[Closed] My bike is too good at everything, its stopping N+1

you need to up your budget for the 29er, obviously 🙂

[url= http://www.radon-bikes.de/xist4c/web/Skeen-10-0_id_25895_.htm ]Radon Skeen 10[/url], 10.8kg, €2600. Mildly cynical on the weight of that one. Edit: it's 26", ignore that!

Or [url= http://www.canyon.com/_en/mountainbikes/bike.html?b=3233#tab-reiter2 ]Canyon Lux CF 9.9[/url], £3300, 10.8kg. Seems there are options out there!

Not quite sure why you think a cheaper bike with bigger wheels [i]should [/i]be lighter though...?

Not quite sure why you think a cheaper bike with bigger wheels should be lighter though...?

I don't necessarily, but I'm just trying to weigh up all the advantages and disadvantages. The Yeti was great at the Bonty with the shock pumped up to give 3.5" of travel, and as mentioned could be lighter (did some maths on an XCracer shopping basket).

Spending £300 on the Yeti then gives me a 25.5lb utilitarian FS. Dropping the balance of the sold yeti/new bike - £1500? - gives me different sized wheels, different Geo, Carbon frame. Is that [i]really [/i]worth £1500? Speed has much more to do with me than a new bike at the moment I reckon.

Buy another exactly the same just in a different colour. 🙂

Question is wider than just weight though innit. Would a 29er be faster, weight aside?

Whatever you do, just don't buy a Spearfish. Thanks.

Carry on.

I don't know NJEE, would it? And how much faster is worth £1500?

localhero94 - Member
Whatever you do, just don't buy a Spearfish. Thanks.

I won't I've heard they are accident prone.

[i]And how much faster is worth £1500? [/i]

that's for you to decide.

Get a demo bike and ride a route/lap you're familiar with and compare with times on the Yeti?

I do rather like that racey [url= http://www.radon-bikes.de/xist4c/web/Black-Sin-29-10-0-SL_id_25887_.htm ]Black Sin 29er[/url]. Sure you couldn't replace the racey 26" FS with a 29" HT?

With a bigger budget, I wonder how light you could get the Yeti. Though may compromise the do it all bit.

Sounds like you don't NEED a new bike, you are just tempted.

Spend the £300 then get a skills course in and go faster through being a better rider!

mrblobby, I potentially have a bigger budget. I could double it and get some A/C wheels to replace my hope/crests and save another 200g for instance.

Thing is, I have a decent 26" HT for short course racing, but I like my comfort PLUS i want an everyday FS trail bike but really don't have room/wife tolerance for another bike. So my thought was to replace the Yeti, later narrowed down to one of the three bikes mentioned above.

Thing is I really like the Yeti, and I'm never going to have the time or perhaps ability to be on podiums, so is the outlay worth it?

The carbon lux looks nice, got a good review in WMB this month too. I'm thinking of replacing my bizango with one, they're the same colour scheme, I doubt the mrs would suspect anything 8) 😕

[i]I'm never going to have the time or perhaps ability to be on podiums, so is the outlay worth it? [/i]

Nope.

There, you can spend the £300 and keep a bike you already enjoy riding.

I think you are right wwaswas.

What's wrong with a Spearfish ?

weeksy - Member
What's wrong with a Spearfish ?

Its an in-joke. Localhero94 & I are known for accidently owning the same of everything, until he semi-retired his Yeti for a Spearfish recently...

[i]I think you are right wwaswas. [/i]

the law of averages said it was bound to happen sooner or later 😉

Set of posh wheels for racing sounds like an interesting alternative to a whole bike though!

Set of posh wheels for racing sounds like an interesting alternative to a whole bike though!

Thats what the crests were - I have some Sun Ringle black flags which go on for trail centres - one of which I busted at the weekend so perhaps I could use the Crests for that and buy the AC's for events.

I should point out my spend is actually double with the exception of wheels, as the "bits" I'd buy from xcracer are x2 for the other bikes as well (Rotors, Stems, QR's, Seatclamps, cable outers/hoses, a bar and ti bolts basically).

Not sure incremental weight loss is worth it, things don't feel much different in my experience.

