[Closed] So how would you improve Critical Mass?

There is of course a difference between the police ushering cyclists through red lights and CM undertaking road traffic duties by themselves. And Mike is worried about accidents happening?!

Junky, Binners and I.

two of us are lefties
2 of us like cricket
2 of like football
2 of us are real and have actual e-mail addresses in profile:wink:

Two of you can spell for balance

he's a spoof account from the DoT

some summer student placement is demonstrating that you can easily discredit (non) organisations such as CM, they will be counting numbers at the next ride and checking whether it's worth keeping the psyops going

another spoof account will pop up soon suggesting a "considerate" CM ride just to keep those who have to do one busy 😉

That's more feasible then the alternative.

Smells more of Fred/Elfin to me.

i heard he finally sought real help for what was quite obviously a serious mental issue, which is why i 'picked on' TJ for my comparison. I know he (TJ)will be laughing, if infact he even hears about it.

I won't be attending a CM ride any time soon, mainly because the 'ride' part looks completely shit.
slow, in the city centre, not going anywhere nice....nah. stick it up yer bum.

So how would you improve Critical Mass?

stick it up yer bum

Thread closed

stick it up yer bum

There's nowt to add to that really

sorry, i'm back from helping an old lady across the road only to leave her in the path of oncoming traffic, you know... for a chuckle like. i've got serious health problems, can you come over and fix my bike mr connor?

That so many of you really want it to be something political or tangible, shows how little you understand the whole concept. Do you have a political agenda whewn you go for a bike ride, or do you just go for a bike ride?

Ok I dont understand. Why would I want to go out for a cycle ride with 200 other people in the busiest part of the country at the busiest time of the week ?

I might want to do it if it had an agenda, ie greater cycle provision in London. It would be worth the effort then.

So I would improve it in either one of 2 ways.

1. Have an agenda ie block up traffic and to prove that more investment is needed in cycling infrastructure in London.

or

2. Do the ride Sunday afternoon in a way to minimise disruption from traffic to increase the ride enjoyment.

Can u just answer why it on a Friday evening ? if not to make a point ie London has no basically cycle infrastructure. Which is a good point to make so why does CM have to have no agenda ?

How would I improve CM?

Well, assuming I was looking to attract more participants or sympathy for my Friday evening social bike ride, then first of all I'd change the name. Critical Mass as a brand (I know the word 'brand' will not be popular but I can't think of a better way to put it at the moment) is, rightly or wrongly, tainted. Non-cyclists and a good proportion of cyclists that I know in London associate it with militant troublemakers. That may not be easy to stomach but it reflects the reactions I have had when mentioning CM.

Plus critical mass (note lower case) can be defined as, 'an amount or level needed for a specific result or new action to occur'. Ignoring the fact that Critical Mass claims it has no aims (in which case it is a critical mass for what?) lets assume it was started to raise awareness of cycling on the streets of the capital with the provision of better facilities as a secondary benefit. Well that critical mass has been passed. There are far more cyclists on the streets of London now than there ever were in the 80s when I first cycled there. In fact I would argue it is now mainstream. You have a cycling mayor, a bike hire scheme that positively encourages cycling and much greater awareness amongst politicians and non-cycling residents. There are also other lobby groups who have established the political legitimacy (not just legal legitimacy) that is needed to effect change.

Critical Mass was a good starting point and was a catalyst for change but it has passed it's zenith.

Is this a post lacking positive suggestions? I think not. There are more positives to be had by moving on than there are in persisting with a negative image.

that was already 'justified' as being agreed with the courts/police and therefore too difficult to move.

why they wanted it then was kinda ignored. I would go along, but i ride to the pub on friday evening.

Can u just answer why it on a Friday evening ?

It's something to do with Christmas I believe...

The ride happens when and where it does, according to it's tradition. i'm not a Christian, yet I have to endure christmas and the ensuing fuss

How would I improve CM?

I'd improve it by not attending. The more people that join me in choosing this option, the smoother the whole ride will be, with less unfortunate jams/side-effects, p155 off fewer people caught up by it, and save the police a few bob too.

