[quote=deviant ]likewise when cycling the odd one comes over out of curiosity and seeing as i like them i often stop and talk to the owner and give the dog a little scratch and play...again, never been attacked.
Lucky, lucky you. I was riding down a track minding my own business when I was attacked by a dog 20-30m away from it's owner. I was just out for a ride, not a dog petting exercise, though not sure what difference it would have made being a dog lover (apparently I should have warned her as she was deaf to the racket I was making kicking up loose stones) - dog clearly knew I was coming and seemed friendly enough which is why I wan't prepared. Just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it doesn't happen (check out stats for dog attacks, it's a massive problem).
i hate cyclists....generally they're all pricks!
If I was going to stupidly generalise I could say the same about dog owners - but actually the majority are very friendly and pleasant and do control their dogs, so it clearly is possible.
Just looking at it from another side based on all information you have provided in this thread.
I'm sorry for your injuries but seriously, get over it.We all fall off bikes all the time (or at least I do).
Hora wrote: The accident wouldn't have happened if the dog was under proper control. Is that hard to accept?
Don't feed these people,Hora. He thinks I just.. fell off my bike. He is either trolling or hasn't read that I was knocked to the ground face first by a dog out of control. It's not worth trying to reason with people that can't evaluate the whole scenario.
Its funny that on here a car driver not seeing a cyclist/hazard because of the dark is never an accepted excuse. They should drive for the conditions, expect the unexpected etc.
The hypocrisy of some cyclists really makes me laugh. Some really do think they can do no wrong, are always correct and should never be held accountable for their actions.
Dog lover here, but.
All those saying 'accidents will happen' and that if there is a dog running about off the lead then there is a danger you aren't going to see it in the dark and hit it..... Just one of those things, well why in God's name are you bringing the dog down to the path in the first place? Talk about engineering an entirely foreseeable 'accident' An uncontrolled dog in the dark on a cyclepath represents an obvious hazard. Are you too stupid or selfish to realise that you can do something about that? My sympathies are with Martin and the dog.
[quote=iolo ]EDIT: one thing I don't get on this story. The dog was behind the other bike so you didn't see it. Why would it suddenly decide, at the very last minute, to launch itself kamikase style at your bike? Or was the dog just always there and you just didn't see it?
Have you really never seen a dog run kamikaze style across a path in front of things? 😯
Rene, scroll. I was riding towards another rider approx 7-10mph. Driving or riding for the conditions? Please. I've got the Garmin file to prove my speed and was no way speeding. I finished my ride, stopped the Garmin, reset and was recording the final jaunt back to the car just for miles. It was a headwind. slow paced.
I think there is an argument to say that if you see a dog on a shared path you should slow right down to mitigate the chance of collision. Certainly I often come across dogs off leads and surprisingly enough I've never been knocked off once.
I'm sure the usual suspects will tell me that this is irelivant and the cyclist is never to blame however...
As for comparing this situation to one where a dog runs out on the road, the 2 aren't comparable. I know this as when my mate got knocked off (in holyrood park) the insurance company tried to argue that it wasn't a public highway as it was in a park, and as such the cyclist was expected to show reasonable care and attention. When his lawyer pointed out it was clearly a 'road' they did a swift uturn on their stance and paid out.
Why would it suddenly decide, at the very last minute, to launch itself kamikase style at your bike?
Errr.. Because it's a dog? I would say it is pretty much SOP for breeds like Springers.
Dog lover here, but.All those saying 'accidents will happen' and that if there is a dog running about off the lead then there is a danger you aren't going to see it in the dark and hit it..... Just one of those things, well why in God's name are you bringing the dog down to the path in the first place? Talk about engineering an entirely foreseeable 'accident' An uncontrolled dog in the dark on a cyclepath represents an obvious hazard. Are you too stupid or selfish to realise that you can do something about that? My sympathies are with Martin and the dog.
Amen.
iolo, I think it was spooked or dazzled. It crossed from behind the bike diagonally and I recall it glancing at me just before I hit it.
Thank you, Imnotverygood!
Thank you, Junkyard!
& that also goes for the other 95% that can see sense.
The SOAC has this to say on the matter
The dog owner was clearly in breach of this.Recreation areas and public places:
avoid causing concern to others by keeping your dog [b]close at heel or on a short lead[/b].
[quote=rene59 ]The hypocrisy of some cyclists really makes me laugh. Some really do think they can do no wrong, are always correct and should never be held accountable for their actions.
Go on then - with an assertion like that I'm sure you can find an example to prove your point...
Highway Code Rule 56
"Do not let a dog out on the road on its own. Keep it on a short lead when walking on the pavement, road or path shared with cyclists or horse riders."
https://www.gov.uk/rules-about-animals-47-to-58/other-animals-56-to-58
This is a recommendation, not a legal requirement.
However the dog owner is negligent in allowing the dog off it's lead on a shared path.
One of the biggest hazards on urban shared paths is dog's off leads.
Are you too stupid or selfish to realise that you can do something about that? My sympathies are with Martin and the dog.
Don't you know? Dogs are great! They're brilliant! They're so adorable, and loyal and stuff! Everyone loves dogs, surely? They're mans best friend. They're just great!! You can't curtail their creativity by keeping them on a lead, or by not letting them jump up at people and bark and shite everywhere, because... well... dogs are great! They're brilliant! etc, etc, etc.....
Under absolutely no circumstances should they all be rounded up and shot! Lets just make that clear!
I'll call the police station later to find out if they found the dog/see how he/she is.
No helmet, bike, non permanent injury matters if a dog has died through the owners negligence. I know he'll be feeling bad vibes towards me too but if he's got any decency in him, he will know it wasn't intended. I got the impression of this as he was asking if I wanted to go to hospital. Like said earlier, he would have been upset and confused. He is worried for his dog and also for me. I was worried for the dog too, he knew that. It's a shame the dog has probably got injured as it was just doing it's thing :O/
rene59 » The hypocrisy of some cyclists really makes me laugh. Some really do think they can do no wrong, are always correct and should never be held accountable for their actions.Go on then - with an assertion like that I'm sure you can find an example to prove your point...
Well I could, yes, but as I said some really think they can do no wrong and are always correct so I would be massively wasting my time.
Isnt the dog only deemed to be under control if it is on a lead? i know that insurers will only pay out if it was on a lead at the time of an accident!
This isn't true
Very depressing reading this thread ... Why are some people always looking to put all the blame on to others?
Take the hit. You got up and walked away ... you even happen to have a pretty good funny story to tell about it too.
[quote=seanbolton ]One of the biggest hazards on urban shared paths is dog's off leads.
Almost, but not quite as bad as grocers' apostrophes 😉
Some really do think they can do no wrong, are always correct and should never be held accountable for their actions.
Internet trolls for example?
[quote=rene59 ]Well I could, yes, but as I said some really think they can do no wrong and are always correct so I would be massively wasting my time.
Sounds like a bit of a circular argument. But I'll take that as a no, you can't actually find such an example, hence your assertion is a load of bollocks. Feel free to prove me wrong...
a black dog
Racist!
Given there are no witnesses to the accident, so it's your word against his, and you've already admitted to being unsighted by his lights immediately prior to passing him, you'll struggle to get anywhere with a compensation claim via insurance or the small claims court.
ditch_jockey - Member
Given there are no witnesses to the accident, so it's your word against his, and you've already admitted to being unsighted by his lights immediately prior to passing him, you'll struggle to get anywhere with a compensation claim via insurance or the small claims court.
This
[img] 
[/img]
I am increasingly reminded of this chap reading the forum of late.
Ill declare one thing first. My other half screws dogs (and other things) back together.
Poor choice of place to put the parentheses, you don't want people pausing there, really, or they may end up with an ill informed view of your OH.
Considering what they get brought in for if a dog bounces off anythings its bloody lucky. The vet bills for stuff like this are generally large (5k as a starting point) so please don't go thinking that animals will learn or whatever from being hit by a bike.
What? So because vet bills are expensive, we shouldn't assume that a dog will learn from being hit?
[url= http://www.torquayheraldexpress.co.uk/Torquay-man-prosecuted-walking-dog-lead/story-25924057-detail/story.html ]Just seen this in the local rag[/url]
Self portrait, rene?
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/wirral-dog-accident-cyclist-may-7577154
and since then quite a few dog walkers seemto have fitted their dogs with reflective collars and flasding led lights when out in the dark
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/6375616/Hotel-owner-faces-ruin-after-customer-hit-by-dog.html
also a freind who had just took early retirement was recently hit by an uncontrolled dog, the idiot owner refused to help or call an ambulance and just walked off, result broken leg, 3 days in hospital and 12 weeks recovery so far.
[quote=project > http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/wirral-dog-accident-cyclist-may-7577154
Headline appears to be totally wrong for that story!
I’m in the accidents happen category.
But also learn from stuff category,
I'm guessing animal owner won’t be riding with an animal (especially at night) having realized what harm can come to his animal though inability to control the animal when a bike/ runner /car/space hopper is approaching.
And I would imagine OP will s**t himself and slow down anytime he can’t see a full 20 yards ahead.
I personally will substitute the word "animal" for "child who has just learned to ride"
I’m almost certain we will all revert to our previous behaviours before too long, because lets face it bikes are fun!
Hope you get better soon OP
Looks like he's nursing a boner in that pic? Maybe the dog was attracted to that 😆
Mooman wrote:
mooman - Member
Very depressing reading this thread ... Why are some people always looking to put all the blame on to others?Take the hit. You got up and walked away ... you even happen to have a pretty good funny story to tell about it too.
A dog is injured or dead, I'm hurt. Shouldn't you be over at Liveleek?
My boss called, he said something along the lines of 'I take it this didn't happen on *Dog Dodgers descent then?!'
*A part of the Strathpuffer course!
What a joke, generation of mommy's boys, so you fell over big deal. No broken bones, no time off work. 3 god damn pages of this tripe.
You continued to go forward though you admit you couldn't see and the dog was off the lead, look where your going or stop if you can't see.
Custard Cream anyone?
Was the other cyclist actually in control of his dog? Nope, thought not. Spot the dog owners in this thread!
Cyclist Wins Compensation From Dog Owner
24-Nov
A cyclist has been awarded £14,000 in compensation after he was injured when a dog ran under the wheel of his bicycle.Ken MacLennan, 65, was cycling though a park when a spaniel that had been let off its lead ran into his path. Mr MacLennan was thrown over the handlebars and suffered a fractured pelvis.
After the accident, Mr MacLennan was in hospital for a month and was forced to use crutches for a further three months. In total he had to have six months off work and was unable to cycle, walk or drive without experiencing pain. It is unlikely that he will ever recover fully from the injury he sustained.
Pet owners have a legal responsibility to safeguard others from the potential dangers posed by their animals. If pets cause an accident, their owners may be liable for any resulting damages.
If you have been injured by an animal as a result of the owner’s failure to control it, you could be entitled to compensation.
Admittedly from what looks like an ambulance chasing website.
Welcome pitch pro ....the worlds slowest troll... I guess he has just got up given its just past 3 pm
C-G I dont think it is a dog owner v non dog owner thing but idiots v not idiots.
*puts flameproof suit on*
Dogs are horrible animals that poo everywhere, bark at and chase cyclists, and like humping things. All dog owners should be forced to give up their dogs and get a cat, much more relaxing. Discuss.
P.s. some of my best friends own dogs, but still, meh.
2011pitchpro gets it, I despair at the direction this country is headed....
...."I'm hurt, waaaah, who can I blame?"....
Some people on STW would be better off sat safely at home wrapped in cotton wool instead of venturing out into the big wide world....the frightening thought is that these people will breed leading to an even more spineless generation of incompetents.
(Cats are horrible creatures and their owners shouldn't be trusted, if everybody grew up with a dog in the family the world would be a better place)
Pretty sure some on STW would be better of just satying inside and shouting their hate filled Bollocks safe from the actual consequences of saying it to peoples faces...oh the Irony that its keyboard warriors calling every one else softies and spineless.
You are so brave and virile I am getting dizzy from your testosterone and I guess if we met [ a boy can dream eh] I would get pregnant just from your awesomeness
Its such a shame you did not get enough cuddles as a child
Christ trolling it so easy WTF is the point ?
What a joke, generation of mommy's boys, so you fell over big deal. No broken bones, no time off work.
You must be drunk,surely? :O)
I didn't fall over. It is a deal. Does a fracture or broken bone mean it's so much worse than a swollen hand that has no grip or carrying capabilities? I've broken the same hand before and this, although shows no fractures, is far more of a pain in the ass. The swelling is like I've had implants. Like it's filled with jelly. I do have time off work. I can't use the hand, it's quiet at work and my boss said to take a few days off. I'm next to useless with my dominant hand today. Hopefully when he goes on holiday for 2 weeks I'll be able to do stuff as there's only 2 or 3 of us. I will be taking notes and answering the phone and that's about all I could do right now.
I struggle with long sentences. Has the dog been found yet?
Just as a discussion point, substitute dog with child. Who is to blame then? I always maintain that if you can't stop in the distance you can see ahead then you are going too fast.
I would slow down to walking pace if I saw someone coming the other way, purely out of shock and to have a chat, it never happens 🙂
Welcome pitch pro ....the worlds slowest troll... I guess he has just got up given its just past 3 pm Perhaps he justy like the number 3 Page 3 at 3 pm ?C-G I dont think it is a dog owner v non dog owner thing but idiots v not idiots.
JY, why is it everytime anyone writes something on here that you disagree with they are either an idiot or a troll? Im genuinely interested ....
Ex dog owner here, I used to work in boarding kennels too. Find myself dismayed at the lack of responsibility that many dog owners exhibit, they fail to realise that training is on-going and not just a puppy class. As someone who only rides on their own I don't see why I should be subjected to someone's stupid dog making a nuisance of itself. Thank goodness for my large feet!
JY you're trolling and I'm not, that's the difference!
Don't like my views?....there is plenty of bollocks on here I don't like, such is life eh?...all you can do is try to avoid people with opposing views in real life then you don't have to be offended in a face to face situation by the whining simpering garbage that spews forth from their stupid fat faces.
(as others have said, you write off opposing views as trolling as it is your defence mechanism that allows you to feel more comfortable about the world, its what children do)
Trolls same old shit say something outrageous insist you mean it etc
Still you seem lovely with it
Anyway I have fed you enough return to the bridge
EDIT: Hahah not even a good one you had to go back to put in the goad in brackets.
That did make me laugh you are just so needing of attention and I am the child
Bless
[quote=devs ]Just as a discussion point, substitute dog with child.
"I was riding on a path that's used for walking and cycling last night. It was dark, I had my lights on and a cyclist was was approaching me with lights on too. We pass each other and his child, off a lead, runs from behind the bike"
I'm not sure it really works.
Two cyclists pass each other, how many would slow to a stop from 10mph knowing that the light ahead is another cyclist? You ride past. No child ran out, if it did, it doesn't have to be on a lead. The dog does. It's a dog, there's no point with 'what if's'
My brother said that if a dog ran out in front of me in the car and I swerved and crashed and caused injury to myself, then it would be a whole different matter. Usual just a cyclist attitude, but put a motorcycle or car into it all and it's a different matter. I could see the path ahead although his light was bright,I was focussed on the path, just like we do when riding motorbikes or driving cars, you soon learn after passing your test to not gaze into lights and look where you're going. The path was clear, a lit rider was approaching but I kept my eyes on the path. The path was clear, I had approx 1500 lumens on the third setting aiming (after considerately dipping it well in advance as to not blind him) to see ahead.
A dog ran out and I hit it. Regardless of dog colour or not, it ran straight across me. That's the last time I'm explaining this bit. If nobody can get it, then so be it.
I would get some proper legal advice, Leigh Day are the BC lawyers IIRC
Getting an ID for the dog owner is probably the biggest issue
Ignore the Internet trolling above
Can't believe the vitriol that this has resorted to!
Dogs should be kept under control in public places by law, not necessarily on a lead. The fact that the dog appears to have run in front of the op suggests to me it wasn't under control.
However, you shouldn't ride so fast that you can't stop in the distance that you can see to be safe. If you can't see, you slow down or stop. Oncoming riders are a pain on my commute in winter, but if I'm dazzled I brake.
Six of one, half a dozen of the other. Hope the op gets better soon.
[quote=deviant ]2011pitchpro gets it, I despair at the direction this country is headed....
Kids today don't know they're born.
It wasn't like this in my day.
...
However, you shouldn't ride so fast that you can't stop in the distance that you can see to be safe. If you can't see, you slow down or stop. Oncoming riders are a pain on my commute in winter, but if I'm dazzled I brake.
During the rush hour, this would mean stopping every 10 seconds or so on my local path.
Why not call a no win no fee solicitor. Get as much cash as you can. You might even get a new bike.
There's no wonder our premiums are so bloody high to cover people who claim on this accident, I repeat accident with both parties partly to blame.
[quote=MoreCashThanDash ]However, you shouldn't ride so fast that you can't stop in the distance that you can see to be safe. If you can't see, you slow down or stop. Oncoming riders are a pain on my commute in winter, but if I'm dazzled I brake.
Six of one, half a dozen of the other. Hope the op gets better soon.
Not really. He's just repeated the explanation above - he could see the path in front was clear. A dog then ran into it. By extension of your argument, all vehicles should travel at 5mph everywhere in case a dog they haven't seen runs out in front of them.
[quote=iolo ]There's no wonder our premiums are so bloody high to cover people who claim on this accident
Bingo!!
Presumably you're not supposed to claim for accidents, only when somebody does something deliberately? I think maybe you're a bit confused about what an accident is.
That's what insurance is for. For accidents. You break something that's partly your fault claim against your own insurance.
Or you can try knock for knock.
Given the description, how exactly is it partly his fault when an out of control dog runs in front of him?
Presumably you also think that it's only claiming on other people's insurance which makes premiums "so bloody high"?
This is going round in circles. He couldn't see, kept riding, read the rest, it's been written a few times above. How could he prove was not already there if the lights were dazzling? And so on.
Presumably you're not supposed to claim for accidents, only when somebody does something deliberately?
No that's not correct is it. Typo?
He couldn't see, kept riding, read the rest, it's been written a few times above. How could he prove was not already there if the lights were dazzling?
Several others above have written this or something similar, and it's utter bollocks.
Driving at night on the road, every time you pass another car you're temporarily partially blinded such that you can't see what's immediately behind the other car.
Should you slow to walking pace, just incase there's someone in a black car with no lights driving erratically behind the passing car?
Dog owners should pay for the consequences of their out of control/untrained dog in this sort of situation IMO
bollocks.
Driving at night on the road, every time you pass another car you're temporarily partially blinded such that you can't see what's immediately behind the other car.
Not me, a trip to spec savers is in order for you.
Do we have the first superman with xray vision on this thread!
Chip you're just flat out awesome aren't you,you little minx.
Lets' not turn this into another godawful driving thread.
@OP Sympathies, your injuries sound highly annoying. For £120 of parts and some bumps and bruises, I can't believe you're even considering the time and expense of a legal process. Get on with your life.
PS. For whatever reason, probably the tone and length of your post, I remembered your sliproad post from a year back. That one went 6 pages with a similar pattern of responses.
He couldn't see, kept riding, read the rest, it's been written afew times above
I'm not sure it's me who needs to do more reading. The OP has now said several times that he could see the path was clear as he approached and that the dog ran out from behind the other cyclist. That the dazzling was only incidental at the point the dog ran out. Do keep up.
Actually Chip has a point, though not with the Specsavers bit.
If you avert your gaze to the left hand side it helps avoid the glare blindness. Works when driving, too.
Ill declare one thing first. My other half screws dogs (and other things) back together.Poor choice of place to put the parentheses, you don't want people pausing there, really, or they may end up with an ill informed view of your OH.
🙂
Deserved quoting or/and re-quoting
If you avert your gaze to the left hand side it helps avoid the glare blindness. Works when driving, too.
That's cerainly true, but you are certainly not able to see much even doing this. Especially with some modern lights or poorly adjusted ones.
I don't want to spark off a driving thread, I just saw it as a decent analogy in response to those who claim you should always travel at a speed you could stop in if something appears in front of you.
It's just not realistic.
The other point to consider is that the OP reported the incident to the police.
The police informed him, after due deliberation there was no case to investigate.
So as no blame was apportioned how could anyone be financially liable for the OP's unfortunate incident?
I just saw it as a decent analogy in response to those who claim you should always travel at a speedyou could stop in if something appears in front of you.
I'd suggest that it's a pretty good idea for general riding and driving, and if you are continuously blinded by the glare of low sun the you should slow down. However it is unrealistic to expect somebody to slow down instantaneously because they are temporarily blinded by somebody else's badly aimed lights. There is a difference between the two.
What's more, it sounds like that made no difference.
iolo, so not only are you confused by what an accident is, you don't understand the difference between a criminal offence and civil liability either?
Ok, OP, go on Judge Judy
Ok, OP, go on Judge Judy
Aracer can be the 'expert' one stood next to him that keeps butting in and having to be told to shut up for talking shite.
Dog owners fault imo.
I don't see how a dog can be held responsible for anything, as a cyclist he should have been more aware of the potential pitfalls of dog walking at night, idiots some of them.
eg Dog on one side of road/cycle path and the owner on the other, connected by a 4 meter lead
The owner should have took reasonable steps to make sure the dog was visible, as a cyclist himself he would have been aware of this but just couldn't be arsed, if it had been my dog I would have took full responsibility and have been gutted I'd allowed it to happen and very apologetic.
Could the owner have done more to prevent it, yes, definitely yes, could the op have done anything different to prevent it, no I don't think he could.
I think it is pretty 50/50 on who was to blame.
The only definite conclusion we have arrived at is that Junkyard is a troll. Every thread over a page or two is littered with his nonsense 😕
I'm half to blame for a dog running under my wheel when I could see the path I'm riding on? Can you not picture this? You've driven vehicles and/or ride bikes in the dark,yes? A dark unlit path, two cyclists with bright lights approaching each other. One had a dog following him. Is it possible to see what's behind any vehicle with lights, such as dogs or animals? No, you just see the lights in blackness and maybe get an idea of the size of vehicle by the light type,height from the road, width etc. If no light is behind them,there's no definition on a dark night with no light behind. Is that too hard to picture and understand? You have got to be trolling. I really cannot believe I'm explaining this. I think the dog would understand this sooner. Nah,you managed to register and sign in, you have got to be trolling.
Dirtydog,it's so calming to read pure common sense every so often :O)
No, but you're fully to blame for not helping to find a potentially seriously hurt and scared dog instead of reporting the incident to the police immediately.
Regardless of who's fault it was and how strong your desire to be compensated surely a bit of compassion would have been well received.
Junkyard=KatyHopkins-KatyHopkins=Junkyard EUGGHHHHH!