Big wheels seem to overcome slight weight penalty but how much is something no one wants to answer (and I've asked) but I'm seriously considering a 24.5lb Spearfish over my 21.5lb Merida 96.

you need to decide how much faster you were between the Black Flags and the Crests on the same course. If it's a matter of seconds is going lighter on wheels going to really make you enjoy the racing anymore or affect your results in any significant way?

Probably not wwaswas, hence I hadn't originally included new wheels in my first few posts, and hence:

Speed has much more to do with me than a new bike at the moment I reckon

stop over-thinking it all and enjoy riding then 🙂

Fit and function, thats what I always think before spending more £'s.

If the Yeti fits and functions well in the playground you prance about in then just upgrade some bits to keep the love alive. If it's struggling to inspire and the proportional spend on upgrades doesn't seem worth it then get rid and spend more on another bike.

It would be hard making the Yeti into an XC whippet though, not really designed for it either is it. What it does excel in is offering you more "whoop" options than say an XC bike would.

You could of course buy my NinerSS rigid off me if you want something flat out fast.. 😉

It would be hard making the Yeti into an XC whippet though, not really designed for it either is it. What it does excel in is offering you more "whoop" options than say an XC bike would.

No, but bear in mind I have a 24lb Enigma Ego 26 / XT / Sid/ AC's chained up next to it:

[url= https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5341/9506878541_c29f64e5a5_z.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5341/9506878541_c29f64e5a5_z.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/fu6eLZ ]Enigma cropped[/url]

I was expecting this thread to mention a tripster in it....

That radon looks lovely. I was completely satisfied with my scale till I saw that.

Just get a new bike, if you have the cash....you don't need to justify it by claiming a few second lap improvements.

CRC ASRc frame?

Ahh, nioce..

Sell the Yeti then and spend the money on a pair of Assos Shades 😆

TBH, sounds like you'd be better off just keeping what you've got, finishing this seasons racing, and using them for some serious training over the winter, then re-evaluate for next season. What with the road racing too it sounds like you're just enjoying competing on a bike rather than being serious about being as competitive as you can be.

Quick edit... what I mean above is what's your goal? What do you want to be good at? E.g. if it's road racing and moving up a cat (or being competitive in current cat) then what mtb you have doesn't really matter as long as you can do the training you need to do.

If you genuinely want to get faster then a power meter, decent book/ coach and hard work must be a better investment for speed than dropping a lb or two from either bike or changing wheel size... Even riding consistently seems to work wonders for most people. Sorry daft idea 😀 Riding is hard, buying stuff is easy.

DanW (from similar threads a month or two ago)- I've been feeling similar... I'm sucking in races and ride a 26 ... therefore the only reason I suck is because of the wheel size. Actually, no, I just suck compared to the other guys I think it is much better to invest the time, energy and potentially money in actually riding the damn bike and trying to improve myself rather than the bike

Just get a new bike, if you have the cash....you don't need to justify it by claiming a few second lap improvements.

stop over-thinking it all and enjoy riding then

Totally agree, if you have n+1 fever the just go and buy something. Don't look for daft justification.

if you want racier i.e faster then forget the bike...make yourself faster
have another phall before a ride then zoom round the course to make it back in time before all hell breaks loose!!
😆

DanW I am training / following a program based on road which has helped me significantly on MTB.

I think you and 'blobby are right. When and more likely if I start getting consistent top tier finishes or think about biking as being racing rather than the other way around then perhaps I should think about a dedicated race bike.

In my last race, last month, the chap who won in my age category rode a real old school steel frame with steel forks, straight alu bars and cantis. Just saying like.

Nerve CF.

Thank me later.

With all this hand-wringing, just forget about the bike and get a subscription to the Guardian 😉

There are only two reasons to buy a new bike

1> because you broke your bike
2> becasue you want to <-- this is a perfectly valid reason!

Trying to justify it with speed gains, capability etc. is all in your head, unless you're doing something stupid like riding a SingleSpeed downhill bike in an XC race, or you are already coming 2nd every time and the only reason the guy coming first is winning is because he has a 80g lighter bike than you, then it's you that makes the bigger difference.

So basically, buy a new bike if you want to, but don't kid yourself it will magically catapult you several places up the ranking, in fact until you've got your setup dialled in on the new bike you may go slower 😉

[i]magically catapult you several places up the ranking[/i]

We may have the answer.

