It seems quite simple... if they've built the frame spot on, and it eventually dies, then why expect a free replacement? The warranty covers the frame not being built right, it's not a "use the product out and we'll keep you in new frames for life" special offer. Being offered a half price replacement after 10 years of love seem great to me.
kelvin - so why promise a warranty for the lifetime of the owner then. It seems that they are offerign exactly what you said: use the product out and we'll keep you in new frames for life ?
Why, how many other manufacturers' frames would last 10 years?
I still use my 1996 Saracen Kili Ultra titanium MTB. That hasn't broken.
I've got a 10 year old Giant NRS that's still fine.
I had a 10 year old Inbred that was fine.
Coyote ht4 still going strong circa 1998
A warranty covers something being wrong with the product, not it wearing out.
Litespeed Bicycle's frames are warranted to be free from manufacturing defects in material and/or workmanship for the lifetime of the original owner.
It would appear that neither material nor workmanship is at fault here. It's a design fault that fails to take into account the fatigue. Design isn't mentioned in that warranty statement so you're ~~~~ed.
A warranty covers something being wrong with the product, not it wearing out.
How does a Ti frame wear out?
A warranty covers something being wrong with the product, not it wearing out.
How does a Ti frame wear out?
Ten years of riding I'm guessing after reading this.
I bought an Airborne Zeppelin (road bike) which subsequently developed a crack at the bottom of the seat tube. It look like it started within the weld at the bottom bracket but then carried on across the tube itself.
By the time this happened Airborne had ceased trading but Van Nicholas had taken over and said they were honouring Airborne warranties up to 5 years. I just scraped in by a few weeks and true to their word they supplied a new frame. Amazingly this cracked at the same place within a few months so I contacted Van Nicholas again and they said that there was a lifetime warranty on this frame but suggested I switch to a different model. This ultimately cracked again after a couple of years and VN duly replaced it once again.
I can't praise Van Nicholas enough for the way I have been treated as they have always honoured their "lifetime" warranty after I supplied photographs of the cracked frames. Litespeed should be named and shamed as often as possible across the interweb and these frauds should be hounded out of business for the money-grabbing charlatans that they are.
Although I already seem to have a titanium frame for life, with my personal experience and all the other stories I have heard on the web, I wouldn't entertain buying a titanium frame now of any description. Empirical evidence seems to indicate to me that this is not the wonder material that it was once hailed as and you might as well buy a cheapish frame and just let it break and then buy a new one.
At least you get a new frame every few years.
Nothing lasts forever, but if you trade on the longevity of your product, and state "lifetime warranty" then you should honour it, and to be honest, who buys a Ti frame and abuses it? Its hardly a kids DJ bike!
Just had Trek offer a replacement frame for one that broke after 20 years of use. In this case a road bike 2300 frame to be replaced by a new Madone carbon frame set. Proper customer service from a company that honours its lifetime warranty.
that's brilliant lostneverfound 🙂
Reading this about vauxhall's "lifetime warranty" that covered 100k miles is interesting
http://asa.org.uk/ASA-action/Adjudications/2011/1/General-Motors-UK-Ltd/TF_ADJ_49572.aspx
The ASA noted that the supporting research provided by the advertiser showed that 96.08% of new car buyers would not reach 100,000 miles in their lifetime of ownership. We therefore considered that most new car buyers would be covered by the warranty throughout their ownership, in spite of the mileage limit.
[b]
lifetime of ownership[/b] is an interesting approach - and I reckon for a ti bike, ten years would be a fairly conservative 'lifetime'
Some people would ride a bike more in one year than others would manage in 20.
[i]Some people would ride a bike more in one year than others would manage in 20. [/i]
which is true and if they were clearer in their T's and C's as to what 'lifetime of the owner' meant then a lot of the bother they seem to have woudl be avoided.
The issue is the expectation they set vs what they actually chose to deliver.
If it says "lifetime of the owner" and then they claim that means five years, presumably they should only sell them to old people?
Litespeed Bicycle's frames are warranted to be free from manufacturing defects in material and/or workmanship for the lifetime of the original owner.Seems clear!
But is followed by:
Useful Product Life Cycle
Every Litespeed frameset has a useful life cycle. This useful life cycle is not the same as the warranty period.
This warranty is not meant to suggest or imply that the frame cannot be broken or will last forever. Bicycles and/or frames will not last forever. The length of the useful life cycle will vary depending on the type of frame, riding conditions and care the bicycle receives.
Whish is pretty much as useless and grey as it possibly could be.
I reckon you'd be rolling a dice on a small claims court claim against the seller/importer.
It cuts both ways, I'm riding about on a 15 year old kona frame, my old man has a Saracen which I think is knocking on 18-19 years old (one owner from new) I doubt either of us are very unique in still using old bikes so you could argue therefore that based on the "useful life cycle" that owners of "lesser" MTBs tend to see (irrespective of warranty periods, price, manufacture or materials), coupled with Litespeed's own claim that their products carry a "Lifetime warranty" that it is reasonable for a customer to expect well beyond say 15 years of fault free use...
It's Litespeed's own fault for not being specific, "lifetime warranty" sounds better than 1, 2, 5, 10, 15 or 25 years but at least if you state a fixed period of time there's no real question over the period of validity...
The trouble with the above statement is simply the lack of numbers, I can accept the "useful life cycle" point so long you put a number against it, otherwise it's a [I]"how long is a piece of string"[/I] appendix to the marketing headline of [I]"Lifetime Warranty"[/I] it's meaningless, in which case I'd say treat the warranty as still valid unless they can site a suitable legal precedent...
They are taking the piss basically, but you need to push hard to get anywhere...
[i]presumably they should only sell them to old people? [/i]
all those threads you see pointing out a fault with a bike with the suggestion it'll be ridden anywway and the question 'Will I die'?
Well Litespeed are working on the assumption that you will.
Well in this instance despite Litespeed's best efforts the original owner is not dead...
ergo he can claim on the warranty...
They are specific...
[i]Litespeed Bicycle's frames are warranted to be free from [b]manufacturing defects[/b] in material and/or workmanship for the lifetime of the original owner.[/i]
Is damn specific... if you find a manufacturing fault, even if it only becomes obvious years down the line, they'll sort it. Nowhere do they say that when the frame finally dies of use, that you'll get a new one free.
is a cracked/failed weld not a manufacturing defect?
they don't seem to have proved it's not in the op's case.
In which case Kelvin see my previous post on challenging litespeed to establish precisely how they know this fault is user caused and not as a result of manufacture or materials issues a decade ago...
I really think the OP has a case.
That is the problem - it hasn't died of use and they want to charge a large amount of money to repair it.Nowhere do they say that when the frame finally dies of use, that you'll get a new one free.
It has failed at a join, which is completely different from wearing out and in my view is a manufacturing defect in that the frame wasn't built with sufficient strength to withstand a 'lifetime' of use in the manner intended.
If they are now saying that the life expectancy of a Ti frame is 5-10 years under normal use, that is what they should specify in the warranty.
What he's got is a effectively a statement to the effect of:
[I]We've looked at it and decided that this failure (which will cost us money to repair) isn't our fault, so you can pay... or you can eff off[/I]
No demonstration of, or real proof has been offered to support their verdict just an In-house assessment, that shock horror removes financial risk from the business...
[i] and to be honest, who buys a Ti frame and abuses it? Its hardly a kids DJ bike! [/i]
456Ti or any number of other long fork HT's?
Sounds like Litespeed have changed for the worst. I bought a Litespeed Hiwassee frame back in '97 and rode it lots till it cracked on a chainstay weld in 2007. I took it back to the shop I bought it from with the receipt, they sent it back to Litespeed and 2 weeks later I had a brand new Pisgah frame as a replacement. I was so impressed I have always had a hankering for another one - sad to say it sounds like I will never buy another one, as I certainly wouldnt regard 5 years as a reasonable length of time for a Ti frame to last. Bad Times 🙁
I have a road bike built in Glasgow in 1957. It is still in one piece after over 50 years. Even after I crashed it into the back of a car last xmas 😳
I would argue that a bike frame is not a moving component, and that subject to not being crashed and not being literally worn out (through), the frame should either have a lifetime of the original owner warranty, or it should have an expected lifetime warranty explicitly stated in years. A cracked frame is not wear and tear, it is the material reaching the end of it's life (it's fatigue failure point). Titanium has a fatigue limit, below which it won't experience fatigue failure no matter how many stress cycles are put on it. It would therefore be reasonable to assume that a well designed and built titanium frame would not crack if used within design constraints.
