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If I was in that 'hypothetical' scenario I would just drive the 3 miles and if I was caught driving I would just say I was going to the supermarket. Not difficult is it.
Well using the Irish model I quoted I’d use the exception;
for vital family reasons, such as providing care to children, elderly or vulnerable people, and in particular for those who live alone, but excluding social family visits
And if you are asked you would have to explain why you have an exemption, the idea of keeping things wide open just in case of some exceptionally rare set of occurrences where someone is uncomfortable explaining their exception is a tad bizarre
It’s really not that difficult to write clear rules, btw my buffoon comment was at our legislators not those having to deal with cack-handed restrictions
It's a shame some people lack the common sense to sensibly apply "guidance". I mean it's only an example of "Rule 1" isn't it? "It's in the guidance but it's not law" is another one. So if it was in the law would you comply? No? I thought not.
A few of my friends are impacted by being on the coast, one couple face a lake and friends have big hills with no paths behind their place, all in the south west of Ireland. They just seem to get on with it and don’t moan about it – that’s not in anyway a dig at you.
Wasn't taken as one, no worries - I'm taking that position almost as Devil's advocate, that even if you did absolutely legislate there's always an argument someone will make if they are of that mind. As I said, in spite of a lack of common sense in the minority, I'm STILL in favour of common sense / rule 1, call it what you want, so that the majority can continue knuckling under and being sensible.
The types that will find the loopholes will do it whether they're loopholes in guidance or legislation regardless.
I think if anything is clear here it's that the guidance hasn't been clearly communicated to the public. I'm seeing the same discussion over and over again on FB and nobody appears to be aware of the definition of local area. Putting it in the small print for a tiny minority to read is not really helpful. The only reason I'm aware of it is because of discussions on here and the fact there's a good proportion of people on here nerdy enough to spend the time digging this info out, including myself.
Don't know any details but apparently police have been handing out fines to people from Leeds parking up in Horton in Ribblesdale to go walking.
I was going to drive to walk the dog but I cant get the car out as its been blocked in by people coming to walk here as the local little nature reserve has closed its car park!!
Don’t know any details but apparently police have been handing out fines to people from Leeds parking up in Horton in Ribblesdale to go walking.
Peak District pretty busy this lunch time. Out on the bike for 90 minute spin from Sheffield and never seen as many cars parked up on Stoney Ridge Road by Fox House. Would have been like shooting fish in a barrel had the police decided to take a drive out. Not going to judge though as fortunate to live on the edge of the countryside.
martinhutch - You have no problem with the police apparently enforcing guidance as if it were the law? You welcome that? Unless of course it's nothing to do with the Covid restrictions and they're actually fining them for their illegal parking. Shit like this diminishes trust in the police.
Quoting from Derbyshire polices statement yesterday after they had been reprimanded for trying to enforce guidance "UK Government guidance strongly requests that people do not leave their local area. However, the Covid Regulations which officers enforce and which enables them to issue FPNs for breaches, do not restrict the distance travelled for exercise."
I live in a small rural Cotswold village of around 20houses.... & I run the village shop.
The village is regularly in top 10 best places to walk in national newspapers and magazines. As a result we get a fair few walkers during normal circumstances.
We have had people visit from all over the UK throughout all of the lockdowns. Birmingham, London, Bristol, Wales etc.
Today there are around 60 visitor cars in and around the village (the local land owner has planning for a public car park it gets so bad in the summer months).
I have no qualms about 'local' people using the countryside during the pandemic, but I do find it particularly vexing when they use the shop for coffee etc.
It's one thing, just going for a walk, it's another using all of the local services.
I've also notice a dramatic increase (compared to the first lockdown) of groups of people of different house holds meeting up and walking together over the last week or so.
Ive not gone propper "are you local?" Yet, but do think I may go full royston vasey at some point.
martinhutch – You have no problem with the police apparently enforcing guidance as if it were the law? You welcome that? Unless of course it’s nothing to do with the Covid restrictions and they’re actually fining them for their illegal parking. Shit like this diminishes trust in the police.
Bullshit. Horton is an hour and a half's drive from Leeds and in a different county. There are numerous places on the outskirts of Leeds where people from the city can exercise. Exercise does not constitute a reasonable excuse for someone from Leeds being there. That's the law, not guidance.
I think if anything is clear here it’s that the guidance hasn’t been clearly communicated to the public. I’m seeing the same discussion over and over again on FB and nobody appears to be aware of the definition of local area.
I believe that the reason for this is that it doesn't really matter that much.
At least compared to closing schools, stopping indoor mixing and getting people vaccinated.
And the more precise the rules on how far you can go to exercise are, the more people they'll end up unintentionally excluding.