I give you the trebuchet bicycle:

[img] [/img]

clearly there's a lot of room for weight saving but it might just work.

curiousyellow - Member
Nerve CF.

Thank me later.

For buying practically what I've got yet throwing away some cash?

Blimey Kryton, I didn't think there was anyone less decisive than me about buying a bike - the only excuse is that we are thinking along the same lines!!

beware the sales adverts. Just went to cycleworks in London and super discounted camber evo gone (hmmmm...) and anthem 29er still at original price??????

It's nearly 2lbs lighter!

Claimed weight anyway.

If you start with that logic then most bikes are "practically" what you've already got. Just buy what you like if you can afford it.

Having been through this dilemma recently I went with a 2015 Whyte M109 team, light, springy, fast and has a faultless list of components and a insanely cheap price and it's British as well, tea and medals all round, huzzzahhh!

Hmmmm

[img] [/img]

Interesting OP.

I find myself not being particularly bothered about replacing this

[img] [/img]

Indeed Dez, I could have posted:

Hmmmm

[img] [/img]

(that one isn't mine buts its the same, cough, colourway)

The M109C team? Four grand and still 24.5 lbs? 😕 Lovely bike but if it's all about the racing then I don't really see where it fits in.

See I keep thinking a cross bike would be nice, and I tell myself it'd be good for training during the winter, good to get a bit of racing in and keep motivated, I've had a couple of test rides, and I keep looking at them on the internet and they are nice and shiny and pretty and I really do want one... BUT... it's a distraction. Instead I've just blown my bike slush fund on stuff that will actually help me to train better and go faster for my specific racing goals.

Instead I've just blown my bike slush fund on stuff that will actually help me to train better and go faster for my specific racing goals.

Which is?

(I was looking at the 109CS btw, only £3k and a bit more relaxed on the HA)

[i]Which is? [/i]

Pies.

Which is?

Pies.

Would be a lot of pies 🙂

A P2M power meter and disc wheel for the TT bike and a few other bits and bobs (new tubs, some positioning stuff.) Considering some spend on the coaching option too.

Not quite as sexy as a new bike, but I've learned to n+1 all the other bike related gubbins too. Bib shorts are a perfect example. I think I have seven or eight flavours now in my quest for the perfect one.

Alternatively, perhaps you're bikepacking-curious? Your race bike will be shit for that. Ta-da! New bike time!

I've decided I don't look racing enough and I need 29" wheels look (the camelback is becuase my bottle cage nut is spinning/stuck in the frame):

Me:
[url= https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3850/14786574595_eda9c79e1f_z.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3850/14786574595_eda9c79e1f_z.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/owD4ti ]image[/url]

A racing person:

[img] [/img]

😕

[url= http://www.cycling-wear.com/team-cycling-jerseys/rabobank-cycling-team-kit.html ]Here[/url] for Rabobank team kit 🙂

Funny how perceptions change though. Remember 29ers looking funny when they came out, now 26ers look a bit funny. Does look a bit like you're riding a kids bike in that photo.

Lol, it does, must be the angle. I'm 5'11 and a half, bang in the middle of the Yeti Geometry between a Medium and Large - thats a medium, and the large seat tube (20") would be too big for me. Weird isn't it. Looks more normal 10 seconds later:

[url= https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3886/14783503321_00b1f3f1fe_z.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3886/14783503321_00b1f3f1fe_z.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/ownjui ]image[/url]

I was going to say - there's your justification:bike is too small!

[i]A racing person:[/i]

You'd look like that if there was a bit of a berm on the 24:12 finish line

I don't look racing enough

Buying a jersey to match your helmet colour (or new helmet), repair the bottle mount to run bottle only and buying some shiney new disco slippers will get you most of the way there 😆

bike is too small

You've been doing this n+1 dance for ages but everything could have been solved if you posted pics of you on the bike earlier! It does look a touch small. Quite a lot of knee flexion even with the heels dropped with cranks at 6 o'clock, a lot of hip flexion with the cranks at 12 o'clock and quite an upright position... all suggest you need the saddle up a fair bit and a longer reach frame... a seat tube length doesn't make a bike too big or too small for you

In all seriousness, ~£100 in a decent bike fit might be a good first step to getting faster and might also serve to offer iron clad justification for a new bike... or may tell you the paragraph above is utter b0llocks based on a bad photo posted online 😀

The M109C team? Four grand and still 24.5 lbs? Lovely bike but if it's all about the racing then I don't really see where it fits in.