Ultimately, if they can get it down to 0 attendees, I'd call it a resounding success 🙂

As Philconsequence said above....if you are just a large group out for a cycle, why are you not obeying the traffic laws?
The group may get split up & fractured but that is a unfortunate consequence of organising an over-sized group cycle through one of the busiest cities in Europe at the busiest time of the week. It's hard enough for two cars to keep together through London due to the stop start nature, so how can you expect and why should you expect a massive group of cyclists to stay together?

The longer this thread goes on, the more I wonder if this is just a well thought out troll.

Indeed. A consensus that has brought together cyclists as diverse as Junky, Binners and I. As well as almost everyone else. On a bike forum, FFS!

Is this the first time that every poster on a thread has been in agreement (except the OP obviously)?
We should celebrate this occurence, preserve it for posterity.

The ST Forum has reached consensus.

Shall we try sorting the Middle East Peace Process now? 😉

Shall we try sorting the Middle East Peace Process now?

I'm not, so I'm not entitled to have an opinion 😉

Stumpy01, if you're cycling in a group and want to keep everyone safe, letting cars split you up and get in the middle is the worst thing you can do. So you proceed as one group and if that means people at junctions have to wait, so be it.

A similar system is also endorsed by BC for local Sky Rides (the ones not held on closed roads). The official position is that you don't control the traffic, but by moving as one group, like a long vehicle, you stop people pulling out and splitting you up. And yes this causes some drivers to react badly.

We should celebrate this occurence, preserve it for posterity.

I suggest a monthly ride through London. Who's with me?

I suggest a monthly ride through London. Who's with me?

I can only make it on a Friday.....shall we say around 6:30pm for maximum disruption?

Surely from what Mike said, nobody represents it

Which is of course, bollx.

It's just that they use an embarrassingly spineless version of the Spartacus defence.

When someone in Authority asks "who's in charge here" instead of all shouting "I'm in charge" as one forceful voice,

Everyone looks down at their shoes and points at someone else randomly.

I'm swooning at the bravery of it all to be honest.

Mr agreeable - so you can jump red lights if in a large group?

What happens at a t-junction if there is ample room for some of you to get out, but not everyone due to an approaching vehicle? Do you wait until there is a large enough gap or just pull out & hope that the car who has right of way realises what is going on and stops? I can understand this approach if there are marshals to control the traffic, but how does it work on a ride where there are no leaders and no organisation? It just turns into a free for all.

What is to stop car drivers jumping red lights to stay with other cars that are going the same way as them and arguing that they are staying in their group - for example a Scooby Owners club drive or something?

If anyone uses the Spartacus defence (or inverse Spartacus as we shall call CM), they should be prepared to go the way of the rebels; crucifixion along the M25.

Is anyone here Middle Eastern? or live there?
I'm not, so I'm not entitled to have an opinion

I, too, have had to move from my previous stance against murder, to a more correct "unsure" position - and all due to my lack of personal experience in the matter.

CFH: Not TJ, I'm thinking one of the older posters from back when?

The STW lynch mob are out then?

Mike Connor has been nothing but polite throughout. Or as polite as he can be under the circumstances. Which is more than I can say for 90% of the replies.

[img] http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQhSE4KBJFwGOvkUoRwds5cYyD3JUo-26iUJ2Il8gXKHeL2-1bk&t=1 [/img]

butcher - Member

The STW lynch mob are out then?

Mike Connor has been nothing but polite throughout. Or as polite as he can be under the circumstances. Which is more than I can say for 90% of the replies.

Mike Connor re-appears on the forum for another bout of seeking support for his unpopular activity.

Sees once again that just about everyone here is in agreement that it's risible nonsense.

butcher describes this as a "lynch mob".

Mike Connor resorts, after a feint at being polite and reasonable, to another series of long-winded, patronising and repetitive responses because he cannot accept that nobody agrees with him (having asked for ideas and got some which he doesn't like).

Mike Connor, earlier: [img] [/img]

I've read the threads, I've read Mike Connor's posts, I've seen the videos.

"Stick it up your bum" pretty much covers it, I think.

PS: No car. Three bikes. 120 miles commute so far this week, BTW.