As a matter of interest, from Wikipedia:
Ferrous alloys and titanium alloys have a distinct limit, an amplitude below which there appears to be no number of cycles that will cause failure. Other structural metals such as aluminium and copper, do not have a distinct limit and will eventually fail even from small stress amplitudes. In these cases, a number of cycles (usually 10 to the power of 7) is chosen to represent the fatigue life of the material.
So, some fagpacket calcs for an aluminum frame:
10000000 cycles at 80rpm = 125000 minutes = 2083 hrs = 208 weeks = 4 years (at 10 hrs per week).
Really, the warranty for any frame that will have a fatigue failure point (any aluminium frame, any steel or titanium frame designed / built so it's fatigue limit is passed) should be for hours of use, the same as aircraft frames. Trouble is, I doubt people measure that, and it is hard to prove. 'I only used it once a week for an hour', so an estimated number of years should be applied.
It is amazing, thinking about this, that some aluminium frame makers give true lifetime of owner warranties.
As an aside, I has my 4 year old Cannondale frame replaced a year and a bit ago, under warranty, with little fuss.
Whatever the rights and wrongs of the OP's case, I won't be buying a Litespeed frame under [b]any[/b] circumstances. This from the owner of many thousand pounds worth of bikes, including a Titanium one.
If a company uses the phrase 'Lifetime guarantee' and it's doesn't mean the lifetime of the [i]original[/i] owner, then it's just a con.
Whatever the rights and wrongs of the OP's case, I won't be buying a Litespeed frame under any circumstances. This from the owner of many thousand pounds worth of bikes, including a Titanium one.If a company uses the phrase 'Lifetime guarantee' and it's doesn't mean the lifetime of the original owner, then it's just a con.
don't buy an alloy Cannondale then, their warranty is exactly the same with the same lack of "lifetime" in the context stated.
I'm planning a complaint to the ASA as their rules now govern website content in regard to Cannondale "lifetime of the first owner" warranty which actually isn't. Primary evidence is the CSG email which states their version of what "lifetime of the first owner" means which doesn't match any buyers
Litespeed Limited Warranty
Litespeed Bicycle's frames are warranted to be free from manufacturing defects in material and/or workmanship for the lifetime of the original owner.
Or in other words 'sold as seen'
i think in some cases going about things with the right attitude helps,sadly i've broke cracked a few frames.
my lovely yeti fro....out of warrenty ,but i hammered the living daylights out of it for years.
santa cruz bullit mk1 6 month old.....no go said it was abused...why else buy one?
gt zasker carbon ,no problem sorted straight away.
intense socom....again extra were great and sorted quick.
oh and a marin mount vision again sorted no prob's
always being honest about why it broke ,no b.s and as a last resort i'll get it welded.
worst company ever to deal with RACEFACE.
having had issues with a camera (jessops) bike companys are a dream to deal with.
Consider TREK's lifetime warranty; my forks began to debond at the carbon-aluminium junction at the fork crown, on a 9 year old bike.
I phoned TREK to ask what replacement fork would fit and was told that the lifetime warranty covers frame and fork so take it to your local dealer, the rep is in there today, and we will sort you out.
A week later, a new fork at no charge.
That's how you get and keep custom and respect.
nikk, if its failed at a weld its not simple fatigue. Every weld affects the composition of the metal in and around it. If it fails at a weld then the welding (or heat treatment) is at fault. With Ti its usually oxygen contamination.
I reckon Ti frames have a higher failure rate (ie. number of failures as a percentage of the number of frames around) than any other material, and it's due to weld contamination.