Got to agree with Blobby, if you are going to change the bike for the faster then something like that Whyte isn't the way to go. Personally I'd pimp your Ti hardtail with as much shiney stuff from R2-Bike as you can get away with. Gorgeous frame, even if it does have a daft name 😉

Hmmm.

I wonder if localhero94 wants to sell his large frame... But a 20" frame is too much for my 32" inside leg.

This is where my body shape may be weird IIRC I have a "short torso". As you may know Enigma size you up for their frames with very specific mesuring. Mark advised me to get the medium with my body measurements. Now, Ego's only came in three sizes, small 15", medium 17.5" and large 19", but they use similar geo to the old Kona geo so have long top tubes - hence I have a 17.5.

Becuase of the short torso issue it make my legs look long on a bike. I have the same issue on road bikes - I ride a 57, and for my height people say well, thats fine. Then they see me on the bike and say "oh, isn't that small? Your knees are up in the air..."

I'm beginning to wonder whether with the sizing as I should just sell it an buy another similar bike in the sales.

Sigh

If you can pick it up you're welcome to borrow, put it back together it and experiment Stan, I'm certainly not going to be able to ride it for a while 🙁

If you can pick it up you're welcome to borrow, put it back together it and experiment Stan, I'm certainly not going to be able to ride it for a while

Cheers, let me sleep on it. I'm in the frame of mind to say to hell with it and click on the (Large) anthem advanced 27.5 2 I wanted anyway.

hmmm (again)

[img] [/img]

Don't really understand why you'd go 650b if it's for proper xc races.

It's for trails at the weekend, and I want to be able to relax and pootle on it more than id race on in Blobby. For short Xc races for example Beastway I'd use the Enigma. For the Bontrager 24 solos where I value the comfort of FS I want a machine in the shed that isn't a 30lb welsh trail centre slayer but is light/right enough for endurance races but is mostly good on my local forest singletrack.

An anthem fits that bill no? Albeit perhaps the alloy XT one at £250 less might be e better bet for that?

It is also a very average spec on an ok frame considering the cost. A large Anthem will only have a 1cm shorter effective top tube length than a large Yeti but both will fit more or less the same when you take the slack STA on the Yeti in to account (i.e. similar if not identical reach).... and you reckon the large Yeti is too big...

But a 20" frame is too much for my 32" inside leg.

It is rubbish to judge frame size by the seat tube length, so long as the saddle can be raised or lowered enough to get the saddle height right. The standover height is ~1cm different between the medium and large Yeti frames so that would be no concern either.

I'm beginning to wonder whether with the sizing as I should just sell it an buy another similar bike in the sales.

Purely judging by the quick photo it does look like the saddle should go up and you should be on a longer frame. If I were you I'd be very tempted to try the Large Yeti and go from there, probably closely followed by a proper bike fit to avoid buying yet another bike which may or may not fit you well

So assuming i get the sizing right, what 26lb bike should I consider if the Anthem is just "average"? Forget budget for a minute, lets just talk about the "right type of bike" for my given use above?

seat tube doesnt dictate standover height on swoopy top-tubed frames so not sure why a 20" would be too high for you?

I'm 5'10" (ie. shorter than you) with a 32" inseam (ie. same as you) and never considered myself to have a short/small torso.

From that top photo the bike looks too small (which might well be aggravated by camera angle looking down on you) and the saddle too low (which isnt influenced by camera angle), as if youve set it up to play around a trail centre not race an endurance event. Did Hora help you? 🙂

too much travel on your bike, sell it, buy a 100mm f+r 29er

[URL= http://i1272.photobucket.com/albums/y394/dansipods2/ScreenShot2014-07-11at143427_zpsae825770.pn g" target="_blank">http://i1272.photobucket.com/albums/y394/dansipods2/ScreenShot2014-07-11at143427_zpsae825770.pn g"/> [/IMG][/URL]

In my last race, last month, the chap who won in my age category rode a real old school steel frame with steel forks, straight alu bars and cantis. Just saying like.