Stumpy01, I believe that legally Critical Mass is considered to be a procession, and it can lawfully move through red lights providing the start of the group went through on green. CM uses an informal system of marshalling where "corkers" stop up side roads and T-junctions.

Its legal status is also the reason that no-one owns up to organising or leading it. If it had organisers and a set route, it would be possible for the Met to refuse permission for it to be held. As it stands, following a judgment by the House of Lords in 2008 it can be held legally, as long as the route is decided on the ride.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2008/nov/26/critical-mass-london-police

Please don't let the above facts get in the way of you slating the RLJing crusties though.

Mike Connor has been nothing but polite throughout. Or as polite as he can be under the circumstances. Which is more than I can say for 90% of the replies.

see now I agree with this. Whether or not you agree with CM, or Mike or whatever this thread ,and the previous on,e have not reflected well on this forum.

I'm a big believer in making things good for yourself and the place you live. Any London riders who genuinely think that CM does a disservice to cycling in their city need to turn off their computers and go and DO SOMETHING about it, or just accept that in many ways the only thing a lot of people on bikes have in common is two wheels.

75 miles so far this week

I'm a big believer in making things good for yourself and the place you live.

Clearly, you're not a Londoner who relies on the motor car to earn a living, sometimes on a Friday night.

Mr Agreeable. Thanks for the link & info. Interesting.

Any London riders who genuinely think that CM does a disservice to cycling in their city need to turn off their computers and go and DO SOMETHING about it

[img] [/img]

😆

No worries. My info on Critical Mass being considered a "procession" comes from Wikipedia so may not be strictly accurate - it would explain why they don't all get ticketed each month though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_Mass

Mikeconnnor, the leafleting seems a progressive and relatively doable objective in an unordered organisation, with the right message and info it would help aleviate a bit of friction , most people don't mind being inconvenienced when there is an explanation, its the unknowing that tends to wind people up---- apart from internet warriors

Video evidence not enough, then?

Frankly, the reason I ride the bike that I do, is because I want a fast getaway from London of an evening. If I was unfortunate enough to encounter this particular irritant getting in my way, I would probably share the communication skills evidenced by the taxi driver in the latest video of the "celebrative procession" of cycling therein.

see now I agree with this. Whether or not you agree with CM, or Mike or whatever this thread ,and the previous on,e have not reflected well on this forum.

No he hasnt. He's been a self important arse. And a troll.

No, I wasn't there.
No, I don't live in London.

But the bloke that made the film was there, so that will do for me.

Some moments that Critical Mass can be proud of.

Some nob stopped in front of a taxi for no reason other than to cause trouble.
(everyone else was moving)
Careful to make antagonistic eye contact to provoke a reaction.

[IMG] [/IMG]

Another nob stopped in front of a taxi for no reason other than to cause trouble.
(again, everyone else was moving)
More antagonistic eye contact to provoke a reaction.

[IMG] [/IMG]

Another nob stopped in front of a taxi for no reason other than to cause trouble.
At a green light refusing to move.(everyone else was moving)
Odd really, as all the others seem unable to stop at red lights.

[IMG] [/IMG]

Those examples do seem to go firmly against Rule 1 of commuting by bike/car/foot and indeed living, i.e. "Don't be a dick"

I'll have to watch the rest of the film to see if they're far outweighed by positive, celebratory, processional riding.

Feel free to watch it. And make your own mind up.

It's on page 5 or 6 I think.

The Taxi Drivers were trying to bully their way through a moving legal procession.

I like Critical Mass! The 'little people' making a stand; not for world peace/ awareness / political gain / better cycle lanes.. just for cycling in their overcrowded City
And they do it legally..

Always got a soft spot for the freedom fighters 😉

Always got a soft spot for the freedom fighters

me too.. but those antagonistic young men in the vid and pics need a good hard kick in the goolies..

preferably from their grandmothers

And they do it legally.

And they do it legally.

No they don't. RLJ, riding at night without lights, many bikes without 2 working brakes, reflectors or an audible warning device.

Always got a soft spot for the freedom fighters

One man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist.