Panniers vs Bikepacking Bags

Use whatever suits your ride and load. I use small panniers on a rack for bikepacking and it works well for me. I have ridden all all over Wales and the Highlands with that setup. I don’t like the swaying seat packs and I don’t like a heavy bulky quivering bag on my bars. I like the ability to pack quickly and easily. I always use a strap around the panniers to stop them rattling on the rack. I pack quite lightly but not super light (I cook rather than rehydrate and I use a light tent rather than bivvy)

Imo if you can get the weight down to 5 or 7 kilos bike****ng bags guve better weight distibution and handling than panniers but oce you start haing to strap stuff allover you forks etc then panniers are better. For bigger loads 12kgplus i prefer a trailer

I'm currently away on a city break (50k gravel and road each way) on the bikes with my wife and I've just put one of these 20l dry bags on the rack. No panniers.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/BTR-Waterproof-Capacity-Recyclable-Cardboard/dp/B0876SHC5X/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=2CUVHNIQ6AD00&keywords=btr+waterproof+rear+rack+dry+bike+bag&qid=1659779749&sprefix=BTR+dry%2Caps%2C173&sr=8-3

It's great for this sort of thing with just a few clothes and odds and sods. Just really convenient and easy to access or carry about; like a poor man's tailfin bag.

I do have the full load of strap on bike packing bags which are useful for more off road stuff and camping but are also quite a faff getting in and off when you need to.

In agreement with others.

Panniers for the win if stuff is getting heavy. They (plus the rack) are heavier before you fill them, so this is going to be a heavier trip regardless of what you are carrying. Then when use the rule of holiday suitcase (the will alway fill whatever suitcase you take no matter how large but will always get by regardless how little you take) you'll fill them up. They can be rattly though so depending on your obsessiveness that might drive you mad off road.

Bikepacking bags - imo, unless you are staying away for a super short trip, or eating takeaways and sleeping hostels/bus shelters, you are going to have to either deprive yourself or spent a shit ton on super small and light camping kit to get it all packed. Solo travel makes that situation worse. The cooler and damper the environment, the logistically harder it is to achieve too. I also am currently loathing my alpkit oversized saddlebag thingy - I load it with anything more than very low density stuff and it starts swaying, then the straps come loose. It is about to undergo some surgery to try and resolve the hassle it's given me.

So can anyone convince me that I shouldn’t just buy a pair of panniers?

Bikepacking: lighter, bike handles better/easier to lift over stuff, arguably more enjoyable riding, have to compromise on kit (not necessarily a bad thing!), probably have to spend more on lighter/more compact kit. Can use (some of the) same kit on road/gravel or MTB. Looks cooler
Panniers: look fine with SPD sandals

Agree with the above. Worth noting that even small rear panniers can be a right pain if you're doing much pushing/lifting of the bike. That BTR rack bag looks handy. Before I bought a seatpack I did long trips with an Ortlieb stuffsac strapped to a rack, which worked fine, but that refines the concept. Might buy one myself for longer trips.

I agree, panniers are a better option, their only drawback is the extra width and the rack being the weak point, but these only apply to hard off road riding. Any bikepacking saddlepack must be 100% waterproof or its pointless.

I prefer bikepacking bags if tricky off road is to be encountered and/or you are traveling light. I would find it hard to use bikepacking bags on a solo trip unless I spent big on small lightweight stuff.
Trailers are good if you have an imbalance in abilities of riders. I went on an over nighter with my 11 year old son last week, he used bike packing bags to carry a few spare clothes and look cool, I lugged everything else in the trailer. Worked well.

Each has there pluses and minuses but key to both is to try and reduce your load as much as you can. You don't have to spend a fortune, maybe even nothing but the lighter the load the easier it gets. First off I would get some digital scales and start weighing stuff so you get an idea of what weighs what - it's very difficult to tell which spare fleece is the lightest for example!

Then start trying to reduce what you take.

Panniers are more convenient when you stop, because you can quickly remove them to set up camp etc.
on my surly, i use a rack with 2 medium panniers, with a framebag, and 2 bottle cages on the forks. I load heavier stuff in the framebag, i find the bike is more stable that way.
Ultimately, there’s no ‘right’ or ‘wrong’ way, do what works for you.

I've been eyeing up that BTR trunk bag for a while- the price is great too. What are they like to get on and off the bike? And is there a shoulder strap or something to carry it with? The slightly annoying thing with Ortliebs is that the bag needs to open to carry it one your shoulder

Anothe big plus of panniers is that if you have to lift your bike over a gate etc you can rapidly remove the pannier weight to lift the bike and bags separately. A fully loaded bike and a huge gate isn't much fun.

@shermer75 yeh there's a shoulder strap. The bag has two straps you wrap around the rack top and then click fasten, pretty quick and easy to do, but maybe a little faff wrapping round the bar each side. There's also an additional third strap you can wrap around the whole lot for more belt and braces,but I've not bothered with that. You can unclip the top and roll fastenings and get some access to the bag with it in place if you need too.

It's quite long so would be too big on my wife's small bike and rack with low seat height, but is fine on my medium framed Topstone.

I've also used is as just an overnight bag travelling as it's just the right size and easy to carry with the shoulder strap.

Not sure how durable the welded plastic style would be for a long term roughly toughty tour, but it's been great so far.

For proper off road bikepacking in the hills I'd still go BPing specific bags, but for road and easy gravel/track credit hotel/hostel/b&b trips it's great.

Bikepacking bags are more aero I'm told by someone who uses them. They had Restrap rear one that just pops out of the seatpost holder easy peasy.

As others have said there are a whole bunch of advantages and disadvatages of eitherr set-up.

What I'll add is that going on a bikepacking trip - even one with sub optimal kit - is way more fun than sitting at home wondering about what kind of bag to take.

Bikepacking bags work really well once you get them set up well and you know what goes where. It can be a long journey to get to a setup you're happy with though and even then they're still a bit of a faff. It's something you refine over time.

With panniers, you bolt your rack on, attach your bags, and just drop all your stuff into the cavernous space. Any oversize items can be attached to the rack with bungees. It's a world of simplicity. They're heavy, and they create some aero drag, and you'll worry the rack's going to break when you go off road, but they generally work in my experience.

I've got both, it's horses for courses.

Panniers are great for "bike camping".

Bags are great for "bikepacking".

The distinction is that panniers make the bike handle like crap but you get a good camping experience.

Bikepacking bags barely affect the weight of the bike (if you pack accordingly) but the trade-off is the measure of overnight success is not waking up with hypothermia.

The lightest I've gotten away with bikepacking was a 1 season sleeping bag and bivi up front and mat, down jacket and leggings in the saddle bag. Had an amazing time as the aim was just to ride bikes for 2 days. As soon as you move away from that ethos then you're straying into panniers (or so much weight in bags that you lose any advantage of it).

Sensible comments and no arguing?

What's this place come to?

Bikepacking bags for off road all the way. I can manage about 4 days of kit and food in bags. Bike rides well still though you may not want to sit next to me in a cafe.

That's on a HT not a gravel bike though.

I use panniers for road/ easy off road touring, and frame bags for proper off road. Each suits its purpose.

I think I will buy a Carradice saddlebag for long audaxes.

Cheers all.

Plenty of yes votes to panniers there with no horror stories.

I think for me for simplicity it’s the way to go, it’s not something I’m going to do loads of at this stage so don’t want to spend hours and £££ perfecting the most streamline set up I can find.

What I’ll add is that going on a bikepacking trip – even one with sub optimal kit – is way more fun than sitting at home wondering about what kind of bag to take.

This is great advice ta

Bikepacking bags are more aero I’m told by someone who uses them.

I’m not very aero so that’s not too much of an issue!

Panniers are more flexible and easier to use. You have to be v disciplined to make bike packing set ups work as otherwise you end up unpacking everything to find something. I even struggled with bar packs as I couldn’t pack stuff right. Pannier racks are also helpful for carrying food/booze to camp. Might be worth borrowing someone’s to see as either way they are ££

And... with my 30" inseam & a 29er tyre (i've used 3" before) theses not enough clearance between the tyre / bag for carrying anything of any volume.

If you already have a rear rack, you could also look at something like a Carradice longflap camper. Best of both worlds, easy to access but less obtrusive than side mounted panniers so can still work well on off road stuff.

Here's how I run my bike normally, can easily get everything I need for 3/4 days out, including food.

carrying food/booze to camp

Nobody has said 1 pannier yet. One pannier on lh side combined with bag strapped to top rack

Pannier convenience with less increased width and no pannier getting in the way if you need to push a bit.

I’ve used both - panniers can shake themselves loose so need constant checking plus they can catch on narrow singletrack / deep ruts. I had a pannier rip-off when I caught a tree stump in a Finnish forest at night in winter - how I laughed as I had to unscrew the broken clip and reattach the pannier with cable ties and bare hands at -20C. There’s also a temptation with too big/many bags to take too much stuff - the discipline of bike packing is to take the minimum. A 20 litre drybag bungeed to a rack works very well for short trips. For short-butts, most big seat pack either rub the back wheel or requires a straddle jump to remount - a right, royal pain.

I have both. Bikepacking bags for fast and light, panniers for bringing lots of stuff/touring/commuting.

Aero penalty for panniers is not to be sniffed at. Also, you're probably looking at a 2kg weight penalty for panniers, too.

Panniers off-road is generally a frustrating experience.
Bikepacking bags are often fiddly to not have them rub against knees/thighs, and sometimes you just have to live with it.

Getting things in and out of panniers is so nice. Even if you're organised, it's a total faff with bikepacking bags.

Nobody has said 1 pannier yet. One pannier on lh side combined with bag strapped to top rack

Exactly what I've been sporting today. One pannier, one bar bag, jackets bungeed to the rack deck.
Ok, it's been 95% road...

I,ve been using Ortleib gravel panniers. Not very big so the bike handles ok. Top quality but not cheap. I cant see me using any thing else. I put heavy stuff in a full frame bag courtesy ' Beerbabe.'

Any off-road .... Bike packing bags.

If it's all on road. Appropriately sized panniers all day long. 4 of = balanced bike. Handling not ruined.

L

Trailer for off road handledmuch better than panniers

Plenty of yes votes to panniers there with no horror stories.

If you're off-road then my experience (based on my pal using them when we did the Cairngorm Loop) is that they're a bad idea:
- they catch on trail-side 'obstacles'
- hard-ish luggage rattles
- difficult to manoeuvre/jump over ruts/water-bars
- encourages too much gear
- PITA if you're pushing

I've ended up with a front harness (so can use on either drops or flats) c/w dry-bag, a seat pack and frame bag.

I got a £20 waterproof pannier from Decathlon, it’s ace and works well.

Panniers for bigger loads or non technical riding. Bike packing kit for the opposite.

If you already have a rack get the toughest dry bag you can and strap it onto the rack. Much less hassle and much cheaper than a myriad of bike packing bags and handles just as well.

Trailer for off road handledmuch better than panniers

I once met a group heading into the the inner Cairngorm loop with trailers.- looked like a hire/guide set up. (Heading down from an lurg)

They may still be out there......

I think if what you're doing is what the CTC / Cycling UK would have classed as rough stuff 30+ years ago then panniers (small front and back) or a Carradice style long flap/camper saddle bag have got to be easier to pack and deal with and the handling impact should be well manageable. I wouldn't have any qualms about riding along (say) the South Downs Way in Hampshire/West Sussex with panniers but I wouldn't want to take in trails around for example Edale with panniers but then I wouldn't ride a gravel bike there either.

If you're doing the kind of thing that involves pushing and carrying and nadgery trails with lifting/ carrying then you probably want the bike packing stuff.

Edit: I'm not (yet) a bike packer but did run a similar thread on this in April time more around day riding with more gear (expanding kids mileages riding in company). I'm therefore speaking from historic riding off and on road with a touring mindset.

We are also thinking about a dad and boys, no car tour in France or Holland next year so been thinking about this a bit for the three of us.

Agree with most of above. Cycled a coast to coast last summer with my wife. 2nights 3 days and we camped. Used bikepacking bags only, and even using a lot of lightweight gear we use for hiking it was a struggle to get packed up easily. We managed and had room to spare for food etc, but it took a fair bit of fiddling before we got the system down.

Lomo do a 20l motorbike drybag that works well as a rack top bag. Pretty cheap too
Motorbike bag

They also do a rack bag, bit smaller but maybe a bit more useful. This is what I would have bought, but they were out of stock so went with the motorbike dry bag instead. Rack top bag

I once met a group heading into the the inner Cairngorm loop with trailers.- looked like a hire/guide set up. (Heading down from an lurg)

Possibly a Glenmore Lodge group. It certainly used to be the case that the "overnight" extension to the MTB Leadership Award mandated the use of trailers.

Possibly a Glenmore Lodge group. It certainly used to be the case that the “overnight” extension to the MTB Leadership Award mandated the use of trailers.

I'd have hoped the assessor would have intervened in that case before they got to where they were. Unless of course they were assessing for wheelbarrow leadership

Use whatever suits your ride and load

This .

I’ve not read the rest of the thread as yet but I use both panniers, rack-pack and/or different bike bags for different loads and different terrain.

Big loads on mostly tarmac always panniers often with some auxiliary bike bags, bar-roll, etc for the small stuff. Lighter loads and lumpy offroad/narrow gaps I’ll go with the handlebar bag and/or a frame bag.

Heavy off-road stuff will be bar-harness/drybag, frame-bag and rack-pack. I can carry extra water on the fork legs as they have bosses for luggage cages etc

Still can’t get my head around a huge seat pack don’t really like the idea, But I really like the Agu rack-pack which sits firmly on top of the rear rack platform and it has little foldout panniers for extra stuff, plus bungee on top for whatever - ie jacket, drybag, helmet, outsized items etc.

My favourite rides out are packed light with everything in a bar bag. I don’t think I’m really massively into off-road bike packing but I do like backroads touring a lot and find panniers to be less faff overall.

* Forgot to say my latest addition/option is a one-wheeled cargo trailer set up (like the BOB Yak) and that is just amazing for backroad heavy/long-term camping tours (backroads and light/medium offroad)

It tracks remarkably well, is almost silent once loaded. I’d just like to fashion/add a bipod kickstand and maybe some plastic bumpers around the trailer-base edges. Of course, once unhitched it leaves your bike as light as you like for extra-curricular/non-carrying duties. Once unloaded it then makes an excellent fetcher/carrier for groceries and firewood

I'm done with frame bags and traffic cone seatpacks.

For me on the fatbike, No.1 priority was dropper deployment.
So, a rack, with small Front Ortlieb panniers (12.5l each), something on the rack itself, plus sleeproll drybag on the bars (1.5kg) is perfect for me. Voluminous!

Descending the Corrieyairack down to Melgarve at full pelt over all the drainage bars, saddle down and nothing came loose.

For gravel bike/road touring I'd also use a rack but my Topeak MTX Trunk bag with the smaller more aero fold out panniers and a bar bag.

Frame triangle is for water.

It's interesting how people's experience of touring/bikepacking shapes their (often strongly held...) opinions.

I took a Yak trailer on a 3700km trip round NZ in the mid-Noughties and promptly sold it when I returned, vowing never to use one again...my main memory is portaging up onto the Otago escarpment, wearing the entire trailer as a rucsac with my arms through the bag handles, muttering like a nutter and thinking how much easier it would've been with weight evenly distributed on the bike in four panniers...

...but fast forward ten years and an offroad LEJoG saw me strapping an Ortlieb stuffsac to a rack, a cheap Alpkit bag on the bars and going for it. Bikepacking fashionistas would (and did) throw up their hands in horror, but it worked fine. For shorter trips, and with concessions made to comfort (or your bank balance), seatpacks are arguably better, but it's angels on the head of a pin stuff. Last year I even went combo old skool for a couple of 4-5 day rides: bar roll, half frame bag, panniers. Guess what? Worked fine...
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These days my preference is for a bar roll, half frame bag and seatpack, plus a small rucsac. It means I can basically ride all the same stuff I'd ride unencumbered. I've taken that setup down red runs at every trail centre in Wales, including BPW, for example. But it's all down to what you want to do with it, and how much you're willing to spend. It's refreshing this thread hasn't descended into partisan abuse because all these solutions work.

Apart from trailers, of course. Anyone advocating for them must be a complete ****.

I'm just about to take a hardtail fitted with a Tailfin aero pack and two 10l panniers on parts of the North downs, King Alfreds and South Downs way, will report back after.

Panniers I have used have always rattled to some extent. And I suspect clips and the rack itself will ultimately be more fragile than many velcro straps.

That said, whilst I've not used full bikepacking gear I'd imagine packing it up would take a fair bit of planning as to what goes where. And your overall capacity is limited. Panniers are also not very aero as I found out trying to sustain a speed above 20mph with them.

I'd quite fancy a rack with some well designed secure mini panniers + top bag, with cinch straps to prevent rattling. And yea I would use Anything Cages with that rather than front panniers, in part because my nice rigid forks have the mounts

Tailfin aero pack and two 10l panniers

What panniers?

Did it just start as a solution for bikes that didn’t have mounts

Pretty much, that and a lighter, less breakage-prone system for off-road trips with minimal kit.
Good quality panniers are fine for most things, just maybe not extended MTB trail routes. Racks and panniers can have weak spots and the best versions avoid them. With bikepacking luggage it's just the wear on / from straps you need to watch.

Bikepacking gear works well if you take very little stuff, that's the whole point. If you're taking plenty of kit and aren't going off-road that much it makes less odds. Panniers and racks may add a kilo or 2 but it you've packed 15kgs onto the bike already.. I expect the aero drag will make more difference than the weight difference.

These days my preference is for a bar roll, half frame bag and seatpack, plus a small rucsac.

Same here - a packable rucsac for some trips to carry food in the evenings, maybe a small camelback for overspill and water bladder on other trips. I think I'd use either that set up or the full 4 panniers packed for comfort and a month away.

Apart from trailers, of course. Anyone advocating for them must be a complete ****.

Harsh .... But I have 2 trailers and both are crap off road.

Unfortunately my daughter refuses to be put in a soft bag......

The bob yaks also pretty awful

These days my preference is for a bar roll, half frame bag and seatpack, plus a small rucsac.

What do you pack for a night in the wilds out of interest?