You missed out the most important detail, the secret to this guys success... what wheel size was he using?

and what colour was it??? 😀

Kryton - So, it was you I was shouting "KRYTONNNNN" at for the first bit of the 24/12...

In the roll call thread you said you were gonna be on a white Yeti with a blue helmet. So, when I saw you I said to my mate 'ah that must be that Kryton bloke off that STW forum thing. I'll shout his name out.....'

"KRYTONNNNNNN..........OI, KRYTOOONNNNNNNN".
"Oh, weird, can't be him. Must be someone else with a white Yeti and a blue helmet"
Next Lap.....
"Ooooh, there's that bloke again. Not seen anyone else matching the white Yeti and blue helmet description"
"KRYTONNNNNNN..........OI, KRYTOOONNNNNNNN".
"Hmmmm, can't be him....."

From this experience, I can conclude you should forget the new bike and get some Hopi ear candles instead..... 😀

What can I say, I get very focused during my race start process...

I don't remember hearing that - was I also wearing a blue top?

Re the bike size;

So the Large Anthem is only 15mm longer in the TT, and has a 0.8 degree steeper seat tube to offset some of that. The seat tube, which you are saying is inappropriate is 1.2" longer.

For a Camber comp Evo large, the seat tube is the same and the TT only 15mm longer also.

If that same picture above was me on the Anthem or Camber, you'd hardly notice it was any bigger from that distance?

So surely, the "bike is too small" comments reflect on such a small difference - probably less than 15mm in the TT - to be effective surely?

Or have I missed something?

Ah, its clicked. When I bought the bike it had a 100mm stem on it. I reduced it to 80mm. Its also got and inch of spacers under the stem. Maybe I should revert back to 100mm - what effect would lowering the stem make?

Kryton...similar/same top as you have in that pic...

It was within the first few hrs of the race just after the start where you do a few twiddles, then onto a short straight section before doubling back and heading over the green felted bridge.
We were camping on that straight section next to a massive motor home...

We'll shout louder next yr! 😀

OK, IMO (and this is not actual fact).....

I agree with amedias, in that you are expecting the size gains to make the difference.....

YOU ARE A WEIGHT WEENY ! 😳 ( NO need)

and mrblobby is wrong..... 29ers Do look wrong ( yes i know they are fast etc) but they are gay!.....

wwaswas is spot on.... just ride your bike and enjoy it. Upgrade if you want to.... 😉

I have a Trigger 29. Now all intend to change is one of the N rather than go N+1.

Will I die?

I used to have an Asr5c that I got down to about 23.5 lbs ish (and a ti 456 at around 23lb). So got to a similar place really.

I think the biggest change to the yeti came when I built a set of dt240 light bike carbon wheels with revs. Came in at 1400g a set but the flow like width gave the bike great speed and stability for trail riding too.

I however got the 29er itch and tried a ti fireline evo which i really liked (& got teased into by a good deal). It's Currently around 23.5lb so 29ers don't have to weigh massively more. Must admit carbon rims help here tho.

Finally the tooing and froing between the 26" yeti & 29" fireline was quite an adjustment to make. I became so impressed at what the fire line could do that the 29" fs itch was too much when I spotted a deal on the Spider 29 comp. I'm still getting used to it tbh but it is amazingly capable and versatile. In Lt mode the 127mm rear and 29" wheels are up to anything I can tackle in the UK. The bike is light enough at 25lb (pikes, reverb, x01, lb carbon rims) to tackle most climbs and big days out.

I'm currently playing with the 115mm setting on the spider and its proving quite nippy and squirty. Not quite as pert as the yeti but pretty good. Mind you I still have to play with shock pressures at the shorter setting. Could also shorten the pikes too I guess.

I also looked at the divinci atlas, codeine and quite fancied the latest banshee phantom iirc if it helps.

I bought an Orange five29 recently, selling or sold all my other bikes. I have far more fun on that bike than I would on a lightweight bike. Probably 29lbs.

For the benefit of the ongoing piss take I'm going to live with the yeti, funds don't allow a new bike.

I am experimenting with a £12 20mm layback seatpost though in an attempt to lengthen the cockpit, and have lowered the stem - 5mm spacer a over the ht only.

It'll have to do for now.