Litespeed are supposed to be premium brand. Defining "lifetime warranty" as the life of the component is comedy genius but not what I expect from a company that sells such high end product. As others have said a more honest but shorter warranty would be more acceptable. Very badly handled, hopefully this warning will cost them more than a new frame for the OP would have.
Contrast this with the likes of Turner and Ibis (and mainstream brands like the trek example above), who seem to bend over backwards to sort warranty issues (even if youre not the first owner). I used to own a Litespeed (Obed) but wont buy another.
thread's a really bad advert for litespeed imho..........
Consider TREK's lifetime warranty; my forks began to debond at the carbon-aluminium junction at the fork crown, on a 9 year old bike.I phoned TREK to ask what replacement fork would fit and was told that the lifetime warranty covers frame and fork so take it to your local dealer, the rep is in there today, and we will sort you out.
A week later, a new fork at no charge.
That's how you get and keep custom and respect.
Many years ago working in a bike shop and a guy brought in one of the very first Specialized carbon road bikes. Carbon tubes bonded into metal lugs. One of these: (pic nicked off a Google image search)
[img] 
[/img]
The tubes had come unbonded and the guy wondered if we could repair it. Obviously not but we phoned Specialized who said send it back - we did and a week later a brand new top end road frame arrived as a replacement. Nothing asked about receipt or the fact that the bike must have been about 10years old at least. Just fantastic service.
IME of dealing with warranty, Specialized and Trek were always excellent. Cannondale were slower than a herd of turtles stampeding through treacle but usually came up with the goods eventually (if the customer hadn't died of old age by then). It was always the more niche brands who couldn't care less.
In my opinion if you operate at that level (i.e. Litespeeds level) in a marketplace you must have exceptional customer service. The cost of that service (including replacing broken frames at 10+ years old for the original owner)needs to accounted for in the original selling price. This shouldn't be that large a financial burden as:
A) plenty of bikes sell on within that time so leave the original owner and warranty.
B)some bikes end up less used with something more modern replacing them so suffer relatively fewer failures.
C) the cost to the manufacturer of this expected high-end market warranty honouring is not only accounted for in the original high profit margins for a premium product, but the warranty costs incurred work as the best kind of marketing - word of mouth, or nowadays on the internet.
D) they should engineer their products so that they do not fail under reasonable use, AND THEN HAVE THE FAITH IN THEIR PRODUCTS TO BACK THIS UP.
Needless to say I wont be buying a Litespeed then.
reminds me of vauxhalls "warranty that could last a lifetime...." (10 years)
I'm kind of hoping I won't be dead in 10 years.
It's misleading, end of.
I once cracked a Dawes touring frame (a manufacturing fault not due to me putting heroic levels of power through it I hasten to add) and it was replaced by them with no hassle at all. My LBS where I had purchased the bike even built my bike back up around the new frame completely free of charge.
Some companies such as Dawes do offer lifetime warranties on their frames but then they don't tend to make bikes that are going to be tested to the absolute limit all that often whereas an MTB manufacturer knows their frames will be ridden hard by the majority of customers.
At Litespeed sky high prices you need to offer superior quality and service.
Quality - A frame they expect to last only 5 years offers nothing in quality or use that cheaper steel and carbon frames cant offer better. Most people view titanium as long lived, not as a cheap throwaway - clearly they are mistaken according to Litespeed.
Service - well thats wiped out for Litespeed as they clearly intend to mislead customers with a statement of lifetime cover that can at best be described as wilfully misleading peoples understanding and trust.
I have in the past come close to buying a ti frame but now having discovered its only going to last 5 years I see no advantage. I may as well get steel and replace to a more modern frame after a few years and I will still be better off and more up to date.
Ti just seems a waste of time now - 5 years lifespan? - just snob value, not a good product at all.
As this thread has already highlighted, it has nothing to do with the frame material. There are folk running some pretty old Ti frames with no problems whatsoever.Midnighthour - Member
Ti just seems a waste of time now - 5 years lifespan? - just snob value, not a good product at all.
