts. I can see the benefits of both but on reflection I do like the simplicity of a garmin and just leave my phone on silent in my bag. I'm not an all day epic explorer so possibly the hardcore mapping from a phone isn't really needed. Hmmm...will ponder more!
As touched on above if you're just wanting to record rides then use the phone and keep it in a pocket / pack.
Certainly in the motorbike world there are concerns over vibrations damaging the image stabilisation in phone cameras, particularly iPhones I think. Quadlock have introduced a thing that goes between the phone holder and the mounting bracket to dampen it. May be worth some research.
I've got quadlock for my pixel 3xl onto my BMW R1150R which being a boxer does vibrate and wiggle a hell of a lot, no problems with my camera yet.
Softer benefit is you can do your activity without your smartphone beeping at you for messages, calls etc. Sometimes it's nice not to be connected.
Do iphone batteries still shit the bed when it's cold?.
Softer benefit is you can do your activity without your smartphone beeping at you for messages, calls etc. Sometimes it’s nice not to be connected.
Partly this for me too.
£79 Nokia 3.2 on the bars using a Quad Lock for me rather than risk damaging my iPhone 8. No sim card, just a dumb device. Bought a rubber protective case and butchered a hole in the rear to attach the universal quad lock mount. Battery good enough for day-long rides. Cheap enough I won't cry if I break it.
Means I can use whatever mapping app I want - bought mainly so I can follow my marked-up IGN map in the French Alps using 'Custom Maps' app, but equally great for ViewRanger etc at home.
I have an edge 520 if you want a cheapish one? Battery will last longer doing GPS... and you can use ANT+ sensors.
edit:- didn't spot you were looking at 820...
When Garmin shopping have a look at the Edge Explore. Great mapping; nav works well; screen works in the rain and with gloves; and only £170.
If only there was a brand new, unused Garmin 1030 Plus in the classifieds with over £100 off rrp.
Do iphone batteries still shit the bed when it’s cold?
just as much as any other lithium based cell.
Do iphone batteries still shit the bed when it’s cold?
Pretty much any battery will do that.
That's why it's important (especially in winter) to keep whatever you're using as your communication device somewhere warm.
Angry Birds
Considering getting a 820
As above: don't. Get a separate bike GPS, but not that one.
Separate bike computer makes sense for me as it's weather proofed, a better size, has better mounting options, and is better optimised for continuous screen-on usage.
In theory, it'll also have a UI that isn't totally reliant on a touchscreen so that you can use it with gloves, but the Edge 820 doesn't.
Just got a Karoo 2. Not cheap, but very nice.