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How far are you allowed to drive to visit a garden centre and how long are you allowed to spend there?
Exercise clearly isn't the only activity that needs clarification, or stricter social distancing requirements
FWIW I just saw this snippet on the BBC
“I think the really important thing to realise is that not very much infection spreads outside the home at all so clamping down on people exercising outside is not likely to affect infection spread," she said.
“There’s a huge difference between indoors and outdoors - and as long as people keep their social distance that’s a much less risky situation."
Attributed to Lucy Yardley, a professor of health psychology at the Universities of Bristol and Southampton who participates in SAGE.
How far are you allowed to drive to visit a garden centre and how long are you allowed to spend there?
Common sense would say your nearest one only and as short a time as possible.....
Simple. What you can do just because the gov doest have the balls to put it into law is irrelevant. The gov's attitude is use common sense, which we've found clearly is lacking in a good proportion of the population.
Attributed to Lucy Yardley
Which is more risky, spending 2weeks at home with the family, or the family all going out side for different exercise regimes each day?
Every time we go somewhere or do something it increases the risk, the more times you do it the more risk. Just because lots of people are still going to work it doesn't mean we should all increase risks.
Which is more risky, spending 2weeks at home with the family, or the family all going out side for different exercise regimes each day?
I'd say the latter is better. Getting some fresh air and exercise will be better than staying couped up all day. As long as you maintain social distance when out, of course. Being overweight and unhealthy is a major factor with covid.
You'd have more chance of catching Covid with the latter, and bringing it home, than becoming overweight or developing any long term health conditions with a reduced exercise programme in the <6months it's currently projected to get the vaccine.
Personally I think the common sense approach doing the minimum exercise for health and mental reasons. I'm not going out of my way to get on a bike daily and cirtainly (when I have managed to get out in the past year), have been riding from home and not trying to improve my skills or do anything risky.
For example we had a family of four drive from their village to ours at the weekend for a walk. They could have walked from home for almost exactly the same walk (it would have added 1/2 a mile each way). Just by getting in the car that's an additional risk, visiting another village is another risk and going in that villages shop is yet a further. If everyone from the area did this the national risk is massively increased.
I did a short drive to the local spot for a ride in an area which attracts walkers and cyclists and was surprised how few parked cars there were, turned out it must have been because it was -4 degrees at 0900am, when I left to go home around 1300 the car park and laybys on the road where busier then I've seen them in the last 6 weeks!
You’d have more chance of catching Covid with the latter, and bringing it home, than becoming overweight or developing any long term health conditions with a reduced exercise programme in the <6months it’s currently projected to get the vaccine.
I'd be interested to see your evidence. This pandemic has been going on for over a year and will be with us for another year. Underlying health conditions are a major factor, outdoor transmission is not.
Feel free to stick to your "common sense" approach, I think it's important to realise we all have different circumstances, so if that works for you then great. Some would rather listen experts such as a professor of health psychology at the Universities of Bristol and Southampton who participates in SAGE.
Personal differences also come into it.
For instance there's me. I admit I'm an exercise obsessive and I'll go out on my bike to investigate "local" woods (7 miles away up a level 4 hill according to Strava) and roam and prat about in the slop without a care in the world. I'll also quite happily go out to a cold cold garage, accept having to move a car, relocate all sorts of things and spend 20 minutes setting up so that I can do a bodyweight/calisthenics workout.
My wife however does not have the sheer bloody-mindedness to do that, she knows that she needs to do exercise for both physical and mental health and badly wants too but in common with most people if given the choice between a 7 mile ride on the roads which is dangerous enough and then slogging through mud OR staying on the sofa watching daytime TV, she'll choose the TV. I also don't particularly want her riding her bike about in a suburban environment as chances are some low-life scumbag will decide to knock her off the bike and nick it.