Thats the thing though, loads of these new Ti frames seem to be cracking. maybe the quality of titanium has gone downhill or manufacturers pushing the wall thickness thinner and thinner to get the weight down or something...?
seems very strange.
You're only hearing from the vocal/unhappy minority. It does seem that Ti has become a lot more common over the last 4-5 years, that's why you are hearing more stories.float - Member
Thats the thing though, loads of these new Ti frames seem to be cracking. maybe the quality of titanium has gone downhill or manufacturers pushing the wall thickness thinner and thinner to get the weight down or something...?
There are folk running some pretty old Ti frames with no problems whatsoever.
Yes, like me - still using my Tinbred most days. I can't remember when I bought it, but it's one of the earliest ones, from before Brant worked out how to get the stickers to stay stuck on the frame 🙂
Why would you expect a Ti frame to last longer than a Steel one? Be lighter, yes; but not last longer. Nothing ever lasts for ever. Of course, many of us have frames that are 20 years old, but in that time have broken one or two as well. C'est la vie.
buy cotic, i broke my soul frame in a crash and cotic sold me a new one with a £125 discount.
now thats nice service.
all frames will eventually break no matter what theyre made of.
I've followed this thread with interest.
I got into biking in the early 90's and remember spending hours pouring over bike mags. I seriously lusted after Merlin frames, they seemed so 'perfect' and, as a young teenager, seriously out of reach.
20 years later I now find myself in a position to afford something that I thought I would never have. Owning a top end, quality titanium frame is within my reach. I always thought though that when you buy something like this that is seriously top end, you were buying into a package. Excellent frame, excellent company, excellent service. Almost like you pay a premium to buy into the whole package. That is how you justify the price.
Apperently not.
Not sure if I want one anymore.
Litespeed Ratner moment me thinks - bet all their customers are going to love the ribbing they will get from their less affluent mates out on the trail 😆
I snapped my Unicoi which was bought new. Same thing, apparently a 71kg XC whippet is not the right person to be on it and I created excess wear and tear by using it. I gave up and had a Serotta custom made after i grilled them on warranty. I would never ever buy Litespeed ever again.
Great to see that if you Google "litespeed warranty", the first page is full of forum threads like this one and this one too.
What are Litespeeds credential anyway?
Is it a case of assumed quality due to the cost? that said was it them that made many road bikes for other brands back in the day.
I have a cheap Ti road frame that gets a hammering, eight years old now and still sweet as.
I had said to the missus about 2 months ago that when life's back on an even keel, I'll buy a Litespeed.
Now there's no question, there are obviously many Litespeed failures and huge Litespeed issues and the Litespeed warranty isn't worth the paper it's written on.
There won't ever be space made in my garage for one.
brant?@shedfireAnother forum thread propagating myths about steel and titanium "fatigue limits". Little knowledge = dangerous
scaredy@home
= quite irritating when people imply expertise but don't share it
Well said scaredy, he's got multiple previous too.
JFGI
"Typical values of the limit (Se) for steels are 1/2 the ultimate tensile strength, to a maximum of 100 ksi (690 MPa). For iron, aluminium, and copper alloys, Se is typically 0.4 times the ultimate tensile strength. Maximum typical values for irons are 24 ksi (165 MPa), aluminums 19 ksi (131 MPa), and coppers 14 ksi (96.5 MPa).[2] Note that these values are for smooth "un-notched" test specimens. The endurance limit for notched specimens (and thus for many practical design situations) is significantly lower."
So, so long as your cyclic fatigue load never exceeds the fatigue limit, all is golden.
But if you want to do the sums and look at the material thicknesses that would have to be used to lower the material stress to this level, you'll see where the problem lies.
Certainly on lightweight performance bicycles, I cannot think of many structural parts that will offer infinite fatigue life.
you'll see where the problem lies.
usually on the non drive side drop-out/stays 🙄
Thanks Brant,
though as a non-engineer that stuff is meaningless and I'm not able to do the calcs (there's no Ti figure there either but it's not like I can make use of it)
are you saying that NO currently used "proper" lightweight frameset (in any material) is within its limits during riding ?
How far off ?