FWIW my local hill was way quieter than immediately before lockdown this morn.
Ive not gone propper “are you local?” Yet, but do think I may go full royston vasey at some point.
I understand why in this current state people don't want "non locals" in "their area" but do you worry that if the Royston Vasey approach was taken businesses would risk alienating themselves further down the line?
Now that the virus is everywhere, I don’t see the need to ask people to stay local. It made sense last spring, but not now.
If it’s to save a few RTAs, why are they not asking us to walk rather than drive to the shop/work if we can?
do you worry that if the Royston Vasey approach was taken businesses would risk alienating themselves further down the line?
As he owns the local shop, presume he's considered this 😆
Local country park was very very busy again today. Little in the way of obvious household mixing, but pretty hard to keep 2 metres apart on the trails.
Like in lockdown 1, it feels "easier" to ride on the road at the moment.
Exercise does not constitute a reasonable excuse for someone from Leeds being there. That’s the law, not guidance.
Seriously, do we have to go round this loop yet again? It is not a requirement under the law to remain local for exercise, and even Derbyshire Police now accept this under guidance issued by the NPCC which states:
"UK Government guidance strongly requests that people do not leave their local area. However, the Covid Regulations which officers enforce and which enables them to issue FPNs for breaches, do not restrict the distance travelled for exercise".
You may not like people travelling out of their local area (whatever that is) for exercise. You may consider that they should follow the guidance. But you are simply wrong to state it is the law.
Now that the virus is everywhere
Simplicity isn’t always your friend. It isn’t “everywhere”, despite being all over the country. It may well not be in a village 20 miles from you, but be in your household. There is more reason to take care not to spread the virus now, than in the Spring. We are in a much worse position right now, and people should be taking that on board, rather than looking for excuses. We’re only months away from being in a much better position… let’s get there with as many people alive and in without damaged health as possible.
Peak District pretty busy this lunch time. Out on the bike for 90 minute spin from Sheffield and never seen as many cars parked up on Stoney Ridge Road by Fox House.
Bit further over, out the back of Lyme Park (just on the Derbyshire/Cheshire border) there's a narrow lane, one or two houses along it and a notice that says that anyone parking there will be ticketed for obstruction.
There's usually half a dozen cars in a little layby but today it was rammed, people parked along the lane for a distance of 1/4 mile each side of the layby. Lot of frustrated people driving along it met by a car coming the other way. Glad I was on the bike, I could just nip through and avoid all the road rage.
do you worry that if the Royston Vasey approach was taken businesses would risk alienating themselves further down the line?
Exactly why I don't do it. I don't know all of the 'locals' from every village in the area - it's only in conversation I've managed to get where people are from. Some customers this year live less than a mile away but I'd never met as they'd usually be in an office or similar.
Still it pisses me off though - being a rural location, we've a disproportionate amount of elderly customers who are within the higher risk catagoary. Also my wife/daughter and I are living apart (again) as wife is in the shielding catagary. It the only way we can keep the shop open and her safe. The way I see it, travel is one big factor of how and why this thing spreads.
We literally had residents scared to leave their homes today because there were that many 'tourists' parked out side their houses and walking around the village.
Like I said I've no issue with people coming to the area, it's much nicer than walking around a culdasac. But theirs no reason to park in the middle of the village and use the local facilities before/after your hour exercise - that just increases risk for everyone.
The covid hotspots in my area are the towns and city's surrounding us, our area is well below the UK average. But 'locals' driving out of town to us for a walk/visit to the shop are coming from a higher risk area.
It may well not be in a village 20 miles from you, but be in your household
Possibly, but I’m not going to give it to that village by driving or cycling through it. That’ll be the people coming from that village to shop in our supermarket or work in our town, or more likely coming to visit someone.
I’ll continue not to drive to ride, as per Welsh rules, but ride through that village quite happily, also in line with our rules. But that doesn’t mean the exercise rules aren’t a little silly, which is why people are ignoring them.
And once they ignore one rule, they’re more likely to ignore other ones too.
So you’d think the government would think the rules through a bit more carefully.
So when you said…
Now that the virus is everywhere, I don’t see the need to ask people to stay local.
…you didn’t mean it?
…you didn’t mean it?
🤷♂️ Not sure what you’re getting at.
Likewise.
I like to take a coffee with me if when I go for a ride or a walk.
As a direct result of this thread I took a coffee on a walk this morning. What a revelation. Once again, thanks STW.
Much quieter in the more touristy core of the New Forest today but very very busy in the urban fringe type dog walker car parks around the edge.
the touristy core has been rammed with cars overflowing the car parks, parking all over the verges and blocking narrow roads for months.
But ‘locals’ driving out of town to us for a walk/visit to the shop are coming from a higher risk area.
I'm astonished so many people seem to struggle with this fairly fundamental point behind the "stay local" thing.
I am still amazed at the amount of people posting in facebook groups being miles out of any description of local riding.
Special mention to the guy on a scottish mtb group today talking about the first time he has visited an area (close to Glasgow) and comparing to the place he was last weekend (dunkeld) but lives in Edinburgh....
I hope he punctures both tyres but only has 1 inner tube.
Went for a local ride yesterday and today. It's nothing like back in March, there is as much traffic as a normal day. In reality, it's not that the rules are hard to understand, it's that people are now tired of doing it.
yit’s not that the rules are hard to understand
Tell that to Derbyshire police
Reports on a local FB group today of a family who'd driven to Dovedale (Peak District) for a walk.
From 96 miles away.
Personally I think that probably falls outside the definition of "local" but apparently not...
I hope he punctures both tyres but only has 1 inner tube.
The ultimate cycling insult!
Short local road ride today, was between 5-7 miles from Derby city centre - roads definitely quieter than usual, pretty much back to first lockdown levels.
Loads of families doing the three mile loop on the lanes between my home village and the next one - both villages have a takeaway coffee outlet and they looked to have done a roaring trade, to the disgust of some on here.
2 laps yesterday, 3 laps today of a local road circuit of ca 15km which keeps me no more than about 3.5km from home.
Roads were quiet but not deserted by any stretch; a few other cyclists and a few walkers where the common lands cross my route but pretty quiet. The odd sleet/snow flurry might have assisted with that.
The new coffee shack up Rivi has been doing a roaring trade, judging by the crowds there and the cups discarded along George's Lane.
What kind of morons live in Wales but choose to drive to England to MTB?
Well they live closer to FOD than I do living nr Gloucester.... & I'd say FOD is my local trail center.
That said I wouldnt go there for a ride at the moment.
Reports of a large group of motorcross bikes ripping up the bike trails in Grizedale Forest today, apparently no number plates on them so must have driven there in vans. Idiots seem unable to stop being idiots.
Let's say I rode 10 miles from my door, on the road then did a 12 mile offroad loop then rode the 10 miles back. Then let's say I was short of time one day so instead of riding that 10 miles I drove it in my car. One is adhering to the guidelines and the other is not but which one has more risk? The one where I cycle along a road with other cars for an hour or the one where I drive in a massive steel box with many safety features.
the one with the car usage. Cars are dangerous in themselves and there is the additional ( albeit small) risk attached to filling up with petrol etc
there will always be anomalies if you look for them but its better not to try to find them?
Reports of a large group of motorcross bikes ripping up the bike trails in Grizedale Forest today, apparently no number plates on them so must have driven there in vans. Idiots seem unable to stop being idiots.
fairly sure it'll be the same ones i saw at the coppermines at coniston, 4 of them went up the footpath i'd just come down from walna scar direction. later as i descended back to the coppermines from tilberthwaite i could see a lot of fresh moterbike tyre marks and also some when i descended back down to torver(which weren't there on my way up earlier)
there was a discussion about it on one of the lake district MTB facebook pages but it seems to have dissaperaead.
in response to jekkyl's post, i drove the 10 miles to torver for my ride, much safer than riding up that road and as there is no need to stop for anything on a jouney that short no risk.
Let’s say I rode 10 miles from my door, on the road then did a 12 mile offroad loop then rode the 10 miles back.
I'm guessing the 32miles would take more than an hour?
Cearphilly isn't closer to the Forest than Gloucester by a long way surely? More to the point, they could have ridden from home which is where the Welsh have to start isn't it.
The locals here were most pleased when the notification of those Welsh lads being sent home was published. Even so, yesterday there were hundreds of people completely ignoring any ruling, just going for a walk.
I’m guessing the 32miles would take more than an hour?
What's that got to do with the price of fish?
Length of time spent out and about, out of your house. Although there are currently no limits on how long you can exercise for, a 32mile ride will take longer than a 12mile. This increase the risks to yourself and others.
Common sense - that thing the government keeps saying we have.
Cearphilly isn’t closer to the Forest than Gloucester by a long way surely?
Depends on where, I'm on the other side of Gloucester, so to be fair it's about the same distance/car time as them. Other than the 417project, FOD and Swinley are my nearest trail centers and take me the same amount of time to get too.
It might be simpler to specify excercise from home. So no driving. Anything else results in endless debate and rule twisting. It's supposed to be about excercise, not meeting for a take away coffee, bird watching or trail centres. The two local water parks near me which would normally be one of the places we would walk (frome home) are always rammed as people arrive in cars. If you have to get the car out it's not local.