Getting in a car, going to a trail center (PBA in the FoD) and riding the blue trail, getting in the car and driving home again is the only way she WILL get her exercise, she can do it, she enjoys it, she needs it. Yes, there are alternatives BUT they're not alternatives that she would actually use. PS. No need to stop for petrol either as it's an EV.
The local footpaths and dog walking routes out of our door are absolutely rammed with people at the moment. I'm still trying to find a time of day that I can take the dogs out without having to veer wildly about, zig zag back and forth in order to avoid all the families with their tiny little virus vectors zipping about on scooters screaming their delight and pathogens into the air.
Personal differences also come into it.
Completely agree. The "I can do it, so anyone can do it" attitude has popped up a few times on this thread. Time for a bit of empathy (I can do it, so anyone can do it 🙂 )
as long as people keep their social distance that’s a much less risky situation.”
And therein lies the key to the problem. The 2 metre rule was totally forgotten when pubs reopened but still was a requirement.
I can see an argument that the outdoor areas of garden centres are "relatively" safe if everyone properly stayed 2 metres apart, and the mental health benefits to garden obsessed retired people like my mum would be huge.
ou’d have more chance of catching Covid with the latter, and bringing it home
Clearly you would have more chance of catching it by leaving your house but what are the chances?
If I go for a solo ride at 8am and don't see another person what are my chances in that scenario?
Unless I go within a metre of someone else who sneezes in my face the chances of me catching anything when outside are zero.
Worth remembering at this point that you can still go to a garden centre, can still have tradesmen around your house etc,. so worrying about a 0.00001% risk of catching it when out solo exercising is not a worthwhile activity.
I think it’s important to realise we all have different circumstances
100% agree, but it's also important to realise that with those differences, come differences in risk.
One other reason I've reduced my interaction with people generally at the weekend is because I work in shop, I see 100's of different people a day, everyday mon-fri, so the chance of being asymptotic will be higher than someone who works in an office with 3 others.
If exercise daily is a necessity, than it's fine as long as people are aware of the risk associated. But also it's fine not too.
Clearly you would have more chance of catching it by leaving your house but what are the chances?
Small, but multiply that chance by 1000s when everyone else does it....
It's like littering, throwing away a piece of litter is a small personal decision with little impact on its own, but when billions of others do it we have a sea filled with plastic.
as long as people keep their social distance that’s a much less risky situation.”
And therein lies the key to the problem. The 2 metre rule was totally forgotten when pubs reopened but still was a requirement.
That is largely the point of this thread isn't it? It is way easier to keep that social distance if you head a bit further into the countryside. It is possible in my local park but you need to weave all over the place and keep hopping off the path onto the grass (which now looks like the Somme). Is it best to stay very local and risk closer interaction, or head a bit out and reduce that risk. IMO there isn't a single answer as we all have different circumstances, but as a generally principle either is potentially fine
Yeah but what is happening is that people are using this as an excuse for a nice day out.
Drive for sometimes quite a long way to go to "the countryside" and, because no-one has any imagination, they all head to the same tourist honeypot areas. Park anywhere - on a grass verge, down a narrow lane - faff around for a while then head up the same hill as 400 other people in a Superdry jacket and some Primark trousers.
Wonder why you're suddenly freezing cold, lost, your phone battery is only at 10% so decide to call out Mountain Rescue who take ages to reach you because you haven't got a clue where you are and also there's 400 cars parked all along the road and nothing can get through.
20-odd volunteers have to sit there in close proximity, work as a team, use up a ****ton of PPE to rescue a few idiots, one of whom then needs an ambulance to go to hospital where they sit there in A&E for 6hrs surrounded by hordes of other morons who've done the same thing because each one of them is thinking "oh but it's outdoors and it's safe".
The argument about "outdoor transmission is very unlikely" is true. Up until the point that thousands of people are driving to the countryside, having car accidents on winter roads in the process, getting lost, relying on Mountain Rescue or all descending on the one coffee shack that's still open and then milling around together (however unintentionally).
I’m guessing the 32miles would take more than an hour?
Exactly what I did yesterday, but entirely on the road, didn't get close to anyone, saw more bikes out than I had before Christmas... I'd still judge the risk of exposure as being far lower than recieving a delivery from Amazon at home.
Which is more risky, spending 2weeks at home with the family, or the family all going out side for different exercise regimes each day?
Every time we go somewhere or do something it increases the risk, the more times you do it the more risk. Just because lots of people are still going to work it doesn’t mean we should all increase risks.
False choice though innit, like it or not you will have to spend time stuck at home with your immediate family. Part of what makes that work though is being able to get out and exercise, we've been on family walks and individual rides and runs, picking times/routes, taking masks and hand gel etc to minimise the risk of interaction with other people and have ways of dealing with any potential contact risks...
The truth is there is no zero risk scenario for most people, the best you can do is plan and formulate contingencies.
About time!
Edit - this is in relation to the police being in Peaslake this weekend
Length of time spent out and about, out of your house. Although there are currently no limits on how long you can exercise for, a 32mile ride will take longer than a 12mile. This increase the risks to yourself and others.
Common sense – that thing the government keeps saying we have.
But your common sense has failed to see the key factor in risk versus benefit. In the cycketotrailhead scenario the guy is getting approximately twice the exercise compared to the drive scenario. The benefit us much higher. Which pushes the balance in favour of cycling there...
Press reporting exercise will be limited soon. Let's hope there is some clarity, e.g. only from home, no travelling and upto 1 hour, or within a set distance.
Hope everyone has this handy!
https://www.calcmaps.com/map-radius/
The 'Gove Hour' could be a bit of a bummer, though.
But your common sense has failed to see the key factor in risk versus benefit. In the cycketotrailhead scenario the guy is getting approximately twice the exercise compared to the drive scenario. The benefit us much higher.
Depends on what the end goal is - stopping the virus so that millions can all get back to normal exercise regimes, or one person getting/maintaining fitness levels?
The benefit of one or many?
Press reporting exercise will be limited soon. Let’s hope there is some clarity, e.g. only from home, no travelling and upto 1 hour, or within a set distance.
Well, I hope it’s a “no driving to exercise” restriction rather than a distance or time one. It takes me an hour of pedalling to even start clearing my head of the amount of stress it accumulates at home at the moment.
Hope everyone has this handy!
five miles covers 95% of the mtb/run routes I tend to use.
Depends on what the end goal is – stopping the virus so that millions can all get back to normal exercise regimes, or one person getting/maintaining fitness levels?
But then cycling along a road isn’t really an issue in direct transmission. Travel introduces two factors: distance (the further people travel, the faster a virus can propagate, via interactions at its new location) and potential for load o health services (and it’s not a simple discussion as to whether that’s greater if you cycle along a road with the potential to be hit by someone, or drive along it with the potential to hit someone else—whether they’re on a bike or on foot or in a car).
Ultimately it’s sound advice to get some exercise, and unless you’re descending on popular hotspots or meeting with others, road cycling at least is a pretty good way of dispersing a population such that a lot of health-beneficial exercise takes place for a very low level of interaction. (Compared to packing everyone into local parks etc). I was out for two hours of road and bridleways yesterday and came within a bidon’s throw of two people, both of whom were passed without delay and at well over two metres.
That radius tool is interesting, I ran for 20 miles over the weekend and didn't leave that radius, but I did cross a county line. Was out for more then a hour too.
Allowed?
Boris cycling 7 miles from home makes the news - it’ll be interesting to see if this results in any clarifications:
7.5 mile radius announced later this week then.
7.5 mile radius announced later this week then.
Bad news, just checked with my handy radius thingy - London Stadium is only just over five miles out from Whitehall...
Well, I hope it’s a “no driving to exercise” restriction rather than a distance or time one. It takes me an hour of pedalling to even start clearing my head of the amount of stress it accumulates at home at the moment.