(and what % "cycles" will exceed the threshold - presumably these need to add up to result in failure, or is one enough to screw it thereafter ?)
I won't ask how you feel about their warranty wording - unless you fancy it 😉
[url= http://www.bobbrowncycles.com/eng.htm ]Some useful frame strength / stiffness / fatigue info[/url]
crazylegs on the flipside specialized refused to honour a warranty claim with me. I argued that some customers will get their shoes cold wet and muddy.
So thats three sets failed in the sameplace. None replaced.Got an issue with spesh shoes? Make sure you dont have any signs of use on them.
"Deal with the shop" and silence was their replies. Specialized and Evanscycles customer service skills are incompetent.
I spoke to two Specializeduk contacts and explained this wasnt the first product failure. Their response? Ignored. Never bad this with any other brand, regardless of product.
Specialized you suck.
I wonder if they (Litespeed) have read this & thought $1000 (est mfr cost), would have been a small price compared to the bad press a 7 page Internet thread generates.
I nearly bought a Ti frame recently. Went with a steel Niner frame instead. I figured that at least its repairable at a reasonable cost if it does fail out of warranty. 😕
Sad state of affairs at Litespeed.
Why would you expect a Ti frame to last longer than a Steel one?
Because that's what the Ti hype machine has been telling us for the last 20+ years? I've got a Schwinn steel frame from 1952, and if my Ti road frame lasts that long I'll re-name myself Mavis Phannyphart.
To be fair - Litespeed very much pushed the longevity issue in their own literature - for example, the 2004 catalogue had this to say:
Fatigue strength is the measurement of how far and how many times a material can bend before it breaks. High fatigue strength is essential to the durability and safety of the frame. Certain materials such as steel and titanium actually have a threshold that if properly designed and used, can be bent an infinite number of times without failure.
Which would strongly suggest that if it broke due to fatigue in normal use during the 'lifetime of the original owner' then there was a design or manufacturing issue.
Seems obvious to me that Litespeed have very much traded on this 'lifetime warranty' as a big selling point for many years, in both their catalogues and advertising,
Certain materials such as steel and titanium actually have a threshold that [u][b]if[/b][/u] properly designed and used, can be bent an infinite number of times without failure.
The "if" is the key there. I don't think it's possible in many bicycle areas, and certainly not Ti down tubes. Not INFINITE life.
Best case welds double the stress in the joint, I'd have said. So that means working fatigue cycles need to be well below 25% of UTS for fatigue life, more like 15%.
That arguable gives a factor of safety of 4 to 6, for ultimate strength, which is quite high for a performance structure.
I have to go catch a plane, but there is some very good stuff on the old internet - Usenet - posted by richkatz@cruzio.com - go have a dig and see who that is 🙂
My beef was that it was a lifetime warranty,that was until it snapped and then it wasn't actually a lifetime warranty. That annoyed me a bt. Lifetime of first owner s jut at, not lifetime of the material.
'SHITESPEED'
We now rename you by forum poll 😀
Just googled Litespeed warranty. Thread, after thread, after thread about their effectively worthles warranties. And its been going on for sometime too. Here's a link http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/index.php/t-736934.html - A sad state of affairs. I've just bought a Turner on the basis of their excellent customer service. They warranty their frames for two years. That seems a reasonable amount of time. If you're using it regularly and there is a defect, its going to become clear fairly soon. As I understand it, they had problems with the 2009 1st generation 5.Spot and they sorted it quickly and cleanly and actually enhanced their rep as a result. IMO its a real shame when these family-owned businesses get bought out and the suits trade on the brand equity whilst simultaneously defrauding it. FWIW there are a few comments on here about Marin and how good their customer service is. They were recently bought out by a private equity outfit. I have hear nothing whatsoever to indicate that this ha effected their customer service, but I will be watching with interest to see if it does. I'm all off to email Litespeed about their warranties!
Hmm... seems that a lifetime warranty against manufacturing defects has raised people's expectations to the level that they think a frame will last as long as the buyer does. I didn't/don't read it that way, but I expect wise companies will offer far more limited warranty periods in future.
wise companies will offer far more limited warranty periods
I think thats fair comment - I don't think many of us would expect a frame to last forever, however I think its disingenuous for a company to push their 'lifetime warranty' as a selling point as strongly as Litespeed have over the years, to not stand by it.
The company I work for reckon the realistic lifetime of our product is two to five years dependent on amount and type of use. I think that's reasonable for high performance lightweight cycle racing components - it carries a two year warranty, and if something fails in normal use in that time, then we cover it under warranty, outside that, we don't, and we carry spare parts for five years.
Seems simple to me - if you only expect your frames to last 5-10 years of normal use, then don't advertise them as having a 'lifetime' warranty.
They warranty their frames for two years. That seems a reasonable amount of time. If you're using it regularly and there is a defect, its going to become clear fairly soon
I would hope that, through proper use and maintainence a frame would last at least 5 years. a fault might not show itself for that period but I would have had a good use of it over that period because, lets face it, when you spend over £1000 on a frame you are going to use it!
I have to go catch a plane, but there is some very good stuff on the old internet - Usenet - posted by richkatz@cruzio.com - go have a dig and see who that is
Keith Bontrager!
http://search.bikelist.org/query.asp?SearchString=%22HBS%3A+Re%3A+Frame+fatigue%22&SearchPrefix=%40msgsubject&SortBy=MsgDate [a]
Turner took 40mins to offer me a replacement better frame. I only paid 750 for it and explaibed Ud be hapoy with a resprayed rear...... nope brand new later frame.
makes me laugh really, in bmx (freestyle, not racing) a lifetime warranty is just that, and all the scummy bmx kids abuse it horribly. if bmx companies took the same stance as some of these mentioned they would be shunned and probably go out of business due to bad rep.
I got the same response from ABG/Litespeed last year when my 8 yo Merlin XLM cracked. It's a wear & tear failure, not covered under warranty.
I didn't take up their offer of a replacement Litespeed. Indy Fab got my money.
None of us are likely to live for infinity either, so I fail to see what the problem is.brant - Member
Certain materials such as steel and titanium actually have a threshold that if properly designed and used, can be bent an infinite number of times without failure.
The "if" is the key there. I don't think it's possible in many bicycle areas, and certainly not Ti down tubes. Not INFINITE life.
I just got sanctioned by Singletrack for expressing an over simplistic view of Litespeed for reneging on this warranty promise. My post was deleted.
So I would just like to say that I think Litespeed to be loathsome in the extreme for this behaviour.
Is that better?
And as for Brant intervening there....my 456Ti broke at the top tube near the head tube. Yes it was replaced on warranty. Yes On One did pay my postage. BUT..... I would rather it had been built 1/2 pound heavier and not suffered this failure. I would rather not have had to deconstruct and reconstruct the bike and spend several weeks without it.
Unpaid R & D operatives...........................the purchasing public.
Nice one to the poster for posting this
the less you ride, the longer your frame will last, and the shorter your life will become (unless you're a commuter, other factors may come into play)
So the key to a lifetime warranty is only to offer it on fantastically unrideable frames.
I just got sanctioned by Singletrack for expressing an over simplistic view of Litespeed for reneging on this warranty promise. My post was deleted.
I presume they are planning an in depth article which looks at this issue, how customers view "lifetime of first owner" warranty's, the views of the manufacturers, LBS's, a legal view on the warranty contract and the ASA view on the difference between customer expectation and the manufacturers statements on their websites.
They obviously would not want you to "spook" a manufacturer they are investigating by making extreme adverse comments on their public website forum.
after all they are "journalists"
What would Martin Bell do?
I would rather it had been built 1/2 pound heavier and not suffered this failure.
There's no guarantee that, if it had been half a pound heavier, it wouldn't have broken there. Would you really want every part of your bike so massively overengineered that there's no chance of it ever failing in your lifetime?
The company I work for reckon the realistic lifetime of our product is two to five years dependent on amount and type of use.
Oh do tell I am sure they would be delighted by your PR work for them on here 😉
Are you the hitman for Superstar products? Perhaps you are just the trouble shooter 😉