If it was summer I woudn't mind swapping my 2x 3.5hr p/week rides for 7 x 1hr but washing muddy clothes and cleaning my drivetrain everyday of the week would become a right pain.
That radius tool is interesting, I ran for 20 miles over the weekend and didn’t leave that radius, but I did cross a county line. Was out for more then a hour too.
Allowed?
My house effectively straddles a county border so I would hope that's permissible. Otherwise the X mile radius would be severely restrictive for folks like me.
My lunchtime ride today was within a 5 mile radius!
About a third of my circle is shit for road riding, but fairly well served with trails on that side, so variety beckons.
It strikes me that exercise is the least of the Covid worries from a transmission perspective.
Would think closing nurseries should be top of the list as well as cutting down the amount of kids still in schools. Plus making sure existing rules are being followed. Our little girl is self isolating here at home after a member of staff tested positive for Covid at her nursery.....whilst kids don’t generally get sick they’re good at passing it onto other households no doubt.
When I have my daughter I have to drive to exercise. I need to go 25 miles to pick her up with our bikes in the back of the car. I couldn't then ride with her to the local quiet spot as she is 10 and I'm not letting her ride on an A road to get there, so I drive to my local woods, for which I have an annual parking pass and a family riding pass.
Update from Matty Hancock. Exercise with one other person is still ok. Just one, and need stay 2m apart. Also 7 miles is ok for local exercise (cited as an example, not a maximum)
Hancock again quoting guidance as if it's law. Staying 2m apart from someone you're exercising with is probably a good idea but there's no actual requirement for it.
You are allowed to follow advice you know. Politicians can tell you that they think following the guidance is worth doing, and why. It’s not a “be as much of a transmission risk as possible within the law” competition.
When I have my daughter I have to drive to exercise. I need to go 25 miles to pick her up with our bikes in the back of the car. I couldn’t then ride with her to the local quiet spot as she is 10 and I’m not letting her ride on an A road to get there, so I drive to my local woods, for which I have an annual parking pass and a family riding pass.
Go for a walk then 🤦🏻♂️
That radius tool is interesting,
It is, my local 30 mile loop is all within a 5 mile radius (well, if I put my gravel tyres on it is)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-55625062
Jessica Allen and Eliza Moore were walking at Foremark Reservoir, Derbyshire, when they were stopped by officers and fined £200 each.
At the time Derbyshire Police insisted driving to exercise was "not in the spirit" of the most recent lockdown.
But new national guidance for police has led the force to quash the fines, and apologise to the women.
The two friends travelled the short distance to the reservoir from their homes in Ashby-de-la-Zouch, Leicestershire, on Wednesday afternoon.
Just had a play with that calcmap.
I'd need a 15 mile radius to cover what I'd consider local riding from my door. 5 miles would be terrible. Takes about 7 to get to the nearest decent hill.
It's all academic anyway for the moment as I'm recovering from Covid.
I think a few are confusing "exercise" with "getting a decent ride in" again
At this time of year I'm doing short local stuff. The 7 mile radius pretty much covers anything I want to do right now and 5 miles isn't too shabby.
Just had a play with that calcmap.
I’d need a 15 mile radius to cover what I’d consider local riding from my door. 5 miles would be terrible. Takes about 7 to get to the nearest decent hill.
I guess I'm relatively lucky. I had a play with calcmap and a 5 mile radius gets me to Swinley, TunnelHill/Mytchett, Porridgepot, Frith, Minley. I can live with that.
Rest up rollindoughnut … dry trails when you get to back to biking … fingers crossed.
Thanks Kelvin. Going from riding 15hrs/wk to nothing has very much pulled the rug out from under my feet. I've always scoffed at people talking about needing to ride for their mental health, but I must admit to suffering from some pretty wild mood swings now I'm deprived of my routine.